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It's coaching 1000%. And we got a taste of it in the off season when Lafleur was going after Becton. Many here bought into that "He's overweight" lie. Then it became Mims forgot how to read playbooks.

Since then, we've seen numerous players making mistakes and just flat out being put in the wrong positions with little chance of success IE. Moore being asked to block on a WR screen and just getting demolished. 

It's a shame because the coaches say the right thing but it's lip service at this point. There was no change in philosophy this week, just more of the same. 

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There are no good players on this team.  That's the first, second, third fourth and fifth problem...after that you can begin to implement a grand scheme..

As much as you don't want to hear it, Zach Wilson is the only plus level talent on this team right now (and he's obviously still learning)

Mosley too - but he's played 6 games in 3 years...

I don't want to hear about QW, until he can get consistent pressure on the QB he's little better than a JAG.

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Can't run.

Can't stop the run.

Can't get pressure.

Can't stop pressure on our QB.

Even in today's pass-happy NFL, if you do any of these things you're going to be very, very bad. 

Especially with a rookie QB.

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10 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

The problem is bad teams like the Lions know they are bad and improvise to win games (fake punt etc) The Pats were 2-4 playing for their season dialing up trick plays going for it on 4th down. 

We pretend we are good or something, sticking to "disciplined" vanilla football.  Its all coaching. 

Of course the Lions haven't won a game yet, but I get your point.

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12 minutes ago, OtherwiseHappyinLife said:

Here are a few.  Curious what your views are.

1. OC who has no ability or leash to think outside the box and cater to whatever few strengths the Jets have

2. DC who fits the same mold above

3. Horrible run defense as a special callout which is limiting opportunities to pin ears back and rush the passer.  Wtf happened to this previous strength?

4. Head Coach who either overly controls his coordinators or who gives them way too much slack.  The scripted first 3 plays yesterday was a joke punishable in my head by severe bamboo stick lashings

5. Now back to the first 3 plays.  Unequivocally to me shows an uptight culture trying to stay in games rather than a bold young team that says f-it.  Winning might be a byproduct of our aggressiveness but the goal now should be to establish an identity that bears fruit down the road.  All GAS no breaks has turned into All Gas + Bloating.  The Jets might qualify as Irritable Bowl Syndrome

6. Back to #5, has anyone thought that football can actually be entertaining?  Bellicheck is an f-in bore but puts a fun product on the field.  To date, Saleh is a stud off the field but a prude in between the lines or sheets 

 

 

Down 14-0 early (and clearly unable to stop the Pats) we drove down the field on 12 plays and on a 4th and 7 from the 30 decided to go for a meaningless long FG instead of having some gutts and going for it. What does a FG really do for a team down 14-0 and unable to stop the opposing offense? 

It's the Adam Gase approach of scoring moral victories so you can say in your press conference after the game that "Hey, we put up some points on our 2nd drive blah blah blah". If you are actually trying to win or build confidence in your Rookie QB you tell the kid "go for it!,  We believe in you!" 

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I do not understand how you call 2 draw plays followed by a desperate 3rd and long sack. Off 2 weeks of prep, that you come out like that is beyond embarrassing. This is Saleh and Lafleur's livelihoods and careers. And like so many before them, they don't seem smart enough to get they're contributing to their own demise. 

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Just now, Bugg said:

I do not understand how you call 2 draw plays followed by a desperate 3rd and long sack. Off 2 weeks of prep, that you come out like that is beyond embarrassing. This is Saleh and Lafleur's livelihoods and careers. And like so many before them, they don't seem smart enough to get they're contributing to their own demise. 

That has to be Saleh telling Lafleur to establish the run, to give the defense a breather etc..

It's 1980's football. 

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I'm not sure why anyone thought the Jets would be good this year, but to answer why they're bad? Inexperience

They have a first-time head coach, first-time offensive coordinator, first-time defensive coordinator, a rookie QB, and 6 other rookie starters on both offense and defense (not to mention the youngest team in the NFL). 

This roster is more talented than those we've seen in the past few seasons, but that doesn't necessarily mean they will win more. These guys are still learning the ropes on the fly, and unlike some teams, we have significant contributors in every positional group who are rookies. Smart defenses and offenses key in on that and will game plan against you differently, knowing that there will be some mental lapses among those guys. 

 

I know it's been tough to watch, especially after a loss like yesterday. The next 3 weeks are going to suck, but the final 8 games of the season have a chance to be fun. The schedule softens significantly, I do think we'll see an improved Zach Wilson post-injury (kind of like we saw for Sam Darnold in 2018), we'll likely have Mekhi back, and at some point its going to "click" for a bunch of these younger guys which should lead to some exciting football at the very least. 

There's a lot of things to sh*t on (I have a long list), but think it's best to kind of sit back and watch how things progress. I for one didn't expect much different in the Jets first 6 games; I expected them to be 0-6. I didn't foresee an injury/Cincinnati being so good, but I expected we would be 1-8 through 10 weeks. I do see them winning 4-to-6 games in the final 8, but ultimately, just preparing to see better performances. 

The Cardinals 3-year rebuild is kind of what I'm hoping to see the Jets foster. I didn't have expectations this year, I do expect them to be a more consistent team next year, but I think 2023 is the year they can put together something special. They have a lot of guys who are really, really talented and will continue to add players the next 2 seasons. I hate waiting as much as anyone else, but I don't realistically expect this team to be a contender anytime soon... if the organization can remain patient between now and 2023, they have a chance to build something special for that season and hopefully many years to come. 

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Sh*t roster. Starters who would be backups for other teams. Backups and rotational players who wouldn’t be in the NFL if they weren’t under contract with the Jets. 

The coaching staff is really bad. Nevertheless, three consecutive GM’s who are horrible at drafting has led us to where we currently are.

Playing the blame game, I’ll go 60% Joe Douglas, 20% Mike Maccagnan, 15% Robert Saleh and the coaching staff, 5% quarterback play. 

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I would say there is no truly elite talent on this team.  Maybe the Becton from last year qualified…. Certainly not ZW at this time.  But none of our skill positions are truly top ten lvl elite.  None of our defenders (Maye has underperformed relative to last year and QW is AWOL for too many stretches of play).  There is no Aaron Donald or TJ Watt that will get us that crucial sack, or a Stephon Gilmore to get us a much needed INT.

I would say 75% of the problem is the rookie qb who is a good bit behind other rookies in knowing how to play.  

Watching little things Mac Jones did yesterday really reinforced the problem.  He’s like a half second faster in every single thing he does, and manipulates the pocket better.  That means fewer sacks, and he throws the ball away correctly.  It just makes for fewer three and outs, and more rhythm (as well as gassing out the opposing D).  He doesn’t need to throw perfect balls to be effective (and in general, you don’t need to in the NFL).  ZW has no mastery of any of that at this time.

And then we get to weaknesses in the roster.  Depth is just awful, but there are major holes.  TE, guard, lber and running back are major areas of need.

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13 minutes ago, football guy said:

I'm not sure why anyone thought the Jets would be good this year, but to answer why they're bad? Inexperience

They have a first-time head coach, first-time offensive coordinator, first-time defensive coordinator, a rookie QB, and 6 other rookie starters on both offense and defense (not to mention the youngest team in the NFL). 

This roster is more talented than those we've seen in the past few seasons, but that doesn't necessarily mean they will win more. These guys are still learning the ropes on the fly, and unlike some teams, we have significant contributors in every positional group who are rookies. Smart defenses and offenses key in on that and will game plan against you differently, knowing that there will be some mental lapses among those guys. 

 

I know it's been tough to watch, especially after a loss like yesterday. The next 3 weeks are going to suck, but the final 8 games of the season have a chance to be fun. The schedule softens significantly, I do think we'll see an improved Zach Wilson post-injury (kind of like we saw for Sam Darnold in 2018), we'll likely have Mekhi back, and at some point its going to "click" for a bunch of these younger guys which should lead to some exciting football at the very least. 

There's a lot of things to sh*t on (I have a long list), but think it's best to kind of sit back and watch how things progress. I for one didn't expect much different in the Jets first 6 games; I expected them to be 0-6. I didn't foresee an injury/Cincinnati being so good, but I expected we would be 1-8 through 10 weeks. I do see them winning 4-to-6 games in the final 8, but ultimately, just preparing to see better performances. 

The Cardinals 3-year rebuild is kind of what I'm hoping to see the Jets foster. I didn't have expectations this year, I do expect them to be a more consistent team next year, but I think 2023 is the year they can put together something special. They have a lot of guys who are really, really talented and will continue to add players the next 2 seasons. I hate waiting as much as anyone else, but I don't realistically expect this team to be a contender anytime soon... if the organization can remain patient between now and 2023, they have a chance to build something special for that season and hopefully many years to come. 

From your keyboard to God’s ears brother.

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1) The QB has been awful.

2) The OC has been awful

3) Overall youth and lack of experience, especially on defense.

I think overall the defense has been fine, as bad as they were yesterday. They were always going to be a work in progress and have been pretty solid most of the season. If we have a competent offense they aren't a topic of conversation. When your offense goes three and out every drive it's hard to play defense. It's hard not to quit when you have no hope of competing on a week to week.

The reason we suck is the same reason we have sucked for 10 years now -- this is an offense, QB driven league and the QB play and offensive coaching has been dreadful. The only season we've been decent since 2010 was 2015 -- when Fitzpatrick and Chan Gailey were the only decent OC and QB combo we've seen.

Literally the only way to be as inept and non-competitive as we've been the last few years is with a QB and OC that aren't NFL caliber.

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22 minutes ago, football guy said:

I'm not sure why anyone thought the Jets would be good this year, but to answer why they're bad? Inexperience

They have a first-time head coach, first-time offensive coordinator, first-time defensive coordinator, a rookie QB, and 6 other rookie starters on both offense and defense (not to mention the youngest team in the NFL). 

This roster is more talented than those we've seen in the past few seasons, but that doesn't necessarily mean they will win more. These guys are still learning the ropes on the fly, and unlike some teams, we have significant contributors in every positional group who are rookies. Smart defenses and offenses key in on that and will game plan against you differently, knowing that there will be some mental lapses among those guys. 

 

I know it's been tough to watch, especially after a loss like yesterday. The next 3 weeks are going to suck, but the final 8 games of the season have a chance to be fun. The schedule softens significantly, I do think we'll see an improved Zach Wilson post-injury (kind of like we saw for Sam Darnold in 2018), we'll likely have Mekhi back, and at some point its going to "click" for a bunch of these younger guys which should lead to some exciting football at the very least. 

There's a lot of things to sh*t on (I have a long list), but think it's best to kind of sit back and watch how things progress. I for one didn't expect much different in the Jets first 6 games; I expected them to be 0-6. I didn't foresee an injury/Cincinnati being so good, but I expected we would be 1-8 through 10 weeks. I do see them winning 4-to-6 games in the final 8, but ultimately, just preparing to see better performances. 

The Cardinals 3-year rebuild is kind of what I'm hoping to see the Jets foster. I didn't have expectations this year, I do expect them to be a more consistent team next year, but I think 2023 is the year they can put together something special. They have a lot of guys who are really, really talented and will continue to add players the next 2 seasons. I hate waiting as much as anyone else, but I don't realistically expect this team to be a contender anytime soon... if the organization can remain patient between now and 2023, they have a chance to build something special for that season and hopefully many years to come. 

Agreed. Although I did not expect them to look this bad. 

Really, the only hope is that these guys will learn from their mistakes and get better next year.  We just put all of this together and it is not getting dismantled after one season.

But it epically sucks to be a fan and have to watch this 'phase' of the plan, with no guarantee we will actually improve. 

 

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53 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

The problem is bad teams like the Lions know they are bad and improvise to win games (fake punt etc) The Pats were 2-4 playing for their season dialing up trick plays going for it on 4th down. 

We pretend we are good or something, sticking to "disciplined" vanilla football.  Its all coaching. 

Was thinking same thing watching Lions game. Jets haven’t just sucked for years, they are boring as Hell to watch. This is supposed to be entertaining, apparently. 

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17 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

overall the defense has been fine, as bad as they were yesterday. They were always going to be a work in progress and have been pretty solid most of the season

I think this narrative is a little over blown and hard to really make it the day after they let up 54 points. What gives it this illusion is they will make a splashy play every now and then on a 1st or 2nd down but man they can’t get off the field when it matters. Look at the Atlanta game, we score it’s 20-17. Ryan gets on the field and marches down over 80 yards like stealing candy from a baby and puts the game to bed. Bridgewater dissected them Week 3. Darnold moves the sticks on them in week 1.

Im not sold on the defense yet simply because hall looks good. A lot of other rookies running around look ok to meh (see Sherwood)

Inunderstand your point about the O not helping but you can’t watch that game yesterday and be comfortable with where the defense is at.

 

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Multitude of things but the overarching reason is the organizations ownership and their inability to build a serious football organization and hire serious football people who only care about winning. I mean the GM fell asleep on TV for Christ’s sakes lol. 
 

Just also feels like another coach who probably interviewed well in CJ’s eyes and is now taking advantage of a HC paycheck while not living up to his all gas thing himself.

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I’m not saying Gase was a good coach but the hate against the guy looks disproportionate to his actually blame now. Darnold is trash, defensive talent is lacking, offensive talent is better this year but just as bad on the field, injuries are still happening but under Gase the team at least had some fight and didn’t feel soft as tissue. 

Fingers crossed that Saleh and co. figure it out. 

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The defense looked lost out there without Mosely. It's crazy how different they looked without them. They were the one part of the jets that looked decent, and they totally sucked

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1 hour ago, football guy said:

I'm not sure why anyone thought the Jets would be good this year, but to answer why they're bad? Inexperience

They have a first-time head coach, first-time offensive coordinator, first-time defensive coordinator, a rookie QB, and 6 other rookie starters on both offense and defense (not to mention the youngest team in the NFL). 

This roster is more talented than those we've seen in the past few seasons, but that doesn't necessarily mean they will win more. These guys are still learning the ropes on the fly, and unlike some teams, we have significant contributors in every positional group who are rookies. Smart defenses and offenses key in on that and will game plan against you differently, knowing that there will be some mental lapses among those guys. 

 

I know it's been tough to watch, especially after a loss like yesterday. The next 3 weeks are going to suck, but the final 8 games of the season have a chance to be fun. The schedule softens significantly, I do think we'll see an improved Zach Wilson post-injury (kind of like we saw for Sam Darnold in 2018), we'll likely have Mekhi back, and at some point its going to "click" for a bunch of these younger guys which should lead to some exciting football at the very least. 

There's a lot of things to sh*t on (I have a long list), but think it's best to kind of sit back and watch how things progress. I for one didn't expect much different in the Jets first 6 games; I expected them to be 0-6. I didn't foresee an injury/Cincinnati being so good, but I expected we would be 1-8 through 10 weeks. I do see them winning 4-to-6 games in the final 8, but ultimately, just preparing to see better performances. 

The Cardinals 3-year rebuild is kind of what I'm hoping to see the Jets foster. I didn't have expectations this year, I do expect them to be a more consistent team next year, but I think 2023 is the year they can put together something special. They have a lot of guys who are really, really talented and will continue to add players the next 2 seasons. I hate waiting as much as anyone else, but I don't realistically expect this team to be a contender anytime soon... if the organization can remain patient between now and 2023, they have a chance to build something special for that season and hopefully many years to come. 

Will it Click for the coaches? I’ve seen no creativity or any semblance of organization

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Of course the Lions haven't won a game yet, but I get your point.
The Lions have had some heartbreaking losses late in games ... that's far more than we've had most of the year!

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I do not understand how you call 2 draw plays followed by a desperate 3rd and long sack. Off 2 weeks of prep, that you come out like that is beyond embarrassing. This is Saleh and Lafleur's livelihoods and careers. And like so many before them, they don't seem smart enough to get they're contributing to their own demise. 
Especially as it's so predictable ... we've been doing the old run-run-pass-punt routine all year. It doesn't take a genius to figure out what we're going to do.

Yesterday we were 14 points down before our QB had even thrown a pass. Wretched.

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1 hour ago, kevinc855 said:

I think this narrative is a little over blown and hard to really make it the day after they let up 54 points. What gives it this illusion is they will make a splashy play every now and then on a 1st or 2nd down but man they can’t get off the field when it matters. Look at the Atlanta game, we score it’s 20-17. Ryan gets on the field and marches down over 80 yards like stealing candy from a baby and puts the game to bed. Bridgewater dissected them Week 3. Darnold moves the sticks on them in week 1.

Im not sold on the defense yet simply because hall looks good. A lot of other rookies running around look ok to meh (see Sherwood)

Inunderstand your point about the O not helping but you can’t watch that game yesterday and be comfortable with where the defense is at.

 

Obviously they sucked yesterday (and I admittedly didn't even watch much of yesterday's game.)

But for the majority of games this season, in a league dominated by offense, they've been "fine." When you consider most of the guys on that D are no-name late round picks or unheralded FA signings they've been good "enough." They are not "the problem."

By contrast the offense continues year after year to be the worst in the entire league. That's why we suck and why our record continues to be so bad. It has nothing to do with the defense. It's the offense.

Let's put it this way -- the Bills are giving up 270 YPC and 16.3 PPG. Both marks are best in the league. Paired with the Jets offense they'd have a losing record.

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