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14 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

It’s all relative.  Salaries are based on revenue, revenue is about to skyrocket.  In 3 years Josh’s deal will seem undervalued, as long as he continues to play at the level he did last season. 

You know what is almost hard to fathom these days? It wasn't really long ago in the bigger picture of things that guys played every year for their contracts. Imagine what baeball or football would be like if that were still the case?

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Now Josh Allen can go back to playing like crap.

Thank God Sam sucked!!! 😀

If he keeps builds on what he was doing last year, getting it done now could wind up being a deal for them. Hope Zach earns a billion dollar contract. 

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1 minute ago, section314 said:

You know what is almost hard to fathom these days? It wasn't really long ago in the bigger picture of things that guys played every year for their contracts. Imagine what baeball or football would be like if that were still the case?

It would be so bizarre at this point.  

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It’s all relative.  Salaries are based on revenue, revenue is about to skyrocket.  In 3 years Josh’s deal will seem undervalued, as long as he continues to play at the level he did last season. 
I totally get that ... typically I never begrudge the players anything they can get .... but the pussified training camps etc have lead to an inferior product with no competition from any other league except fifa. I have never been on the owner's side.... I'm just saying there comes a point when the the public acknowledges that a QB is not worth a 1/4 billion.

250 million dollars could be put to better use and the public at some point may agree.

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20 minutes ago, Dunnie said:

I totally get that ... typically I never begrudge the players anything they can get .... but the pussified training camps etc have lead to an inferior product with no competition from any other league except fifa. I have never been on the owner's side.... I'm just saying there comes a point when the the public acknowledges that a QB is not worth a 1/4 billion.

250 million dollars could be put to better use and the public at some point may agree.

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Now do basketball and baseball salaries, lol.

This topic was relevant 20, 25 years ago, but that ship has sailed. We’re in an age of $40 parking passes, $2000 field or court level seats, and upper bowl seats costing way more than premium ones did just a few years back, regardless of the sport.

The days of the “average working man” going to sporting events on a regular basis are long gone. Go to a game, listen to the crowd. It’s rare that you hear that crazed sound of the “real fans” screaming their hearts out. Those people are in the minority now, they’ve either been gifted seats or are there on an annual splurge for that one night.

You have a corporate vibe in it’s place, and the noise you hear is usually pumped in or prompted by an arena’s sound system. Things aren’t going back to how they were. Even if the salaries miraculously went down, the prices to go to the games wouldn’t.

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19 minutes ago, Dunnie said:

I totally get that ... typically I never begrudge the players anything they can get .... but the pussified training camps etc have lead to an inferior product with no competition from any other league except fifa. I have never been on the owner's side.... I'm just saying there comes a point when the the public acknowledges that a QB is not worth a 1/4 billion.

250 million dollars could be put to better use and the public at some point may agree.

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Nonsense. Throw on a game from the 70s or 80s and it looks like college. Sure the rules were not as restrictive for player safety but the players were also much smaller and slower as well. I dont think the game is affected as much from being softer as it is affected too much by officiating.

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Nonsense. Throw on a game from the 70s or 80s and it looks like college. Sure the rules were not as restrictive for player safety but the players were also much smaller and slower as well. I dont think the game is affected as much from being softer as it is affected too much by officiating.
That's your opinion ... the no touch rules have led to a product that resembles basketball on turf.

Score of 49-42 ... have resulted in one sure thing ... more commercial time .. it's the golden goose .... trick the public into thi king they are seeing superior offense , when in reality it's the absense of defense.

Calculate the actual playing time vs game time.

The product is a shadow of its former self.

Still the best sport to watch on TV ... but for how long?? Wait until the NFL requires that you watch the advertising. .. that time is coming my friend ... I hate it and I'm in that industry.

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Now do basketball and baseball salaries, lol.
This topic was relevant 20, 25 years ago, but that ship has sailed. We’re in an age of $40 parking passes, $2000 field or court level seats, and upper bowl seats costing way more than premium ones did just a few years back, regardless of the sport.
The days of the “average working man” going to sporting events on a regular basis are long gone. Go to a game, listen to the crowd. It’s rare that you hear that crazed sound of the “real fans” screaming their hearts out. Those people are in the minority now, they’ve either been gifted seats or are there on an annual splurge for that one night.
You have a corporate vibe in it’s place, and the noise you hear is usually pumped in or prompted by an arena’s sound system. Things aren’t going back to how they were. Even if the salaries miraculously went down, the prices to go to the games wouldn’t.
Less players on those rosters... so of course they would make more.

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7 minutes ago, Dunnie said:

That's your opinion ... the no touch rules have led to a product that resembles basketball on turf.

Score of 49-42 ... have resulted in one sure thing ... more commercial time .. it's the golden goose .... trick the public into thi king they are seeing superior offense , when in reality it's the absense of defense.

Calculate the actual playing time vs game time.

The product is a shadow of its former self.

Still the best sport to watch on TV ... but for how long?? Wait until the NFL requires that you watch the advertising. .. that time is coming my friend ... I hate it and I'm in that industry.

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Fair point. We all prefer different things. I like today's NFL I liked  football in the 70s 80s and 90s too.

Personally I don't miss defensive biased football all that much. I like to see offense, plus it also makes defensive  stops more exciting. 

Today's game is faster on the field but agree on length of games and commercials but advertising is what sustains football in the end.

Even though there is much more scoring I don't think it is as dramatic vas you think. I think I read that like 24 points wins most games. In thev70s maybe that was 18. 

 

E

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Dunnie said:

Less players on those rosters... so of course they would make more.

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I’ll turn that around on you. 😉

Football brings in a lot more revenue then both those sports, so their salaries should be higher.

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17 hours ago, Yucatan Jetfan said:


I was. Hurt so bad that he was so freaking bad. emoji17.png


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Majority of Jets fans were absolutely delusional about Sam Darnold until the very last minute. He never showed the potential Allen showed first two years. 

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2 hours ago, Dunnie said:

I totally get that ... typically I never begrudge the players anything they can get .... but the pussified training camps etc have lead to an inferior product with no competition from any other league except fifa. I have never been on the owner's side.... I'm just saying there comes a point when the the public acknowledges that a QB is not worth a 1/4 billion.

250 million dollars could be put to better use and the public at some point may agree.

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Personally, before I worry about athletes, I'll worry about CEOs of corporations.. the cost/benefit ratio there seems much more out of whack. I'm fairly confident there's not a really smart dog that could achieve the same results that Josh Allen does in his profession. 

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Personally, before I worry about athletes, I'll worry about CEOs of corporations.. the cost/benefit ratio there seems much more out of whack. I'm fairly confident there's not a really smart dog that could achieve the same results that Josh Allen does in his profession. 
Whole 'nother conversation ... totally agree ... obscene what failing CEOs get too.

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1 hour ago, jeremy2020 said:

Personally, before I worry about athletes, I'll worry about CEOs of corporations.. the cost/benefit ratio there seems much more out of whack. I'm fairly confident there's not a really smart dog that could achieve the same results that Josh Allen does in his profession. 

 

1 hour ago, Dunnie said:

Whole 'nother conversation ... totally agree ... obscene what failing CEOs get too.

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Yeah, but Josh Allen’s contract is just crazy yo! 

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10 hours ago, Green Ghost said:

At the end of the day, it comes down to this.

Good teams pay their good players, especially their QBs.

Bad teams keep trying to find a good QB and hope to build around him within a window.

Best teams find that QB, build around him within the window, and then pay him. Long term success ensues. 

 

So…. They don’t draft safeties and DLineman before QBs???   

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9 hours ago, Dunnie said:

That's your opinion ... the no touch rules have led to a product that resembles basketball on turf.

Score of 49-42 ... have resulted in one sure thing ... more commercial time .
 

That's the biggest myth ever. 

• In 1968 (year the Jets won the SB) the NFL/AFL averaged 20.5 Points scored per game. 

• In 1985 (the year I was born) the NFL averaged 21.5 points scored per game. 

• In 1990 the NFL averaged 20.1 points scored per game. 

• In 2000 the NFL averaged 20.7 points scored per game. 

• In 2010 the NFL averaged 22.0 points scored per game. 

• In 2019 the NFL averaged 22.8 points scored per game. 

Not much has changed in regards to NFL scoring dating back to 1968 and is decided by a FG per game etc. 

and the NFL scoring "so much more" per game today than 20-30-40-50 years ago is an absolute myth. 

✓ I bet you didn't even know Joe Namath of 1968 was dropping 31, 32, 35, 37, 47 and 48 points per game on that ass, did you? Neither did I. But through research I learned (THE TRUTH).

And so is the game being "soft". That's another myth.

There is nothing soft about this game.

and of course the league has to be strict with brutal helmet to helmet hits (that still happen every Sunday) because not only is CTE a real thing but unlike the 1950's and 1960's these kids (of today) all have either 4.2-4.3 blazing speed, have Mekhi Becton size, have Ray Lewis strength, have J.J. Watt power and have potential to kill a man on the football field. 

Let's just say that if NFL players were allowed to play Defense like the guys of the 60s/70s/80s/90s? Kids would be leaving the field in body bags every Sunday (unlike those throwback days) because these kids of today are way more DANGEROUS because as humans our athlete's athleticism has evolved over the years.

Is that what you guys want? Dead kids and dead bodies for entertainment?

But to call this game "soft" is clueless.

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One more thing about Josh Allen having it easy on the road with no fans in the stands and no distractions with perfect offensive communication. 

2020's Covid tainted season allowed an average of 24.8 points scored per game. The highest amount of Points scored in NFL history (and I predicted this would happen heading into 2020 too). 

No fans in the stadium = highest amount of scoring All-Time is and was NO COINCIDENCE.

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That's the biggest myth ever. 
• In 1968 (year the Jets won the SB) the NFL/AFL averaged 20.5 Points scored per game. 
• In 1985 (the year I was born) the NFL averaged 21.5 points scored per game. 
• In 1990 the NFL averaged 20.1 points scored per game. 
• In 2000 the NFL averaged 20.7 points scored per game. 
• In 2010 the NFL averaged 22.0 points scored per game. 
• In 2019 the NFL averaged 22.8 points scored per game. 
Not much has changed in regards to NFL scoring dating back to 1968 and is decided by a FG per game etc. 
and the NFL scoring "so much more" per game today than 20-30-40-50 years ago is an absolute myth. 
✓ I bet you didn't even know Joe Namath of 1968 was dropping 31, 32, 35, 37, 47 and 48 points per game on that ass, did you? Neither did I. But through research I learned (THE TRUTH).
And so is the game being "soft". That's another myth.
There is nothing soft about this game.
and of course the league has to be strict with brutal helmet to helmet hits (that still happen every Sunday) because not only is CTE a real thing but unlike the 1950's and 1960's these kids (of today) all have either 4.2-4.3 blazing speed, have Mekhi Becton size, have Ray Lewis strength, have J.J. Watt power and have potential to kill a man on the football field. 
Let's just say that if NFL players were allowed to play Defense like the guys of the 60s/70s/80s/90s? Kids would be leaving the field in body bags every Sunday (unlike those throwback days) because these kids of today are way more DANGEROUS because as humans our athlete's athleticism has evolved over the years.
Is that what you guys want? Dead kids and dead bodies for entertainment?
But to call this game "soft" is clueless.
Nice work ... of course no one wants death. Hell no on e WANTS injuries either.

The biggest thing missing in today's game is balance on both sides of the ball. The game is so slanted towards offense it is approaching boring ... and that is a fact.

I will do mor research before responding again to check the number of time at least one team has scored over a certain point total in a single season. I care less about point differentials than point per team occurrences.




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On 8/6/2021 at 10:14 PM, Buffalo 24 7 said:

All those you mentioned players were either replaced by someone clearly better, or they were a non-factor in 2020.

Eric Fisher was replaced by Orland Brown.

Mitchell Schwartz basically suffered a career ending injury, that is why he is currently a free agent.

Austin Reiter is currently a free agent, and they added Joe Thuney.

Damien Williams opted out in 2020.

Sammy Watkins only had 400 yards and was hurt all year. He had a grand total of 13 yards in the playoffs

Bashaud Breeland will be replaced by L'Jarius Snead, who had an amazing rookie year.

Damien Wilson is a non-factor.
Kelechi Osemele was only a starter because Laruent Tardif Duvernay opted out. KO played less than 1/3 o the games anyway.

They won't be missing any of those players.

 

Excusing the fact that you excused away 8 starters leaving…

That wasn’t the point.

The point was that their roster is not the same. That they lost 8 starters.

Whether they gained equal or better players was never part of the discussion.

PS, There is a reason articles like this exist: https://www.si.com/nfl/chiefs/gm-report/dont-panic-do-worry-about-the-kansas-city-chiefs-offseason-so-far

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On 8/6/2021 at 2:52 PM, Facts said:

No, I don’t think so.

Pretty sure they lost like 7 starters.

Edit: Just looked it up. They lost Eric Fisher, Mitchell Schwartz, Anthony Reiter, Damien Williams, Sammy Watkins, Bashaud Breeland, Damien Wilson, Kelechi Osemele and Kapsaacin.

Thats 8 starters they lost. Why did you think they kept their whole squad!??

https://www.si.com/nfl/chiefs/gm-report/dont-panic-do-worry-about-the-kansas-city-chiefs-offseason-so-far

......

Fisher was a starter and suffered achillies injury in the AFCCG.  He was cut because going into this season, it was the last year of his contract and he wouldn't be available to play until around week 8 at best.  Why pay and suffer the cap hit of the last year of a contract for a guy that won't play?  They cut him.

 

Schwartz started the 2020 season at RT...suffered a back injury early in the year and never was able to come back.  Same as fisher...he was etnering the last year of his contract.....cut because no reason to pay a guy and take the cap hit for aguy that can't play....not official yet, but he is likely retired.....and again...played well under half of the season.  

 

Reiter was perhaps the worst starting C in football.  He was released...remains unsigned...couldn't even get a gig with the Texans who tried him out a couple weeks ago.  he SUCKS....but yes....we lost a starter.

Damien Williams was a covid opt out....not a starter.  

Sammy Watkins.....nominal starter.....not a big factor.

Baushaud Breeland.  Good starter they let walk as they have his replacement on the roster at lower price.

Damien Wilson.....starting LB....not good...couldn't cover...never made a play.  FA...unsigned elsewhere....his replacement....and early camp standout 2nd round LB from last year. Willie Gay...on the roster....will be better player.

Osemele?  Come on..that dues started like 2 games becuase LDT opted out...and he blew out his knees. 

Kpass......not sure you can really call him a starter...KC rotated DE a ton.  either way...he was non factor.

 

If you want to try and imply value by calling these guys "starters"  then go ahead......the roster is way better....especially the O line.

 

Not that you all care..but KC got the steal of the draft in OG Trey Smith.....will make the pro bowl as a rookie at OG....new starting C Creed Humphrey will be all rookie...the new Line ....you guys don't understand whats about to happen....KC is going to have 2018 offense all over again....

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34 minutes ago, Zerovoltz said:

......

Fisher was a starter and suffered achillies injury in the AFCCG.  He was cut because going into this season, it was the last year of his contract and he wouldn't be available to play until around week 8 at best.  Why pay and suffer the cap hit of the last year of a contract for a guy that won't play?  They cut him.

 

Schwartz started the 2020 season at RT...suffered a back injury early in the year and never was able to come back.  Same as fisher...he was etnering the last year of his contract.....cut because no reason to pay a guy and take the cap hit for aguy that can't play....not official yet, but he is likely retired.....and again...played well under half of the season.  

 

Reiter was perhaps the worst starting C in football.  He was released...remains unsigned...couldn't even get a gig with the Texans who tried him out a couple weeks ago.  he SUCKS....but yes....we lost a starter.

Damien Williams was a covid opt out....not a starter.  

Sammy Watkins.....nominal starter.....not a big factor.

Baushaud Breeland.  Good starter they let walk as they have his replacement on the roster at lower price.

Damien Wilson.....starting LB....not good...couldn't cover...never made a play.  FA...unsigned elsewhere....his replacement....and early camp standout 2nd round LB from last year. Willie Gay...on the roster....will be better player.

Osemele?  Come on..that dues started like 2 games becuase LDT opted out...and he blew out his knees. 

Kpass......not sure you can really call him a starter...KC rotated DE a ton.  either way...he was non factor.

 

If you want to try and imply value by calling these guys "starters"  then go ahead......the roster is way better....especially the O line.

 

Not that you all care..but KC got the steal of the draft in OG Trey Smith.....will make the pro bowl as a rookie at OG....new starting C Creed Humphrey will be all rookie...the new Line ....you guys don't understand whats about to happen....KC is going to have 2018 offense all over again....

I loved Trey Smith too but he 100% will not make the Pro Bowl as a Rookie. 

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16 hours ago, Zerovoltz said:

......

Fisher was a starter and suffered achillies injury in the AFCCG.  He was cut because going into this season, it was the last year of his contract and he wouldn't be available to play until around week 8 at best.  Why pay and suffer the cap hit of the last year of a contract for a guy that won't play?  They cut him.

 

Schwartz started the 2020 season at RT...suffered a back injury early in the year and never was able to come back.  Same as fisher...he was etnering the last year of his contract.....cut because no reason to pay a guy and take the cap hit for aguy that can't play....not official yet, but he is likely retired.....and again...played well under half of the season.  

 

Reiter was perhaps the worst starting C in football.  He was released...remains unsigned...couldn't even get a gig with the Texans who tried him out a couple weeks ago.  he SUCKS....but yes....we lost a starter.

Damien Williams was a covid opt out....not a starter.  

Sammy Watkins.....nominal starter.....not a big factor.

Baushaud Breeland.  Good starter they let walk as they have his replacement on the roster at lower price.

Damien Wilson.....starting LB....not good...couldn't cover...never made a play.  FA...unsigned elsewhere....his replacement....and early camp standout 2nd round LB from last year. Willie Gay...on the roster....will be better player.

Osemele?  Come on..that dues started like 2 games becuase LDT opted out...and he blew out his knees. 

Kpass......not sure you can really call him a starter...KC rotated DE a ton.  either way...he was non factor.

 

If you want to try and imply value by calling these guys "starters"  then go ahead......the roster is way better....especially the O line.

 

Not that you all care..but KC got the steal of the draft in OG Trey Smith.....will make the pro bowl as a rookie at OG....new starting C Creed Humphrey will be all rookie...the new Line ....you guys don't understand whats about to happen....KC is going to have 2018 offense all over again....

 

Again, that wasn't the discussion.

Whether the players sucked, were replacements, or anything else, was not in the discussion.

Just whether KC lost starters or not. That's it. 

I hope you guys are good. Jets aren't quite there yet and KC has sucked forever so it's nice to see a forever-horrible team be good once in a while.

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Unique talent. Has benefited from the system/great coaching around him. But has done a great job executing the system.

I still wouldnt want him to be my QB dropping back on 3rd and 9 in a big spot though. Still not a natural QB, IMO. 

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4 hours ago, Barton said:

Unique talent. Has benefited from the system/great coaching around him. But has done a great job executing the system.

I still wouldnt want him to be my QB dropping back on 3rd and 9 in a big spot though. Still not a natural QB, IMO. 

You hated our best QB since Namath. Of course you wouldn't want Josh Allen lol.

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6 hours ago, Barton said:

Unique talent. Has benefited from the system/great coaching around him. But has done a great job executing the system.

I still wouldnt want him to be my QB dropping back on 3rd and 9 in a big spot though. Still not a natural QB, IMO. 

He’s proven himself capable in high leverage situations.

One of his remaining shortcomings is his decision-making in low-leverage 3rd and 9s, where he sometimes still doesn’t assess risk well and tries to do too much.

Anyway, he’s got a good enough head on his shoulders as well as unencumbered athletic ability, and has well-enough put to bed any question of desire or drive, to shed the label of being a system QB.

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On 8/7/2021 at 11:22 AM, Dunnie said:

I totally get that ... typically I never begrudge the players anything they can get .... but the pussified training camps etc have lead to an inferior product with no competition from any other league except fifa. I have never been on the owner's side.... I'm just saying there comes a point when the the public acknowledges that a QB is not worth a 1/4 billion.

250 million dollars could be put to better use and the public at some point may agree.

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His money is going to be taxed by the Federal Government and almost every State he plays in that has income tax.  He's just as likely to give money to good charities as the team owner.

Money that's earned by the team leaks out to the public.  The QB is the star that  people recognize and want to see.  

The product is the product.  You either watch it and support the money flow into the game or you don't.  To me the game is still great.  The bigger problem is to finance the game more and more commericials are needed to support the income stream.  The games are constantly stopped for commercials making the experience of TV viewers exsaperating and killing the game for the live audience who are watching two teams stand around waiting for the TV timeout to end. 

This isn't about the QB getting overpaid, it's about the owners sharing revenue and deciding that paying the QB maximizes TV revenue and other income streams.   The owners are clearly invested in creating a star who will sell merchandise and get eyes on the game.

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8 hours ago, Irish Jet said:

You hated our best QB since Namath. Of course you wouldn't want Josh Allen lol.

 

You think Josh Allen would be getting this contract if he had played under Bowles and Adam Gase? Cmon now.

He is a solid player though. If he continues to improve his passing skills then this contract makes sense. 

And for the record, I've come around on Pennington. He's ok in my book now. 🙃

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