Training Camp Updates - Tues Aug 3

[UntouchableCrew]

Just now, TeddEY said:

Ferrell abused him pretty thoroughly as well, if memory serves.

Raiders game was probably his 2nd worst game of the season but I don't know if I'd say Ferrell abused him. Although that is admittedly more concerning because Ferrell sucks.

[Green Ghost]

Zach pc on nfl network now

[BornJetsFan1983]

6 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

You guys are crazy.  Truly.  

Where is he struggling?  Missing one deep ball? or getting sacked too much?  

It's 4 F-ing practices.

I was thinking the same thing...and becton going against a top rusher talent is great for him to learn and grow.

[ZachEY]

6 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Quite an assessment after 4 practices.

 

We're a little over a month away from week 1.  This isn't an assessment of his potential or his career, it's an assessment of where he is today, and where you'd hope a guy who's starting NFL games in a month would be.

[Mogglez]

Zach was just live on NFLN.  Great presser.

[flgreen]

5 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

I'm beginning to agree with this. Seems like he's struggling a bit now that the live bullets are flying.

Seems to me from the tweets, and the reports he's struggling  right now because both Becton and Moses are struggling.

Seems like Lawson, JFM, and Huff are running free on him every play.    The OL needs to step up very soon or it will not be a fun year for anyone.  

[J_Smith]

Curious to see how the pre season games look. Really tough to judge good or bad based on install days. 

[JohnnyLV]

17 minutes ago, TeddEY said:

Ok, early worries that will surely garner plenty of thumbs downs.

1) I don't think Wilson is ready to be the day 1 starter.  Wish we had a veteran, even for 6-8 games.

2) Becton getting abused is not great.  This goes beyond "Well it's a good sign from Lawson."  Lawson may be the best pass rusher we've had since Abraham, but the guy isn't Lawrence Taylor.  Concerning.

Not thumbs down but what exactly is leading to your feelings on #1? Not really hearing much negative on Wilson at all, had an awesome practice Saturday and most of the issues seem to be OL related. There is no question he will need to become acclimated to the speed and more "live" types of situations but I see no real red flags so far.

[kdels62]

11 minutes ago, BornJetsFan1983 said:

Omg Connor writes trash get a room

Sorry… That I read someone’s articles? 

[ZachEY]

Just now, johnnysd said:

Not thumbs down but what exactly is leading to your feelings on #1? Not really hearing much negative on Wilson at all, had an awesome practice Saturday and most of the issues seem to be OL related. There is no question he will need to become acclimated to the speed and more "live" types of situations but I see no real red flags so far.

Seems like a lot of stuff is just off target.  Overthrows, under throws - these are things that in shorts should be easy.  Rarely putting together a string of good completions, and when he is, they're all underneath stuff.

Again, this has zero to do with long term anything and everything to do with starting an NFL game in 40 days.

[BornJetsFan1983]

1 minute ago, kdels62 said:

Sorry… That I read someone’s articles? 

Apology accepted for reading  "Articles"

[kdels62]

5 minutes ago, TeddEY said:

We're a little over a month away from week 1.  This isn't an assessment of his potential or his career, it's an assessment of where he is today, and where you'd hope a guy who's starting NFL games in a month would be.

Give it a preseason game, maybe? 

[kdels62]

Just now, BornJetsFan1983 said:

Apology accepted for reading  "Articles"

You have the Athletic?

[FidelioJet]

Just now, TeddEY said:

We're a little over a month away from week 1.  This isn't an assessment of his potential or his career, it's an assessment of where he is today, and where you'd hope a guy who's starting NFL games in a month would be.

So, where is he lacking? Tell me?

More important I guess is what were you expecting? I mean 4 practices shouldn't change anything about how you view his ability to start.  

If you expected a rookie QB, coming into the lead, what has been statistically the worst offense in the NFL for two years.  Under a new systems, with 4 starting rookies and 7 new starters overall...and then expect said rookie to light it up in his first 4 practices I think your expectations are just a tad too high.

For me, personally I would liked to have had him sit a few weeks too, but that has NOTHING to do with the four practices.  If anything they've shown me he has the poise to start now.  He hasn't seemed to panicked, doesn't keep making the same mistakes, hasn't tilted on turned into an INT machine.  

He's getting pressured, throwing the ball away often and mostly making good decisions and throws.  Did he throw a deep one short today (that's what they're telling me) sure...Not sure really what else he did poorly today.  Seems to have made a number of quality completions and moved the ball down field pretty well.  Sometimes the defense wins - and it's not really the QB's fault. 

Defense is clearly winning the day but that seems to have much more to do with the DL than the QB.

[BornJetsFan1983]

Just now, kdels62 said:

You have the Athletic?

No...they are terrible

[kdels62]

Just now, BornJetsFan1983 said:

No...they are terrible

So you’re speaking from ignorance

[Matt39]

Bectons rookie season was wildly overrated and he seemed pretty happy reading his own press clippings. Time to get his butt in gear.

[ZachEY]

2 minutes ago, kdels62 said:

Give it a preseason game, maybe? 

I mean, he's going to get those preseason games, so of course it can change.  But, I don't see why this is so controversial an opinion, outside of you're not allowed to say anything but positive things about our QB, that 40 days isn't a long time, and he's looking only fair in shorts right now.

[FidelioJet]

2 minutes ago, TeddEY said:

Seems like a lot of stuff is just off target.  Overthrows, under throws - these are things that in shorts should be easy.  Rarely putting together a string of good completions, and when he is, they're all underneath stuff.

Again, this has zero to do with long term anything and everything to do with starting an NFL game in 40 days.

You're reading into reporter tweets who have to write something.  They're looking for slight nuances to report.  Not every throw is going to be perfect, but if I have to tweet about it I'm going to be specific as to the placements.  Guys have to catch too.

an underthrown completion for 30 yards is a completion - not a cause for concern.  You have no idea of his decision making there - may very well have been on purpose to assure the completion.  

Look, I'm not saying he's been spectacular but I think, under the circumstances, I think he's been as good if not better than we could have expected or hoped for.

[Paradis]

So early takeaways from following these threads--

• Carl Lawson will be as advertised. I think i might cry when i finally see a legit Pass Rush in green and white for the first time in 15 years... (also the "OMG Becton" narrative. Carl Lawson is a top 5  NFL PR'er in his prime.. Becton is in year 2 camp, he'll be fine)
• Bryce Hall will be a jersey in the stands.
• I'm tired of pumping brakes on Moore, if he wants to ball out as rookie WR of the year candidate, then LFG
• All 5 WRs will rotate in on gameday with some regularity
• I've bought into "Zach's supercomputer" aura - but expect there to be a lot picks a long the way to get there. 
• Our Dline could be as good as it's been in 20 years.

[Matt39]

Just now, TeddEY said:

I mean, he's going to get those preseason games, so of course it can change.  But, I don't see why this is so controversial an opinion, outside of you're not allowed to say anything but positive things about our QB, that 40 days isn't a long time, and he's looking only fair in shorts right now.

I will be concerned if he continues to struggle in practice and if the Jets treat him with kid gloves in preseason games. He needs to play a lot on preseason, IMO. Let him get ready, take some hits and have a welcome to the NFL moment. The gap between BYU and the league is massive.

[Bleedin Green]

22 minutes ago, TeddEY said:

Ok, early worries that will surely garner plenty of thumbs downs.

1) I don't think Wilson is ready to be the day 1 starter.  Wish we had a veteran, even for 6-8 games.

2) Becton getting abused is not great.  This goes beyond "Well it's a good sign from Lawson."  Lawson may be the best pass rusher we've had since Abraham, but the guy isn't Lawrence Taylor.  Concerning.

Yeah, I'm definitely not sure how to feel about all of this.  Obviously, you want to see some positive return out of a new player, particularly at such a position of need for the Jets for a very, very long time. However, you also don't want that to come with a guy like Becton getting beaten repetitively, when he's supposed to be one of the cornerstone pieces for the future of this offense.  If anything, you'd hope for more of a back and forth than it being such a one-sided affair as it has seemed to be so far.

The flip side of it is, I'm not so sure we've seen enough to really be ready to anoint Lawson just yet either (which of course could potentially make the Becton situation even more concerning).  While the practice setup is obviously not his fault, and sacks are something he simply cannot register, the reality is that the reports of Lawson's play "could have had a sack" has pretty much been the tag-line of his entire professional career, but regularly came up just a little short, and is the reason why he's the closest thing to a pass-rusher to make it into FA in a very long time.  So while he will definitely be an upgrade regardless, he still has to prove he can actually finish plays.

Those are two guys who will definitely be among those to keep an eye on throughout preseason, when matched up against other players, having the opportunity to go through the entire play and at full speed.

[JustInFudge]

18 minutes ago, TeddEY said:

Ok, early worries that will surely garner plenty of thumbs downs.

1) I don't think Wilson is ready to be the day 1 starter.  Wish we had a veteran, even for 6-8 games.

2) Becton getting abused is not great.  This goes beyond "Well it's a good sign from Lawson."  Lawson may be the best pass rusher we've had since Abraham, but the guy isn't Lawrence Taylor.  Concerning.

1) With the very unfortunate passing of Knapp, who is developing Zach?  There isnt a single player or coach on the team who has taken an NFL snap at QB.  Not 1. There isnt a single coach on the team who has developed a QB.  There isnt a single coach on the team who has called play in an NFL Football game.  And we're rolling out a project QB.  It's not a good recipe for success.  And I've got a buddy who has been to every practice and said Wilson has looked "erratic" at best, during live time.  That said, it's early...so we'll see how it changes but I hate that he has nobody to work with that actually knows the position. 

2) I'd be more concerned if he didnt prove himself last year.  Concerning?  Sure but I think Becton proved when he was available last year, he has elite attributes if he can put it all together and stay on the field. 

[Jackie Treehorn]

An honest Q, and you all know I’m a noob so thread carefully:

Could it be that Bechton is struggling due to the new blocking scheme? Is there a new blocking scheme? Is Bechton struggling?  

[kdels62]

Just now, TeddEY said:

I mean, he's going to get those preseason games, so of course it can change.  But, I don't see why this is so controversial an opinion, outside of you're not allowed to say anything but positive things about our QB, that 40 days isn't a long time, and he's looking only fair in shorts right now.

It’s not controversial to say that a rookie QB needs time to improve. It is dramatic to claim that he won’t be ready to play at a low end starter level in 4 weeks. By all accounts he’s come in and been better than White and Morgan, he’s thrown less picks than Lawrence, he’s working with starters unlike Fields. If Wilson goes out there and shuts the bed in a preseason game then you probably have a point, but now after 4 practices having any view that isn’t “this isn’t enough sample size let’s wait” is dramatic. 

[ZachEY]

3 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

So, where is he lacking? Tell me?

More important I guess is what were you expecting? I mean 4 practices shouldn't change anything about how you view his ability to start.  

If you expected a rookie QB, coming into the lead, what has been statistically the worst offense in the NFL for two years.  Under a new systems, with 4 starting rookies and 7 new starters overall...and then expect said rookie to light it up in his first 4 practices I think your expectations are just a tad too high.

For me, personally I would liked to have had him sit a few weeks too, but that has NOTHING to do with the four practices.  If anything they've shown me he has the poise to start now.  He hasn't seemed to panicked, doesn't keep making the same mistakes, hasn't tilted on turned into an INT machine.  

He's getting pressured, throwing the ball away often and mostly making good decisions and throws.  Did he throw a deep one short today (that's what they're telling me) sure...Not sure really what else he did poorly today.  Seems to have made a number of quality completions and moved the ball down field pretty well.  Sometimes the defense wins - and it's not really the QB's fault. 

Defense is clearly winning the day but that seems to have much more to do with the DL than the QB.

I thought we should have had a veteran in there prior to these practices, and nothing Zach Wilson has done in these practices has made me rethink that.

I would have liked to have seen better accuracy with the ball when he has had chances in between the clear defensive wins.

Again, this isn't some hot take, it's a luke warm take, that the guy hasn't convinced me that he's ready to start in 40 days.

[Jet Nut]

34 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Quite an assessment after 4 practices.

 

Amazing that when the "bullet fly" fans let the old axioms fly out the window.

Its a new OL, implementing a new blocking scheme, it takes time to jell as a unit.  

Zach by most reports was fine today, in practice.  Lets panic just because 

[flgreen]

Connor Hughes @Connor_J_Hughes

Edoga is dealing with a knee injury. Saleh doesn’t know what’s wrong with Zuniga yet #Jets

[flgreen]

Ethan Greenberg @EGreenbergJets 32m

#Jets HC Robert Saleh happy with the team’s run game today but said there still needs to be a better pocket created for the QBs.

Beat Writer / Columnist

•  

[Biggs]

Zach is fine.  Rookie OC, lots of new moving parts.  Not worried at all about Zach.  

The Jets got the 2nd pick for a reason.  He's not the problem.  

[flgreen]

Andy Vasquez @andy_vasquez 34m

Jets coach Robert Saleh says OL Cameron Clark has a neck injury. He wouldn’t get into details on the injury but says that Clark has some movement in his extremities. He said more updates will come later.

Beat Writer / Columnist

•  

[Grandy]

I think Zach's doing alright seeing as it's almost unheard of for a rookie to be taking first team reps as the definite starter so early. At this point he doesnt exactly need to light it up. Him just not sucking and continuing to improve puts him pretty far ahead for where he is in his career.

[ZachEY]

6 minutes ago, kdels62 said:

It’s not controversial to say that a rookie QB needs time to improve. It is dramatic to claim that he won’t be ready to play at a low end starter level in 4 weeks. By all accounts he’s come in and been better than White and Morgan, he’s thrown less picks than Lawrence, he’s working with starters unlike Fields. If Wilson goes out there and shuts the bed in a preseason game then you probably have a point, but now after 4 practices having any view that isn’t “this isn’t enough sample size let’s wait” is dramatic. 

Won't isn't a word I've used.  It's 40 days, and the guy is a bit of a project.

I think it's a mistake not to have another option.

And, I guess my bar wasn't "low end starter."

[UntouchableCrew]

20 minutes ago, flgreen said:

Seems to me from the tweets, and the reports he's struggling  right now because both Becton and Moses are struggling.

Seems like Lawson, JFM, and Huff are running free on him every play.    The OL needs to step up very soon or it will not be a fun year for anyone.  

I guess I'm just less concerned about Becton and Moses because they are, to a certain extent, known commodities. I've seen them play (and look very good) against NFL defenses.

Hard to gather too much from a bunch of tweets considering we aren't there in person but I'm getting a little nervous about Wilson.

[kdels62]

7 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Bectons rookie season was wildly overrated and he seemed pretty happy reading his own press clippings. Time to get his butt in gear.

It wasn’t. It was mediocre for a good starting, experience LT and tracks Becton towards being really good. But you’re also making up that Becton was resting on his laurelsz