Jets in on OT Moses

[NYJ1]

5 minutes ago, Lith said:

At this point, I don't think there is any major rush, especilly from his end.  He has already missed most of the offseason program -- just a 3 day minicamp left.  I think he signs either here or Chicago before the start of training camp, but I don't expect it to be in the next few days.  

So I take it he really hasn't given anyone an idea when he'll sign. Thank you for the information......

[Lith]

3 minutes ago, NYJ1 said:

So I take it he really hasn't given anyone an idea when he'll sign. Thank you for the information......

Not that I have seen.  I know he visited us and the Bears.  As of now, they are expecting to start Elijah Wilkinson and German Ifedi on the right side of their line.  He is an instant starter and upgrade for them (similar to us).  On the other hand, we have more cap space and can probably outbid them.

[Jet Nut]

On 6/11/2021 at 7:56 AM, GreenFish said:

I have no idea but I hope so. Depending on the news that comes out, this might be the first downvote I give Joe Douglas. He has to get this done.

With Becton/AVT on the left and Moses on the right, our running game will be a problem for other teams. It’ll make life easier for Wilson.

What’s “he has to get this done” mean?  If Moses signs elsewhere there are more than a few reasons that go into where a FA signs.  
It’s not a simple case of if JD wants him it’s a done deal.  

[whodeawhodat]

just a few weeks ago we were discussing how you cant just move players around the oline at any postion and some are talking about sliding fant inside?  

[Ecuadorian Jet]

On 6/9/2021 at 1:42 PM, #27TheDominator said:

Why?  Didn't Elflein grade out particularly horrible.  I think PFF had him like 20 points behind Lewis and Van Roten. Isn't it kind of like pining for Josh Andrews? 

i honestly dont know the manner in which PFF grades, but from a spectator pov, the line seemed way more firm once he lined up next to Becton. It seemed to me that it was the correct assesment based on the rather quick offer he got once we didnt extend him.

[Jetsfan80]

2 hours ago, whodeawhodat said:

just a few weeks ago we were discussing how you cant just move players around the oline at any postion and some are talking about sliding fant inside?  

It’s easier to play G than RT.  No, it’s not always a good move or an easy transition for some guys, but in general, you can make THAT move.  

More likely, however, is Moses taking Fant’s job and Fant ultimately ending up a swing tackle again.  Perhaps even after trying him at guard but realizing we already have a better option on the roster. 

[#27TheDominator]

20 hours ago, Ecuadorian Jet said:

i honestly dont know the manner in which PFF grades, but from a spectator pov, the line seemed way more firm once he lined up next to Becton. It seemed to me that it was the correct assesment based on the rather quick offer he got once we didnt extend him.

I am not PFF guy, but people point to Eiflein playing in the two wins.  I believe most of that had to do with people that were looking to draft him coming out.  You don't hear many people mentioning that Josh Andrews played 100% of the snaps against the Rams and 65% against the Browns. 

[choon328]

7 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

I am not PFF guy, but people point to Eiflein playing in the two wins.  I believe most of that had to do with people that were looking to draft him coming out.  You don't hear many people mentioning that Josh Andrews played 100% of the snaps against the Rams and 65% against the Browns. 

I am one of those people who saw a noticeable improvement when Elflein was starting next to Becton.

[Patriot Killa]

19 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

I am not PFF guy, but people point to Eiflein playing in the two wins.  I believe most of that had to do with people that were looking to draft him coming out.  You don't hear many people mentioning that Josh Andrews played 100% of the snaps against the Rams and 65% against the Browns. 

Yeah but it was specifically the left side that Ty Johnson and Josh Adams were able to run wild thru in those games.

[#27TheDominator]

1 hour ago, choon328 said:

I am one of those people who saw a noticeable improvement when Elflein was starting next to Becton.

Fair enough

1 hour ago, Patriot Killa said:

Yeah but it was specifically the left side that Ty Johnson and Josh Adams were able to run wild thru in those games.

Also a fair thought, but be careful of how our recollection changes.  In the two wins Josh Adams had zero carries.  Ty Johnson had 5 in both games combined.  He did have 29 yards on those carries and he added another 39 on 6 catches against the Rams.  None of those things really strike me as our left side running game taking off.  

[Patriot Killa]

1 hour ago, #27TheDominator said:

Fair enough

Also a fair thought, but be careful of how our recollection changes.  In the two wins Josh Adams had zero carries.  Ty Johnson had 5 in both games combined.  He did have 29 yards on those carries and he added another 39 on 6 catches against the Rams.  None of those things really strike me as our left side running game taking off.  

Good call I was thinking of the Raiders game and one other.

[Joe W. Namath]

Joe has probably given moses and lowball offer.  Now with the crowder restructure, maybe he ups the offer a little.

But Moses is running out of options as most teams do not have much cap space.

If guys like Moses or Nelson are going to come here, Douglas is going to get them on ridiculously team friendly deals.

[choon328]

4 hours ago, Joe W. Namath said:

Joe has probably given moses and lowball offer.  Now with the crowder restructure, maybe he ups the offer a little.

But Moses is running out of options as most teams do not have much cap space.

If guys like Moses or Nelson are going to come here, Douglas is going to get them on ridiculously team friendly deals.

I'm not sure about that. The one position he's been aggressive with and "overspent" has been offensive line.  Whether it's money (Fant, GVR, McGovern) or draft capital (Vera-Tucker). 

If the Jets want him they can have him bc nobody else would be able to outbid them at this point on a 1 yr deal. And I'm sure Moses would want to hit FA after the season for a final big contract so I think a multi year deal is out of the question.

[BCJet]

On 6/13/2021 at 10:34 AM, whodeawhodat said:

just a few weeks ago we were discussing how you cant just move players around the oline at any postion and some are talking about sliding fant inside?  

There is a general thought on this board that if someone struggles at OT (or in this case we sign a better player), they can simply "move inside" as if guard is an easier position for every player.

There are college OTs who move to guard due to athletic limitations, arm length, etc. but that doesnt mean every OT can do that.  Fant is a tall, very athletic OT who can move well in space.  He also struggles against bull rushes and has below average play strength.  How on earth could a player with his skill set play guard?  It would literally force all his weaknesses to the forefront and take away his positive qualities.  

Morgan Moses is a powerful player who could potentially fit at guard, but Fant certainly does not.

[Rhg1084]

2 minutes ago, BCJet said:

There is a general thought on this board that if someone struggles at OT (or in this case we sign a better player), they can simply "move inside" as if guard is an easier position for every player.

There are college OTs who move to guard due to athletic limitations, arm length, etc. but that doesnt mean every OT can do that.  Fant is a tall, very athletic OT who can move well in space.  He also struggles against bull rushes and has below average play strength.  How on earth could a player with his skill set play guard?  It would literally force all his weaknesses to the forefront and take away his positive qualities.  

Morgan Moses is a powerful player who could potentially fit at guard, but Fant certainly does not.

Erek Flowers went from OT bust to a solid startup guard. Not saying it’s easy to do or anyone can do it, but if the Jets do sign Moses I would definitely try to play Fant at RG 

[choon328]

12 minutes ago, Rhg1084 said:

Erek Flowers went from OT bust to a solid startup guard. Not saying it’s easy to do or anyone can do it, but if the Jets do sign Moses I would definitely try to play Fant at RG 

Two completely different players. Fant was a TE coming out,  ran a 4.8, benched 225 lbs 22X

Flowers was 330 lbs, benched 225 lbs 37X, ran a 5.31. Flower mold of a tackle who can move inside,  Fant doesn't. 

[Rhg1084]

2 minutes ago, choon328 said:

Two completely different players. Fant was a TE coming out,  ran a 4.8, benched 225 lbs 22X

Flowers was 330 lbs, benched 225 lbs 37X, ran a 5.31. Flower mold of a tackle who can move inside,  Fant doesn't. 

So move Moses to guard? Or Fant becomes a backup?

[jetsons]

4 minutes ago, Rhg1084 said:

So move Moses to guard? Or Fant becomes a backup?

Moses Stays @ rt... Fant becomes a swing tackle backup... Van Roten / Clark @ rg. 

[flgreen]

21 minutes ago, Rhg1084 said:

So move Moses to guard? Or Fant becomes a backup?

 That could actually be the hold up.  Perhaps the Jets have offered Moses a fair contract if he agrees to move to guard if Becton is good to go.  

A lot of OT's at his age don't want to move to G.  

 

 

 

[Bronx]

This might be a good reason for him to stay in the East coast and NJ makes perfect sense.

 

 

[GreenFish]

If Fant can’t transition to RG, than make him the swing tackle. But he should definitively be giving a shot to win the RG spot if we sign Moses. We need athletic guards not maulers.

Tom Compton was the RG for the 49ers at the start of the season.

I’m sure both are stronger now then when they were drafted but let’s compare their combine stats.

Fant:

6’5” 296

22 reps with 35” arms

Tom Compton:

6’5” 314

20 reps wit 34” arms

Fant is now 320 and has been in an NFL strength and conditioning program for 5 years. I highly doubt his strength has remained static.

 

[choon328]

1 hour ago, Rhg1084 said:

So move Moses to guard? Or Fant becomes a backup?

Fant becomes the swing tackle like he was in Seattle. That makes more sense. 

[choon328]

1 hour ago, jetsons said:

Moses Stays @ rt... Fant becomes a swing tackle backup... Van Roten / Clark @ rg. 

Van Roten or Lewis

[choon328]

52 minutes ago, GreenFish said:

If Fant can’t transition to RG, than make him the swing tackle. But he should definitively be giving a shot to win the RG spot if we sign Moses. We need athletic guards not maulers.

Tom Compton was the RG for the 49ers at the start of the season.

I’m sure both are stronger now then when they were drafted but let’s compare their combine stats.

Fant:

6’5” 296

22 reps with 35” arms

Tom Compton:

6’5” 314

20 reps wit 34” arms

Fant is now 320 and has been in an NFL strength and conditioning program for 5 years. I highly doubt his strength has remained static.

 

I'm not sure why anybody would expect Fant to start over Lewis or even GVR at RG. It makes more sense to keep Fant as the swing tackle in case of injuries..

[jetsons]

11 minutes ago, choon328 said:

Van Roten or Lewis

I prefer Clark over Lewis... I'm hoping JD Hit on this one.

[choon328]

2 minutes ago, jetsons said:

I prefer Clark over Lewis... I'm hoping JD Hit on this one.

I can't find it but there was a report that Clarke is not even in the running for a starting position this year. 

[Ghost420]

Jets will either sign Sherman or Moses by training camp. Maybe both

[jetsons]

11 minutes ago, choon328 said:

I can't find it but there was a report that Clarke is not even in the running for a starting position this year. 

I'll hold out Hope. ?

[choon328]

2 minutes ago, jetsons said:

I'll hold out Hope. ?

I hope so too lol. The Jets need some damn luck with these mid round picks

[greenwave81]

On 6/8/2021 at 1:58 PM, #27TheDominator said:

I think I like Fant better at LT than Moses.  I give the edge to Moses as a player, but if they are both going to be on the field at the same time I think I run Fant at LT and Moses on the right.

Which may be true and is fine....Issue is, you need versatility and a potential swing tackle.

Plus, AVT could play RT also.

[greenwave81]

On 6/9/2021 at 7:56 AM, Jethead said:

I don't think it's a$ issue. Moses wants a starting T job and we don't have one to offer. To pay a premium to outbid others who could make him a starter for a backup just doesn't work. 

Wut?

Moses is better than Fant right up front.  Fant can either move inside to OG, or serve as backup swing tackle as he did in SEA.

[Irish Jet]

I'll be a little disappointed if after all this we don't get him. Would be another valuable piece to at the very least add quality competition and depth. I think he'd get a starting spot somewhere and push GVR or Fant to the backup spot that I think they deserve tbh - Never been as high on either as some here.

I think it probably also shows how nervous they are to give time to either McDermott or Edoga and that's pretty understandable. 

[Sperm Edwards]

5 hours ago, Irish Jet said:

I'll be a little disappointed if after all this we don't get him. Would be another valuable piece to at the very least add quality competition and depth. I think he'd get a starting spot somewhere and push GVR or Fant to the backup spot that I think they deserve tbh - Never been as high on either as some here.

I think it probably also shows how nervous they are to give time to either McDermott or Edoga and that's pretty understandable. 

I said it earlier, but I think there's still a possibility that bringing in Moses - and letting him leave without any (reported) offer - could've just been a motivational tool for Becton to stay in playing shape.

You want that big LT contract when the time comes? Stay on the field, because - even though it isn't the preference - the team has someone else who can play LT this year and can sign someone else to play RT. Never mind both of KC's starting tackles from 1 year ago - the two best linemen they had for the past couple seasons - are still available FAs (Fisher & Schwartz). 

Maybe not, but I can't 100% rule it out just yet. If Douglas really didn't care for Fant at RT he could've cut him in March before his $4MM+ salary guarantee kicked in. This was about Becton, not Fant. 

edit: Fisher isn't available; didn't realize he signed with Indy last month

Edited June 15, 2021 by Sperm Edwards

[The Crusher]

Good heavens, you would think with only ten things to discus, Moses would have signed already. 

[RichardTodd27]

1 hour ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I said it earlier, but I think there's still a possibility that bringing in Moses - and letting him leave without any (reported) offer - could've just been a motivational tool for Becton to stay in playing shape.

You want that big LT contract when the time comes? Stay on the field, because - even though it isn't the preference - the team has someone else who can play LT this year and can sign someone else to play RT. Never mind both of KC's starting tackles from 1 year ago - the two best linemen they had for the past couple seasons - are still available FAs (Fisher & Schwartz). 

Maybe not, but I can't 100% rule it out just yet. If Douglas really didn't care for Fant at RT he could've cut him in March before his $4MM+ salary guarantee kicked in. This was about Becton, not Fant. 

I agree this might be the case (although I believe Fisher already signed with the Colts).

But to be honest, I hope they do get some insurance for Becton. His size is an issue and it's why a lot of us prefferred to draft Whirf instead of him.