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Prospects 2022 and random college ball talk.


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11 hours ago, Paradis said:

btw, i've made a killing off CCU this year and i should have seen this coming tonight. As good as they've been, they're sloppy. Bad tacklers and undisciplined. 

Chase Brice and his WRs Williams and Sutton had a night.  Chase is the most beloved Clemson player who has transferred out of the program.  Good to see him having some success at App State. 

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12 hours ago, Paradis said:

Ehhh i'm not there with Likely, yet. Love him, but he's more Jared Cook than he is Hockensen or Fant... that said, i've watched him as a fan this year, not really with an eye for scrutiny. Ruckert is still TE1 in my books - physically and positionally. It's October though... we'll see 

 

 

Kolar is a tad overrated IMO

I think physical testing is super important for Ruckert. It’s where his potential exist because his performance are mostly nonexistent. 

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3 hours ago, kdels62 said:

I think physical testing is super important for Ruckert. It’s where his potential exist because his performance are mostly nonexistent. 

I thought at the time, Ruckert  made a huge mistake going to OSU.   I think his final 3 schools were OSU, Michigan and Notre Dame, he could have showcased his talents better at both of those other schools.  I think he will test well, not freakish or anything, but worthy of being talked about as a top 100 player. 

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9 hours ago, kdels62 said:

I think physical testing is super important for Ruckert. It’s where his potential exist because his performance are mostly nonexistent. 

eh, like @sec101row23 just outlined, that's a product of more than just JR. 

Although i like him as the best TE in class (at least as of today) I don't know if that will reflect the league perception. JR going in round 2/3 would be phenomenal for us. It's my view that his career as a pro will be an "out of nowhere" experience for many. 

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19 hours ago, Paradis said:

eh, like @sec101row23 just outlined, that's a product of more than just JR. 

Although i like him as the best TE in class (at least as of today) I don't know if that will reflect the league perception. JR going in round 2/3 would be phenomenal for us. It's my view that his career as a pro will be an "out of nowhere" experience for many. 

I get it but I don’t think I’m convinced of it yet. 

Have an opinion on Cade Otton? If anything he’s a legitimate blocker to me but damn that Washington QB is brutal and hurts the rest.

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2 hours ago, BurntDice said:

What do you guys think about leal as an edge? I like him a lot more than Hutchinson. Dude is a wrecking ball. He can also play dt and rotate around the line. I feel he compliments Lawson and jfm very well 

Yes. He doesn’t work on the inside. He’s not stout enough. But he has bend at 290 and that’s wild.

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25 minutes ago, kdels62 said:

Yes. He doesn’t work on the inside. He’s not stout enough. But he has bend at 290 and that’s wild.

He is just so damn explosive and relentless. It seems like he just refuses to be blocked. With the hutch hype he seems like the polar opposite to me. He seems like he’s lost most of the time and is taken out of the play on a regular basis. I’ve been delving more into leal and I’m getting pretty confident that I want him with the first pick. 

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Still impressed by Sam Williams Ole Miss. Up to 7.5 sacks in 7 games. He’s doing it with both speed and power and seems likely to test well athletically. 

Also you have to be impressed by how Drake London is carrying that offense. He’s getting a crap ton of targets on a bad team, but still being very productive. 

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4 minutes ago, kdels62 said:

We’re gonna need a linebacker which I hate so much. 

I don’t know how much it’ll get prioritized early - hope it’s not (at least yet) and they didn’t focus on it much last year. On one hand we’re seeing what happens when you don’t focus on the position but on the other hand linebacker play didn’t look as bad when Mosley was playing and this is a team that’s already bad down its two best starters at linebacker. Young guys have time to improve too. They really need to build a functional offense before anything else.

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1 minute ago, derp said:

 

I don’t know how much it’ll get prioritized early - hope it’s not (at least yet) and they didn’t focus on it much last year. On one hand we’re seeing what happens when you don’t focus on the position but on the other hand linebacker play didn’t look as bad when Mosley was playing and this is a team that’s already bad down its two best starters at linebacker. Young guys have time to improve too. They really need to build a functional offense before anything else.

I disagree. I know Mosley is good and a stabilizing force but this system pushes the Dline into the backfield and the LBers need to be able to clean up. Quincy Williams is bad. Sherwood is unathletic. Cashman is injured. Jarrad Davis might be something but it’s week 7 and he hasn’t practiced yet. Also while Mosley brings leadership and vision he has been constantly cooked on runs that aren’t in his direction and his drop zone range is limited.

I’m hoping we don’t have to dip into the LB pool too early but the value and need is pushed up.

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1 hour ago, kdels62 said:

I disagree. I know Mosley is good and a stabilizing force but this system pushes the Dline into the backfield and the LBers need to be able to clean up. Quincy Williams is bad. Sherwood is unathletic. Cashman is injured. Jarrad Davis might be something but it’s week 7 and he hasn’t practiced yet. Also while Mosley brings leadership and vision he has been constantly cooked on runs that aren’t in his direction and his drop zone range is limited.

I’m hoping we don’t have to dip into the LB pool too early but the value and need is pushed up.

I guess I’m not arguing the merits of the players or the issues they’re causing but thinking about what positions they seem to value. It was a weakness heading into the draft and heading into the offseason, they really didn’t do much. Don’t think it’s a priority position for the coaching staff or front office. Might be different if priority positions were well stocked but they’re bad too. I think they’ll go into next season bad at linebacker over pretty much any other position.

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1 minute ago, derp said:

I guess I’m not arguing the merits of the players or the issues they’re causing but thinking about what positions they seem to value. It was a weakness heading into the draft and heading into the offseason, they really didn’t do much. Don’t think it’s a priority position for the coaching staff or front office. Might be different if priority positions were well stocked but they’re bad too. I think they’ll go into next season bad at linebacker over pretty much any other position.

Linebackers are important to the system. The over front creates huge running lanes that the linebackers have to be able to plug up. But also because this is the modern nfl, they need to be able to cover and obviously play zone. The Dline requires the special skill set for gap penetration, but their responsibilities are way easier to digest. 

i haven’t looked at linebackers that hard yet though so not sure what’s out there. 

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47 minutes ago, Jets Voice of Reason said:

Linebackers are important to the system. The over front creates huge running lanes that the linebackers have to be able to plug up. But also because this is the modern nfl, they need to be able to cover and obviously play zone. The Dline requires the special skill set for gap penetration, but their responsibilities are way easier to digest. 

i haven’t looked at linebackers that hard yet though so not sure what’s out there. 

Again I think they’re important but they pretty clearly think they can take discounts and acquire smaller but athletic guys who won’t go too early because they don’t fit other schemes - which is what SF has done except for Warner.

I guess high level I think the team is going to have weaknesses heading into next season regardless of what areas they choose to focus on adding assets to and based on what they’ve done so far and the systems on both sides of the ball I think LB will be lower on the totem pole than a bunch of other positions. Doesn’t mean they’re not important but in the case of this multi year seemingly never ending rebuild I just don’t think linebacker is going to be a spot they go hard on this offseason - especially not in the draft.

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10 hours ago, derp said:

Again I think they’re important but they pretty clearly think they can take discounts and acquire smaller but athletic guys who won’t go too early because they don’t fit other schemes - which is what SF has done except for Warner.

I guess high level I think the team is going to have weaknesses heading into next season regardless of what areas they choose to focus on adding assets to and based on what they’ve done so far and the systems on both sides of the ball I think LB will be lower on the totem pole than a bunch of other positions. Doesn’t mean they’re not important but in the case of this multi year seemingly never ending rebuild I just don’t think linebacker is going to be a spot they go hard on this offseason - especially not in the draft.

Got it. You might be right. I just looked back at the 49ers draft history and except for Warner that's what they've done, which I hadn't realized. Seems like DT and edge are the premium roles they value highly and the rest of the defense they try to stack on at the later ends of the draft.

The only thing giving me optimism about this team is that the upcoming draft has players that can fill the biggest weaknesses of the Jets, which to me is center, guard, and tight end. Linebacker looks a little light in terms of depth on initial look, but there are some tall, athletic safeties that the Jets might want to convert to linebacker in the middle rounds.

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28 minutes ago, Jets Voice of Reason said:

Got it. You might be right. I just looked back at the 49ers draft history and except for Warner that's what they've done, which I hadn't realized. Seems like DT and edge are the premium roles they value highly and the rest of the defense they try to stack on at the later ends of the draft.

The only thing giving me optimism about this team is that the upcoming draft has players that can fill the biggest weaknesses of the Jets, which to me is center, guard, and tight end. Linebacker looks a little light in terms of depth on initial look, but there are some tall, athletic safeties that the Jets might want to convert to linebacker in the middle rounds.

Yeah, I mean listen there’s nothing to say that the Jets are definitely going to draft like the 49ers but that’s the best model we have. I also think that prioritizing the front four meshes with the idea of building in the trenches on both sides of the ball that Douglas clearly believes in. And off ball linebackers are also down on the draft list anyway these days.

The team also has so many weaknesses on offense they need to be addressed that drafting an off ball linebacker on the first two days of the draft is just tough to wrap my head around. Particularly given as you pointed out they really prioritize the DL so you know that’s probably coming before linebacker.

I do think it gets addressed but IMO that’s more of a 2023 piece when most of the rest of the team is put together. They’re doing this insanely slowly as much as fans bitch and moan and I think that’s just lower on the team building list especially when you’re trying to develop a quarterback.

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1 hour ago, derp said:

Yeah, I mean listen there’s nothing to say that the Jets are definitely going to draft like the 49ers but that’s the best model we have. I also think that prioritizing the front four meshes with the idea of building in the trenches on both sides of the ball that Douglas clearly believes in. And off ball linebackers are also down on the draft list anyway these days.

The team also has so many weaknesses on offense they need to be addressed that drafting an off ball linebacker on the first two days of the draft is just tough to wrap my head around. Particularly given as you pointed out they really prioritize the DL so you know that’s probably coming before linebacker.

I do think it gets addressed but IMO that’s more of a 2023 piece when most of the rest of the team is put together. They’re doing this insanely slowly as much as fans bitch and moan and I think that’s just lower on the team building list especially when you’re trying to develop a quarterback.

I agree and don’t think the team needs to spend a first rounder on a linebacker but it’s such a weak spot that looking to spend a 2nd rounder isn’t far fetched anymore. 

I remain lukewarm on Evan Neal so for me it’s Linderbaum or bust. Although I think Linderbaum/ Burks is my preferred pairing with Linderbaum/ Karlaftis as my second option. 

 

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52 minutes ago, kdels62 said:

I agree and don’t think the team needs to spend a first rounder on a linebacker but it’s such a weak spot that looking to spend a 2nd rounder isn’t far fetched anymore. 

I remain lukewarm on Evan Neal so for me it’s Linderbaum or bust. Although I think Linderbaum/ Burks is my preferred pairing with Linderbaum/ Karlaftis as my second option. 

 

What about Kenyon Green from A&M?

 

also, what does everyone think the board would be favoring if we ended up picking first overall? kayvon or trade?

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1 hour ago, kdels62 said:

I agree and don’t think the team needs to spend a first rounder on a linebacker but it’s such a weak spot that looking to spend a 2nd rounder isn’t far fetched anymore. 

I remain lukewarm on Evan Neal so for me it’s Linderbaum or bust. Although I think Linderbaum/ Burks is my preferred pairing with Linderbaum/ Karlaftis as my second option. 

 

It’s absolutely a weakness but you could argue that the positions that aren’t weak, important, and/or recently addressed enough to potentially warrant using a second round pick on are what - QB, LG, and maybe DT? The roster’s in shambles. Just think it’s low on the totem pole for the guys making decisions. That’s all.

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3 hours ago, derp said:

Yeah, I mean listen there’s nothing to say that the Jets are definitely going to draft like the 49ers but that’s the best model we have. I also think that prioritizing the front four meshes with the idea of building in the trenches on both sides of the ball that Douglas clearly believes in. And off ball linebackers are also down on the draft list anyway these days.

The team also has so many weaknesses on offense they need to be addressed that drafting an off ball linebacker on the first two days of the draft is just tough to wrap my head around. Particularly given as you pointed out they really prioritize the DL so you know that’s probably coming before linebacker.

I do think it gets addressed but IMO that’s more of a 2023 piece when most of the rest of the team is put together. They’re doing this insanely slowly as much as fans bitch and moan and I think that’s just lower on the team building list especially when you’re trying to develop a quarterback.

I think a lot will depend on how they evaluate Sherwood and Nasirlideen at the end of the season.  Either way I don’t see them taking a LBer with one of the first 5 picks next year.  If they want to continue the experiment with Sherwood and Nasirildeen then I think we’ll see some FA LBer signed in March. 

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39 minutes ago, Bay Ridge Jet said:

What about Kenyon Green from A&M?

 

also, what does everyone think the board would be favoring if we ended up picking first overall? kayvon or trade?

If we end up first overall then we book a hotel room in Vegas and sit there with a card that reads Kayvon Thibodeaux the day after the season ends until the draft starts. 

Kenyon Green is poor man’s AVT. Good player but not special not worth a top 15 pick in my mind.

Ikem Ekwonu is another guy who’s hype doesn’t match what I’ve seen. Dude whiffs a lot and get taken to town on power to speed moves. 

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37 minutes ago, kdels62 said:

If we end up first overall then we book a hotel room in Vegas and sit there with a card that reads Kayvon Thibodeaux the day after the season ends until the draft starts. 

Kenyon Green is poor man’s AVT. Good player but not special not worth a top 15 pick in my mind.

Ikem Ekwonu is another guy who’s hype doesn’t match what I’ve seen. Dude whiffs a lot and get taken to town on power to speed moves. 

Curious what you think of Jarrett Patterson on day 2. I want Linderbaum first and foremost, but he's played all over the line for ND and the versatility might be nice to use him at guard or backup center in a pinch, plus his mobility is a plus and seems like a good fit for ZBS.

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59 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

I think a lot will depend on how they evaluate Sherwood and Nasirlideen at the end of the season.  Either way I don’t see them taking a LBer with one of the first 5 picks next year.  If they want to continue the experiment with Sherwood and Nasirildeen then I think we’ll see some FA LBer signed in March. 

I personally feel very underwhelmed by Sherwood, but the coaching staff seems to like him a lot so he must be doing something right.

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55 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

I think a lot will depend on how they evaluate Sherwood and Nasirlideen at the end of the season.  Either way I don’t see them taking a LBer with one of the first 5 picks next year.  If they want to continue the experiment with Sherwood and Nasirildeen then I think we’ll see some FA LBer signed in March. 

Yeah this is pretty much where I expect things to land. Obviously things were horrific Sunday but not having Mosley really made things a lot worse, Davis hasn't played, and the safety conversions were bound to take some time.

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If the Jets end up with the first pick then it’s a no brainer. The pick should be Thibodeaux, he is Chase Young/Bosa talent level. Then Linderbaum or best guard with Seahawks pick.

Now I see a lot of mocks having the Jets take Daniel Faalele in round 2. A bit of a reach in my opinion that early. Too slow to play RT in the NFL and would get destroyed. With his size and power he may be a good RG project.

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41 minutes ago, Jets Voice of Reason said:

Curious what you think of Jarrett Patterson on day 2. I want Linderbaum first and foremost, but he's played all over the line for ND and the versatility might be nice to use him at guard or backup center in a pinch, plus his mobility is a plus and seems like a good fit for ZBS.

My thoughts on Patterson without a deep dive and just from watching some ND games were that he’s basically Linderbaum with average traits. Slower, weaker, less anchor, less aggression, and yet still very sound. 3rd round prospect type that can be elevated by narrative. I need to look at more but that’s the thoughts on him that I’ve had all year. 

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37 minutes ago, HtownJet said:

If the Jets end up with the first pick then it’s a no brainer. The pick should be Thibodeaux, he is Chase Young/Bosa talent level. Then Linderbaum or best guard with Seahawks pick.

Now I see a lot of mocks having the Jets take Daniel Faalele in round 2. A bit of a reach in my opinion that early. Too slow to play RT in the NFL and would get destroyed. With his size and power he may be a good RG project.

Don't think there's been a guard that tall in NFL history. Too easy for DT's to get under his pads. Not to say that means he's athletic enough for tackle but I think guard is a non starter.

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1 hour ago, HtownJet said:

If the Jets end up with the first pick then it’s a no brainer. The pick should be Thibodeaux, he is Chase Young/Bosa talent level. Then Linderbaum or best guard with Seahawks pick.

Now I see a lot of mocks having the Jets take Daniel Faalele in round 2. A bit of a reach in my opinion that early. Too slow to play RT in the NFL and would get destroyed. With his size and power he may be a good RG project.

A 6’9 400lb guard?? He’d get wrecked in this scheme. The average guard on the 9ers was around 6’3 300. They need to be athletic to pull and move guys in space.

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I don’t think the Jets go tackle early enough for it to matter, though a lot depends on how the rest of Becton’s season goes, but depending on that and where the Jets’ pick lands Charles Cross may be worth a bit of a dive. Was well regarded as a recruit, seems to be playing well against quality competition, and doesn’t go to a school that’s going to lead to him being overhyped as a prospect. I know those here have questions on Neal, doesn’t seem out of the realm of possibility that Cross is just a little cleaner of a prospect.

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On 10/21/2021 at 8:29 PM, Paradis said:

eh, like @sec101row23 just outlined, that's a product of more than just JR. 

Although i like him as the best TE in class (at least as of today) I don't know if that will reflect the league perception. JR going in round 2/3 would be phenomenal for us. It's my view that his career as a pro will be an "out of nowhere" experience for many. 

TE's Stonger and Ruckert - grab both these guys - they are athletic, and have ridiculous upside. Zach would be goo goo ga ga 

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On 10/18/2021 at 3:50 PM, Paradis said:

You have to think that (depending our final record) Linderbaum to the Jets will be the most popular/common mocked picks in every draft published. Unfortunately the majority of those 1-5 teams are as bad as we are - and many a QB in yr1... Linderbaum might go top 5

No way. Thefre's just to many top prospects out there. Thib, Neal, Karalaftis, Stingley, Hutchinson,  Hamilton, Olave and I havent even mentioned Qb's who are ALWAYS reached for like Howell, Coarral, Willis, Rattler, Strong

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