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Nothing in this game made me regret trading Sam


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4 hours ago, Sports-Journalism101 said:

I have read this entire thread and really get the impression that everyone here just wants to bicker with each other rather than dispassionately analyze the game of football and the performance of the New York Jets.  I try to just watch the game and divorce my own ego from the process and in my experience it lets me pick up on the finer aspects of the game.  Perhaps next time you guys can detach yourself from the framework of whether or not you "regret" a trade. 

All that being said, Sam Darnold's performance suggests marginal improvement in his ability to take what the Defense gives him and not forcing the issue.  If he maintains this level of performance, there's a meaningful argument that a Second Round pick (possibly a late Second Round pick) was insufficient compensation to the Jets. 

^See what I did there?  Rather than speaking in the language of regrets, I focused my analysis on value, compensation, and team-building.  

Isn’t bickering the point of a message board?

not everyone can be a sports journalist 

:-)

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Sam with Weapons has a lower ceiling than Zach. I am at peace with this decision. 

Me neither he still sucks. 

Are you also at peace with the fact that the Jets are putting Wilson out there with the same type of garbage OL they did with Sam? Im glad you’re at peace with the decision, and your arbitrary ce

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5 hours ago, Sports-Journalism101 said:

I have read this entire thread and really get the impression that everyone here just wants to bicker with each other rather than dispassionately analyze the game of football and the performance of the New York Jets.  I try to just watch the game and divorce my own ego from the process and in my experience it lets me pick up on the finer aspects of the game.  Perhaps next time you guys can detach yourself from the framework of whether or not you "regret" a trade. 

All that being said, Sam Darnold's performance suggests marginal improvement in his ability to take what the Defense gives him and not forcing the issue.  If he maintains this level of performance, there's a meaningful argument that a Second Round pick (possibly a late Second Round pick) was insufficient compensation to the Jets. 

^See what I did there?  Rather than speaking in the language of regrets, I focused my analysis on value, compensation, and team-building.  

We really need as a society to bring back bullying.

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If Moore doesn’t drop 2 balls put right in his lap early and the Panthers D isn’t just rushing the QB we might have found out a little more about Sam.  He did a great job managing the game which is exactly what was needed against the Jets.  FYI the pass to Robbie was perfect.  There was no need to lead him.  He got the ball to him which is all that was needed.  
 

Sam played a solid game.  He wasn’t asked to do to much but the Panthers didn’t need a lot from him.  Good game. Move on.  
 

Zach didn’t see ghosts.  He took things into his own hands when everything broke dow around him and made some spectacular plays.  If we can make some adjustments to our blocking and realize we can’t run the ball to set up the pass we might just be able to set up the run with the pass.  Zach showed balls when our OC and blocking scheme showed they weren’t ready for prime time.  Kids going to be great if he doesn’t physically  break down.  Mentally tough as nails. 

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3 hours ago, Prodigal Syndicate said:

We really need as a society to bring back bullying.

A little bullying is normal, natural and healthy. A way for kids to learn to establish their own pecking order and social hierarchy when stakes are low. Obviously not endorsing extreme or relentless cases but we are robbing kids of the tools to navigate life.

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I like Sam, I think he can succeed as a starter but I'm blown away from what I've seen from my Zach.  He's still not guaranteed to be a success but he has tools that very few QBs have and he appears to have the right mindset as well.  Clean up the OL issues(I think there's enough talent to have a good OL this year) and we are looking at a potential star QB.

The first half was awful yesterday, it looked like a continuation of the past few years but for Zach to bounce back and even give the Jets a chance with what he dealt with yesterday was incredibly impressive and we should all be really excited.

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11 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

I like Sam, I think he can succeed as a starter but I'm blown away from what I've seen from my Zach.  He's still not guaranteed to be a success but he has tools that very few QBs have and he appears to have the right mindset as well.  Clean up the OL issues(I think there's enough talent to have a good OL this year) and we are looking at a potential star QB.

The first half was awful yesterday, it looked like a continuation of the past few years but for Zach to bounce back and even give the Jets a chance with what he dealt with yesterday was incredibly impressive and we should all be really excited.

Carolina won the first half, jets won the 2nd half.  Jets offensive game plan in the first half is why they lost.  Philosophically, jets wanted to come out with the mature 49ers offense of being able to run the ball effectively to set up play action.  Problem was that Carolina brought the heat and jets didn’t change the game plan until late 3rd q.  Hopefully they move wilson around more and use all the wrs to open up the offense b/c Wilson just might be their best player and they’re not going to be able to run the ball well until they show teams they have to play the pass honestly.

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11 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

Lol - Jets fans and their insecurities.

It's Monday, the Jets are 0-1 and the Panters are 1-0.  A very large part of the reason they are 0-1 is because Sam Darnold had the best opening day of his career and connected with former Jets WR, Robby Anderson for a 60 yard TD.  Like all QB's, he missed some passes but he made the ones he needed to when it mattered.   Knocking him for throwing the ball to the best weapon in Football, might be one of the dumbest exercise in mental gymnastics I've ever seen.  Suddenly, standing the pocket taking pressure, giving what the D gives you and getting the ball to your best player, is a negative.  lmfao.

Jets fans, it's week 1.  We'll see how this Darnold experiment works in Carolina but I'd be encouraged if were them, you didnt see any of the boneheaded sh*t that makes Darnold a liability.  He just missed a few throws on opening day.  Wilson missed a few throws too, they werent nail in the coffin TD's like Sam but he missed throws because that's what QB's do.  Nobody is perfect, except Jameis Winston.

 

Sam wasn't good yesterday, he had all day to throw, own receivers all game and Christian McCaffrey.  That's why he won, Zach was the better QB when you factor in the conditions and it wasn't close.

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11 hours ago, Green Ghost said:

How many games do you think Zach will last this year taking the type of beating he did today, and how long do you think it will be before those beatings have him looking like Darnold did after dealing with them?

See, I came out of this thinking completely differently than you did. I’m incredibly frustrated right now. I’m thinking we might have finally gotten the right guy to play QB, but we’re going to throw him to the wolves.

Again 

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1 hour ago, nyjunc said:

Sam wasn't good yesterday, he had all day to throw, own receivers all game and Christian McCaffrey.  That's why he won, Zach was the better QB when you factor in the conditions and it wasn't close.

You are wrong.  The better QB and the better team won yesterday and it's ok, doesnt mean anything long term but those are the facts. 

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16 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

You are wrong.  The better QB and the better team won yesterday and it's ok, doesnt mean anything long term but those are the facts. 

The better QB did not win yesterday.  The QB in the better situation won.  If you switched the QBs yesterday Carolina wins in a blowout.

 

I wish Sam well, I like Sam but he was not better yesterday.

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18 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

You are wrong.  The better QB and the better team won yesterday and it's ok, doesnt mean anything long term but those are the facts. 

Sam haters trying to rationalize losing to him yesterday after claiming he’s worse than Jared Stidham for the past 10 months

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1 hour ago, nyjunc said:

Sam wasn't good yesterday, he had all day to throw, own receivers all game and Christian McCaffrey.  That's why he won, Zach was the better QB when you factor in the conditions and it wasn't close.

Wow a qb did well with a better supporting cast what a concept!

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Too funny, it's like Sam stole some of your lunch money in 4th grade.

I thought Zach looked pretty damn good, especially given he's a rookie, the lack of protection and drops.

But Sam played a very good game--sure missed a few throws but every QB does and sure he has CMC to lean on but a lot of teams have dynamic players to lean on. 

Sam will never be a top 10 QB but he'll be a long term starter in the league.  No reason to try to tear him down, he's a better QB that we ever gave him credit for.  

But sure, flame away.  He's in the rear view mirror, it's all about Zach going forward and he's gooing to be a great one.  

 

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1 minute ago, Peace Frog said:

Too funny, it's like Sam stole some of your lunch money in 4th grade.

I thought Zach looked pretty damn good, especially given he's a rookie, the lack of protection and drops.

But Sam played a very good game--sure missed a few throws but every QB does and sure he has CMC to lean on but a lot of teams have dynamic players to lean on. 

Sam will never be a top 10 QB but he'll be a long term starter in the league.  No reason to try to tear him down, he's a better QB that we ever gave him credit for.  

But sure, flame away.  He's in the rear view mirror, it's all about Zach going forward and he's gooing to be a great one.  

 

Teddy Bridgewater puts up at least 24 on us yesterday.  

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1 minute ago, Peace Frog said:

Too funny, it's like Sam stole some of your lunch money in 4th grade.

I thought Zach looked pretty damn good, especially given he's a rookie, the lack of protection and drops.

But Sam played a very good game--sure missed a few throws but every QB does and sure he has CMC to lean on but a lot of teams have dynamic players to lean on. 

Sam will never be a top 10 QB but he'll be a long term starter in the league.  No reason to try to tear him down, he's a better QB that we ever gave him credit for.  

But sure, flame away.  He's in the rear view mirror, it's all about Zach going forward and he's gooing to be a great one.  

 

You said it right here. Sam isn't a top 10 qb. So we did right trading him for someone who may or may not be. One thing for sure is that we won't be paying Zack like a top 10 qb next year. Sam on the other hand...

Also yeah he had a good game. Not very good. Just good. Take away CMC. Take away Moore. Take away Anderson. What do you have? Same guy we drafted 3+yrs ago.

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9 hours ago, Ecuadorian Jet said:

Zach will be truly broken before the end of the season with this line. Panthers are not even that good. What happens to Wilson when he faces truly elite pass rushers?

We have the Broncos in 2 weeks

 

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6 hours ago, Prodigal Syndicate said:

We really need as a society to bring back bullying.

This might surprise you, but I am a proponent of what I refer to as "pro-social bullying" as I think that certain anti-social traits are helpfully eliminated through the mechanism of conflict-oriented interactions that force the subject of "pro-social bullying" to reconsider their own potentially anti-social traits.  One of my favorite sports journalist professors even observed that good sports journalism can from time to time be perceived as bullying insofar as you are criticizing players in a way that attempts to get them to change their conduct.  In any event, a good example of pro-social bullying would be that several of my comrades in middle school bullied a peer that, despite being 13 years old, would pull his pants and underpants all the way to the floor when using a urinal.  The subject of this pro-social bullying stopped pulling his pants all the way down after several incidents where he was subjected to pro-social bullying.  Based on his social media presence, he has been able to lead a better life as an adult now.  I get that the one incident did not change everything for him, but I can't help but think that, in the absence of pro-social bullying, he may have become a strange fellow that would urinate with his ass exposed in public restrooms as a 40-year old man if there had been no intervention.  

Separately, to the extent you are suggesting that I would be a prime target for bullying, you are sorely mistaken.  Perhaps by luck, I have certain physical traits and confidence that does not lend itself to being bullied.  Also, I have intense patience with people's positions and will wholeheartedly engage with anyone, and as a result people find it tiresome to get into petty disputes with me.  

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1 hour ago, Peace Frog said:

Too funny, it's like Sam stole some of your lunch money in 4th grade.

I thought Zach looked pretty damn good, especially given he's a rookie, the lack of protection and drops.

But Sam played a very good game--sure missed a few throws but every QB does and sure he has CMC to lean on but a lot of teams have dynamic players to lean on. 

Sam will never be a top 10 QB but he'll be a long term starter in the league.  No reason to try to tear him down, he's a better QB that we ever gave him credit for.  

But sure, flame away.  He's in the rear view mirror, it's all about Zach going forward and he's gooing to be a great one.  

 

He did not play a very good game, if he did they would have easily scored 30+.  I like Sam, I will root for the guy going forward but he was not very good yesterday

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2 hours ago, JiFapono said:

Lol - Jets fans and their insecurities.

It's Monday, the Jets are 0-1 and the Panters are 1-0.  A very large part of the reason they are 0-1 is because Sam Darnold had the best opening day of his career and connected with former Jets WR, Robby Anderson for a 60 yard TD.  Like all QB's, he missed some passes but he made the ones he needed to when it mattered.   Knocking him for throwing the ball to the best weapon in Football, might be one of the dumbest exercise in mental gymnastics I've ever seen.  Suddenly, standing the pocket taking pressure, giving what the D gives you and getting the ball to your best player, is a negative.  lmfao.

Jets fans, it's week 1.  We'll see how this Darnold experiment works in Carolina but I'd be encouraged if were them, you didnt see any of the boneheaded sh*t that makes Darnold a liability.  He just missed a few throws on opening day.  Wilson missed a few throws too, they werent nail in the coffin TD's like Sam but he missed throws because that's what QB's do.  Nobody is perfect, except Jameis Winston.

 

the knock isn't that he threw it to CMC. the knock is when guys like you say it was his best game and it was but CMC had 50% of there yds. anybody can hand it off or pass it 2 yds. and watch CMC run it for another 8 plus. 

Sam miss 2 open WRs in the end zone. that's where it counts. not encouraging. 

and did you miss the bonehead fumble.? another mistake in the end zone.

 

you said we are insecure?. you said the Panthers should be encouraged? well i went to the Huddle last night to see just that and they are more insecure than us and they won. lol must be a fan thing.

funny how they thought there OL was the worst thing. i didn't see it. they also thought Rhule got outcoached by Saleh cause of the 2nd half adjustments. 

and there cautiously optimistic about Sam. for pretty much what i mentioned above. they know those miss opportunities in the end zone wont fly with about 3/4 of the league. hell that almost didn't fly with us despite how bad we played.

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Darnold haters last 3 years "He just sucks"

Darnold supporters: "Let see how he plays when he finally has time and some weapons."

Darnold Haters now "Well of course he played well, he had time and weapons."

Darnold supporters "Duh, that's all we have argued the last 3 years." 

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16 minutes ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

This is not being sour grapes, because I want Sam to succeed starting in 2022, but he is not a good QB. Getting a 4th round pick for him was a victory. Also getting a 2nd rounder is a robbery. 

I 100pct think the trade was great for us and the decision to take Wilson was also great for us. 

I don't think that supports the belief, by some, that Darnold is a bust. He just isn't as talented as Wilson. That is pretty clear. 

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55 minutes ago, Sports-Journalism101 said:

This might surprise you, but I am a proponent of what I refer to as "pro-social bullying" as I think that certain anti-social traits are helpfully eliminated through the mechanism of conflict-oriented interactions that force the subject of "pro-social bullying" to reconsider their own potentially anti-social traits.  One of my favorite sports journalist professors even observed that good sports journalism can from time to time be perceived as bullying insofar as you are criticizing players in a way that attempts to get them to change their conduct.  In any event, a good example of pro-social bullying would be that several of my comrades in middle school bullied a peer that, despite being 13 years old, would pull his pants and underpants all the way to the floor when using a urinal.  The subject of this pro-social bullying stopped pulling his pants all the way down after several incidents where he was subjected to pro-social bullying.  Based on his social media presence, he has been able to lead a better life as an adult now.  I get that the one incident did not change everything for him, but I can't help but think that, in the absence of pro-social bullying, he may have become a strange fellow that would urinate with his ass exposed in public restrooms as a 40-year old man if there had been no intervention.  

Separately, to the extent you are suggesting that I would be a prime target for bullying, you are sorely mistaken.  Perhaps by luck, I have certain physical traits and confidence that does not lend itself to being bullied.  Also, I have intense patience with people's positions and will wholeheartedly engage with anyone, and as a result people find it tiresome to get into petty disputes with me.  

Realizing you're a bit of a prick because you were too large and intimidating to be slut shamed appropriately when you were going through puberty shows a level of self awareness that I rarely see on this board.   I salute you!

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1 hour ago, Sports-Journalism101 said:

This might surprise you, but I am a proponent of what I refer to as "pro-social bullying" as I think that certain anti-social traits are helpfully eliminated through the mechanism of conflict-oriented interactions that force the subject of "pro-social bullying" to reconsider their own potentially anti-social traits.  One of my favorite sports journalist professors even observed that good sports journalism can from time to time be perceived as bullying insofar as you are criticizing players in a way that attempts to get them to change their conduct.  In any event, a good example of pro-social bullying would be that several of my comrades in middle school bullied a peer that, despite being 13 years old, would pull his pants and underpants all the way to the floor when using a urinal.  The subject of this pro-social bullying stopped pulling his pants all the way down after several incidents where he was subjected to pro-social bullying.  Based on his social media presence, he has been able to lead a better life as an adult now.  I get that the one incident did not change everything for him, but I can't help but think that, in the absence of pro-social bullying, he may have become a strange fellow that would urinate with his ass exposed in public restrooms as a 40-year old man if there had been no intervention.  

Separately, to the extent you are suggesting that I would be a prime target for bullying, you are sorely mistaken.  Perhaps by luck, I have certain physical traits and confidence that does not lend itself to being bullied.  Also, I have intense patience with people's positions and will wholeheartedly engage with anyone, and as a result people find it tiresome to get into petty disputes with me.  

Real sociopath hours

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Obviously the narrative will be Sam got revenge on the Jets and is in a better place, etc.

But yeah, he was super mediocre. Hit Robby for that long pass where the backup safety blew a coverage (which he did when he was here from time to time to) but other than that it was largely check downs to McCaffery. Missed routine throws, fumbled in the redzone.

He looked "better" but nothing in the game made me think we'll regret moving on.

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2 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

Obviously the narrative will be Sam got revenge on the Jets and is in a better place, etc.

But yeah, he was super mediocre. Hit Robby for that long pass where the backup safety blew a coverage (which he did when he was here from time to time to) but other than that it was largely check downs to McCaffery. Missed routine throws, fumbled in the redzone.

He looked "better" but nothing in the game made me think we'll regret moving on.

I like to think of the trade as all of us are in a better place.

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1 hour ago, Sports-Journalism101 said:

This might surprise you, but I am a proponent of what I refer to as "pro-social bullying" as I think that certain anti-social traits are helpfully eliminated through the mechanism of conflict-oriented interactions that force the subject of "pro-social bullying" to reconsider their own potentially anti-social traits.  One of my favorite sports journalist professors even observed that good sports journalism can from time to time be perceived as bullying insofar as you are criticizing players in a way that attempts to get them to change their conduct.  In any event, a good example of pro-social bullying would be that several of my comrades in middle school bullied a peer that, despite being 13 years old, would pull his pants and underpants all the way to the floor when using a urinal.  The subject of this pro-social bullying stopped pulling his pants all the way down after several incidents where he was subjected to pro-social bullying.  Based on his social media presence, he has been able to lead a better life as an adult now.  I get that the one incident did not change everything for him, but I can't help but think that, in the absence of pro-social bullying, he may have become a strange fellow that would urinate with his ass exposed in public restrooms as a 40-year old man if there had been no intervention.  

Separately, to the extent you are suggesting that I would be a prime target for bullying, you are sorely mistaken.  Perhaps by luck, I have certain physical traits and confidence that does not lend itself to being bullied.  Also, I have intense patience with people's positions and will wholeheartedly engage with anyone, and as a result people find it tiresome to get into petty disputes with me.  

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10 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Realizing you're a bit of a prick because you were too large and intimidating to be slut shamed appropriately when you were going through puberty shows a level of self awareness that I rarely see on this board.   I salute you!

This sort of humor might have gone over the heads of some of the Jets Nation users so I wanted to call special attention to it.  You have both complimented me regarding my masculinity and simultaneously emasculated me by talking about how I should have been slut shamed.  The misdirection and punch line are masterfully executed.  A lot of people say that I am not very funny, but I take a lot of pride in being able to appreciate and understand the humor of others.  

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9 minutes ago, Sports-Journalism101 said:

Putting all my cards on the table here, I have suffered from depression (not the Jamal Adams kind) in the past but have not suffered from sociopathy.  

No offense intended, man. Just breaking balls (or pro-social bullying if you prefer)

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