Would you still draft Zach if we could have a do-over?

[Mogglez]

This place is unreadable.  See y’all after the bye-week.

Maybe.

[Matt39]

10 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

Tell me about it, sounds great on paper, hire a bunch of hot chicks, drink all the booze, sleep with the clientele, start a couple of brawls, get in the red and make a couple backdoor deals and the next thing you know your on your knees "begging for forgiveness" behind the trash out back just to make sure you have enough Natural Light for the patrons.

 

hell yea

[Dunnie]

Yes.

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk

[Wit]

22 minutes ago, legler82 said:

I wouldn’t go as far as saying he looks good.  He just hasn’t looked bad IMO.

I guess because if his wonky delivery and lack of readiness I thought he would look worse. He also has better talent around him by far and a defense that doesn’t quit. 

[Wit]

16 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

This place is unreadable.  See y’all after the bye-week.

Maybe.

Good to see you back! Also I do remember after the NE game you had given up on Zach, so we gotta cut e drunken slack. That being said, after a loss all the trolls and clowns come out and do their thing. Some at least are trying to have honest conversations but many are just trying to get a rise out of people. 

[JustInFudge]

18 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

This place is unreadable.  See y’all after the bye-week.

Maybe.

[T0mShane]

26 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

This place is unreadable.  See y’all after the bye-week.

Maybe.

This is the rigorous marketplace of ideas, pal.

[Green Ghost]

1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

Somehow more than 2-1 voted they would draft him again and hes turning around and making it 31%  are ready to move on?  Who cares, Id bet the vote was the same not to draft him in the first place.  

I’m not disagreeing with you and @TheNuuFaaolaExperience here, all I’m saying is I’m surprised how many seem ready to give up on him if given a second chance.

You make a good point though when you say the 30 something percent probably never wanted to draft him in the first place.

[Jet Nut]

Just now, Green Ghost said:

I’m not disagreeing with you and @TheNuuFaaolaExperience here, all I’m saying is I’m surprised how many seem ready to give up on him if given a second chance.

You make a good point though when you say the 30 something percent probably never wanted to draft him in the first place.

Its more than 2-1 for.  All the Justing Fields, Mac Jones, Trey Lance fans voted against.  Theyre all struggling and will have good and bad days.  But actually I do think they'll all work out

[Wit]

2 hours ago, Ecuadorian Jet said:

In order to understand the people who voted yes, the bottom line is not drafting Zach, but key decisions that came later. I would not have drafted Elijah More, because everyone knew the biggest thing that you can do to protect Wilson was draft olinemen.  I would have drafted C Creed Humphrey, and would not have drafted Hamsah Nasirildeen, instead would have gone G Trey Smith. So the draft would have ended like this:
Round 1 · Pick 2 (2) Zach Wilson QB Brigham Young
Round 1 · Pick 14 (14) Alijah Vera-Tucker G USC  
Round 2 · Pick 2 (34) Creed Humphrey C Oklahoma
Round 4 · Pick 2 (107) Michael Carter RB North Carolina
Round 5 · Pick 2 (146) Jamien Sherwood SAF Auburn
Round 5 · Pick 10 (154) Michael Carter II CB Duke
Round 5 · Pick 31 (175) Jason Pinnock CB Pittsburgh  
Round 6 · Pick 2 (186) Trey Smith G Tennessee
Round 6 · Pick 16 (200) Brandin Echols CB Kentucky 
Round 6 · Pick 23 (207) Jonathan Marshall DT Arkansas  

Trey smith hurts, but apparently he would have been only able to practice once a week on the blood thinner he was taking. His doctors cleared him from being  on meds since and KC has the fan capital to take a risk that big. 

[maury77]

1 hour ago, Matt39 said:

speaking of mobility...the throw at 1:05 with about 20 yards in front of him to run...just wtf

That would have been a first down had he ran to the right. Instead the Jets unted. 

[Ecuadorian Jet]

46 minutes ago, Wit said:

Trey smith hurts, but apparently he would have been only able to practice once a week on the blood thinner he was taking. His doctors cleared him from being  on meds since and KC has the fan capital to take a risk that big. 

It was the 6th round, we could have taken him - we needed another G - and there was nothing but upside. PS: he has become a talented starter

[Wit]

9 minutes ago, Ecuadorian Jet said:

It was the 6th round, we could have taken him - we needed another G - and there was nothing but upside. PS: he has become a talented starter

Yeah if you go back to that thread we were praying it into existence that day. 

[nyjunc]

Zach has struggled like last rookies do, I have seen nothing to make me regret the Jets taking him.  

[legler82]

23 hours ago, JetBlue said:

Nothing you said changes the fact that like all young quarterbacks in this draft, he had things to work on and clean up.   Have you seen Lawrence lately?  Tell me he looks much better and he was the consensus best quarterback in this draft.  Fields, who I know you are in love with, has looked decent and actually has a pretty good offensive team but he if he were on the the Jets team can you seriously think he would be any better under the current circumstances?  

The problem is the Knapp tragedy and the utter stupidity of not signing a veteran back up who even have started the first few games of the season so the kid could have been brought along slowly.    

Coming from a Fields fan, we’d still suck if he was here.  The only difference IMO would be less INTs and less easy misses.  

[FidelioJet]

I'm glad to see a strong majority of the fans on this board aren't just downright idiots. But for the minority that voted they wouldn't draft him again, there are two groups...

1) The anti-zaxers that are truly enjoying his inevitable struggles - Those people I honestly feel bad for - would rather see their team lose to be proven right - must be a very sad existence - honestly, it must translate outside of football too.  Tough life for sure.

2) The other folks that were fine with ZW being drafted but now after 5 weeks - of a lot of poor play with some flashes of special and a rookie of the week.  Exactly the type of performance that should be expected and even hoped for - from a rookie QB on a sh*tty team  - that are now are saying it was a mistake to draft him....

I mean those people are just downright stupid - I mean, no offense to y'all that changed your mind on 5 weeks of rookie QB play - I'm sure you just can't help it,  people's intelligence levels are what they're born with - so I truly wish you the best in life, can't be an easy one.

[thebuzzardman]

I was really rooting for the kid. Big arm, athletic, got the idea of resetting the QB money clock and Sam is a ginger blockhead.

But a 2nd rounder was wasted on this twink. He's raw as all get out, can't make reads and simple throws. If the Jets were going to draft a several year project at QB, which it's obvious Boy Wonderbread is, than make that pick lower down. 

At this point, even though I think Sam sucks, they should have gone another couple of years and drafted Pitts, looked for a QB two years from now. I mean, the Jets are going to suck for another 2  years anyway, so might as well have let Sam get his bell rung and throw interceptions for 2 more years. 

[Albaniajet]

Zach Wilson sucks

[legler82]

On 10/11/2021 at 1:33 PM, Jetsfan80 said:

He sucked his first full 2 seasons in the league.  Sue us.  

And as @sec101row23 pointed out earlier in the thread, QB's don't tend to fix their accuracy issues at the pro level.  I'll take that a step further.  Allen's turnaround is historically unprecedented by any QB in NFL history.  His freakish athleticism and maniacal desire to improve his accuracy are incredibly rare traits that you can't count on. 

I.E. we have little to learn from Allen except to say taking a QB with freakish athleticism and a great work ethic, even if he's flawed otherwise, is a better bet than it used to be in the pros.  Though that trend started with Cam Newton, not Josh Allen.  Hence why I could have gotten behind drafting Trey Lance out of this past class.  I also could have gotten behind taking Lamar Jackson in 2018, even if I had no interest in Allen and Darnold was my # 1 choice out of the class.  At the time i just figured Jackson would be fun to watch if nothing else.  I had Jackson as my # 3 guy behind Darnold and Rosen.  Yeah, bad calls on those 2 also.  We all make them when it comes to QB's.  But I certainly had Jackson over Mayfield for the reasons I stated.

You cannot expect that kind of turnaround to happen with any young QB who struggles with accuracy in college along with their first 2 seasons in the pros.  Darnold bros are still waiting for him to fix his accuracy problems and it's never gonna happen for him.  This past week proved that.  

Some of us recognized by watching games that Allen’s accuracy issues were a bit overblown.

 

[Albaniajet]

One bright side:  in 3 years if Zach is still here he will make it easier to tank for Arch

[Jetsfan80]

3 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

I'm glad to see a strong majority of the fans on this board aren't just downright idiots. But for the minority that voted they wouldn't draft him again, there are two groups...

1) The anti-zaxers that are truly enjoying his inevitable struggles - Those people I honestly feel bad for - would rather see their team lose to be proven right - must be a very sad existence - honestly, it must translate outside of football too.  Tough life for sure.

2) The other folks that were fine with ZW being drafted but now after 5 weeks - of a lot of poor play with some flashes of special and a rookie of the week.  Exactly the type of performance that should be expected and even hoped for - from a rookie QB on a sh*tty team  - that are now are saying it was a mistake to draft him....

I mean those people are just downright stupid - I mean, no offense to y'all that changed your mind on 5 weeks of rookie QB play - I'm sure you just can't help it,  people's intelligence levels are what they're born with - so I truly wish you the best in life, can't be an easy one.

 

I voted no.  So this means you either "feel sorry" for my "sad existence" or believe I am just "downright stupid", eh?  

I'd like to believe in Wilson.  And he may well be the next Aaron Rodgers.  But I liked Kyle Pitts a lot more as a prospect, even at a non-premium position.  I think he easily could be a future HOF TE and one of the best to ever play the position.  

[FidelioJet]

1 minute ago, Jetsfan80 said:

 

I voted no.  So this means you either "feel sorry" for my "sad existence" or am just "downright stupid", eh?  

I'd like to believe in Wilson.  And he may well be the next Aaron Rodgers.  But I liked Kyle Pitts a lot more as a prospect.  I think he easily could be a future HOF TE and one of the best to ever play the position.  

Yes.  

[Jetsfan80]

1 minute ago, FidelioJet said:

Yes.  

Cool.  Good talk!

[Snell41]

Abso****inglutely not


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[RSJ]

I wanted to keep Darnold even though I didn’t think he was that great. I would definitely still take Wilson though.


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[mfmartin]

If Lawrence was gone, Jones was the choice. A smart guy, great size, won at Bama against superior  soon to be pro SEC competition. Every time I saw him looked like he was thorwing 40 yard ropes, and he wasn't facing some Mickey Mouse conference. Pretty much the same scouting report as Deshawn Watson spare the SEC part. Picking Wilson was overthinking it, the weakness of having a scout rather than a real GM. Douglas fell in love with a great story,a  find, rather than picking an NFL player. 

Same scouting report as who.


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[JustInFudge]

4 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Cool.  Good talk!

lol - I voted no but that doesnt mean I've given up hope. Zach could still be very good.  He's got a ton of work to do but he could turn it around.  It's 5 weeks into his career.  Silly to think we know sh*t about sh*t right now.  But it was a hypothetical question and my stance before the draft hasnt changed because Zach Wilson hasnt given me any reason to think different but yes, I'm a dumb dumb head pathetic human being for playing along in a silly hypothetical question proposed by someone else?  People are getting a little too hysterical around here, no need for that behavior. 

 

 

[Jetsfan80]

4 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

lol - I voted no but that doesnt mean I've given up hope. Zach could still be very good.  He's got a ton of work to do but he could turn it around.  It's 5 weeks into his career.  Silly to think we know sh*t about sh*t right now.  But it was a hypothetical question and my stance before the draft hasnt changed because Zach Wilson hasnt given me any reason to think different but yes, I'm a dumb dumb head pathetic human being for playing along in a silly hypothetical question proposed by someone else?  People are getting a little too hysterical around here, no need for that behavior. 

 

EVERYONE WHO CRITICIZES ZACH AND DOESN'T THINK HE'S A FUTURE HOFer IS SAD, PATHETIC, AND DUMB AND SHOULD FEEL BAD

[Sperm Edwards]

In this thread alone, I don't know what the total is on the number of times it was again restated they should've traded down and picked up "a haul of picks" but it's plenty.

The Jets already had and still do have a haul of picks without trading down from #2. Then Douglas did a 3-for-1 trade up for AVT and still had a haul of picks.

Entering the 2021 draft they had

• What looked like 3 starters from the 2020 draft class in Becton, Mims, and Hall.
• Right now two 1sts (including #2 overall), a very high 2nd, two 3rds, two 5ths, and two 6ths. That's 4 of the top 66 overall, and 5 picks on days 1-2.
• Then the following draft two more picks in the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 6th. (Later tripling up in rds 4 & 6 with the Herndon trade).

I love the team hoarding draft picks, but as the draft started, the last thing this team needed to do, pick-strategy-wise, was draft in 2-3 more rookies to start together, to learn next to all those other rookies, while learning under two novice coordinators and a novice head coach.

[Action Zachtion]

4 hours ago, JiFapono said:

lol - I voted no but that doesnt mean I've given up hope. Zach could still be very good.  He's got a ton of work to do but he could turn it around.  It's 5 weeks into his career.  Silly to think we know sh*t about sh*t right now.  But it was a hypothetical question and my stance before the draft hasnt changed because Zach Wilson hasnt given me any reason to think different but yes, I'm a dumb dumb head pathetic human being for playing along in a silly hypothetical question proposed by someone else?  People are getting a little too hysterical around here, no need for that behavior. 

 

 

FWIW - I am sitting in the middle of the Zach homer camp,  but I think your takes have been reasonable and in the "I see where your are coming from" vein. 

 

[doitny]

13 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

I'm glad to see a strong majority of the fans on this board aren't just downright idiots. But for the minority that voted they wouldn't draft him again, there are two groups...

1) The anti-zaxers that are truly enjoying his inevitable struggles - Those people I honestly feel bad for - would rather see their team lose to be proven right - must be a very sad existence - honestly, it must translate outside of football too.  Tough life for sure.

2) The other folks that were fine with ZW being drafted but now after 5 weeks - of a lot of poor play with some flashes of special and a rookie of the week.  Exactly the type of performance that should be expected and even hoped for - from a rookie QB on a sh*tty team  - that are now are saying it was a mistake to draft him....

I mean those people are just downright stupid - I mean, no offense to y'all that changed your mind on 5 weeks of rookie QB play - I'm sure you just can't help it,  people's intelligence levels are what they're born with - so I truly wish you the best in life, can't be an easy one.

you forgot about the Sam fans.. you know there rooting for Sam to do good and Wilson to fail. 

and you hit the nail on the head when you said....

Those people I honestly feel bad for - would rather see their team lose to be proven right - must be a very sad existence..

your so right. there is no way that a guy comes here and argues with us about how everything Jets is bad. the GM, HC...the players... and then roots for them to win Sunday. there lying..

how can they root for Wilson to do good when they just said he sucks and wish Sam was still here? or root for the defense to make a stop so we keep the game at 3 points with a chance to win when they say we are so bad we might not win another game...

they cant

 

 

 

[doitny]

4 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

 

I love the team hoarding draft picks, but as the draft started, the last thing this team needed to do, pick-strategy-wise, was draft in 2-3 more rookies to start together, to learn next to all those other rookies, while learning under two novice coordinators and a novice head coach.

imagine if we started 2-3 more rookies, this board would have jumped ship after week 1. lol

[JustInFudge]

8 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

In this thread alone, I don't know what the total is on the number of times it was again restated they should've traded down and picked up "a haul of picks" but it's plenty.

The Jets already had and still do have a haul of picks without trading down from #2. Then Douglas did a 3-for-1 trade up for AVT and still had a haul of picks.

Entering the 2021 draft they had

• What looked like 3 starters from the 2020 draft class in Becton, Mims, and Hall.
• Right now two 1sts (including #2 overall), a very high 2nd, two 3rds, two 5ths, and two 6ths. That's 4 of the top 66 overall, and 5 picks on days 1-2.
• Then the following draft two more picks in the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 6th. (Later tripling up in rds 4 & 6 with the Herndon trade).

I love the team hoarding draft picks, but as the draft started, the last thing this team needed to do, pick-strategy-wise, was draft in 2-3 more rookies to start together, to learn next to all those other rookies, while learning under two novice coordinators and a novice head coach.

Meh, I was one of those and disagree with this take.  In principle, I dont think you can have "too many draft picks".  In your scenario, it's assuming that JD just stayed put the rest of the draft but maybe he could have moved up again, it's not like there arent holes all over the roster, who cares if you're filling it with rookies. Whats the worst that could happen?  We suck and only win a handful of games?  And I think the rookies starting together is way overblown.  You have what, 1 rookie starting on offense, AVT.  Carter and Moore are more committee types.  On on D, it's who?  Sherwood and Echols?  Seems like that's not really all that many rookies playing together, idk, could be wrong but I would assume that's probably common for teams and I dont think in every situation you'd be force to start them.  

Just feel like there are many angles you're kind of missing here; trade picks for veterans during or after the draft, trade down and go quality over quantity, trade multiple late picks to move up into the mid rounds, trade picks for positioning in next years draft, increase your odds of finding good players, etc.

 

 

 

 

[jgb]

On 10/12/2021 at 3:25 AM, Mogglez said:

This place is unreadable.  See y’all after the bye-week.

Maybe.

Hmm... seems to have suddenly improved

[JustInFudge]

5 hours ago, Action Zachtion said:

FWIW - I am sitting in the middle of the Zach homer camp,  but I think your takes have been reasonable and in the "I see where your are coming from" vein. 

 

Thank you, this is appreciated.  I believe I'm being level headed and honest in my takes on our QB, despite the legion of posters who attack me for being ant-Zach.  It's annoying and stupid and many people are taking it personal for some odd reason.  I've fully embraced him and fully support him because he's the QB of my favorite team.  He's a great kid, seems to have a good head on his shoulders, has some talent and I hope he becomes the best QB in the NFL because that would be awesome.  I'd rather be wrong on an opinion of a prospect and watch my team prosper and be ridiculed for not wanting Zach than to have to watch another bust QB my favorite team.

That said, I'm going to give my takes on what I'm seeing both good and bad because that's like, what these message boards are all about.