Sam Wilson

[More Cowbell]

54 minutes ago, The Crusher said:

It’s just nuts because this is what he actually did good coming in. Game seems to big for him right now, been nice to let him sit awhile to get use to it but powers that be thought he was ready. Still alot of time in the season but early returns are pretty bleak. 

The issue was he never saw a real NFL defense until the bullets  were real. All the defensive players he saw in preseason  were second and third string and everyone thought what a great feel he has for the game. 

[Green Ghost]

16 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

That would be an interesting decision.  I do feel Corral has a toughness to him that will serve him well in the NFL.    

I like that kid a lot, and if Wilson doesn’t take steps forward from where he is right now, we have to consider a guy like him.

This board can be confusing at times. I remember before the draft a lot of people were saying if we took Zach and had a top 1-3  pick again in ‘22, or he was a bottom 4-5 QB, the Jets would have to take another one and keep doing it until you find the right one…
Somehow that’s changed into the Darnold-esque “gotta give him 3 years to develop” thing again.

[southparkcpa]

1 minute ago, Charlie Brown said:

I was thinking of Mahomes (who I wanted drafted) he sat.  It all depends on the team, he Jets have stunk and had a new HC, OC etc and I think sitting Zach would not have been a bad thing but I agree common wisdom is these guys "have to start" now right away..

Come on... everyone knows, when you have Josh McCown at the help drafting a safety is the right play!!!!!!

[Smashmouth]

1 hour ago, ScarletKnight89 said:

This has been the biggest issue with Zach Wilson. He misses way too many easy throws. I don't see how it's not a correctable problem. He's just playing too fast IMO. Settle down, make that throw, and it could be a TD. 

This has to be it, because that's a throw that has to be made damn near every time. He is (as some have said) playing way too fast on plays that don't have to be rushed

[southparkcpa]

1 hour ago, carlito1171 said:

Yes I remember saying WTF Zach?! on this throw....completely on him 

Agreed.  I remember Josh Allen looking pretty shaky his first year.  The Bills got him help, a solid O-line and well....  the rest is evident.  

[rangerous]

1 hour ago, Bronx said:

This throw is equivalent to a layup in basketball. If you can't make this basic throw, you belong nowhere near a football field. 

yes.  i was going to use the term "bunny" which i picked up when listening to bob cousy call games for the celtics.

[sec101row23]

1 minute ago, Green Ghost said:

I like that kid a lot, and if Wilson doesn’t take steps forward from where he is right now, we have to consider a guy like him.

This board can be confusing at times. I remember before the draft a lot of people were saying if we took Zach and had a top 1-3  pick again in ‘22 the Jets would have to take another QB. Keep doing it until you find the right one…
Somehow that’s changed into the Darnold-esque “gotta give him 3 years to develop” thing again.

It has worked out for the Cardinals, but they moved on from their entire coaching staff as well.  Plus, Murray’s skill set is more unique than Corral’s.  It would require a massive set of balls by JD to do that. 

[JustInFudge]

22 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

He’s from Southern California so the only real question is….does he surf or is he a kook boogey boarder? 

lmfao he doesnt surf.  I actually saw an interview that he's never surfed before...the first time he tried a water sports was wake surfing...which is acceptable since it wasnt wake boarding. 

On the real, he's a totally different type of So Cal boy.  He left his prep school because he didnt like "all the rich kids who will never work a day in their lives" and he beat the snot out of Wayne Gretzky's son because he was one of those pompous little rich pricks he hated, so he transferred High School's and then he decommitted from USC because he didnt want to play in the Hollywood drama.

 

[FidelioJet]

15 minutes ago, Bronx said:

Common! You were all about getting him reps as a rookie. 

You have to start acknowledging that you overrated this player. 

Go back and look.  I loved him as a prospect but wanted him to sit early.  

Defiantly did NOT over rate him.  Also go and look what I told you to expect.

He's right where I expected him to be.  Flashing massive potential, but also making a ton of mistakes.

The fact that you can call him "overrated" after 5 weeks is just insane. 

[K_O_Brien]

11 minutes ago, TokyoJetsFan said:

Wilson vs the Falcons reminded me of the kickers in the Packers and Bengals game.  All the talents there, but psychologically not confident and trying too hard not to mess up and over compensating because of it on his throws.   Not saying this is all that’s wrong, but hard to keep your confidence with all the INT he’s thrown so far. He’ll be ok when things slow down for him..hopefully sooner than later.

See, at times I think he can look the opposite, over-confident. That he's looking to sling it too much, searching for the big play.

I like Zach but he definitely has an ego. And that is ok, all the great QBs do. But he needs to accept he is still a rookie, and he doesn't need to show the world he can make all the throws by his fifth game in the pro's. Show a little humility, you're not Aaron Rodgers, take the short throw and live to play another down. 

[UnknownJetFan]

1 hour ago, longsuffering88 said:

Agree

and correct me if I’m wrong I thought he had good natural accuracy in college?

Everyone needs to settle down. The NFL game is too fast for him right now, but it will slow down. We just do not always realize this while it is occurring. Payton Manning struggled similarly his first year and I will never forget (just like Wilson beat the Titans with his play) Manning beat out Jets with Vinny T. the year we almost went to the SB with Parcells. Did that mean Manning had arrived that game?. No, he lost almost all the rest of his games and went 3-13. But for the Colts they expected that and waited for him to continue to develop where he had shortcomings. The game will slow down for Zack towards the end of this season and into next year more and more. We also need the coaches to get better at what they are doing. The OC needs to get better at game plans and even a better 6-8 play script to start the game to get the first drive going leading to 1st downs and points and that will help the 1st half drive situations. Pleas we need our receivers to do better catching any balls that hit them in the hands. When Becton comes back, no question he starts at LT again since we need to form the left side with him and AVT for getting a consistent run game going there. That that will help various plays with Zack as well as far as play action, additional bootlegs/rollouts, etc. The Jets have problems in areas around Zack that makes his job even harder as he is learning on the fly. The one area that was keeping us in the games helping out the O was the D and in this game yes they stopped a few drives in normal fashion, and then got a few turnovers, but the turnovers were already on the Jets side of the field that while they prevented points from occurring were not much different than a punt netting bad field position for the O. Ryan got the best of the D likely due to the Falcons using that same D the last 5-6 years, so he knew it well. He did this also in Ryan's 1st year in 1997 where the aggressive defenses he seems to be able to handle based on his quick decision making. It also didn't help that their run game was effective enough to keep us from pinning our ears back and going after him. The refs also stink as always with their lets give the home team the game tone setting start by calling roughing the passer when it was not even close to that on the first drive. This league is so inconsistent with the way games are called it is almost like watching Pro Wrestling.  

[Uncle Nicco]

15 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

I know, it shouldn't  effect momentum  at all when your QB misses a pass  that is equivalent  of a layup in basketball.

It does, but that didn’t happen yesterday. Again, the offense was dead for the full half before Wilson missed his first layup. You’re spreading a false narrative 

[jgb]

Just now, UnknownJetFan said:

Everyone needs to settle down. The NFL game is too fast for him right now, but it will slow down. 

Yeah, when he is on his next team.

[Green Ghost]

17 minutes ago, Jets Voice of Reason said:

Almost every game Wilson has hand at least a handful of throws where his mechanics have been off like this. This is correctable, but they have to coach this out of him rep after rep. There really is no higher priority on the Jets right now than drilling his footwork on every rep. 

 

 

 

“Things we said for the last 3 years” for $500 Alex.

[Bronx]

2 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

The fact that you can call him "overrated" after 5 weeks is just insane. 

I said that you overrated or I can say glorified him. Sometimes we fall into the blackhole of subjectivity. 

[sec101row23]

4 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

lmfao he doesnt surf.  I actually saw an interview that he's never surfed before...the first time he tried a water sports was wake surfing...which is acceptable since it was wake boarding. 

On the real, he's a totally different type of So Cal boy.  He left his prep school because he didnt like "all the rich kids who will never work a day in their lives" and he beat the snot out of Wayne Gretzky's son because he was one of those pompous little rich pricks he hated, so he transferred High School's and then he decommitted from USC because he didnt want to play in the Hollywood drama.

 

He’s a Long Beach kid, those are much tougher streets than the ones in Capistrano Beach.  

[The Crusher]

33 minutes ago, Pac said:

The lady friend giggled at this pass but laughed out loud for 20 seconds at the one he threw off the back of Moses' head.

I sat there quietly letting the anger flow though me and ultimately subside as she cackled away.

I would guess you’re pretty use to her listing at you by now. My wife won’t even come into the room when I watch them anymore. She drops off grub or beverage, pets the dog a bit then says,” see you after that crap is done!” 

[jgb]

10 minutes ago, Green Ghost said:

“Things we said for the last 3 years” for $500 Alex.

flashes!!!

[Smashmouth]

22 minutes ago, southparkcpa said:

Agreed.  I remember Josh Allen looking pretty shaky his first year.  The Bills got him help, a solid O-line and well....  the rest is evident.  

Stephon Diggs 

[FidelioJet]

13 minutes ago, Bronx said:

I said that you overrated or I can say glorified him. Sometimes we fall into the blackhole of subjectivity. 

Okay, 

But there are plenty of people around here already calling him a bust, calling him overdrafted, doing victory laps today because they didn't like him in the first place.  If that's not you then I apologize.

Question, for argument sake.  

Let's say the defense stops the Falcons on 3rd and 12 in the 4th - with plenty of time left...and the Jets get the ball back and drive down for a TD - Jets win...btw.  I have little doubt that's what would have happened, ZW had settled in.

I know that's not what happened, but let's say it did...what would be the narrative about him today?

We're talking about a fine line between people calling him a bust or people calling him the future.  

[FidelioJet]

9 minutes ago, jgb said:

flashes!!!

Problem is Sam never flashed.

[jgb]

2 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Problem is Sam never flashed.

Flash is in the eye of the butt holder

[Jet Nut]

2 hours ago, Pichula said:

Darnold is actually pin point accurate on these short throws. 

He’s a 4th year QB who doesn’t need to have the game slow down for him at this point.  An important piece of the puzzle

[Bronx]

54 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

We're talking about a fine line between people calling him a bust or people calling him the future.  

He has bust factors going for him right now, but we should buy more time to decide.

There are players in other sports that prefer flashy plays, shooting a 3 pointer instead of a mid range in basketball; swinging for the fences instead of contact hitting in baseball, etc. Zach seems to be focused on the flashy plays and missing out on the simple ones. Somewhat narcissistic and egocentric. He needs to step down from the high horse and make the simple plays instead of heroic ones.

[FidelioJet]

27 minutes ago, K_O_Brien said:

See, at times I think he can look the opposite, over-confident. That he's looking to sling it too much, searching for the big play.

I like Zach but he definitely has an ego. And that is ok, all the great QBs do. But he needs to accept he is still a rookie, and he doesn't need to show the world he can make all the throws by his fifth game in the pro's. Show a little humility, you're not Aaron Rodgers, take the short throw and live to play another down. 

Yes...I think that's the point really.  it's a combination of both.

I think it's clear he's caught up in his own head.   Coaches are telling him to take the check downs, his nature is to go big...He's learning this new system where check downs and short throw are super important.  He's just not playing freely.  You can see him pressing.  When he makes a few completions in a row, you can also see him start to relax and gets better.  

That could be a good thing or a bad thing - good thing is once he does calm down he going to start hitting these throws and things will start to look really good...

Or

he doesn't grow out of it and he just sucks. 

I know what I believe and am quite confident in this kid becoming a top 5 QB.  But who knows!

[Jet Nut]

4 hours ago, Bronx said:

This throw is equivalent to a layup in basketball. If you can't make this basic throw, you belong nowhere near a football field. 

Funny, Mahomes skipped a few short passes last night.  And Allen.  Before the rain.  I guess they shouldn’t be allowed near a football field too. 

Let the over analysis continue but he’ll get better as the game slows and while he’ll skip a pass here and there like every other NFL QB the number will drop

[FidelioJet]

1 minute ago, Bronx said:

He has bust factors going for him right now, but we should buy more time to decide.

There are players in other sports that prefer flashy plays, shooting a 3 pointer instead of a mid range in basketball; swinging for the fences instead of contact hitting in baseball, etc. Zach seems to be focus on the flashy plays and missing out on the simple ones. Somewhat narcissistic and egocentric. He needs to step down from the high horse and make the simple plays instead of heroic ones.

He does but he also has superstar factor.  I think that was always going to be what we were getting here.

I think he takes more of the short stuff than we realize.  He has missed a bunch of those throws for sure.  Two of them cost TD's (I think the one in the right flat yesterday might go a for a TD) and the one last week...

Surely he has an ego, no doubt.  I don't want to break him of that - I really think it just comes down to the game is just too fast for him right now...everywhere, the speed of the WR's, the complicated offense.  He's def. thinking too much - it's obvious.  But that's what rookie QB's have to deal with, especially the ones...

1) are on sh*tty teams

2) not runners (running QB's will fare far better in their early years as it's a security blanket) for whatever reason ZW and LeFleur do not want Zach running at all.

[SAR I]

He's a bust.  I think we all know this now.

Trade him for a 5th before the deadline and before he's completely untradeable.  We're going to wind up with the #1 overall anyway, I'm sure there's another five-tool quarterback we can 'reset' with come April.

SAR I

[docdhc]

1 hour ago, UntouchableCrew said:

By far the biggest and most concerning issue with Zach at this point is his accuracy on short and intermediate throws that are routine.

Obviously it's not great that he's throwing picks, but lots of rookies throw picks -- he needs to adjust to NFL speed, coverage schemes, a different level of pressure, etc.

But the frequency with which he throws crossing routes two yards behind the receiver, throws swing passes in the dirt, and airmails quick out routes is genuinely alarming. Simply put, accuracy is not an issue that typically improves over time. 

I'm extremely worried about Zach.

If he is thinking too much accuracy is affected and should improve when the game slows down for him. No reason he can’t hit short passes when he can drop 30 and 40 yard dimes. Josh Allen has certainly improved his accuracy from year 1. 

[More Cowbell]

49 minutes ago, Pichula said:

It does, but that didn’t happen yesterday. Again, the offense was dead for the full half before Wilson missed his first layup. You’re spreading a false narrative 

I:m not trying to say this was the only problem. The defense is also horrible but you seem to think that Wilson os not a major part of what is wrong with this team when he is. 

[Bronx]

7 minutes ago, docdhc said:

No reason he can’t hit short passes when he can drop 30 and 40 yard dimes. 

Thus far he is proving otherwise. 

[legler82]

2 hours ago, Charlie Brown said:

This was reason so many said DON'T draft Fields!!!  

Fields makes his lay ups and also has way better ball placement than Zach.

[Uncle Nicco]

10 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

I:m not trying to say this was the only problem. The defense is also horrible but you seem to think that Wilson os not a major part of what is wrong with this team when he is. 

Wilson is a rookie QB who is talented and makes a handful of wow plays a game but is going to make mistakes and struggle at times. Like Saleh said this organization will lift you not the other way around. The coaching and offense needs to put this kid in a position to succeed.

Yesterday on our first drive it’s 3rd and 2 and Wilson makes a great play after a bad snap, but crowder steps out of bounds and drops the ball. Wilson then didn’t get the ball again until the second quarter. 

On his second drive he threw a ball behind Davis, but it hit him in the hands. Then we run for -3 so he’s staring at 3-13…

He’s a rookie playing with zero margin for error and he’s not getting enough reps because the defense cannot get off the field. 

[UntouchableCrew]

36 minutes ago, docdhc said:

If he is thinking too much accuracy is affected and should improve when the game slows down for him. No reason he can’t hit short passes when he can drop 30 and 40 yard dimes. Josh Allen has certainly improved his accuracy from year 1. 

Josh Allen is one of the biggest anomalies in NFL history, but yes, he did dramatically improve his accuracy.

Certainly hope it's the yips or something mental he can work through. Deep ball accuracy and short/intermediate precision accuracy are IMO two different things.

[More Cowbell]

11 minutes ago, Pichula said:

Wilson is a rookie QB who is talented and makes a handful of wow plays a game but is going to make mistakes and struggle at times. Like Saleh said this organization will lift you not the other way around. The coaching and offense needs to put this kid in a position to succeed.

Yesterday on our first drive it’s 3rd and 2 and Wilson makes a great play after a bad snap, but crowder steps out of bounds and drops the ball. Wilson then didn’t get the ball again until the second quarter. 

On his second drive he threw a ball behind Davis, but it hit him in the hands. Then we run for -3 so he’s staring at 3-13…

He’s a rookie playing with zero margin for error and he’s not getting enough reps because the defense cannot get off the field. 

Might help if he had some short range accuracy.  You seem to want to blame everyone but Wilson. He is a huge problem. The early returns on him suck. Fortunately  what os wrong can be fixed. Will see if it happens.