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Zach represented by Bosa's team and JD won't budge..


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When Zach forces his way to Seattle you’ll all be cheering Joe Douglas as a genius for getting draft picks.   SAR I

You’re a master in the art of bad posting, but this might be your opus.      

It's a problem of motivation Bob. I work my ass off and Initech ships a few extra units, I don't see another dime, so where's the motivation? And here's another thing, I have eight different bosses ri

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We will will see how dug in Zach and and his camp are on offset language. Lawrence got it but jets never do offset language. I would be happily surprised if Zach gets to camp on time. Darnold went through the same thing and missed 3 days. He did not get offset language but I think got his bonus paid in full on signing.

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Ive wasted time on this.   I don't know why.  Here are the terms that cause issues:

1) Offsets. If a player gets cut and signed by another team, what the second team pays the Jets wouldn't need to pay that portion.  

2) Voidable for on or off the field suspensions or fines.  (Top picks usually get this changed to voidable for suspensions only - the next CBA should get rid.of this). 

3) When the bonus gets paid. (The Chargers have a holdout about this every year and the Jets might play games here as well) 

The Lawrence deal seems standard for top picks.  Wilson should expect the same deal and sign nothing less. - No offsets, Voidable for suspensions only, paid the whole bonus days after signing.  

 

Why do people think Darnold had offsets?  I just find stuff like this:

-&----5
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Jets finally do the smart thing and end their contract standoff with Sam Darnold

Jets finally do the smart thing and end their contract standoff with Sam Darnold

 
Jul 30, 2018 at 2:03 pm ET1 min read
 
 
 
 

The Sam Darnold dispute with the Jets was one of the more absurd disputes we've seen in quite some time, with New York potentially alienating the No. 3 overall pick over contractual language that, given what they've invested in Darnold, seemed simply nonsensical.

Good news: the holdout is over, with Darnold hammering out a deal with the Jets and announcing the move via Twitter.

It is reportedly a four-year, $30.25 million fully guaranteed deal, according to Ian Rapoport. There were two rumored holdups on the Darnold contract, both of which were going to make the Jets look like they didn't know what they were doing. 

More on the NFL

On the first, there was the Jets pushing for offset language, which basically means if he was cut by the Jets in the first four years of his deal, they wouldn't have to pay him whatever amount he received from another team who signed him. Essentially, offset language keeps him from "double dipping." But this is so, so dumb for a No. 3 overall pick and a franchise quarterback: if you cut him within four years, the ramifications are so much worse than a couple million dollars for the franchise. Everyone is fired and everything is awful if Darnold is playing on another team before the end of his rookie deal. 

 

And the second part was reportedly about the Jets wanting to take away guarantees from Darnold if he was suspended or fined for a substance abuse violation, a PED violation or a violation of personal conduct policy. It's a way of protecting the team, but it is a slap in the face to Darnold to ask for that. 

We'll wait and see what the language says, but one would assume Darnold didn't sign off on a deal involving either.

Having talked briefly with Darnold on the Pick Six Podcast a few weeks ago, it's very clear how focused and locked in he is on being a good person and a good teammate. This is a level-headed 21-year-old face of the franchise. The Jets needed to skip the typical contractual B.S. and get him into camp so he can maximize his reps. 

 

Good on them for getting it done before the PR hit became extremely ugly

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6 hours ago, peebag said:

DWC has spammed numerous Jet fan boards, here's his modus operandi:

1 - joins board, starts flaming with posts longer than anything Tolstoy might come up with if he was Jets fan.

2 - is asked politely to tone down the posts, ignores advice.

3 -  gets into arguments, goes out in a blaze of non glory

4 - wash, rinse, repeat.

hahahah tolstoy ..love the ref

 

Well rgr on all, i haven't seen alot of that - not saying it is not true, but the responses i have seen are terrible  to dwc ... just seems odd and out of place considering general decorum on Jetnation is friendly. 

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6 hours ago, Embrace the Suck said:

You should probably wait for some actual information prior to extrapolating the worst possible scenario about his character. I doubt offset language is a concern of his since as you mentioned he isn't coming from a economically poor family.

There aren't many things that can be negotiated since length of contract and salary are determined by the CBA. So offset language and how much of the CBA-specified salary is signing bonus and how much is game checks are just about ALL Wilson can negotiate.

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6 hours ago, Embrace the Suck said:

Revis held out as a rookie too... Did you understand then when he was unproven and accomplished absolutely nothing on an NFL level? Adams wasn't on the last year of his contract. He wanted a new one halfway through his rookie contract. Seems like semantics...

Revis was back in the day when his salary wasn't dictated by the CBA. Whole different world.

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6 hours ago, Matt39 said:

I mean this is the Johnsons haggling over contract minutiae that doesn’t matter at all. You made Wilson the second pick of the draft, give him the same contract as Lawrence and move on. 

fair...i suppose - but also equally fair to have a standard contract set up for picks that does not change year to year...that Joe sets based on experience...kids could ask for everything in the sky on thier deal - saying no is not necessarily a bad thing and depending on what it is could set a horrible precedent. Putting the team at risk. so just as fair to say do a good contract and screw that agent.

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1 hour ago, Action Zachtion said:

Ive wasted time on this.   I don't know why.  Here are the terms that cause issues:

1) Offsets. If a player gets cut and signed by another team, what the second team pays the Jets wouldn't need to pay that portion.  

2) Voidable for on or off the field suspensions or fines.  (Top picks usually get this changed to voidable for suspensions only - the next CBA should get rid.of this). 

3) When the bonus gets paid. (The Chargers have a holdout about this every year and the Jets might play games here as well) 

The Lawrence deal seems standard for top picks.  Wilson should expect the same deal and sign nothing less. - No offsets, Voidable for suspensions only, paid the whole bonus days after signing.  

 

Why do people think Darnold had offsets?  I just find stuff like this:

-&----5
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Jets finally do the smart thing and end their contract standoff with Sam Darnold

Jets finally do the smart thing and end their contract standoff with Sam Darnold

 
Jul 30, 2018 at 2:03 pm ET1 min read
 
 
 
 

The Sam Darnold dispute with the Jets was one of the more absurd disputes we've seen in quite some time, with New York potentially alienating the No. 3 overall pick over contractual language that, given what they've invested in Darnold, seemed simply nonsensical.

Good news: the holdout is over, with Darnold hammering out a deal with the Jets and announcing the move via Twitter.

It is reportedly a four-year, $30.25 million fully guaranteed deal, according to Ian Rapoport. There were two rumored holdups on the Darnold contract, both of which were going to make the Jets look like they didn't know what they were doing. 

More on the NFL

On the first, there was the Jets pushing for offset language, which basically means if he was cut by the Jets in the first four years of his deal, they wouldn't have to pay him whatever amount he received from another team who signed him. Essentially, offset language keeps him from "double dipping." But this is so, so dumb for a No. 3 overall pick and a franchise quarterback: if you cut him within four years, the ramifications are so much worse than a couple million dollars for the franchise. Everyone is fired and everything is awful if Darnold is playing on another team before the end of his rookie deal. 

 

And the second part was reportedly about the Jets wanting to take away guarantees from Darnold if he was suspended or fined for a substance abuse violation, a PED violation or a violation of personal conduct policy. It's a way of protecting the team, but it is a slap in the face to Darnold to ask for that. 

We'll wait and see what the language says, but one would assume Darnold didn't sign off on a deal involving either.

Having talked briefly with Darnold on the Pick Six Podcast a few weeks ago, it's very clear how focused and locked in he is on being a good person and a good teammate. This is a level-headed 21-year-old face of the franchise. The Jets needed to skip the typical contractual B.S. and get him into camp so he can maximize his reps. 

 

Good on them for getting it done before the PR hit became extremely ugly

this is terrible thinking...yeah who cares a couple million dollars...etc. 

YEAH well i care. if a pick doenst work out like darnold - despite it not really being his fault - I do not think the team should be on the hook for the deal. Any rook has done ziltch in the league. This article makes like of it like the team is stupid - no bro the team is stupid if they dont care about it. I am so tired of paying money to guisy that dont deserve. it hold strong Joe!!

Second part, its a slap in the face??really no bro if a kid does drugs or whatever it should be standard to protect the team from his terrible decisions. Last time i check pretty much every new job I have ever held had some sort of probation perioud or process to protect them selves from drug abuse etc. This article is like well it will hurt his feelings...give me a break again who wrote this stupid article.

The only real thing I would say they needs to be argued or negotiated in the bonus payouts..but again this should be best for the team not the player. I would not be mad at the team paying those bonus..but I do think overall zach should sing a team standard and that is it, a standard that joe sets out.

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6 hours ago, IndianaJet said:

Did it ever dawn on anyone that Knapp's death and funeral has slowed the process down since I would imagine JD and most of the coaching staff traveled to Cali for the funeral and/or visitation.

I also wouldn't be surprised if Zach has agreed to terms, but the Jets didn't want to announce the signing until Zach was actually in NY to pose for the obligatory signing pic.  Zach can't do that if he's in Cali for the funeral.

They also may not have wanted to announce the signing so close to coach Knapp's death.

I wouldn't be shocked at all if we get the Zach has signed announcement today.

 

Spot on (I think).

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10 hours ago, Bronx said:

He needs to miss ZERO days at camp with all the variables surrounding this team. 

If he’s the real deal it won’t make any difference.

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29 minutes ago, viffer said:

Revis was back in the day when his salary wasn't dictated by the CBA. Whole different world.

Yeah, and they made a lot more, and he still held out. In fact, it seems worse to have done it back then.

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32 minutes ago, BornJetsFan1983 said:

this is terrible thinking...yeah who cares a couple million dollars...etc. 

YEAH well i care. if a pick doenst work out like darnold - despite it not really being his fault - I do not think the team should be on the hook for the deal. Any rook has done ziltch in the league. This article makes like of it like the team is stupid - no bro the team is stupid if they dont care about it. I am so tired of paying money to guisy that dont deserve. it hold strong Joe!!

Second part, its a slap in the face??really no bro if a kid does drugs or whatever it should be standard to protect the team from his terrible decisions. Last time i check pretty much every new job I have ever held had some sort of probation perioud or process to protect them selves from drug abuse etc. This article is like well it will hurt his feelings...give me a break again who wrote this stupid article.

The only real thing I would say they needs to be argued or negotiated in the bonus payouts..but again this should be best for the team not the player. I would not be mad at the team paying those bonus..but I do think overall zach should sing a team standard and that is it, a standard that joe sets out.

Lawrence set the market.  Why would Wilson sign a worse deal?  

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Just now, freestater said:

This Is Fine GIF

Once the Johnsons get back from their Mediterranean  cruise in August I’m sure this will be settled. No need to panic.

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7 hours ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

He's a Quarterback and supposed to be "team leader" but yet he's the only Jets rookie unsigned and 1 of only 2 NFL rookies unsigned throughout the entire NFL? That's absolutely disgusting

So because youre a QB and team leader he should take whatever the team is offering?  Did Lawrence and the other 1st rounders youre pointing to?  Its a business, his teammates dont care that hes taking care of business.  Happens all the time is the way to look at it, he'll be in to practice.  

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Zach has been too media savvy to be bragging about California when he’s supposed to be in Jersey. This is just to put pressure on the Jets FO.

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4 minutes ago, BigRy56 said:

This is all for nothing. Does anybody think he’s really not going to sign? JD and his team won’t come to an agreement? Come on lol

Why would the Johnsons dig their heels in on offset language again? They took Wilson second to be their QB for the next four years. There’s nothing to negotiate here. 

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7 hours ago, Defense Wins Championships said:

I don't hate the kid. I've raved about him all offseason. 

I'm hypothetically speaking. 

Because if he reports late to training camp? And becomes a team distraction? And puts himself ahead of his teammates and coaches? 

Well then yes, he'll deserve all the hehe he receives.

I actually can't wait for him to sign. And it's bothering me that every NFL rookie has signed except for him (and 1 other player).

When did you start watching football, yesterday?

Negotiating your contract isnt a distraction to anyone.  It doesnt put him ahead of his teammates and coaches.  

Its business, his teammates understand this.  

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1 hour ago, BornJetsFan1983 said:

hahahah tolstoy ..love the ref

 

Well rgr on all, i haven't seen alot of that - not saying it is not true, but the responses i have seen are terrible  to dwc ... just seems odd and out of place considering general decorum on Jetnation is friendly. 

Just wait.  

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22 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

So because youre a QB and team leader he should take whatever the team is offering?  Did Lawrence and the other 1st rounders youre pointing to?  Its a business, his teammates dont care that hes taking care of business.  Happens all the time is the way to look at it, he'll be in to practice.  

I was being sarcastic and mocking (some) fans by giving him the "Darrelle Revis" treatment so spare me the lectures. 

I was attacked by our fan base for wanting Revis to be paid accordingly as one of the greatest coverage CBs of All-Time during his prime and 50% of Jets fans HATED him for it. 

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9 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

When did you start watching football, yesterday?

Negotiating your contract isnt a distraction to anyone.  It doesnt put him ahead of his teammates and coaches.  

Its business, his teammates understand this.  

I was actually mocking (some) of our fan base and was being sarcastic by giving the kid the "Darrelle Revis" treatment for holding out so please spare me the lectures. 

I'm the one who had the back of Revis for wanting him to be paid accordingly (during his prime and before the ACL) and I was attacked by this fan base because of it and I could bump the thread if you really want me to).

(PS: Don't let me ever find a post of you crapping all over Revis and Jamal due to contact demands because if I do? They'll be very hypocritical of you).

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2 hours ago, Action Zachtion said:

Ive wasted time on this.   I don't know why.  Here are the terms that cause issues:

1) Offsets. If a player gets cut and signed by another team, what the second team pays the Jets wouldn't need to pay that portion.  

2) Voidable for on or off the field suspensions or fines.  (Top picks usually get this changed to voidable for suspensions only - the next CBA should get rid.of this). 

3) When the bonus gets paid. (The Chargers have a holdout about this every year and the Jets might play games here as well) 

The Lawrence deal seems standard for top picks.  Wilson should expect the same deal and sign nothing less. - No offsets, Voidable for suspensions only, paid the whole bonus days after signing.  

 

Why do people think Darnold had offsets?  I just find stuff like this:

-&----5
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Jets finally do the smart thing and end their contract standoff with Sam Darnold

Jets finally do the smart thing and end their contract standoff with Sam Darnold

 
Jul 30, 2018 at 2:03 pm ET1 min read
 
 
 
 

The Sam Darnold dispute with the Jets was one of the more absurd disputes we've seen in quite some time, with New York potentially alienating the No. 3 overall pick over contractual language that, given what they've invested in Darnold, seemed simply nonsensical.

Good news: the holdout is over, with Darnold hammering out a deal with the Jets and announcing the move via Twitter.

It is reportedly a four-year, $30.25 million fully guaranteed deal, according to Ian Rapoport. There were two rumored holdups on the Darnold contract, both of which were going to make the Jets look like they didn't know what they were doing. 

More on the NFL

On the first, there was the Jets pushing for offset language, which basically means if he was cut by the Jets in the first four years of his deal, they wouldn't have to pay him whatever amount he received from another team who signed him. Essentially, offset language keeps him from "double dipping." But this is so, so dumb for a No. 3 overall pick and a franchise quarterback: if you cut him within four years, the ramifications are so much worse than a couple million dollars for the franchise. Everyone is fired and everything is awful if Darnold is playing on another team before the end of his rookie deal. 

 

And the second part was reportedly about the Jets wanting to take away guarantees from Darnold if he was suspended or fined for a substance abuse violation, a PED violation or a violation of personal conduct policy. It's a way of protecting the team, but it is a slap in the face to Darnold to ask for that. 

We'll wait and see what the language says, but one would assume Darnold didn't sign off on a deal involving either.

Having talked briefly with Darnold on the Pick Six Podcast a few weeks ago, it's very clear how focused and locked in he is on being a good person and a good teammate. This is a level-headed 21-year-old face of the franchise. The Jets needed to skip the typical contractual B.S. and get him into camp so he can maximize his reps. 

 

Good on them for getting it done before the PR hit became extremely ugly

Sam Darnold holdout: What was point of Jets fighting for offset language?

Updated Jan 30, 2019; Posted Jul 31, 2018
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One of the things the Jets wanted -- and got -- in quarterback Sam Darnold's rookie contract was offset language.

 

Now that Darnold's training camp holdout is over, after three practices, Jets general manager Mike Maccagnan on Monday offered a debriefing of sorts on the process.

 

The Jets' compromised deal with Darnold included a couple notable things. The Jets got the offset language in. And while they can void Darnold's guaranteed pay if the NFL suspends him, they cannot do so if he is fined. Darnold also gets his full signing bonus up front -- which is essentially semantics, since he was going to get the entire thing at some point anyway.

 

Nothing changed about the basics of the contract. It is a fully guaranteed, four-year deal worth $30.247 million, including a $20.078 million signing bonus, with the Jets holding a fifth-year option. Bottom line: Darnold will almost certainly wind up getting all $30 million and change.

 
 

But in the bigger picture, what was the point of the Jets fighting for offset language in the contract?

 
 

Yes, even this year's No. 1 overall draft pick, Browns quarterback Baker Mayfield, got offset language included in his deal. And yes, offset language offers a safety net, of sorts, for teams. The Jets have typically included it in their high-profile rookie contracts.

 

Still, offset language for the No. 1 overall pick or No. 3 pick (as Darnold was) seems somewhat silly, doesn't it? (Yes, it does, for a couple reasons.)

 
 

First, a refresher on what offset language is. In the final year of a contract, a team will include it as a form of protection. Darnold's fourth-year salary is expected to be $4.604 million. But say the Jets got $2 million of offset language in the deal. If they cut Darnold after Year 3 of the contract -- which seems unlikely -- and he signs elsewhere for $2 million, that money would come off what the Jets owe Darnold and also wouldn't count against the Jets' salary cap.

 
 

Here's the thing, though: If Darnold is so bad that the Jets cut him after his contract's third year -- again, a release at that point seems unlikely -- he probably is going to get just the minimum salary for 2021 anyway, with his new team.

 
 

And even if the Jets are able to recoup $2 million, you're talking about $2 million in a $30 million deal. More likely, you're talking about $750,000 (Darnold's potential 2021 minimum salary) in a $30 million deal. Doesn't that seem like a rather small point to battle over?

 
 

Maccagnan on Monday explained why he considers offset language worth fighting for -- and his rationale mainly involves contracts that will come after Darnold's deal.

 

"From the team's standpoint, it does give you some ability to recoup your money," Maccagnan said. "When you look at not only draft picks, but you look at pro free agents, there are certain things you feel very strongly about that you may not want to have a precedent for put on the table. It may impact you with another [player], maybe on the pro side.

 
 
 
 

"Some of those things, they do set precedents going forward. I know there are certain trends in the league right now with offset language, trending toward no offset. But again, it's one thing if you can kind of stay consistent with what you believe in and what you want to protect."

 
 

But sometimes, it's all a moot point. The Jets drafted cornerback Dee Milliner -- a future all-time bust -- ninth overall in 2013. He had offset language in his fully guaranteed $12.66 million contract. It wound up not mattering. He was so bad that the Jets cut him before the 2016 season. He never landed with another NFL team, and the Jets paid out his entire contract.

 
 

Darryl Slater may be reached at

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8 minutes ago, Joe W. Namath said:

It looks like Zach will miss the 1st few days of camp.  No big deal.  If he misses for then a week I will start getting concerned.

Sigh.  Fourth first in five years.  I guess it's not a GM thing. 

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@Jet Nut

Busted.

Please don't become hypocritical with me when I was using Zach Wilson's holdout as a way of teasing fans such as yourself (to come at me out of the woodworks because I play chess and not checkers). 

Before jumping down my throat would you care to explain yourself to me (and all of us) for these posts (below) regarding one of the greatest coverage CBs of All-Time over his holding out? 

You were PISSED!

You were absolutely furious about Revis holding out but yet you feel the need to judge me over an unproven Rookie holding out of a guaranteed $35.2 million dollar contract?

1.) "Because he broke or threatened to break every contract he signed after holding out to get those contracts"?

2.) I don't care why, he held out, that's what I said. He held out of his first deal with two years left on it. He wanted 6 years, the Jets wanted to give him 5 and he held out after 4. Doesn't make a difference how well he played, if he didn't play up to his rookie deal would he have given money back? He was set to opt out of his last deal, that's why he was traded. Everyone knows it, that's why he wanted it in the deal.You're making excuses for him. He was a great player for the Jets but Revis is what he is.

3.) Yes you are, you're saying there were reasons he held out of a 6 year deal in year 4. I love the way the guy played for us. But he's a money hungry, pay me first player who has never felt compelled to honor his deal.

4.) You keep explaining why he held out to tell me he didn't hold out or to justify it. My statements are true, he held out I don't know why you keep making excuses, I could care less why he held out, he held out twice and was going to opt out a third time.

5.) Exactly, Revis collected 4'years salary off of his initial deal. Even if his yearly salary at that point was below what he could get and did get, did he give back any of his initial bonus? It was a bonus that was supposed to be part of a 6 year deal, not a 4 year deal. Have to calculate that money into his deal.

6.) They do it all the time. Sign a 6 year deal for say 60 mil with bonus money, stagger the payments, big bucks within the first 4 years and as soon as they hit a season where they aren't being paid huge money they cry that they're the 32nd highest paid player at a position. Even if the 60 mil deal put them at the top of the heap.

7.) What is you're friggen point? We would have been watching the same two corners against the raiders.A ngry, no. Are you so in love with Revis that you think because you love him his holdout isn't really a holdout? That was the point, apparently you can't get past that. You continue to argue that his holdout was justified. Which doesn't make my comment that he held out wrong. Just as it doesn't make your silly response that I rewrote history and more right, it's not. And one more time, read it slow, it's not what you're paid in a particular year, it's the entire contract. If you sign a deal that pays you well and they front load the deal, to your benefit, and then at the end of the deal your salary isn't in the top of the league, you're not underpaid. This can't be that hard.

8.) Who cares if he was overpaid or underpaid? I said he held out, who give a damn why. He held out. Who cares that you think it was fine, you miss your guy, we get it. Are you serious, no one could struggle this much for something this easy to understand.

9.) Are you serious? You're so he'll bent on arguing that you're not using your head. I tell you that my point was that he held out twice and your answer is that my point is the only one that counts? Considering I brought up that he held out, yes, it's the one at counts. What are you talking about? On get it, you made excuses why he held out. It was Tannys fault, and you're blindly going to tell us that he wasn't going to opt out of a deal he made sure had an pit out in it. Ok, good for you, everything Revis has been and is says he would NEVER have taken the opt out that he negotiated into his deal. I have a bridge to sell you.

10.) When he held out the Jets essentially gave him a 1 year deal knowing he would opt out in year 2. Tampa essentially gave him a 1 year deal by not guaranteeing him any $$ NE essentially gave him a 1 year deal by giving him 20 mil next year with a buy out.

And I'll stop there @ 10 different and separate posts. 

You think you can judge me for being just a little frustrated with an unproven Rookie QB drafted #2 overall who's holding out heading into training camp despite the fact you were an absolute JET NUT about Revis's holding out? 

Treat others how you'd like to be treated in return and PS I couldn't care less about Zach Wilson holding out I just wanted to give him the "Revis and Adams" treatment in order for fans such as yourself to take shots @ me this way I could fire shots back. 

image.thumb.png.c49ed939db3f5e8296b7767d3e1d37ca.png

You're the #1 poster who I was hoping would question me about being fake frustrated about Wilson's holding out as an unproven Rookie 🤑

Don't bother making Zach Wilson excuses either because "he held out and I don't care why he held out because he held out" (your words, not mine).

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