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52 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

Too bad the raiders defense can’t stop Brian Hoyer at qb 

Raiders offense will even be more potent in 2021( lost n Agholor - got faster better route runner, and hands in Wr John Brown . Rb K Drake joining Josh Jacobs gives two beast running backs. Te Foster Moreau( J Witten stole his minutes but they let him fully recover from Acl injury).

All the Raiders defense has to be is average, and they’re a playoff team .   Gus Bradley is better Dc, and scheme is better than Paul Guenter.  Have added a lot of depth on defense line( Y Ngakoue - Sslb) Q Jefferson ,Solomon Thomas , David Irving( played two games last year wasn’t in shape) .    Raiders had two major needs heading into the draft Find starting Rt, and get a starting free safety. With pick 17 they got their starting Rt.    With pick 48 they will get R grant .     

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Connor Hughes@Connor_J_Hughes 7m The #Jets said they viewed Alijah Vera-Tucker as a “top-10” player. That’s why they traded up to go get him.

I'm not sure why everyone is hell bent on trading back from 34 just to get back a late 3rd. You're going to pass up on a potential 1st round value just to get back what will most likely be a career ba

So I think that AVT trade is the best of Douglas' career. Recouping a 4th and giving up two 3rds in a draft where everything after the top 30 players is a crapshoot is great. Throwing Lawrence away fo

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8 hours ago, kdels62 said:

Javonte Williams

JOK

Teven Jenkins

Asante Samuel

Kelvin Joseph

Creed Humphrey

Dillon Radunz

Aziz Ojulari 

Elijah Moore 

Rondale Moore

Terrace Marshall

Eric Stokes 

—————————————-

Yeah, we can trade down some distance. Cowboys have 3 3rd round picks, I think and make a reasonable partner at 44

 

 

 

Best argument for a trade down (Stokes was already picked).  All depends on how we have these guys graded.  Lets say we have a top 15 or 20 grade on one of these guys, I could see just taking the player.  But I would love to see us move back and add another 3.  I like AVT, but that was an expensive move up.

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26 minutes ago, Lith said:

Best argument for a trade down (Stokes was already picked).  All depends on how we have these guys graded.  Lets say we have a top 15 or 20 grade on one of these guys, I could see just taking the player.  But I would love to see us move back and add another 3.  I like AVT, but that was an expensive move up.

Agreed.  I just wonder how far back you would have to go to get a 3rd rounder back.  Most likely they could net a 4th by dropping back a few spots.  

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6 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

Agreed.  I just wonder how far back you would have to go to get a 3rd rounder back.  Most likely they could net a 4th by dropping back a few spots.  

I would guess they need to go back 10-12 spots to get a 3. 

But I have to admit, there is a part of me that would love to see them just take Teven Jenkins at 34 (unless Jax grab him) and feel like the OL is set with 3 young studs to anchor the line for the next 5 - 10 years.

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1 minute ago, Lith said:

I would guess they need to go back 10-12 spots to get a 3. 

But I have to admit, there is a part of me that would love to see them just take Teven Jenkins at 34 (unless Jax grab him) and feel like the OL is set with 3 young studs to anchor the line for the next 5 - 10 years.

I would like to see some speed added to the offense, but I get the attraction to Jenkins.  I just worry about having two rookie O-linemen starting with a rookie QB.   I guess you might as well let them all learn at the same time though.  

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11 hours ago, Tranquilo said:

Wilson has never gone down due to a bad shoulder 

Sparky; use google once in a while. Despite Lincoln's warnings about the internet, has some truthful stuff out there right at your fingertips. 

  • "Wilson explained in an interview before the 2019 season that he initially injured his shoulder in high school. He underwent surgery after his freshman season as a Cougar to repair the labrum in his right shoulder. Wilson has played 21 games the past two seasons, throwing for 6,074 yards with 44 touchdowns and 12 interceptions in that span."
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  • Wilson throws righthanded. 

Having had that surgery as an old guy, it's not fun; 18 months out you begin to feel normal. But old or young, you shoulder is never going to be the same. 

Further, I watched Pennington's career go into the terlet after shoulder surgery. And seen my own son's D2 DL final 2 seasons go awry from the same surgery(performed by Gronk's Harvard surgeon). 

Wilson is one good hit away from being done. And he's a little guy. 

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1 minute ago, Bugg said:

Sparky; use google once in a while. Despite Lincoln's warnings about the internet, ash some truthful stuff out there right at your fingertips. 

  • "Wilson explained in an interview before the 2019 season that he initially injured his shoulder in high school. He underwent surgery after his freshman season as a Cougar to repair the labrum in his right shoulder. Wilson has played 21 games the past two seasons, throwing for 6,074 yards with 44 touchdowns and 12 interceptions in that span."
  •  
  • Wilson throws righthanded. 

Having had that surgery as an old guy, it's not fun; 18 months out you begin to feel normal. But old or young, you shoulder is never going to be the same. 

Further, I watched Pennington's career go into the terlet after shoulder surgery. And seen my own son's D2 DL final 2 seasons go awry from the same surgery. 

Wilson is one good hit away from being done. And he's a little guy. 

He never went down though. He played throughout the season and only missed games due to a thumb injury. Where does it say the shoulder took him out? Try again, sparky.

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Just now, sec101row23 said:

I would like to see some speed added to the offense, but I get the attraction to Jenkins.  I just worry about having two rookie O-linemen starting with a rookie QB.   I guess you might as well let them all learn at the same time though.  

Honestly, I don't expect them to take Jenkins.  I would imagine their preference is to trade back.  If we can move back to mid 40s and get one of Rondale Moore, or Elijah Moore, that would work.  And there are still lot of good defensive players on the board.  JOK & Assante Samuel come immediately to mind.  Ojulari is still out there too, but I am not sure how good a fit he is for a 4-3.

Plenty of options.  Which seems to make the case for moving back.

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2 minutes ago, Tranquilo said:

He never went down though. He played throughout the season and only missed games due to a thumb injury. Where does it say the shoulder took him out? Try again, sparky.

So he squeezed 9 months of rehab into an offseason. Splitting hairs, are ya? 

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Just now, Lith said:

Honestly, I don't expect them to take Jenkins.  I would imagine their preference is to trade back.  If we can move back to mid 40s and get one of Rondale Moore, or Elijah Moore, that would work.  And there are still lot of good defensive players on the board.  JOK & Assante Samuel come immediately to mind.  Ojulari is still out there too, but I am not sure how good a fit he is for a 4-3.

Plenty of options.  Which seems to make the case for moving back.

Agreed.   I think JD is working the phones as we speak.  

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1 minute ago, Bugg said:

So he squeezed 9 months of rehab into an offseason. Splitting hairs, are ya? 

I'm not splitting hairs, I'm telling you for a fact, the shoulder injury didn't take him out and he didn't go down. He literally started the year and played a bunch of games till the thumb injury. Trevor Lawrence just had shoulder surgery. Does that mean the shoulder took him down? Come on, dude.

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13 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

Agreed.  I just wonder how far back you would have to go to get a 3rd rounder back.  Most likely they could net a 4th by dropping back a few spots.  

12-15 spots should get us back into the mid third round.  That would mean we could possibly get one of the following unless they all happen to go in those 12-15 spots:

DEFENSE

Asante Samuel Jr.

Tyron Campbell

Carlos Basham Jr.

Joseph Ossai

Azeeze Ojulari

OFFENSE

Tevon Jenkins

Samuel Cosmi

Liam Eichenberg

Creed Humphrey

Quinn Meinerz

Pat  Frierermuth

Terrace Marshall

Rondale Moore

Wyatt Davis

Elijah Moore

In my opinion, and given no safeties have gone yet, there is a good chance we move down.  That is, unless the Jets are in love with someone in particular.  Who knows!  We shall see in a few hours.

 

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9 minutes ago, Tranquilo said:

I'm not splitting hairs, I'm telling you for a fact, the shoulder injury didn't take him out and he didn't go down. Trevor Lawrence just had shoulder surgery. Does that mean the shoulder took him down? Come on, dude.

Talk about missing the forest for the trees.

He's had shoulder surgery.  That is a risk going forward, as every one of us who watched Chad career disintegrate know all too well.

Ffs.  

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Just now, Warfish said:

Talk about missing the forest for the trees.

He's had should surgery.  That is a risk going forward, as every one of us who watched Chad career disintegrate know all too well.

Ffs.  

Quarterbacks have been fine getting that shoulder surgery. You want to make the point your own, that's fine. But the fact is, the shoulder injury never made him miss any games.

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I want a day 1 starter at #34, it's basically a 1st round pick.

I'm not interested in trading down for a couple of Morgan/Perine/Zuniga/Clark non-entities.

If there is a legit Day 1 starter who will contribute to this team, I want them.  Not project players.

I'm glad we got AVT, he was one I wanted at #23, but in hindsight, we jumped the gun, AVT and Darrisaw would likely have both been sitting available at #23.

The cost of that is those mid-round project guys.  Sorry.  Draft a starter at #34, don't get tricky or smug or think you're smarter than everyone else JD.  You're not.

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4 minutes ago, Tranquilo said:

Quarterbacks have been fine getting that shoulder surgery. You want to make the point your own, that's fine. But the fact is, the shoulder injury never made him miss any games.

So he was going to wake up from surgery and throw 50 passes vs. Boise State that very day? It's a significant risk. 

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Just now, Warfish said:

I want a day 1 starter at #34, it's basically a 1st round pick.

I'm not interested in trading down for a couple of Morgan/Perine/Zuniga/Clark non-entities.

If there is a legit Day 1 starter who will contribute to this team, I want them.  Not project players.

I'm glad we got AVT, he was one I wanted at #23, but in hindsight, we jumped the gun, AVT and Darrisaw would likely have both been sitting available at #23.

The cost of that is those mid-round project guys.  Sorry.  Draft a starter at #34, don't get tricky or smug or think you're smarter than everyone else JD.  You're not.

They don’t need to stay at 34 to get a starter.  I expect a pass rusher like Perkins after a trade back.

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1 minute ago, Warfish said:

I want a day 1 starter at #34, it's basically a 1st round pick.

I'm not interested in trading down for a couple of Morgan/Perine/Zuniga/Clark non-entities.

If there is a legit Day 1 starter who will contribute to this team, I want them.  Not project players.

I'm glad we got AVT, he was one I wanted at #23, but in hindsight, we jumped the gun, AVT and Darrisaw would likely have both been sitting available at #23.

The cost of that is those mid-round project guys.  Sorry.  Draft a starter at #34, don't get tricky or smug or think you're smarter than everyone else JD.  You're not.

We need a guard more than a tackle. And AVT is more talented, anyway.

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2 minutes ago, Tranquilo said:

Quarterbacks have been fine getting that shoulder surgery. You want to make the point your own, that's fine. But the fact is, the shoulder injury never made him miss any games.

A elevated risk =/= a definite future of missed time or reinjury.  It's just a risk.

If you don't think a history of throwing arm labrum surgery for a QB is a risk, you're not worth debating on the topic.

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Just now, Bugg said:

So he was going to wake up from surgery and throw 50 passes vs. Boise State that very day? 

So every player who gets surgery in the offseason is considered going down? If that's your definition, uh ok I guess.

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3 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

Agreed.   I think JD is working the phones as we speak.  


All you need is one team a few spots behind you to consider someone on the board an elite prospect who should’ve been gone in the first 20 picks. They might be willing to overpay. If they were willing to use a number 20 overall pick on a guy and can now get him at 34 then the compensation might be for a pick somewhere between 20 and 34?

At this point, the value chart gets very fuzzy because the trade is being made for a player not for a slot. Prior to the draft is when you see teams stick a little bit more closely to the value chart IMO.

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Just now, Warfish said:

A elevated risk =/= a definite future of missed time or reinjury.  It's just a risk.

If you don't think a history of throwing arm labrum surgery for a QB is a risk, you're not worth debating on the topic.

If it was a huge risk, they wouldn't have drafted him. That's why they waited for the medicals.

So other than Pennington, because he always seems to get mentioned, who else has had that surgery and cut their career short? I don't give a sh*t what you think is worth debating, you're the one that jumped in. You can see your way out.

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7 minutes ago, CanadaSteve said:

12-15 spots should get us back into the mid third round.  That would mean we could possibly get one of the following unless they all happen to go in those 12-15 spots:

DEFENSE

Asante Samuel Jr.

Tyron Campbell

Carlos Basham Jr.

Joseph Ossai

Azeeze Ojulari

OFFENSE

Tevon Jenkins

Samuel Cosmi

Liam Eichenberg

Creed Humphrey

Quinn Meinerz

Pat  Frierermuth

Terrace Marshall

Rondale Moore

Wyatt Davis

Elijah Moore

In my opinion, and given no safeties have gone yet, there is a good chance we move down.  That is, unless the Jets are in love with someone in particular.  Who knows!  We shall see in a few hours.

 

I would also include Ronnie Perkins on that list if the Jets trade down.

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1 minute ago, jetstream23 said:


All you need is one team a few spots behind you to consider someone on the board an elite prospect who should’ve been gone in the first 20 picks. They might be willing to overpay. If they were willing to use a number 20 overall pick on a guy and can now get him at 34 then the compensation might be for a pick somewhere between 20 and 34?

At this point, the value chart gets very fuzzy because the trade is being made for a player not for a slot. Prior to the draft is when you see teams stick a little bit more closely to the value chart IMO.

Very true.  Hopefully a 3-4 defense team REALLY loves Ojulari and makes a move. 

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6 minutes ago, Warfish said:

 

I'm glad we got AVT, he was one I wanted at #23, but in hindsight, we jumped the gun, AVT and Darrisaw would likely have both been sitting available at #23.

What makes you say that? I think it's pretty clear we needed to get ahead of the Raiders for AVT.

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One scenario I could see happening is the Jets including one of their 5ths in any trade down to make sure they got a 2nd and 3rd back in any deal.  They could trade back to say pick 40 and also get 72 while trading 34 and 148 to do so. That would be the ideal scenario for me

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3 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I'm glad we got AVT, he was one I wanted at #23, but in hindsight, we jumped the gun, AVT and Darrisaw would likely have both been sitting available at #23.

The cost of that is those mid-round project guys.  Sorry.  Draft a starter at #34, don't get tricky or smug or think you're smarter than everyone else JD.  You're not.

Why do you think AVT would have been there at 23? It seems likely that the Raiders would have taken him instead of Leatherwood - who was widely regarded as a second rounder before the draft. 

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6 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

They don’t need to stay at 34 to get a starter.  I expect a pass rusher like Perkins after a trade back.

I have a feeling the Jets are all in on offense this year through the first 2 days

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1 minute ago, sec101row23 said:

Very true.  Hopefully a 3-4 defense team REALLY loves Ojulari and makes a move. 

If a team comes up to 34 I think it would be for a guy like JOK or Elijah Moore.

I also don’t think I want to see the Jets drop past 40.

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1 minute ago, UntouchableCrew said:

What makes you say that? I think it's pretty clear we needed to get ahead of the Raiders for AVT.

 

1 minute ago, slimjasi said:

Why do you think AVT would have been there at 23? It seems likely that the Raiders would have taken him instead of Leatherwood - who was widely regarded as a second rounder before the draft. 

Lol and I make asinine posts. @Warfish

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9 hours ago, David Harris said:

I want to keep 34 and pick a stud. Jenkins, Elijah Moore or Jay OK and I don’t care about a third rounder 

Answer: Chuma Edoga, Nathan Sheperd, Ardarius Stewart, Jordan Jenkins, Lorenzo Mauldin, Dexter Mcdougle have all this in common

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