Would you still draft Zach if we could have a do-over?

[JustInFudge]

6 minutes ago, jgb said:

Hmm... seems to have suddenly improved

must have took his dad with him...

[JustInFudge]

5 hours ago, doitny said:

you forgot about the Sam fans.. you know there rooting for Sam to do good and Wilson to fail. 

and you hit the nail on the head when you said....

Those people I honestly feel bad for - would rather see their team lose to be proven right - must be a very sad existence..

your so right. there is no way that a guy comes here and argues with us about how everything Jets is bad. the GM, HC...the players... and then roots for them to win Sunday. there lying..

how can they root for Wilson to do good when they just said he sucks and wish Sam was still here? or root for the defense to make a stop so we keep the game at 3 points with a chance to win when they say we are so bad we might not win another game...

they cant

 

 

 

Dont do this...dont agree with that....you dont call people that sh*t because they disagree with you.  That's childish and really, if you're saying that to someone else for having a different opinion, you need to have a long hard look in the mirror about who's "existence is sad."  This is a message board, just like anything in life, people are going to have different opinions and that's cool because that's life and this sh*t doesnt matter.  It's ******* Football for christ sake and we have zero control over any of this nonsense. 

These same people who are so quick to judge Wilson, are doing the same exact sh*t on the other prospects they didnt like.  All the Anti-Fielders or whatever, lol, were ready to call him a bust because of his first ever NFL start.  Now he's 2-1, playing very well and silence?  People are reactionary, this week to week evaluations and determinations of players, is stupid.  Nobody know sh*t about sh*t when it comes to these rookies but for people to get their panties in a wad and start bashing and name calling because other people are simply sharing what they see and it doesnt jive with you, is just childish middle school behavior.

 

 

[jamesr]

18 hours ago, thebuzzardman said:

I was really rooting for the kid. Big arm, athletic, got the idea of resetting the QB money clock and Sam is a ginger blockhead.

But a 2nd rounder was wasted on this twink. He's raw as all get out, can't make reads and simple throws. If the Jets were going to draft a several year project at QB, which it's obvious Boy Wonderbread is, than make that pick lower down. 

At this point, even though I think Sam sucks, they should have gone another couple of years and drafted Pitts, looked for a QB two years from now. I mean, the Jets are going to suck for another 2  years anyway, so might as well have let Sam get his bell rung and throw interceptions for 2 more years. 

Where would Trevor Lawrence sit in this redraft with Zach as a low 2nd / 3rd rounder?

[thebuzzardman]

1 minute ago, jamesr said:

Where would Trevor Lawrence sit in this redraft with Zach as a low 2nd / 3rd rounder?

I meant 2nd pick. Point was, if Zach is this much of a project, then just take the project QB later in the draft and instead use the #2 on something valuable, like Pitts or whatever. 

I knew he's be raw, but he's showing signs of just not being any good. Unfortunately, I've seen this script with the Jets often enough. Hope I'm completely wrong. Probably am. 

[jamesr]

10 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

Thank you, this is appreciated.  I believe I'm being level headed and honest in my takes on our QB, despite the legion of posters who attack me for being ant-Zach.  It's annoying and stupid and many people are taking it personal for some odd reason.  I've fully embraced him and fully support him because he's the QB of my favorite team.  He's a great kid, seems to have a good head on his shoulders, has some talent and I hope he becomes the best QB in the NFL because that would be awesome.  I'd rather be wrong on an opinion of a prospect and watch my team prosper and be ridiculed for not wanting Zach than to have to watch another bust QB my favorite team.

That said, I'm going to give my takes on what I'm seeing both good and bad because that's like, what these message boards are all about.  

 

 

I thought it was about two extreme viewpoints hurling insults at each other for 18 weeks, but I like this idea better. Hope it catches on.  

[Jetsfan80]

10 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

Dont do this...dont agree with that....you dont call people that sh*t because they disagree with you.  That's childish and really, if you're saying that to someone else for having a different opinion, you need to have a long hard look in the mirror about how's "existence is sad."  This is a message board, just like anything in life, people are going to have different opinions and that's cool because that's life and this sh*t doesnt matter.  It's ******* Football for christ sake and we have zero control over any of this nonsense. 

These same people who are so quick to judge Wilson, are doing the same exact sh*t on the other prospects they didnt like.  All the Anti-Fielders or whatever, lol, were ready to call him a bust because of his first ever NFL start.  Now he's 2-1, playing very well and silence?  People are reactionary, this week to week evaluations and determinations of players, is stupid.  Nobody know sh*t about sh*t when it comes to these rookies but for people to get their panties in a wad and start bashing and name calling because other people are simply sharing what they see and it doesnt jive with you, is just childish middle school behavior.

For real.  Disappointed with the attitude coming from Fidelio.  I thought I’d interacted with him enough to assume he wouldn’t paint everyone with the same insulting brush if they didn’t believe in Zach Wilson, especially after explaining their positions in a reasonable manner.  I was wrong.

Sucks to know you and I are dumb and have sad existences.  I thought we were doing pretty well.  Good jobs, hot black wives.  You’re an adonis and I’ve lost 60 pounds in the last 7 months. Thought we were generally killing it at life, but Fidelio really humbled us today.

[jgb]

17 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

Dont do this...dont agree with that....you dont call people that sh*t because they disagree with you.  That's childish and really, if you're saying that to someone else for having a different opinion, you need to have a long hard look in the mirror about how's "existence is sad."  This is a message board, just like anything in life, people are going to have different opinions and that's cool because that's life and this sh*t doesnt matter.  It's ******* Football for christ sake and we have zero control over any of this nonsense. 

These same people who are so quick to judge Wilson, are doing the same exact sh*t on the other prospects they didnt like.  All the Anti-Fielders or whatever, lol, were ready to call him a bust because of his first ever NFL start.  Now he's 2-1, playing very well and silence?  People are reactionary, this week to week evaluations and determinations of players, is stupid.  Nobody know sh*t about sh*t when it comes to these rookies but for people to get their panties in a wad and start bashing and name calling because other people are simply sharing what they see and it doesnt jive with you, is just childish middle school behavior.

 

 

 

9 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

For real.  Disappointed with the attitude coming from Fidelio.  I thought I’d interacted with him enough to assume he wouldn’t paint everyone with the same insulting brush if they didn’t believe in Zach Wilson, especially after explaining their positions in a reasonable manner.  I was wrong.

Sucks to know you and I are dumb and have sad existences.  I thought we were doing pretty well.  Good jobs, hot black wives.  You’re an adonis and I’ve lost 60 pounds in the last 7 months. Thought we were generally killing it at life, but Fidelio really humbled us today.

Predicting rain means you'd rather have crappy weather than a nice day!!!!

[jamesr]

2 minutes ago, thebuzzardman said:

I meant 2nd pick. Point was, if Zach is this much of a project, then just take the project QB later in the draft and instead use the #2 on something valuable, like Pitts or whatever. 

I knew he's be raw, but he's showing signs of just not being any good. Unfortunately, I've seen this script with the Jets often enough. Hope I'm completely wrong. Probably am. 

There's a difference between being a project and struggling early on. If anyone saw Zach as a project they'd have sat him a year, maybe more, and started some journeyman while they worked on the project.

If he was hitting the ground instead of his targets in practice, or had done so regularly in college then I'd agree, but this is not the case. He didn't just suddenly decide to start sucking 5 weeks ago, so clearly there are some issues that need to be fixed about the speed of the game, decision making and not getting away from basic mechanics. The NFL is a big step up for all these guys, especially so for QBs. 

[thebuzzardman]

Just now, jamesr said:

There's a difference between being a project and struggling early on. If anyone saw Zach as a project they'd have sat him a year, maybe more, and started some journeyman while they worked on the project.

If he was hitting the ground instead of his targets in practice, or had done so regularly in college then I'd agree, but this is not the case. He didn't just suddenly decide to start sucking 5 weeks ago, so clearly there are some issues that need to be fixed about the speed of the game, decision making and not getting away from basic mechanics. The NFL is a big step up for all these guys, especially so for QBs. 

I think he's been kind of bad since day 1. Well, the entire team is so bad it gets confusing. 

[jgb]

19 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

1) The anti-zaxers that are truly enjoying his inevitable struggles - Those people I honestly feel bad for - would rather see their team lose to be proven right - must be a very sad existence - honestly, it must translate outside of football too.  Tough life for sure.

Bro, people who have been pessimistic about the Jets have been right enough for a lifetime. No one here would prefer the Jets to suck for yet another Internet point to add to their pile.

[The Crusher]

19 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

Dont do this...dont agree with that....you dont call people that sh*t because they disagree with you.  That's childish and really, if you're saying that to someone else for having a different opinion, you need to have a long hard look in the mirror about how's "existence is sad."  This is a message board, just like anything in life, people are going to have different opinions and that's cool because that's life and this sh*t doesnt matter.  It's ******* Football for christ sake and we have zero control over any of this nonsense. 

These same people who are so quick to judge Wilson, are doing the same exact sh*t on the other prospects they didnt like.  All the Anti-Fielders or whatever, lol, were ready to call him a bust because of his first ever NFL start.  Now he's 2-1, playing very well and silence?  People are reactionary, this week to week evaluations and determinations of players, is stupid.  Nobody know sh*t about sh*t when it comes to these rookies but for people to get their panties in a wad and start bashing and name calling because other people are simply sharing what they see and it doesnt jive with you, is just childish middle school behavior.

 

 

Well said sweet one. It’s totally possible to hate everything about this team, the owners, the coaches and players but still root for them. Look at the Zach for Class President thread a week back when we literally barely beat the Titans on an overtime missed field goal. Everyone was ready and excited for the next step from that absolutely barely a sliver shimmer of hope. Realty showed up in London and almost everyone hated and wanted to replace everyone again. It’s the Jet fans Circle of life for the sake of God. We all are beat down frustrated and reacted as such but as soon as this horrible franchise gives us a little glimpse of what will likely never be we fall in love again. Fields is 2-1 you say? Who woulda thunk?

[jamesr]

19 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

Dont do this...dont agree with that....you dont call people that sh*t because they disagree with you.  That's childish and really, if you're saying that to someone else for having a different opinion, you need to have a long hard look in the mirror about how's "existence is sad."  This is a message board, just like anything in life, people are going to have different opinions and that's cool because that's life and this sh*t doesnt matter.  It's ******* Football for christ sake and we have zero control over any of this nonsense. 

These same people who are so quick to judge Wilson, are doing the same exact sh*t on the other prospects they didnt like.  All the Anti-Fielders or whatever, lol, were ready to call him a bust because of his first ever NFL start.  Now he's 2-1, playing very well and silence?  People are reactionary, this week to week evaluations and determinations of players, is stupid.  Nobody know sh*t about sh*t when it comes to these rookies but for people to get their panties in a wad and start bashing and name calling because other people are simply sharing what they see and it doesnt jive with you, is just childish middle school behavior.

 

 

This is why I'm glad I don't follow college football at all ... so many people seem to have made their minds up on prospects before the draft and can't accept that we didn't draft "their guy".

Whoever we draft I will support - I'll critique where applicable but not simply slate them with throwaway terms like "bust", "sucks" etc. It's all so binary - good or bad, no in between, and immediate judgement one way or the other.

I guess it would all have been so much better if Zach started 3-0 like Sanchez did, because that was really a great predictor for the next 5 years.  

Patience is most certainly a dying art.

[FidelioJet]

3 minutes ago, jgb said:

Bro, people who have been pessimistic about the Jets have been right enough for a lifetime. No one here would prefer the Jets to suck for yet another Internet point to add to their pile.

I'm sorry, but there are far too many people relishing in Zach's poor play.  I'm not saying that's you.

I just don't agree with you statement -" No one here would prefer the Jets to suck".

I'm not talking about the concerned or frustrated fans - I'm talking about the MANY that are seemingly just giddy with joy. 

I don't disagree we have a right to express our frustrations and I'm right there with you - I'm certainly not an everything is always great guy.  More often than not I don't like what this team is doing (and to your point I've been right)  I happen to think Zach Wilson is an exceptional talent that just needs time.  Just about everything else around his garbage - but that's not the point..  This is 5 weeks into a rookie QB campaign, where he's had little support yet shown flashes of Special and been bad a lot.

People are claiming to be knowledgable NFL fans and have already given up on this QB. This isn't that they might be proven right later.  Zach may very well bust...

But the point is, after 5 weeks there's simply no way to know that.  

 

[jamesr]

2 minutes ago, The Crusher said:

Well said sweet one. It’s totally possible to hate everything about this team, the owners, the coaches and players but still root for them. Look at the Zach for Class President thread a week back when we literally barely beat the Titans on an overtime missed field goal. Everyone was ready and excited for the next step from that absolutely barely a sliver shimmer of hope. Realty showed up in London and almost everyone hated and wanted to replace everyone again. It’s the Jet fans Circle of life for the sake of God. We all are beat down frustrated and reacted as such but as soon as this horrible franchise gives us a little glimpse of what will likely never be we fall in love again. Fields is 2-1 you say? Who woulda thunk?

Our highs and lows are possibly the highest and lowest we can get.  

I think I've posted far more this week after a loss than I did after a win. The euphoria was nice to see although it felt so overdone. But I didn't want to be "that guy" telling everyone to calm down so I mostly said nothing.

The build up to Atlanta was similar ... our D would flatten Ryan all day, Zach will beat them deep over and over, and so on. Kind of like how the Saints were championship material and Green Bay were toast after Week 1. The NFL is a week to week thing, like most team sports at the top level. Soccer, rugby, football - you don't win or lose a game because of how you played the week or the month before. It would be very boring and predictable if it worked that way!

[JustInFudge]

9 minutes ago, jamesr said:

This is why I'm glad I don't follow college football at all ... so many people seem to have made their minds up on prospects before the draft and can't accept that we didn't draft "their guy".

Whoever we draft I will support - I'll critique where applicable but not simply slate them with throwaway terms like "bust", "sucks" etc. It's all so binary - good or bad, no in between, and immediate judgement one way or the other.

I guess it would all have been so much better if Zach started 3-0 like Sanchez did, because that was really a great predictor for the next 5 years.  

Patience is most certainly a dying art.

I watch more college Football than the NFL.  I find it to be much much more entertaining.  So I tend to have very strong opinions on players.  My intuition has served me right many times and not to brag but much more often than not but just like anyone else, I get it wrong too but after this offseason and the venom I received for swimming against stream, I'm going to dial it back in the upcoming draft classes.  People are F'ing looney tunes, man, fawning over a child they're never met while just absolutely destroying another for absolutely no logical reason.  It got personal.  It's bizarre, honestly.

 

[Sperm Edwards]

1 hour ago, JiFapono said:

Meh, I was one of those and disagree with this take.  In principle, I dont think you can have "too many draft picks".  In your scenario, it's assuming that JD just stayed put the rest of the draft but maybe he could have moved up again, it's not like there arent holes all over the roster, who cares if you're filling it with rookies. Whats the worst that could happen?  We suck and only win a handful of games?  And I think the rookies starting together is way overblown.  You have what, 1 rookie starting on offense, AVT.  Carter and Moore are more committee types.  On on D, it's who?  Sherwood and Echols?  Seems like that's not really all that many rookies playing together, idk, could be wrong but I would assume that's probably common for teams and I dont think in every situation you'd be force to start them.  

Just feel like there are many angles you're kind of missing here; trade picks for veterans during or after the draft, trade down and go quality over quantity, trade multiple late picks to move up into the mid rounds, trade picks for positioning in next years draft, increase your odds of finding good players, etc.

Fair enough, but the more likely outcome is he'd have signed even fewer (or less-heralded) FAs than he already did. GMs who hoard high picks like that tend to keep it close to the vest in FA because those positions, ideally, should be filled by all those draft picks he's got. 

I'm not missing the idea that it's more picks to trade away; it's that I don't think a team convinced its future FQB is sitting right there decides to time its FQB acquisition in the first place. It's the same mentality - saying "next year" is the more apt timing for this team - that led it to pass on two FQBs for a safety. Then it turns out only 1 of the following draft's top 4 prospects is even in the conversation grading against both QBs passed on the year before. It's asking for cherry-picking of a mid-round pick (e.g. Prescott) where the odds far lower than nailing one towards the top of the draft. Or the Giants passing on Allen for a RB (when they had a true luxury of having him sit, with Eli still easily productive enough to start). 

High draft picks can have a further, unintended effect, which is finding a couple good, later picks (or even UDFAs), who may grow into solid or better starters, don't get nearly the same look & opportunity when their positions are already taken by higher picks who - for all teams without a cemented starter - get 10x the benefit of the doubt just from draft status. There's obvious pressure put on coaches to play high draft picks instead, especially when that pick was made to fill a specific hole. It takes extreme case busts (e.g. Gholston) to almost never see the field. The pressure mounts even more from fans, who are also intolerant of not seeing a once hopeful prospect not seeing the field (e.g. whatever's the full story going on with Mims). I'm not at all saying trade away all the high picks for low ones; rather I'm saying the competition largely goes away, and the opportunity to find such lower-cost starters for years goes with it. Teams need balance, not even more 21-22 year olds who feel they're entitled to starting jobs by dint of draft slot. 

Anyway the last thing holding this organization back is the lack of additional draft picks. They have more picks - on top of more cap space - than any team should need in order to build a winner. The problem won't be that they didn't trade down; it'd be that they took the wrong QB no matter where they took him. If they chose poorly at QB it'd be a poor choice with or without an extra high pick or two on top of the extra full draft's worth of picks they already had. 

[The Crusher]

3 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

I watch more college Football than the NFL.  I find it to be much much more entertaining.  So I tend to have very strong opinions on players.  My intuition has served me right many times and not to brag but much more often than not but just like anyone else, I get it wrong too but after this offseason and the venom I received for swimming against stream, I'm going to dial it back in the upcoming draft classes.  People are F'ing looney tunes, man, fawning over a child they're never met while just absolutely destroying another for absolutely no logical reason.  It got personal.  It's bizarre, honestly.

 

^^ Still loves Tebow and baps the framed picture of him for luck every time he leaves the house to golf or surf. 

[jamesr]

4 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

I watch more college Football than the NFL.  I find it to be much much more entertaining.  So I tend to have very strong opinions on players.  My intuition has served me right many times and not to brag but much more often than not but just like anyone else, I get it wrong too but after this offseason and the venom I received for swimming against stream, I'm going to dial it back in the upcoming draft classes.  People are F'ing looney tunes, man, fawning over a child they're never met while just absolutely destroying another for absolutely no logical reason.  It got personal.  It's bizarre, honestly.

 

I think I posted this T2 quote during the offseason ... still seems to apply quite well today:

John: [Watching two children fight] We're not gonna make it, are we? People, I mean.
Terminator: It's in your nature to destroy yourselves.
John: Yeah. Major drag, huh?

[JustInFudge]

9 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Fair enough, but the more likely outcome is he'd have signed even fewer (or less-heralded) FAs than he already did. GMs who hoard high picks like that tend to keep it close to the vest in FA because those positions, ideally, should be filled by all those draft picks he's got. 

I'm not missing the idea that it's more picks to trade away; it's that I don't think a team convinced its future FQB is sitting right there decides to time its FQB acquisition in the first place. It's the same mentality - saying "next year" is the more apt timing for this team - that led it to pass on two FQBs for a safety. Then it turns out only 1 of the following draft's top 4 prospects is even in the conversation grading against both QBs passed on the year before. It's asking for cherry-picking of a mid-round pick (e.g. Prescott) where the odds far lower than nailing one towards the top of the draft. Or the Giants passing on Allen for a RB (when they had a true luxury of having him sit, with Eli still easily productive enough to start). 

High draft picks can have a further, unintended effect, which is finding a couple good, later picks (or even UDFAs), who may grow into solid or better starters, don't get nearly the same look & opportunity when their positions are already taken by higher picks who - for all teams without a cemented starter - get 10x the benefit of the doubt just from draft status. There's obvious pressure put on coaches to play high draft picks instead, especially when that pick was made to fill a specific hole. It takes extreme case busts (e.g. Gholston) to almost never see the field. The pressure mounts even more from fans, who are also intolerant of not seeing a once hopeful prospect not seeing the field (e.g. whatever's the full story going on with Mims). 

Anyway the last thing holding this organization back is the lack of additional draft picks. They have more picks - on top of more cap space - than any team should need in order to build a winner. The problem won't be that they didn't trade down; it'd be that they took the wrong QB no matter where they took him. If they chose poorly at QB it'd be a poor choice with or without an extra high pick or two on top of the extra full draft's worth of picks they already had. 

Fair, all good points and I kind of jumped in because I was one of the hoard more picks guys but we're talking about a hypothetical of not taking Wilson and in this scenario, the Jets still have Sam Darnold.

 

[jgb]

23 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

I'm sorry, but there are far too many people relishing in Zach's poor play.  I'm not saying that's you.

I just don't agree with you statement -" No one here would prefer the Jets to suck".

I'm not talking about the concerned or frustrated fans - I'm talking about the MANY that are seemingly just giddy with joy. 

I don't disagree we have a right to express our frustrations and I'm right there with you - I'm certainly not an everything is always great guy.  More often than not I don't like what this team is doing (and to your point I've been right)  I happen to think Zach Wilson is an exceptional talent that just needs time.  Just about everything else around his garbage - but that's not the point..  This is 5 weeks into a rookie QB campaign, where he's had little support yet shown flashes of Special and been bad a lot.

People are claiming to be knowledgable NFL fans and have already given up on this QB. This isn't that they might be proven right later.  Zach may very well bust...

But the point is, after 5 weeks there's simply no way to know that.  

 

Posters here are a self-selected population of especially invested fans that deal with continued disappointment in varied ways. On one end of the spectrum are those that are optimistic in the face of a seemingly endless string of indignities. On the other, are those who take the default position that everything and everyone is presumed to suck until it is definitively proven that they do not. Then of course there is everything in between.

Both extremes annoy each other equally. Neither is operating in bad faith.

[sec101row23]

9 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

I watch more college Football than the NFL.  I find it to be much much more entertaining.  So I tend to have very strong opinions on players.  My intuition has served me right many times and not to brag but much more often than not but just like anyone else, I get it wrong too but after this offseason and the venom I received for swimming against stream, I'm going to dial it back in the upcoming draft classes.  People are F'ing looney tunes, man, fawning over a child they're never met while just absolutely destroying another for absolutely no logical reason.  It got personal.  It's bizarre, honestly.

 

We saw this coming months and months ago.  Merely mentioning that the hype train on Zach Pre draft was getting out of hand resulted in accusations of being a “hater”.   Commenting on a bad throw during training camp resulted in the same.  These issues Zach is having are LITERALLY the issues that were brought up prior to him being drafted.   But now, if you simply say “this play was Zach’s fault” you never want the Jets to be successful, you are only saying this because you loved Fields or you just hate Zach.  
 

Like you said, it was a truly bizarre pre-draft process and that has continued through the season. 

[sackdance]

58 minutes ago, thebuzzardman said:

 

I knew he's be raw, but he's showing signs of just not being any good. 

Same could be said about your takes.

[FidelioJet]

1 hour ago, Jetsfan80 said:

For real.  Disappointed with the attitude coming from Fidelio.  I thought I’d interacted with him enough to assume he wouldn’t paint everyone with the same insulting brush if they didn’t believe in Zach Wilson, especially after explaining their positions in a reasonable manner.  I was wrong.

Sucks to know you and I are dumb and have sad existences.  I thought we were doing pretty well.  Good jobs, hot black wives.  You’re an adonis and I’ve lost 60 pounds in the last 7 months. Thought we were generally killing it at life, but Fidelio really humbled us today.

You are correct. 

I probably should have created a 3rd bucket of level headed and or frustrated fans that have seen something that truly concerns them.  But I do stand by the other two groups of people that exist in this spectrum.

But I do agree with your sentiment and apologize!

[jgb]

18 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

We saw this coming months and months ago.  Merely mentioning that the hype train on Zach Pre draft was getting out of hand resulted in accusations of being a “hater”.   Commenting on a bad throw during training camp resulted in the same.  These issues Zach is having are LITERALLY the issues that were brought up prior to him being drafted.   But now, if you simply say “this play was Zach’s fault” you never want the Jets to be successful, you are only saying this because you loved Fields or you just hate Zach.  
 

Like you said, it was a truly bizarre pre-draft process and that has continued through the season. 

Feels the same as it ever was to me. Pennington, Sanchez, Geno, Darnold... always the same. The difference is the dark siders think homers are unrealistic and naive while homers think dark siders are evil and operate in bad faith.

[Jetsfan80]

2 minutes ago, jgb said:

Feels the same as it ever was to me. Pennington, Sanchez, Geno, Darnold... always the same. 

The truly remarkable thing is @Pac thinks all 4 of these QBs were actually good, and in Geno and Darnold’s case, still are.

He doesn’t like Wilson much so that gives me hope.  Still waiting for Pac to tell me which litter numbers definitely WON’T win so I can be rich.

[jgb]

5 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

The truly remarkable thing is @Pac thinks all 4 of these QBs were actually good, and in Geno and Darnold’s case, still are.

He doesn’t like Wilson much so that gives me hope.  Still waiting for Pac to tell me which litter numbers definitely WON’T win so I can be rich.

A strong argument could be made that they've been consecutively worse

[JustInFudge]

24 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

We saw this coming months and months ago.  Merely mentioning that the hype train on Zach Pre draft was getting out of hand resulted in accusations of being a “hater”.   Commenting on a bad throw during training camp resulted in the same.  These issues Zach is having are LITERALLY the issues that were brought up prior to him being drafted.   But now, if you simply say “this play was Zach’s fault” you never want the Jets to be successful, you are only saying this because you loved Fields or you just hate Zach.  
 

Like you said, it was a truly bizarre pre-draft process and that has continued through the season. 

Yep and the point of bringing up the issues, isnt to say I told you so or to say this will never change or to pronounce him a bust.  It's quite the opposite.  It's all about simply pointing out that this was stuff he carried with him from college and someone needs to coach him out of it.  That's all.  And to me, it's concerning when you hear both the OC and the QB dismiss any question about fundamentals and mechanics when they're clearly and outwardly plaguing his ability to play the position at this level.  That's the concern because the cause and effect of this is very bad and detrimental to the go forward plan.  Zach's inability to execute, is muddying the opportunities to assess other players/coaches/the system, etc.  LaFleur might be calling the most beautiful game imaginable, the OL might be great, the weapons could be awesome but we'd never know because Zach cant execute simple plays.

 

[legler82]

On 10/11/2021 at 11:41 AM, batman10023 said:

did you advocate drafting him instead of darnold?

[Rangers9]

I wouldn't have probably started Wilson day 1. Again the Jets had a very high draft pick at Qb and there was no true Qb competition in training camp. We've done this before recently and it's failed. But right now I'd still start him it's too late imo to reverse course on this unless he regresses or an injury. Also we have no experienced backup White hasn't played a snap in the NFL and going into the season out of training camp all 3 Qbs on the depth chart had no snaps. They do have Johnson now as no. 3.  Not all of Zach's fault he hasn't had consistent production out of the other skill positions. A lot of dropped passes which killed drives. He would have been a lot more successful if his receivers were overproducing which is what you are paying them to do. Also the game plan imo not good enough esp for a rookie Qb. They have adjusted it in recent weeks and at times his performance in short passing game has been pretty bad. Good that we are having a bye week this coming weekend this team needs it. 

[legler82]

On 10/11/2021 at 2:36 PM, Out of Bounce said:

Wilson didn't have accuracy issues in college.  His downfield accuracy was elite and his low-mid range was just good.  His recent struggles don't change that.

Too bad we’re not in college anymore.

[legler82]

On 10/11/2021 at 6:19 PM, Matt39 said:

https://mattwaldmanrsp.com/2021/04/15/matt-waldmans-rsp-film-room-with-mark-schofield-qb-zach-wilson-byu/

Waldman did flag it in the predraft, especially with the short/horizontal stuff that were seeing him struggle with.

Rewatching this video and Matt Waldman pointed out EVERY single one of the issues we are seeing now with Wilson. Credit to him and his evaluation skills.

[slimjasi]

5 minutes ago, legler82 said:

Rewatching this video and Matt Waldman pointed out EVERY single one of the issues we are seeing now with Wilson. Credit to him and his evaluation skills.

The good news is that some of this should be correctable. The offseason will be huge for Wilson. 

[legler82]

2 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

The good news is that some of this should be correctable. The offseason will be huge for Wilson. 

What would not be correctable?

[slimjasi]

Just now, legler82 said:

What would not be correctable?

It depends on if there is a mental component to him missing some of the bunnies that he misses and what kind of work ethic Zach has. Everyone says he's a very hard worker, so I'm hopeful. 

[Matt39]

29 minutes ago, legler82 said:

Rewatching this video and Matt Waldman pointed out EVERY single one of the issues we are seeing now with Wilson. Credit to him and his evaluation skills.

Yeah. He’s good and pretty unbiased. A bit more in depth than Steve Young or that goober Orlovsky.