Other teams optimism

[Alka]

6 hours ago, WowOhWow said:

Like many, I've got all the "feels" as it relates to this team.  I am a big fan of JD, love the Salah hire (and coordinators/staff), like our draft class, FA additions, etc.  Basically I've been completely re-energized as a Jets fan and literally can't wait for more practices to discuss, pre-season, etc.  

That said, I was with a Bills fan yesterday who feels the same way.  I called my nephew (Miami fan) and friend from Boston and they both feel the same way.  They feel their teams have upgraded, are better, etc.

It got me thinking...if our division rivals all believe they got better (and I don't think it's a question that our organization, talent, etc. has improved) did we close the gap enough, did we close it a lot, a little, etc.

I believe we were so inept in so many areas that even though our rivals got better we closed the gap considerably.  We're not on par with them yet but in the NFL competency alone can win you games...and I believe we will be competent, with talent potentially catching up the more the season progresses.

I believe the Bills are the lead dogs and we can find ourselves on par with the other two, which means we should be in a lot of games this year with a chance to win a lot of them.

Am I off?

I correctly predicted losing seasons each of the last 2 years on this board, and both times, was ridiculed.  I feel that I am a realist, so I will tell you the good and the bad:

The Bad:

1. The tight ends are below average, and we have a rookie quarterback.  

2. We have unproven cornerbacks, and while I like our starting linebacker corps, I feel the the depth is not there. 

3. No superstar running backs, and our right guard is the weak point of the offensive line.

These translate into a very uneven team this year.  The team got better, but with a rookie QB, unproven cornerbacks and still holes at tight end and right guard, I predict the Jets will struggle in many games that they will be competitive in.

The Good:

1. Wide receiver group is respectable.  Offensive line is respectable.  Quarterback will prove to be respectable, but still a rookie.

2. Defensive line will excel.  Starting linebackers will be respectable.  Cornerbacks will struggle and cost the Jets games.

This translates into a team "on the rise".  No one will bully this Jets team, and the direction of the organization is pointing up for once in a long time.

My optimistic view is that this Jets team will be 9-8 this season.  My pessimistic view is that this Jets team will be 8-9 this season.  

This is a big hurdle up, but will be still disappointing to most Jets fans.  Things are getting better.  

[Jetscode1]

7 hours ago, WowOhWow said:

Like many, I've got all the "feels" as it relates to this team.  I am a big fan of JD, love the Salah hire (and coordinators/staff), like our draft class, FA additions, etc.  Basically I've been completely re-energized as a Jets fan and literally can't wait for more practices to discuss, pre-season, etc.  

That said, I was with a Bills fan yesterday who feels the same way.  I called my nephew (Miami fan) and friend from Boston and they both feel the same way.  They feel their teams have upgraded, are better, etc.

It got me thinking...if our division rivals all believe they got better (and I don't think it's a question that our organization, talent, etc. has improved) did we close the gap enough, did we close it a lot, a little, etc.

I believe we were so inept in so many areas that even though our rivals got better we closed the gap considerably.  We're not on par with them yet but in the NFL competency alone can win you games...and I believe we will be competent, with talent potentially catching up the more the season progresses.

I believe the Bills are the lead dogs and we can find ourselves on par with the other two, which means we should be in a lot of games this year with a chance to win a lot of them.

Am I off?

Good thread.  I agree the Jets finally moved the needle, at least I'm confident they have.  Great HC hire, excellent draft, and some feel good buzz from the OTAs.  We really won't know what we got until they start playing in the fall.  

As far as the others, Buffalo looks real and if you buy into the analysts they had a better than average draft.  I fully expect them to compete for the AFC Championship this year.  Too many good decisions from the front office and I like the coaching staff.

Miami has a decent HC in Flores.  I was impressed how they played last year but I'm still not sold on Tua at the NFL level.  They did pick up Fuller and Waddle to expand the passing game threats but ultimately it comes down to Tua's improvement and they won't have Fitzpatrick to bail him out this year.  I would not be surprised to see them out of the hunt this year.

Hard to ever doubt the Patriots with Belicheck but you know what?  The Patriots suck!  Without Brady they are a below average football club and Cam did not exactly inspire the team last year.  I expect a continues drop off from last year.  

Bottom line:  I don't think you're off.  Maybe I'm drinking the kool aid a bit as well but I like the new vibe (coaching) and the draft (front office) and maybe, just maybe the Jets are on an upward trajectory.

[Jetsfan80]

20 hours ago, The Crusher said:

For the guy that started the rookie HC hall of Shame you all of a sudden got a confidence boner that’s still growing  for  a team  full of rookies. Coaches, QB and several key positions. Good for you, 

“Growing confidence boner” will now be a regularly used phrase in my lexicon until the day I die.  Thank you for this. 

[Maynard13]

On 7/16/2021 at 1:14 PM, freestater said:

Getting rid of this idiot makes us the most improved of the bunch. 

How do you not fire him immediately following that embarrassing press conference just shows how inept this franchise is led by Woody ‘no balls’ Johnson. 

[MichaelScott]

The Bills are clearly still in the convo at the top of the league until they fall off and prove otherwise. 

I do believe Miami is ahead of us by a pretty good amount as far as building their roster. They are a talented team with 10 wins last year that should be able to grab a Wildcard and give the Bills some competition for the division. Obviously most of this depends on Tua. Another year removed from his injury alone should help significantly. 

The Pats... Personally, I'm not a believer in their spending spree this year. It STINKS of desperation and is so completely contrary to anything BB has believed in during his *dynasty. I do believe it's more likely to blow up in their face and they will miss the playoffs for a second season. However, if Jones takes the league by storm and is the second coming, all bets are out the window and he are screwed on multiple levels. So maybe this would be the most Jetsy like outcome. 

[Maynard13]

18 hours ago, GREENBEAN said:

I am just happy to have the opportunity to watch a Bradyless  BB have to scramble and try to play catch up while the division is no longer packed full of pushovers. his legend will diminish and I'm happy about it. 

Oh, and the Jets are winning the division ?

6 Super Bowl wins. Yea that record is going to go down soon. I get the hate @ BB, but he’s one of the legendary HC’s in the NFL. And he was our HC for 5 minutes, so there. 

[Savage69]

On 7/16/2021 at 1:20 PM, UntouchableCrew said:

Most fans think their team had a good offseason and will be better next year. Nobody wants to believe things clearly got worse and it's going to be a long season. Maybe Lions fans are reading the room and recognizing they're in for a rebuild.

Personally we were far enough away from contention last year that I'm not overly worried about the distance between us and the Bills. I just want to see a competitive team that plays with fire, a competent offense, and smart coaching. If we're hovering around .500 and in every game I'm okay with that. Next year is when you want to make that leap to the playoffs.

As far as the division:

Bills are very good and didn't lose much. They're the runaway favorites to win the division, IMO. I only see serious regression from them if Allen is injured or really takes a step back.

Dolphins look better on paper -- outside of the QB position where they may have regressed. Tua is the key factor there. If he plays like he did last year I can't see them making much noise.

Pats look better (they had a ton of opt outs last year and signed a bunch of FAs) but I'm not convinced it will matter. They felt very tired last year and Cam looked shot.

Tua had a decent rookie year but without Fitz coming in and helping they don't go 10-6.. If Tua doesn't progress this year will Watson be a Fin next year?? 

[Larz]

I’m the immortal words of the late Jim fassel :

“You’ve got to do a better job of getting better than the other guy “

Almost every team can say that they are better 

[Jet Nut]

22 hours ago, SAR I said:

Only because the schedule is so ridiculously easy and the roster, though young, is no different in talent-level than the 2019 Jets who figured out a way to win 7 with 18 players on IR.

SAR I

Is this the same logic you used for your 5-0 start prediction under the king of Florham park or whatever you knighted him?

[JohnnyLV]

23 hours ago, Alka said:

I correctly predicted losing seasons each of the last 2 years on this board, and both times, was ridiculed.  I feel that I am a realist, so I will tell you the good and the bad:

The Bad:

1. The tight ends are below average, and we have a rookie quarterback.  

2. We have unproven cornerbacks, and while I like our starting linebacker corps, I feel the the depth is not there. 

3. No superstar running backs, and our right guard is the weak point of the offensive line.

These translate into a very uneven team this year.  The team got better, but with a rookie QB, unproven cornerbacks and still holes at tight end and right guard, I predict the Jets will struggle in many games that they will be competitive in.

The Good:

1. Wide receiver group is respectable.  Offensive line is respectable.  Quarterback will prove to be respectable, but still a rookie.

2. Defensive line will excel.  Starting linebackers will be respectable.  Cornerbacks will struggle and cost the Jets games.

This translates into a team "on the rise".  No one will bully this Jets team, and the direction of the organization is pointing up for once in a long time.

My optimistic view is that this Jets team will be 9-8 this season.  My pessimistic view is that this Jets team will be 8-9 this season.  

This is a big hurdle up, but will be still disappointing to most Jets fans.  Things are getting better.  

TE group will not hurt us., Corners are an order of magnitude less important than in the dumb defenses we have run since Rex and our WR are FAR better than respectable. And Zach will be OROY. We win 10 games at least.

[Savage69]

4 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

Is this the same logic you used for your 5-0 start prediction under the king of Florham park or whatever you knighted him?

 

When has Sar used logic??

[jgb]

90% of Jets fans were optimistic going into last season based on fan polling. What you are experiencing is the normal cycle of fandom.

[jgb]

10 hours ago, johnnysd said:

TE group will not hurt us., Corners are an order of magnitude less important than in the dumb defenses we have run since Rex and our WR are FAR better than respectable. And Zach will be OROY. We win 10 games at least.

Oh boy. 

[Long Island Leprechaun]

On 7/16/2021 at 4:57 PM, SAR I said:

There are 10 winnable games on the schedule and that’s with a 2-4 division record.  

We only face 3 legitimate quarterbacks the whole year.  

We have a 9th home game and a game on a neutral field. 

Tampa Bay and Buffalo will likely be resting their starters in the freezing January cold.  

We should expect 8 wins. 10 is not too crazy.  Look at the schedule.  Look at the improved roster.  Look at the great coaching staff. 

SAR I

Would you think I'm crazy if I said we'd start 4-1? Ah, the memories... lol

[jgb]

On 7/17/2021 at 1:41 AM, Alka said:

I correctly predicted losing seasons each of the last 2 years on this board, and both times, was ridiculed.  I feel that I am a realist, so I will tell you the good and the bad:

The Bad:

1. The tight ends are below average, and we have a rookie quarterback.  

2. We have unproven cornerbacks, and while I like our starting linebacker corps, I feel the the depth is not there. 

3. No superstar running backs, and our right guard is the weak point of the offensive line.

These translate into a very uneven team this year.  The team got better, but with a rookie QB, unproven cornerbacks and still holes at tight end and right guard, I predict the Jets will struggle in many games that they will be competitive in.

The Good:

1. Wide receiver group is respectable.  Offensive line is respectable.  Quarterback will prove to be respectable, but still a rookie.

2. Defensive line will excel.  Starting linebackers will be respectable.  Cornerbacks will struggle and cost the Jets games.

This translates into a team "on the rise".  No one will bully this Jets team, and the direction of the organization is pointing up for once in a long time.

My optimistic view is that this Jets team will be 9-8 this season.  My pessimistic view is that this Jets team will be 8-9 this season.  

This is a big hurdle up, but will be still disappointing to most Jets fans.  Things are getting better.  

Kudos for going bold and calling an upside and downside with only a 1 point swing. I’m less ballsy. 4-13 if Wilson sucks, 7-10/8-9 if he’s really good for a rookie. Our defense is gonna be pretty bad.

[JustInFudge]

This is still a last place team in the division but they’re at least close to an NFL team now.  If that’s closing the gap, sure!

[Alka]

4 hours ago, jgb said:

Kudos for going bold and calling an upside and downside with only a 1 point swing. I’m less ballsy. 4-13 if Wilson sucks, 7-10/8-9 if he’s really good for a rookie. Our defense is gonna be pretty bad.

I find you low ball number something that just will not happen, unless G-d forbid Wilson gets a season ending injury.  The Jets with their crappy offensive, no wide recievers, garbage offensive line, old age running back and garbage head coaching should have won minimum 3 games last year, which includes the gift to the Raiders.  With an extra game this year, and better players, solid left side of the offensive line and a respectable right tackle, coaching etc,  you are giving the Jets just 1 extra win?   I would be very happy to bet you some serious money on that one.

You say that the defense will be pretty bad?  Their front defensive line should be a top 15 line in the NFL at the least.  I can't make any predictions on the rest of the defense, but "pretty bad" would not be the phrase I would use.  "Work in progress",  "lower 15 overall defense" perhaps.  

There are just too many open questions to even make any predictions on the defense, since we just don't know how CJ Moseley is going to play.  If he is the CJ Moseley of old, then the Jets will be respectable, with still open questions regarding their cornerbacks.

The high water mark for you of 7 wins is just 1 win away from my lowball number, so I can live with your predication of 7 wins, but your 4-13 prediction is just off base.

[Alka]

16 hours ago, johnnysd said:

TE group will not hurt us., Corners are an order of magnitude less important than in the dumb defenses we have run since Rex and our WR are FAR better than respectable. And Zach will be OROY. We win 10 games at least.

I hope you are right!!  And I don't think your 10 win prediction is crazy, but more than that is just unrealistic.  I will stick to my 8-9 win prediction.  We will circle back if you remember to see what which one of us is right.

[jgb]

9 minutes ago, Alka said:

I find you low ball number something that just will not happen, unless G-d forbid Wilson gets a season ending injury.  The Jets with their crappy offensive, no wide recievers, garbage offensive line, old age running back and garbage head coaching should have won minimum 3 games last year, which includes the gift to the Raiders.  With an extra game this year, and better players, solid left side of the offensive line and a respectable right tackle, coaching etc,  you are giving the Jets just 1 extra win?   I would be very happy to bet you some serious money on that one.

You say that the defense will be pretty bad?  Their front defensive line should be a top 15 line in the NFL at the least.  I can't make any predictions on the rest of the defense, but "pretty bad" would not be the phrase I would use.  "Work in progress",  "lower 15 overall defense" perhaps.  

There are just too many open questions to even make any predictions on the defense, since we just don't know how CJ Moseley is going to play.  If he is the CJ Moseley of old, then the Jets will be respectable, with still open questions regarding their cornerbacks.

The high water mark for you of 7 wins is just 1 win away from my lowball number, so I can live with your predication of 7 wins, but your 4-13 prediction is just off base.

You make good points and I’m definitely not confident enough in my low ball prediction to make a bet just my feeling — which is worth spit. I do have that sinking feeling Jets will give up one of the most air-yards-against this season, though. Which may seem pessimistic, at first. But it will mean our offense is good enough to keep opponents throwing late.

[Jet Nut]

On 7/16/2021 at 7:41 PM, Alka said:

I correctly predicted losing seasons each of the last 2 years on this board

[jgb]

6 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

To stick up for Alka here — what seems obvious now was definitely attacked relentlessly at the time. I also called two terrible seasons and was butt fumbled to oblivion.

[Jimmy 2 Times]

On 7/16/2021 at 12:28 PM, johnnysd said:

Most years there is a team that has a big unexpected drop off. Even without injuries Seattle seems the best candidate. They got worse, all of their division competition got better and they have a brutal schedule. Couple that with R Wilson seeming to lose a step and not really excelling at being the focal point of the offense it seems that Seattle is primed for a big fall. If Wilson went down they could be really bad.

Just speculation here, but how much is Diggs a factor to Allen suddenly being elite?  

It makes me think of Dante Culpepper who was a pro bowler with Moss then sucked in Miami without him.  

Having Diggs helps read the defenses.  

-If they roll coverage towards him someone else is open.  

-If they don't, then throw it to him.  

-If he isn't open, then Allen runs.  

 

He's in for a big regression if Diggs gets hurt or his play drops off. 

[JohnnyLV]

53 minutes ago, Jimmy 2 Times said:

Just speculation here, but how much is Diggs a factor to Allen suddenly being elite?  

It makes me think of Dante Culpepper who was a pro bowler with Moss then sucked in Miami without him.  

Having Diggs helps read the defenses.  

-If they roll coverage towards him someone else is open.  

-If they don't, then throw it to him.  

-If he isn't open, then Allen runs.  

 

He's in for a big regression if Digs gets hurt or his play drops off. 

Diggs was gigantic in terms of Allen's emergence.  We will see if he can sustain that performance. I think he could really regress or he could just be elite. I suspect teams will defend him better and at times he seemed like same guy just having things go his way.

[peebag]

everyone needs

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, Jimmy 2 Times said:

It makes me think of Dante Culpepper who was a pro bowler with Moss then sucked in Miami without him.  

Except in fairness to Culpepper when he got to Miami he was playing on a knee that threatened to keep him from walking and he was nowhere near the QB he was in Minny with or without Moss.  Add to it that Diggs makes cover corners look bad, what kind of defense has a S, even one who can cover have Diggs as his man?  

[NYJ1]

On 7/16/2021 at 12:41 PM, WowOhWow said:

Like many, I've got all the "feels" as it relates to this team.  I am a big fan of JD, love the Salah hire (and coordinators/staff), like our draft class, FA additions, etc.  Basically I've been completely re-energized as a Jets fan and literally can't wait for more practices to discuss, pre-season, etc.  

That said, I was with a Bills fan yesterday who feels the same way.  I called my nephew (Miami fan) and friend from Boston and they both feel the same way.  They feel their teams have upgraded, are better, etc.

It got me thinking...if our division rivals all believe they got better (and I don't think it's a question that our organization, talent, etc. has improved) did we close the gap enough, did we close it a lot, a little, etc.

I believe we were so inept in so many areas that even though our rivals got better we closed the gap considerably.  We're not on par with them yet but in the NFL competency alone can win you games...and I believe we will be competent, with talent potentially catching up the more the season progresses.

I believe the Bills are the lead dogs and we can find ourselves on par with the other two, which means we should be in a lot of games this year with a chance to win a lot of them.

Am I off?

I think you're pretty much dead on but it really all boils down to how many wins do you think the Jets will have? I think they'll somewhere around 8-9. A middle of the pack team. Not good enough to make the playoffs but vastly improved from 2-14. 

[Buffalo 24 7]

Jets - They improved their pass rush, O-line and LBs, but most of the secondary is in a bad spot. The WR group has the ingredients to be good, but it is still below average unless the Mims and Moore exceed expectations for young WRs. 

Miami - They improved their WR group, but their Offensive line is still unproven. They downgraded at QB until proven otherwise. Their defense also might not be able to repeat their success from last year.

Bills - They managed to maintain 21/22 starters but the pass rush and running game are still questionable. The starting pass rushers on the Bills are both over 32 years old and their replacements are 1st or 2nd year players. 

Patriots - Their O-line is good, but their WR group is still the worst in the league. Their defense is aging, but they also got back a few starters from opt-outs and injuries. They could easily be a 10+ win team with better QB play. 

[Jet Nut]

So its not only writers and broadcasters comments that send us into a deep depression or to turn a hissy fit we have to now add whatever fans are other teams are saying too?  

I know I for one have never really concerned about what braindead Fish fans think, I should though?

[jgb]

18 hours ago, peebag said:

everyone needs

Yep. I learned to compartmentalize hope from expectations long ago with this team. I haven't been disappointed by the Jets in a long time.

[Facts]

20 hours ago, Jimmy 2 Times said:

He's in for a big regression if his play drops off. 

This deserves a captain obvious award of the century.

[Facts]

Patriots - Getting a lot of Covid guys back but their QB still sucks. I still see them somehow scraping together 9-10 wins though.

Dolphins - One of the most complete rosters in the NFL outside of QB. Tua is the main reason they’ll win less than 11 games in my opinion. I’m still surprised they didn’t try to grab Fields.

Jets - Sorry, don’t want to go there.

Bills - I think Allen is the real deal, not a one year wonder. His arm strength and elusiveness are both elite and those things don’t just go away. They’ll be 12+ wins unless Allen gets hurt.

[Matt39]

On 7/16/2021 at 12:41 PM, WowOhWow said:

Like many, I've got all the "feels" as it relates to this team.  I am a big fan of JD, love the Salah hire (and coordinators/staff), like our draft class, FA additions, etc.  Basically I've been completely re-energized as a Jets fan and literally can't wait for more practices to discuss, pre-season, etc.  

That said, I was with a Bills fan yesterday who feels the same way.  I called my nephew (Miami fan) and friend from Boston and they both feel the same way.  They feel their teams have upgraded, are better, etc.

It got me thinking...if our division rivals all believe they got better (and I don't think it's a question that our organization, talent, etc. has improved) did we close the gap enough, did we close it a lot, a little, etc.

I believe we were so inept in so many areas that even though our rivals got better we closed the gap considerably.  We're not on par with them yet but in the NFL competency alone can win you games...and I believe we will be competent, with talent potentially catching up the more the season progresses.

I believe the Bills are the lead dogs and we can find ourselves on par with the other two, which means we should be in a lot of games this year with a chance to win a lot of them.

Am I off?

I mean as it currently stands the Jets are the 4th team in the division. Football Outsiders projected the Jets to be the worst team in football. They have a long way to go. What you want to see is Wilson show he’s the guy early.

[jgb]

 

On 7/17/2021 at 8:16 PM, MichaelScott said:

The Bills are clearly still in the convo at the top of the league until they fall off and prove otherwise. 

I do believe Miami is ahead of us by a pretty good amount as far as building their roster. They are a talented team with 10 wins last year that should be able to grab a Wildcard and give the Bills some competition for the division. Obviously most of this depends on Tua. Another year removed from his injury alone should help significantly. 

The Pats... Personally, I'm not a believer in their spending spree this year. It STINKS of desperation and is so completely contrary to anything BB has believed in during his *dynasty. I do believe it's more likely to blow up in their face and they will miss the playoffs for a second season. However, if Jones takes the league by storm and is the second coming, all bets are out the window and he are screwed on multiple levels. So maybe this would be the most Jetsy like outcome. 

If Darnold had any 10-game stretch like Tua's only 10 NFL games to date, he might still be here.

On 7/18/2021 at 1:20 PM, Long Island Leprechaun said:

Would you think I'm crazy if I said we'd start 4-1? Ah, the memories... lol

SAR will just keep throwing out crazy takes. When they fail, he excuses them away by counting "mental wins if this or that." One day he'll get one right by sheer chance. Then God help us all.

[jeremy2020]

20 hours ago, Jimmy 2 Times said:

Just speculation here, but how much is Diggs a factor to Allen suddenly being elite?  

It makes me think of Dante Culpepper who was a pro bowler with Moss then sucked in Miami without him.  

Having Diggs helps read the defenses.  

-If they roll coverage towards him someone else is open.  

-If they don't, then throw it to him.  

-If he isn't open, then Allen runs.  

He's in for a big regression if Diggs gets hurt or his play drops off. 

Diggs was certainly a huge help, but Allen made a big jump each season. Pretending that Diggs is the only reason that Allen is good seems more like hope than reality. 

[Biggs]

I expect Zach as a rookie to give us the best QB play we have had since Pennington came off the bench to replace Vinny T.   He's the Dan Marino of this draft class.   Marino went 7 and 2 as a rookie when he finally got the start.

If Zach isn't flat out great this team will suck for another decade.  It he's great were going to be in the hunt for the playoffs.  

Saleh got it dead wrong.  Zach has to lift the team.  I think he does it.