Lions CUT WR Breshad Perriman

[Doggin94it]

8 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

He was 26th last year in average contract money last year. Given his production in the 2020 season you're scoffing at, $10MM/yr is an under-market contract. If he was a FA following that season instead of a second season with Darnold he'd have gotten much closer to the $15MM/yr he was seeking. 

Other than guys still on their rookie contracts, how many receivers behind him (in $) were noticeably better and more productive in 2020? I'm not really seeing any who are clearly/objectively superior. 

How many WR making more than RA were not as effective last year? Jeffery, Tyrell Williams, E.Sanders, TY Hilton, Fitzgerald, Shepard, Boyd, AJ Green, OBJ -- none of those 9 top 25 WRs by money were top 25 in production last year either (nor even measured up to RA's numbers with the WR-maker gunslinger Bridgewater). That's not even counting superior and pricier WRs like Thomas, Kupp, & Woods who had down, less-productive years in 2020.

He was worth the $ differential between money to a cap-rich Jets team looking to see whether or not its golden boy QB was worth not just keeping for a 4th season, but also reinvesting in a ~$20MM guaranteed 5th year. On an amortized basis, the team saved very little cash between the two WRs considering that importance. 

What's done is done, I'm very happy WR is finally looking like a Jets team strength (at least on paper thus far), but it wasn't a prudent choice at the time. However things worked out in spite of a poor decision, the plan was never for Perriman to be such an unreliable disappointment he wasn't worth retaining for a second season and the team had to go WR shopping again in both FA (x 2) plus with another high draft pick.

Hey, bad decisions can still work out to a team's benefit. It might be that this is such a case, and I'm hoping it is. 

The guys ahead of him (who performed worse) got those deals because they had resumes of better production that justified them (or, in Williams' case, bad GMs). Robby had a great statistical year - 95-1,096 - but he still couldn't get into the endzone (3TDs), and played on a team that had to throw constantly and lost its best playmaker, which is a situation tailor-made for empty volume stats (catches/yards). Football Outsiders still had him with a negative DVOA (-10.9%, good for 73rd WR in the NFL) and a bare minimum 19 DYAR (and, interestingly enough, identical 19YAR), ranking 68th (and 69th) in the NFL. 

In other words, the advanced metrics have him as a mediocre, eminently replaceable player. You don't give those guys 10M+ per year, even if they do put up good counting stats if you feed them 137 targets

[Prodigal Syndicate]

Never forget the threads and posters on here arguing until they were blue in the face that Perriman was better than Robbie and that the deal was why Douglas was a genius.

[genot]

4 hours ago, DetroitRed said:

Not saying Sam is going to be great this season, but he definitely has a chance to shut some people up and have a very nice year.  He had Crowder to begin last year and that was it.  That’s a complete joke.  The rest of his starting skill positions are out of the league 

It's amazing how some people fail to admit the obvious. 

[GREENBEAN]

3 hours ago, Saul Goodman said:

Lot of people were arguing at this time last year that Perriman is better than Robby. 

He is if could stay healthy. ??‍♂️

[FootballLove]

If Robbie were still on the roster, how would he fare this year?

Davis, Robbie, Moore, Crowder, Cole?  (Mims, Berrios and both Smiths cut or moved to PS?)

Could Robbie push Mims out?

[JustInFudge]

2 hours ago, Doggin94it said:

I thought he was a good risk-reward type signing, and better value than Robby at his price. Still think that; the nature of risk-reward signings is sometimes you get the downside, not the upside, and I still don't think Robby is worth 10M+ per year (which basically had him as a top-25 WR last year, which he wasn't

It's ok, I forgive you.  I'm pretty sure it was @Paradis who was acting like we signed the next Randy Moss, similar to how he acted like we signed the next Tony Gonzalez when they signed ASJ. 

[Paradis]

13 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

It's ok, I forgive you.  I'm pretty sure it was @Paradis who was acting like we signed the next Randy Moss, similar to how he acted like we signed the next Tony Gonzalez when they signed ASJ. 

That hurts. I wouldn’t have to touched Perriman before day 3 when he was drafted for all the reasons he’s struggled. Signing him last year was dog sh*t

[Sperm Edwards]

30 minutes ago, Doggin94it said:

The guys ahead of him (who performed worse) got those deals because they had resumes of better production that justified them (or, in Williams' case, bad GMs). Robby had a great statistical year - 95-1,096 - but he still couldn't get into the endzone (3TDs), and played on a team that had to throw constantly and lost its best playmaker, which is a situation tailor-made for empty volume stats (catches/yards). Football Outsiders still had him with a negative DVOA (-10.9%, good for 73rd WR in the NFL) and a bare minimum 19 DYAR (and, interestingly enough, identical 19YAR), ranking 68th (and 69th) in the NFL. 

In other words, the advanced metrics have him as a mediocre, eminently replaceable player. You don't give those guys 10M+ per year, even if they do put up good counting stats if you feed them 137 targets

Oh absolutely no doubt some of those WRs got deals based on past production, but your objection was to RA being (actually just outside) the top 25 specifically last year, and that he wasn't worth it. But by his production last year, he was more worthy of top-25  compensation than more than a third of those making even more.

I don't know with 100% certainty if the EZ thing is a Robby thing or a Bridgewater thing, though I'd tend to lean towards the latter (Bridgewater was always more of a game manager than a TD passer, outside of 2 games since 2014). So that same QB-cause could/would also affect DVOA or other numbers for his WR. e.g. if the ball's not leading the receiver - especially in a more congested, short-yardage part of the field - and there isn't enough to open up a little running room, then a WR's DVOA, DYAR, etc. are going to be affected. What's more, he was playing a new role for the first time (with yet another QB change at that); a new role which all detractors here said he couldn't possibly play (he was said to be a "one trick pony" only capable of running go-routes, as I recall). 

Wherever FO has him ranked in DVOA, I'd rather have had him starting than Perriman, and until proven otherwise (hopefully this year) that'd go for Mims, too.

Plus a QB doesn't throw the ball a WR's way that many times unless he's deemed worthy of having his number called so often. He gets open and (overwhelmingly) usually catches it, that moves the chains, and that's why they continue do so. Otherwise a team would just be able to throw the ball 137x to any other low-DVOA scrub at all and similarly expect a 70% catch rate for 1100 yards. Except that doesn't happen. 

Players primarily get paid based on production, not more niche metrics like DVOA; and based on that he was not at all overpaid. If anything he was underpaid for his production. 

I do agree Anderson is replaceable, and said as much myself months ago. And as I also just wrote to you, teams can still end up benefitting from making bad decisions (like choosing Perriman over Anderson). So while he's replaceable, the Jets not only swung & missed on replacing him for a year, but missed doing so in a year when they were surely big on further evaluating their young FQB. This then - directly or indirectly - likely dropped Darnold's trade value, even if the team decided to move on from him anyway. Then again it may have led to a better QB replacing Darnold (and/or Wilson instead of a lesser prospect), as we possibly could have won another game or two, which would have led to a lower draft slot in '21 and/or more team confidence in Darnold to keep him.

But this unplanned outcome wasn't the reason they chose one over the other.

[JustInFudge]

4 minutes ago, Paradis said:

That hurts. I wouldn’t have to touched Perriman before day 3 when he was drafted for all the reasons he’s struggled. Signing him last year was dog sh*t

Damn it!  Thought it was you.  lol

[Prodigal Syndicate]

1 hour ago, GREENBEAN said:

He is if could stay healthy. ??‍♂️

Perrimans best season in his career is on par with Robby worst season. 

One of Anderson's best qualities is how durable he has been. Only missed 2 games in 5 years.

[Paradis]

1 hour ago, JiFapono said:

Damn it!  Thought it was you.  lol

I understand, ppl tend to associate me with bad players. 

[Embrace the Suck]

Sign him up. JD could then trade him for a 6th round pick.

[Jetlife33]

It’s been talked about ad nauseam but JD has got to regret letting Robby walk and signing this guy. GM’s are never going to be perfect, but some moves hurt more than others. 

[Albaniajet]

7 hours ago, Rhg1084 said:

This guy was our “#1” wr last year 

No you troll that was Chris “I quit the nfl to play lacrosse” Hogan

[Albaniajet]

7 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

He stinks 

I blame Sam

[CanadaSteve]

7 hours ago, Fantasy Island said:

The old weaponz defense.

Sanchez just needed

Geno just needed

Sam just needed

To be fair....its true.

 

[genot]

2 hours ago, Prodigal Syndicate said:

Perrimans best season in his career is on par with Robby worst season. 

One of Anderson's best qualities is how durable he has been. Only missed 2 games in 5 years.

Robby can catch. Perriman has the dropsies.

[slimjasi]

Very frustrating player. 

Plenty of physical talent but no feel for the position. 

[genot]

6 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

Very frustrating player. 

Plenty of physical talent but no feel for the position. 

Yes. What you said. Plus i think he's a lazy football player. The Trumaine Johnson of wide receivers.

[GREENBEAN]

4 hours ago, Prodigal Syndicate said:

Perrimans best season in his career is on par with Robby worst season. 

One of Anderson's best qualities is how durable he has been. Only missed 2 games in 5 years.

Thats the key.  Health.  All of the concerns about RA's slight frame have been dashed on the rocks by his ability to stay healthy. 

But Perriman is a significantly better WR than Anderson even with his work toward expanding his route tree.  It amounts to a hill of beans because he never plays a full season so I get it. but that's the way of it.  ?

[Jetsfan80]

8 hours ago, Doggin94it said:

I thought he was a good risk-reward type signing, and better value than Robby at his price. Still think that; the nature of risk-reward signings is sometimes you get the downside, not the upside, and I still don't think Robby is worth 10M+ per year (which basically had him as a top-25 WR last year, which he wasn't

Exactly.  Perriman at the price we got him > Anderson at the price he costs Carolina.  We were able to quickly move on from Perriman and upgrade this past offseason.  

[Jet hustle]

12 hours ago, kmnj said:

sam had no weapons no coach and a bad gm-he is going to make lots of haters look very silly

 

And when he doesnt?.......

Sam Darnold Fn blows at Football.  Get over it, accept it, and move on

[Albaniajet]

3 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Exactly.  Perriman at the price we got him > Anderson at the price he costs Carolina.  We were able to quickly move on from Perriman and upgrade this past offseason.  

We’re one fluke Corey Davis injury away from again having the worst WR group in the entire NFL again

 

I wonder what the Texans want for Cooks

[Jetsfan80]

9 hours ago, Albaniajet said:

We’re one fluke Corey Davis injury away from again having the worst WR group in the entire NFL again

This WR group without Davis is still better than last year's WR room and the years prior (2016-2019) as well.  You have to make progress where you can.  

 

9 hours ago, Albaniajet said:

I wonder what the Texans want for Cooks

Eww.  Let him go somewhere else, please.  I'd much rather pick Perriman back up if we needed another body.

[Sperm Edwards]

3 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

This WR group without Davis is still better than last year's WR room and the years prior (2016-2019) as well.  You have to make progress where you can.  

 

Eww.  Let him go somewhere else, please.  I'd much rather pick Perriman back up if we needed another body.

Signing Perriman to be the team's #1 WR was not "progress" though; nor was it the first purposeful (mis)step in some master plan.

He just got outright cut by the Lions ffs, despite an 80%-guaranteed contract, after they lost Galloway. And they cut him literally just to get back his roster spot, since they only saved $500K and now only have 4 WRs without him, none of whom are really worth a damn. Maybe at best Tyrell Williams, whose last Anderson2020-level season was 5 years ago (despite being on the receiving end of a productive, 4000+ yard QB every year since).

So is Perriman - who should be in the prime of his career at age 27 - suddenly a less talented & overall worse receiver than he was when the Jets signed him? The Lions' WR corps without him looks no better than the Jets' WR corps without him last year. He should be running away with a starting job, not getting cut by because he's not worth the roster spot as a backup in Detroit. 

He sucks and that's why even the Jets' FO admitted (in so many words) that the insignificant savings with Perriman over Anderson was a mistake. It wasn't because Douglas didn't want to keep Anderson; it was only because he badly miscalculated Anderson would get so much more from elsewhere than he got in Carolina, so JD stopped at what he thought would be a lowball offer (low on guarantees and annual amounts, but high on RA's ties to the team [4 years], whereby he couldn't up his dollars here even if the Jets' QB play and coaching improved to allow his numbers to improve).

[Jetsfan80]

36 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Signing Perriman to be the team's #1 WR was not "progress" though; nor was it the first purposeful (mis)step in some master plan.

He just got outright cut by the Lions ffs, despite an 80%-guaranteed contract, after they lost Galloway. And they cut him literally just to get back his roster spot, since they only saved $500K and now only have 4 WRs without him, none of whom are really worth a damn. Maybe at best Tyrell Williams, whose last Anderson2020-level season was 5 years ago (despite being on the receiving end of a productive, 4000+ yard QB every year since).

So is Perriman - who should be in the prime of his career at age 27 - suddenly a less talented & overall worse receiver than he was when the Jets signed him? The Lions' WR corps without him looks no better than the Jets' WR corps without him last year. He should be running away with a starting job, not getting cut by because he's not worth the roster spot as a backup in Detroit. 

He sucks and that's why even the Jets' FO admitted (in so many words) that the insignificant savings with Perriman over Anderson was a mistake. It wasn't because Douglas didn't want to keep Anderson; it was only because he badly miscalculated Anderson would get so much more from elsewhere than he got in Carolina, so JD stopped at what he thought would be a lowball offer (low on guarantees and annual amounts, but high on RA's ties to the team [4 years], whereby he couldn't up his dollars here even if the Jets' QB play and coaching improved to allow his numbers to improve).

 

Your response has absolutely nothing to do with what I posted.  You just wanted another excuse to post more about your Anderson vs. Perriman garbage.  I don't really give 2 sh*ts about rehashing that debate in earnest anymore.  Both are gone and we "recruited over" both of them.  Quote someone else or GFTO of here lol.  

[Sperm Edwards]

5 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

Your response has absolutely nothing to do with what I posted.  You just wanted another excuse to post more about your Anderson vs. Perriman garbage.  I don't give 2 sh*ts about that debate anymore.  Both are gone and we "recruited over" both of them.  Quote someone else or GFTO of here lol.  

Meh, I quoted the wrong post of yours in on this page.

17 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Exactly.  Perriman at the price we got him > Anderson at the price he costs Carolina.  We were able to quickly move on from Perriman and upgrade this past offseason.  

So admit your mistake.

Kneel before Zod.

[Jetsfan80]

5 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Meh, I quoted the wrong post of yours in on this page.

So admit your mistake.

Kneel before Zod.

 

Just because I said what I said doesn't mean I give enough f**ks to debate you on it.  I will not be responding to your essay that doesn't matter anymore.  

[Sperm Edwards]

3 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

Just because I said what I said doesn't mean I give enough f**ks to debate you on it.  I will not be responding to your essay that doesn't matter anymore.  

Give the f**ks! Give them all!

[Jetsfan80]

4 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Give the f**ks! Give them all!

Robby Anderson sucks and I don't miss him one iota (and nor does Joe Douglas, despite what he said publicly about his "mistake" in letting him walk).  There.  Now I'll need a 750+ word response on my desk in the next 8 minutes.

[Sperm Edwards]

4 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Robby Anderson sucks and I don't miss him one iota (and nor does Joe Douglas, despite what he said publicly about his "mistake" in letting him walk).  There.  Now I'll need a 750+ word response on my desk in the next 8 minutes.

I'm getting on a call in 3 min. But I'm happy to comply after that.

[Albaniajet]

5 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

This WR group without Davis is still better than last year's WR room and the years prior (2016-2019) as well.  You have to make progress where you can.  

 

Eww.  Let him go somewhere else, please.  I'd much rather pick Perriman back up if we needed another body.

Not saying much considering last year’s WR corps was historically untalented 

 

Cooks is so much better than Periman it’s not even a debate

[Jetsfan80]

1 minute ago, Albaniajet said:

Not saying much considering last year’s WR corps was historically untalented 

 

Cooks is so much better than Permian it’s not even a debate

Again, you have to make progress somewhere.

And I don't care that Cooks is much better than Perriman.  He would cost too high of a pick to acquire and he can't stay healthy.  How many teams have to give up high picks for Cooks, then give up on him, before people recognize he isn't worth the cost?

Thus, if we need a WR, it would be far better to acquire one without giving up a pick at all.  Perriman would fit the bill there.

[Albaniajet]

16 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Again, you have to make progress somewhere.

And I don't care that Cooks is much better than Perriman.  He would cost too high of a pick to acquire and he can't stay healthy.  How many teams have to give up high picks for Cooks, then give up on him, before people recognize he isn't worth the cost?

Thus, if we need a WR, it would be far better to acquire one without giving up a pick at all.  Perriman would fit the bill there.

Our history drafting WRs has been pretty horrible

[Jetsfan80]

2 hours ago, Albaniajet said:

Our history drafting WRs has been pretty horrible

Yeah, we all know this.  Not sure what your point is?  That we should give up a high pick for Cooks rather than draft WRs of our own?  No thanks.  Besides, Elijah Moore looks pretty promising, don't you think?