How good has George Fant been at LT?

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

2 hours ago, More Cowbell said:

Becton is not going to sit. This is one of JD's big selections  and he will play. What most likely  happens  is Fant moves back to RT and Moses either goes to the bench or they  move him to G and end the GVR experiment.  

Becton won't be playing because he is one of JD's big selections. Becton will play because he is the best LT on this team by a wide margin. Health and conditioning are two legit knocks on Becton, but there is no question that he is better than both Moses and Fant. 

[jgb]

This is a lost season. Figuring out whether Becton is the long term solution at LT is one of the few pieces of value we can still hope to achieve. He has to play.

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

1 minute ago, jgb said:

This is a lost season. Figuring out whether Becton is the long term solution at LT is one of the few pieces of value we can still hope to achieve. He has to play.

I try to be optimistic with Becton and think that these early injuries will not be indicative of what will come in the future, but I have a strong feeling that we will be doing this again in 2022. 

 

[More Cowbell]

19 minutes ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

Becton won't be playing because he is one of JD's big selections. Becton will play because he is the best LT on this team by a wide margin. Health and conditioning are two legit knocks on Becton, but there is no question that he is better than both Moses and Fant. 

Even if he was not the best LT, he plays. You don't  sit #1 draft picks in their second season.  

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

Just now, More Cowbell said:

Even if he was not the best LT, he plays. You don't  sit #1 draft picks in their second season.  

Based on how the #2 pick hasn't been playing, the same would be true for the #1 pick. But since Becton is clearly better than Fant, we won't have to find out. 

[peebag]

3 hours ago, Barton said:

He's done well but who has he really played against?

Certainly not Karl Lawson.

?

[Barry McCockinner]

Nice to have o-line depth to where your line isn't completely decimated when the starting LT goes down. In years past this would have been detrimental. Credit Joe Douglas for significantly improving the depth of the o-line. The rest is just noise.

[jgb]

15 minutes ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

I try to be optimistic with Becton and think that these early injuries will not be indicative of what will come in the future, but I have a strong feeling that we will be doing this again in 2022. 

 

Have a sinking suspicion you are right but the only way to shed the injury prone label is to play and not get hurt.

[Bruce Harper]

Fant is a strong pass blocker and a below average run blocker.  When Becton comes back, I would tell Moses if you want to stay on the field we want you to play right guard.  Put Fant back at RT and Becton at LT and that's our best five.  Normally I don't just assume a tackle can move to guard but Moses's skills seem like they would translate well.  And this would get rid of our weak link (Van Roten) and improve our running game dramatically.  I know Moses would probably be resistant but if the alternative is the bench, maybe he'd come around.

[More Cowbell]

4 minutes ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

Based on how the #2 pick hasn't been playing, the same would be true for the #1 pick. But since Becton is clearly better than Fant, we won't have to find out. 

There is a huge difference between a guy that you selected at the end of the second after you traded down multiple times before picking and a guy you picked in the first half of the first round at a position you made a proclamation that fixing was job one. That guy plays. 

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

8 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

There is a huge difference between a guy that you selected at the end of the second after you traded down multiple times before picking and a guy you picked in the first half of the first round at a position you made a proclamation that fixing was job one. That guy plays. 

The better player plays, and Becton is a better player. We are at a stalemate here. Time to agree to disagree. 

[More Cowbell]

10 minutes ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

The better player plays, and Becton is a better player. We are at a stalemate here. Time to agree to disagree. 

I happen to agree, Becton is the better player but even if he was not, he would still play. Fant actually might be grading higher at pass protection and Becton definitely grades out better as a run blocker  so arguments can be made one way or the other but due to Bectons draft status, it is a no brainer. You start him where you drafted him to play. 

[Fantasy Island]

1 hour ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

This goes against the JD ignored the OL narrative. He solidified the tackle position.

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

1 hour ago, More Cowbell said:

I happen to agree, Becton is the better player but even if he was not, he would still play. Fant actually might be grading higher at pass protection and Becton definitely grades out better as a run blocker  so arguments can be made one way or the other but due to Bectons draft status, it is a no brainer. You start him where you drafted him to play. 

We are at a stalemate here. Time to agree to disagree. 

[FidelioJet]

2 hours ago, More Cowbell said:

Even if he was not the best LT, he plays. You don't  sit #1 draft picks in their second season.  

They're sitting a 2nd rounder.....

[Butterfield]

Didn’t Fant play some guard with the Seahawks?

[flgreen]

14 minutes ago, Butterfield said:

Didn’t Fant play some guard with the Seahawks?

No.

He's a converted TE who never actually played TE in college.  Was a basketball player.

Came into the league on a try out at TE.  Blocked so well they made him a T.  Good pass blocking T, OK , but below average in the run game.  Fant is a valuable player, can play LT, RT, and TE.  He is not a guard

[freestater]

Fant - AVT - McGovern - Moses - Becton

[jgb]

1 hour ago, FidelioJet said:

They're sitting a 2nd rounder.....

Wish they were sitting on another 1st

[FidelioJet]

19 minutes ago, jgb said:

Wish they were sitting on another 1st

Agree, would really like to see what that Mike White has to offer...

[jgb]

1 minute ago, FidelioJet said:

Agree, would really like to see what that Mike White has to offer...

So that's where we are now. God we suck.

[nj meadowlands]

We didn't draft Becton as high as we did to move him around or screw with his confidence.  He's going to play LT when he's back.  It's great, for a variety of reasons, that Fant is playing well.  Maybe the Jets can survive another year or so with him at RT while they address C and RG in the draft/FA this offseason.

[JohnnyLV]

7 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Fant’s contract isn’t up after this year. He’ll be about $10MM in new money next year (not guaranteed, though), plus another $1MM from his signing bonus hits the cap whether he’s on the team or not.

Also Seattle used him that way because he was dirt cheap. Nobody pays a backup/swing tackle $10MM (let alone while squeezing other starting players out of millions). The players are well aware how much each other makes.

Correct.

One problem with Becton’s injury is that he isn’t going to get back until the trade dealine has passed, so (barring a Becton trade) all three starting tackles, for two starting tackle positions, are going to be here this season. Moses I think is only on a 1-year deal. Fant has one more year, and Becton 2 more (plus an option yr for one more, which is a notch lower $ because he wasn’t a top 10 pick).

After this season they have a lot of options. The easiest is to just not re-sign Moses.

Or they could re-sign Moses & trade Fant. A veteran LT who’s been top-notch in pass blocking, whose contract is just under $10MM for the year, without a long-term committment required, would have some trade value.

The most versatile + efficient option is to have 2 starters for 2 positions: just let Moses go and just bring back Fant/Becton.

• Let Fant/Becton battle it out for who plays which position.
• Fant’s run-blocking is no less of a liability at RT than LT, so maybe he stays there if his current level of play continues.

The most injury-bulletproof option would be to bring back all 3 (as this year demonstrated firsthand).

• However if Fant isn’t one of the two starters it rarely sits well among the players to have a $10MM player (whose contract wasn’t guaranteed in ‘22) backing up two $5MM starters.
• A non-starting swing tackle isn’t a $10MM position, and it could be bad for morale to give him - yet another veteran starter - the Crowder treatment after waiting until everyone else already has their starting tackles in place.
• It could be that money was the tie-breaker when Fant started over Moses opening day; the idea being that, while their individual strengths were different, overall neither was night & day better than the other & they wouldn’t have that lopsided $ arrangement. Plus Moses had playing time incentives.
• With more options where to go in March, Moses may not want to return to a team where he isn’t effectively guaranteed a starting job, since he isn’t getting 2 guaranteed $ seasons from anyone.

With so much cap space, and so little clout for the GM & HC/OC to weather the excuses of an injured OT starter next year, their best option may be just to bring back all 3 in their current roles (whatever those will be when Becton returns lol), even if it’s a inefficient use of space, and maybe put a bit of a squeeze on Fant in late August if he doesn’t beat out both next year. I don’t love the squeeze practice, but if he gets beat out he’s put himself in that situation, and in late Aug he’s not getting a guaranteed $10MM from anyone else anyway (salaries become guaranteed once he makes that final cut for week 1).

I think that one thing people are not considering is that AVT is approaching All Pro level play after a bad week 1. So it is possible that Fant is having a career year because of that. Still, I think I might offer Fant an extension. He is reliable and stays healthy. Becton is a very large ? at this point. I could see him busting out when he comes back or learning from the injury and starting to take better care of himself and realizing his potential. I wouldnt want to bet either way,

[Sperm Edwards]

4 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

I think that one thing people are not considering is that AVT is approaching All Pro level play after a bad week 1. So it is possible that Fant is having a career year because of that. Still, I think I might offer Fant an extension. He is reliable and stays healthy. Becton is a very large ? at this point. I could see him busting out when he comes back or learning from the injury and starting to take better care of himself and realizing his potential. I wouldnt want to bet either way,

I wouldn't. The Jets have a bajillion draft picks and I'm satisfied enough with the pleasant surprise of his pass blocking to just enjoy that much while the team's breaking in a rookie QB.

Last thing I'd bank on is someone's career year - in one aspect of his game, while still relatively failing at the other half - becoming the baseline for all years to come.

At this point it's between wait & see and take the money & run on Fant. It's not even a sure thing that he should be the starting LT next year, or even for the entire duration of this season yet, let alone anointing him for 2023 and beyond. Plus he's not going to come at any more of a discount to extend now (or at the end fo the season) than he'll be a year later.

There's no need to do anything with Fant until at least this time next year.

[Integrity28]

7 hours ago, More Cowbell said:

Even if he was not the best LT, he plays. You don't  sit #1 draft picks in their second season.  

You do if they aren’t earning it.

This take is classic Jets franchise trash. Protecting the optics vs. playing the best players. Awful.

[AFJF]

7 hours ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

This goes against the JD ignored the OL narrative. He solidified the tackle position.

While AVT is dominating and McGovern is looking more like the guy they thought they were getting in free agency.

 

GVR is the only issue.   If not for the spinal injury  he may have already lost his job to Cam Clark.

 

OL is 80% good to go.

Edited October 19, 2021 by AFJF

[Matt39]

7 hours ago, More Cowbell said:

I happen to agree, Becton is the better player but even if he was not, he would still play. Fant actually might be grading higher at pass protection and Becton definitely grades out better as a run blocker  so arguments can be made one way or the other but due to Bectons draft status, it is a no brainer. You start him where you drafted him to play. 

Becton should have never been drafted to begin with. But anyways….Wilson not getting hit is more important than whatever slight run blocking upgrade he may give you whenever he comes back(if at all this season). Also have to see what type of shape he’s in. 

Becton seems more like a sunk cost than anything at this point. Just doesn’t seem locked into football and doesn’t have the mental toughness to play offensive line yet. Maybe the light goes on, don’t see it though.

[Skeptable]

19 hours ago, AFJF said:

Have been very impressed with Fant at LT and decided to see where PFF had him ranked since taking over at LT in week 2.  Numbers were even better than I expected.

 

But how is he at run blocking

[FidelioJet]

59 minutes ago, AFJF said:

While AVT is dominating and McGovern is looking more like the guy they thought they were getting in free agency.

 

GVR is the only issue.   If not for the spinal injury  he may have already lost his job to Cam Clark.

 

OL is 80% good to go.

It's worse than just GVR.  He is clearly the weak link - but he's a weak link on an already weak chain.

The pass blocking has been better of late, for sure - but it's still not good, just better than it was...

Run blocking is still atrocious.  I mean, there's just no push whatsoever in the run game.  

The Jet OL is still a bottom 5 unit in the NFL.  Just not as bad as it was the first 3 weeks.

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

1 hour ago, AFJF said:

While AVT is dominating and McGovern is looking more like the guy they thought they were getting in free agency.

 

GVR is the only issue.   If not for the spinal injury  he may have already lost his job to Cam Clark.

 

OL is 80% good to go.

Yes.

Some people expected JD to fully rebuild an awful line in two years. He has signed Fant, McGovern, Van Roten, and Moses. Drafted Becton, Clark, and AVT, but somehow, he "neglected the line." Did he do the best possible job? No. But saying he neglected the line is asinine. Being an RG, and center upgrade away from a top 15 line is an acceptable job. McGovern is ok, but it's time for an elite center like this organization is accustomed to. 

[More Cowbell]

1 hour ago, Integrity28 said:

You do if they aren’t earning it.

This take is classic Jets franchise trash. Protecting the optics vs. playing the best players. Awful.

Every team would do that. That WR the Pats picked 3 or 4 years ago in round 1 was trash. They still played him

[More Cowbell]

41 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Becton should have never been drafted to begin with. But anyways….Wilson not getting hit is more important than whatever slight run blocking upgrade he may give you whenever he comes back(if at all this season). Also have to see what type of shape he’s in. 

Becton seems more like a sunk cost than anything at this point. Just doesn’t seem locked into football and doesn’t have the mental toughness to play offensive line yet. Maybe the light goes on, don’t see it though.

Becton has been more unlucky than bad. 

[k-met57]

17 hours ago, johnnysd said:

I think he is signed through next year.

With 0 dead money if cut and 9m in savings. In NFL language that may as well mean he is a FA…not to mention that if he keeps this up he will posture for a multi year extension with someone.

[Matt39]

14 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

Becton has been more unlucky than bad. 

Him getting rolled on was unlucky. Overall he's just been disappointing for a variety of reasons.

[AFJF]

46 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

It's worse than just GVR.  He is clearly the weak link - but he's a weak link on an already weak chain.

The pass blocking has been better of late, for sure - but it's still not good, just better than it was...

Run blocking is still atrocious.  I mean, there's just no push whatsoever in the run game.  

The Jet OL is still a bottom 5 unit in the NFL.  Just not as bad as it was the first 3 weeks.

Wholly disagree.  Had plenty of push vs Atlanta but numbers didn't look great because the run was abandoned early, GVR allowed some hits in the backfield and multiple runs inside the 5 yd line.