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How early is too early for Tyler Linderbaum?


Tyler Lynderbaum?  

50 members have voted

  1. 1. Where would you draft Tyler Linderbaum?

    • I'd be happy taking him in the top ten with the Seahawks pick
      33
    • I'd take him but only if we traded back or the Seahawks start winning. Top 10 is too high for IOL
      12
    • I wouldn't take him. This team has too many needs and has sunken too many assets into the OL. Give me an EDGE, CB, offensive playmaker, etc.
      5


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4 minutes ago, HawkeyeJet said:

 

Nice game today.  Just caught the late 3rd and 4th, but I think that was all I needed to see. 

Any thoughts on Laporta.  Iowa has been a TE factory, and we sure could use one.

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Tyler Linderbaum is, IMO, exactly what this Jets offensive line needs. He's a smart, physical, athletic stud at center, a former wrestler (who pinned Tristan Wirfs!) who will bring the whole thin

probably one of the worst takes I've read on here.

Only CB in that range is Stingley and he’s not worth the risk.

5 minutes ago, Lith said:

Nice game today.  Just caught the late 3rd and 4th, but I think that was all I needed to see. 

Any thoughts on Laporta.  Iowa has been a TE factory, and we sure could use one.

I like LaPorta a lot.  I think with better QB play you would hear quite a bit more about him.  He’s a good, but not great athlete.  He’s just an all around solid player.  He does everything pretty good.

This name won’t probably resonate with anyone because he had just an OK NFL career but he reminds me of former Iowa TE Brandon Myers, who played with the Raiders and I think Giants.  LaPorta is a better version of that “mold” though. Some people think she’s comparable to Hockenson.  I see that a bit.  Hockenson was a better blocker, but athletically pretty similar.

Not saying much but he’d be the best TE on their roster Sunday if he suited up.

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5 hours ago, HawkeyeJet said:

I like LaPorta a lot.  I think with better QB play you would hear quite a bit more about him.  He’s a good, but not great athlete.  He’s just an all around solid player.  He does everything pretty good.

This name won’t probably resonate with anyone because he had just an OK NFL career but he reminds me of former Iowa TE Brandon Myers, who played with the Raiders and I think Giants.  LaPorta is a better version of that “mold” though. Some people think she’s comparable to Hockenson.  I see that a bit.  Hockenson was a better blocker, but athletically pretty similar.

Not saying much but he’d be the best TE on their roster Sunday if he suited up.

Is LaPorta expected to enter the 2022 draft?

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I used to think 1sts need to be hall of famers.  Solid starters is fine.  It would be a surprise if that wasn’t Linderbaum floor at a huge position of need.  

Don’t draft to please Mel Kipper.  Draft a winner.   
 

RG and C in the first round would be fine with me.  TE early and another late as well.   Then hopefully next year heavy on D early.  Unless they see can’t miss value then take it. 
 

The draft simulators make it clear - this team should be much better next season.

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1 hour ago, doitny said:

some of you guys act like you dont watch the games. the defense is not just bad, but historically bad. and you guys are talking about a Center in the 1st rd. smh.

 

I’d like to see a good OLine and TE.  I think it’s worth it to prioritize that above all else if you think you may have the right QB in the building.  
 

The defense hasn’t come up with stops even when the score wasn’t ugly.   It’s a mess. Carl Lawson probably won’t return as an all world edge either, but I’d like to see an offensive identity.

There are some special looking edges.  If they want to go for one in the first I’d understand.

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5 hours ago, Hal N of Provo said:

I’d like to see a good OLine and TE.  I think it’s worth it to prioritize that above all else if you think you may have the right QB in the building.  
 

The defense hasn’t come up with stops even when the score wasn’t ugly.   It’s a mess. Carl Lawson probably won’t return as an all world edge either, but I’d like to see an offensive identity.

There are some special looking edges.  If they want to go for one in the first I’d understand.

i have no problem with getting a good OL and i would be ok if one of our top 4 picks was TE but thats all i would give to the offense until day 3.

our best OL only had 2 picks that were #1. the other 2 were FAs and a UDFA. and still i would argue that instead of taking Brick with the 4th pick we could have won a SB if we took TE Vernon Davis who got picked 2 spots behind Brick.

and Center isn't even a need right now. MGV is just fine. use that pick for a Edge, LB, CB, TE. i would even be fine with a really good WR. but not a Center. and not using a 3rd or 4th first rd pick on the line.

if Saleh and JD are smart and want to keep their jobs after 2022 they need to fix this defense. we're not winning many games if we can't stop anyone. and as someone here mentioned the really good players dont become available during FA. 

 

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8 hours ago, doitny said:

some of you guys act like you dont watch the games. the defense is not just bad, but historically bad. and you guys are talking about a Center in the 1st rd. smh.

 

Exactly - it’s hard to envision both picks not being used on the defense right now. The offensive line has been fine and we don’t even need a center 

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1 hour ago, maury77 said:

FWIW, both Damien Woody and Duke Manyweather said they would not take a center in the top 10 

 

I think this will end up being a mot point for the Jets because their pick will be top 5 (which is definitely too high for a center) and the Seattle pick will be somewhere between 10-15 (which does feel like Linderbaum territory).  I hope I’m wrong on both but that’s just the way I see things playing out.

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11 hours ago, doitny said:

some of you guys act like you dont watch the games. the defense is not just bad, but historically bad. and you guys are talking about a Center in the 1st rd. smh.

Well, you have 2 first rounders, and 2 seconds.

You could go passrusher, then a center, and still have 2 early second rounders to go LB and safety or corner.

Also, you want to help the defense?  Develop an actual running game to run the clock and give the defense a break.

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12 hours ago, doitny said:

some of you guys act like you dont watch the games. the defense is not just bad, but historically bad. and you guys are talking about a Center in the 1st rd. smh.

 

I think it’s important to give the young QB a situation that can elevate him as he develops before going all in on fixing the defense.

Some huge issues with the defense are at non premium positions. Injuries have been bad too.

Defense certainly needs to be fixed and I wouldn’t be mad about help there but still think the young QB comes first. His development is what would lead to sustained competitiveness.

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5 minutes ago, derp said:

I think it’s important to give the young QB a situation that can elevate him as he develops before going all in on fixing the defense.

Some huge issues with the defense are at non premium positions. Injuries have been bad too.

Defense certainly needs to be fixed and I wouldn’t be mad about help there but still think the young QB comes first. His development is what would lead to sustained competitiveness.

this is a deep EDGE draft so if we dont get one in the 1st rd we could regret it.

ok then get a WR or a TE in the 1st two rds. not an OL. 

Buffalo has not one 1st rd pick on their line...a couple of 2nds and mostly FA..

NE has 1. and couple of 6th rd picks.... there Center is a UDFA and hes been their starter for 5 years...

Balt has 1 who has been on the IR all season. they have been starting a 4th rd pick, a FA and 2 UDFAs..

Tenn has 1 and a 3rd rd pick and 3 FAs.... and they have 4 UDFA as backups.

KC has none...... they have a 2nd, 3rd and a 6th rd pick plus 2 FAs. remember they lost the SB cause of their line? they didnt use there 1st rd on OL. they wait till 63rd pick in the 2nd rd to get Creed Humphries. and the 6th to get Trey Smith. and some of you guys want us to draft a center in the top 15. smh..and people want to know why other teams laugh at us.

Cincy has 1 and a 2nd, 2 FA and 2 UDFA

LAC has one who they just drafted. 2 FA and 2 UDFA.... 

Indy has 2 and a 2nd and the rest FA..

these are your probable playoff teams in the AFC. 2 teams have zero 1st rd picks including SB favorites KC and Buffalo. Indy has the most at 2 and there favored to do nothing.

Bill Belichick, Andy Reid, John Harbaugh/Ozzie Newsome. some of the smartest most successful HCs and GMs in the league dont use 1st rd picks on the lines.

1 hour ago, chirorob said:

Well, you have 2 first rounders, and 2 seconds.

You could go passrusher, then a center, and still have 2 early second rounders to go LB and safety or corner.

Also, you want to help the defense?  Develop an actual running game to run the clock and give the defense a break.

see above...

 

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14 minutes ago, doitny said:

this is a deep EDGE draft so if we dont get one in the 1st rd we could regret it.

ok then get a WR or a TE in the 1st two rds. not an OL. 

Buffalo has not one 1st rd pick on their line...a couple of 2nds and mostly FA..

NE has 1. and couple of 6th rd picks.... there Center is a UDFA and hes been their starter for 5 years...

Balt has 1 who has been on the IR all season. they have been starting a 4th rd pick, a FA and 2 UDFAs..

Tenn has 1 and a 3rd rd pick and 3 FAs.... and they have 4 UDFA as backups.

KC has none...... they have a 2nd, 3rd and a 6th rd pick plus 2 FAs. remember they lost the SB cause of their line? they didnt use there 1st rd on OL. they wait till 63rd pick in the 2nd rd to get Creed Humphries. and the 6th to get Trey Smith. and some of you guys want us to draft a center in the top 15. smh..and people want to know why other teams laugh at us.

Cincy has 1 and a 2nd, 2 FA and 2 UDFA

LAC has one who they just drafted. 2 FA and 2 UDFA.... 

Indy has 2 and a 2nd and the rest FA..

these are your probable playoff teams in the AFC. 2 teams have zero 1st rd picks including SB favorites KC and Buffalo. Indy has the most at 2 and there favored to do nothing.

Bill Belichick, Andy Reid, John Harbaugh/Ozzie Newsome. some of the smartest most successful HCs and GMs in the league dont use 1st rd picks on the lines.

see above...

 

The bold conflicts with itself. The edge draft is more deep than it’s strong at the top. There will be good prospects available later.

The rest of your post is entirely about the offensive line. My post was about not just focusing on the defense. I still think it’s too early in the development of the offense, with a young quarterback, to focus on the defense.

I’m also not going to go team by team but KC for example didn’t spend their first round pick on an offensive lineman…because they traded it to acquire an offensive lineman. They also gave Thuney 5 years, $80 million. And then, as you said, spent a second round pick on an offensive lineman. Certainly multiple ways to acquire those guys - although the best free agents have been going to better teams lately - but they’re heavily invested on the offensive line.

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22 minutes ago, derp said:

The bold conflicts with itself. The edge draft is more deep than it’s strong at the top. There will be good prospects available later.

The rest of your post is entirely about the offensive line. My post was about not just focusing on the defense. I still think it’s too early in the development of the offense, with a young quarterback, to focus on the defense.

I’m also not going to go team by team but KC for example didn’t spend their first round pick on an offensive lineman…because they traded it to acquire an offensive lineman. They also gave Thuney 5 years, $80 million. And then, as you said, spent a second round pick on an offensive lineman. Certainly multiple ways to acquire those guys - although the best free agents have been going to better teams lately - but they’re heavily invested on the offensive line.

yeah but do you want to get a good Edge rusher or the best? there is no reason picking in the top 5 we shouldnt get the top 1 or 2 .

i said if you have a top WR or TE then im ok with using one 1st rd pick on that guy. im just heavy against using a 3rd 1st rd pick on the OL. i think i have proven that none of the best teams or coaches do that. 

and im not sure Andy Ried would have went with the OL if the didnt sign Thuney. i looked back at his Phila drafts and he drafted 2 between 1999-2012 they were 7 years apart and both busts. 

did you see my list? most of those lines are made up of FAs and UDFAs. why cant we do that? why do we have to load our line with 1st rd picks? thats all im saying. 

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6 minutes ago, doitny said:

yeah but do you want to get a good Edge rusher or the best? there is no reason picking in the top 5 we shouldnt get the top 1 or 2 .

i said if you have a top WR or TE then im ok with using one 1st rd pick on that guy. im just heavy against using a 3rd 1st rd pick on the OL. i think i have proven that none of the best teams or coaches do that. 

and im not sure Andy Ried would have went with the OL if the didnt sign Thuney. i looked back at his Phila drafts and he drafted 2 between 1999-2012 they were 7 years apart and both busts. 

did you see my list? most of those lines are made up of FAs and UDFAs. why cant we do that? why do we have to load our line with 1st rd picks? thats all im saying. 

As I said, this edge class is better depth wise than it is strong at the top. So yeah, I'd rather take advantage of the depth than take someone i feel iffy about at the top of the draft.

I did see your list. You labeled trades as FA's and disregarded injured players. You also chose teams that were deeper into their rebuilds with established quarterbacks - with the exception of a Buffalo team that basically has a tight end playing quarterback. The Jets have a young QB who's still developing and played well in college behind an insanely good offensive line. This draft class doesn't have wide receivers or tight ends who look likely to go in the range of the Seattle pick, but there are offensive linemen who look like they'll go there. If that's the best way to help Wilson that's the best way to help Wilson.

As for why the Jets can't build a line out of FA's - they don't want to come here. The Jets wanted Thuney, he went elsewhere. Linsley went to the Chargers. I think they'd like to sign good offensive linemen. The current line, the same way you were listing lines, is four FA's and a first round pick. The better linemen don't come here. If they would that'd be great. I hope they can sign Scherff or even Laken Tomlinson. They haven't been able to close on those guys.

It's also not unprecedented to see three first round picks on a line, and lots of good teams have had two. Dallas absolutely spent at least three picks on first round selections on offensive linemen and it's what set them up to develop Prescott. San Francisco at the beginning of their run several years back had three first round picks on their line. The Titans had two first round tackles when they got Henry going, let one go in FA, and replaced him with another first round linemen.

I'm not saying the Jets have to spend a third first round pick on an offensive linemen. But I am pushing back on your notion that they shouldn't do it, simply for the sake of not doing it. If the best player who could positively impact the quarterback's development is an offensive linemen there's no reason to avoid drafting one.

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2 hours ago, derp said:

As I said, this edge class is better depth wise than it is strong at the top. So yeah, I'd rather take advantage of the depth than take someone i feel iffy about at the top of the draft.

I did see your list. You labeled trades as FA's and disregarded injured players. You also chose teams that were deeper into their rebuilds with established quarterbacks - with the exception of a Buffalo team that basically has a tight end playing quarterback. The Jets have a young QB who's still developing and played well in college behind an insanely good offensive line. This draft class doesn't have wide receivers or tight ends who look likely to go in the range of the Seattle pick, but there are offensive linemen who look like they'll go there. If that's the best way to help Wilson that's the best way to help Wilson.

As for why the Jets can't build a line out of FA's - they don't want to come here. The Jets wanted Thuney, he went elsewhere. Linsley went to the Chargers. I think they'd like to sign good offensive linemen. The current line, the same way you were listing lines, is four FA's and a first round pick. The better linemen don't come here. If they would that'd be great. I hope they can sign Scherff or even Laken Tomlinson. They haven't been able to close on those guys.

It's also not unprecedented to see three first round picks on a line, and lots of good teams have had two. Dallas absolutely spent at least three picks on first round selections on offensive linemen and it's what set them up to develop Prescott. San Francisco at the beginning of their run several years back had three first round picks on their line. The Titans had two first round tackles when they got Henry going, let one go in FA, and replaced him with another first round linemen.

I'm not saying the Jets have to spend a third first round pick on an offensive linemen. But I am pushing back on your notion that they shouldn't do it, simply for the sake of not doing it. If the best player who could positively impact the quarterback's development is an offensive linemen there's no reason to avoid drafting one.

who cares if they were trades or not. the point was how many 1st rd picks that are on their roster today. and i didn't disregard anyone. i mentions Balt only 1st rder who is Stanely on the IR.

why do we always think when we get a new QB that our line needs to be the best. weather its Zach or Sam, Geno, Sanchez... right now our OL was good enough for White to throw 400 yd, Johnson to throw 300 yds even Flacco under blitzs was a few yds short of 300. there is no excuse why this OL isnt good enough for Zach Wilson. 

Fant and MGV have played well and they were not top FAs. if Tardiff plays well maybe we resign him and move Becton to RT. draft some depth in the 3rd or later rds. 

there are one or 2 teams with 3 1st rd picks on the line. but there not good. Atlanta had 4 last year i believe. 3 now and they always suck. they drafted 2 in the 1st rd in 2019. and passes up guys like Montez Sweet, Dabo Samuel, Brain Burns, Savage JR. think they be better with just one of those guys. but for some reason they felt the need to use those picks on the OL.

wanna laugh? the year (2016) they lost in the SB they had only one. 

and Dallas? they made the playoffs 3 times in 10 years. i rather model our team the way NE, GB, BALT, PITTS, KC... the teams that make it just about every year .

so yeah im pushing back on the use of another 1st rd pick on the OL. i find it hard to believe that when we pick there wont be someone just as good as an OL. your going to over kill a position thats not a problem and neglect others that are will not help anyone. 

 

 

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2 hours ago, doitny said:

who cares if they were trades or not. the point was how many 1st rd picks that are on their roster today. and i didn't disregard anyone. i mentions Balt only 1st rder who is Stanely on the IR.

why do we always think when we get a new QB that our line needs to be the best. weather its Zach or Sam, Geno, Sanchez... right now our OL was good enough for White to throw 400 yd, Johnson to throw 300 yds even Flacco under blitzs was a few yds short of 300. there is no excuse why this OL isnt good enough for Zach Wilson. 

Fant and MGV have played well and they were not top FAs. if Tardiff plays well maybe we resign him and move Becton to RT. draft some depth in the 3rd or later rds. 

there are one or 2 teams with 3 1st rd picks on the line. but there not good. Atlanta had 4 last year i believe. 3 now and they always suck. they drafted 2 in the 1st rd in 2019. and passes up guys like Montez Sweet, Dabo Samuel, Brain Burns, Savage JR. think they be better with just one of those guys. but for some reason they felt the need to use those picks on the OL.

wanna laugh? the year (2016) they lost in the SB they had only one. 

and Dallas? they made the playoffs 3 times in 10 years. i rather model our team the way NE, GB, BALT, PITTS, KC... the teams that make it just about every year .

so yeah im pushing back on the use of another 1st rd pick on the OL. i find it hard to believe that when we pick there wont be someone just as good as an OL. your going to over kill a position thats not a problem and neglect others that are will not help anyone. 

 

 

There are multiple ways to invest. I’d argue trading a first round pick for a guy and needing to re-sign him to a hefty deal is more of an investment than just spending a first round pick. Spending a lot of money alone is a serious investment, too. I don’t know why you’re so caught up in the distinction between different kinds of investments, but I don’t think about player acquisition the same way as you.

I also don’t get why you’re so caught up in it can’t be offensive line. All I’m saying is it’s useful to help the developing quarterback whether it’s offensive line or pass catchers. In this draft the offensive linemen are the better prospects. You’re the one saying only help the young quarterback if it’s not drafting offensive linemen.

All those teams you’re listing have elite quarterbacks. That’s why they make it regularly, not because they don’t draft offensive linemen. And those quarterbacks help the lines, too.

Steelers also recently ended a stretch they had multiple first round linemen. Ravens had multiple when they won with Flacco.

The point with Dallas is the line play helped develop the quarterback.

Again I’m not saying they need to spend a first round pick on an offensive lineman but I also don’t think you’ve cracked this code of what does and doesn’t lead to good football teams. All you’re showing is that teams with good quarterbacks do well. And what I’m saying is the Jets need to do what they can to finalize the development of that quarterback.

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17 minutes ago, derp said:

There are multiple ways to invest. I’d argue trading a first round pick for a guy and needing to re-sign him to a hefty deal is more of an investment than just spending a first round pick. Spending a lot of money alone is a serious investment, too. I don’t know why you’re so caught up in the distinction between different kinds of investments, but I don’t think about player acquisition the same way as you.

I also don’t get why you’re so caught up in it can’t be offensive line. All I’m saying is it’s useful to help the developing quarterback whether it’s offensive line or pass catchers. In this draft the offensive linemen are the better prospects. You’re the one saying only help the young quarterback if it’s not drafting offensive linemen.

All those teams you’re listing have elite quarterbacks. That’s why they make it regularly, not because they don’t draft offensive linemen. And those quarterbacks help the lines, too.

Steelers also recently ended a stretch they had multiple first round linemen. Ravens had multiple when they won with Flacco.

The point with Dallas is the line play helped develop the quarterback.

Again I’m not saying they need to spend a first round pick on an offensive lineman but I also don’t think you’ve cracked this code of what does and doesn’t lead to good football teams. All you’re showing is that teams with good quarterbacks do well. And what I’m saying is the Jets need to do what they can to finalize the development of that quarterback.

I’d argue that WR or even a top flight TE is more important for a qb than an OL. Look at the bengals. They chose chase over Sewell and look how that’s working out. As long as you have a mediocre ol (which we do) then skill positions are way more valuable than making the ol the best. 
 

im also anti 1st round ol this year. Depending on where the picks end up I’d much rather take someone like dean and hutch/thib if we can’t trade down. If a trade down is possible then 100% do it and take someone like Wilson/Dotson/ojabo/hill

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12 minutes ago, BurntDice said:

I’d argue that WR or even a top flight TE is more important for a qb than an OL. Look at the bengals. They chose chase over Sewell and look how that’s working out. As long as you have a mediocre ol (which we do) then skill positions are way more valuable than making the ol the best. 
 

im also anti 1st round ol this year. Depending on where the picks end up I’d much rather take someone like dean and hutch/thib if we can’t trade down. If a trade down is possible then 100% do it and take someone like Wilson/Dotson/ojabo/hill

I disagree with that first premise as that’s just a one sample size argument. But in general, I’d be very much in favor of a WR or a TE if there were good prospects this year. I wanted Pitts last year.

Jets’ picks are currently 2 and 6. As an example, Dane Brugler is a respected draft analyst. His top draft prospects go edge-safety-corner. Rounding out his top twelve are three edge rushers and six offensive linemen. The value at the top of the draft this year is very OL heavy. First WR appears at 17, first TE at 49.

It’s a different conversation if there’s a Chase or a Pitts this year, there isn’t. And I’d be all for a trade down. But with those picks as they are I really don’t think WR is in play and TE absolutely isn’t.

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3 minutes ago, derp said:

I disagree with that first premise as that’s just a one sample size argument. But in general, I’d be very much in favor of a WR or a TE if there were good prospects this year. I wanted Pitts last year.

Jets’ picks are currently 2 and 6. As an example, Dane Brugler is a respected draft analyst. His top draft prospects go edge-safety-corner. Rounding out his top twelve are three edge rushers and six offensive linemen. The value at the top of the draft this year is very OL heavy. First WR appears at 17, first TE at 49.

It’s a different conversation if there’s a Chase or a Pitts this year, there isn’t. And I’d be all for a trade down. But with those picks as they are I really don’t think WR is in play and TE absolutely isn’t.

Eh look at the chiefs in years past they had a ton of weapons and a meh OL, same with many other teams. Wrs who get separation quickly helps out the qb and ol. Sure there’s no great pitts level te this year, but are a bunch of 2nd/3rd round guys and a few in FA. Moore also wasn’t regarded as highly as the jeudy/chases of the world and he has been playing great. Wilson and Dotson might not be elite level #1s but they fit the offense very well and have a ton of talent. They both are great at creating separation which is what this scheme is based on.  If shultz can break loose then pair him with those wrs and it’s looking pretty good 

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25 minutes ago, BurntDice said:

Eh look at the chiefs in years past they had a ton of weapons and a meh OL, same with many other teams. Wrs who get separation quickly helps out the qb and ol. Sure there’s no great pitts level te this year, but are a bunch of 2nd/3rd round guys and a few in FA. Moore also wasn’t regarded as highly as the jeudy/chases of the world and he has been playing great. Wilson and Dotson might not be elite level #1s but they fit the offense very well and have a ton of talent. They both are great at creating separation which is what this scheme is based on.  If shultz can break loose then pair him with those wrs and it’s looking pretty good 

This is great but doesn’t change that there almost certainly will not be a WR or TE worth taking where the Jets’ first two picks will be which is the entire point. Nobody’s saying they shouldn’t add at the position. The point is value won’t match up with the first two picks.

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31 minutes ago, derp said:

This is great but doesn’t change that there almost certainly will not be a WR or TE worth taking where the Jets’ first two picks will be which is the entire point. Nobody’s saying they shouldn’t add at the position. The point is value won’t match up with the first two picks.

As I said before trade the first pick down and take one of the wrs or ojabo/karlaftis/hill to pair with dean. If it can’t be traded down then take hutch/thib and dean. No OL involved here 

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1 hour ago, derp said:

There are multiple ways to invest. I’d argue trading a first round pick for a guy and needing to re-sign him to a hefty deal is more of an investment than just spending a first round pick. Spending a lot of money alone is a serious investment, too. I don’t know why you’re so caught up in the distinction between different kinds of investments, but I don’t think about player acquisition the same way as you.

I also don’t get why you’re so caught up in it can’t be offensive line. All I’m saying is it’s useful to help the developing quarterback whether it’s offensive line or pass catchers. In this draft the offensive linemen are the better prospects. You’re the one saying only help the young quarterback if it’s not drafting offensive linemen.

All those teams you’re listing have elite quarterbacks. That’s why they make it regularly, not because they don’t draft offensive linemen. And those quarterbacks help the lines, too.

Steelers also recently ended a stretch they had multiple first round linemen. Ravens had multiple when they won with Flacco.

The point with Dallas is the line play helped develop the quarterback.

Again I’m not saying they need to spend a first round pick on an offensive lineman but I also don’t think you’ve cracked this code of what does and doesn’t lead to good football teams. All you’re showing is that teams with good quarterbacks do well. And what I’m saying is the Jets need to do what they can to finalize the development of that quarterback.

see you want to draft the best available player and if that is an OL then so what. but it is a big deal. how much do you think adding another OL helps Zach?

where not getting rid of Becton. so he starts at one spot. you want to draft a Tackle to replace Fant even though he has another year on his contract? right now he hasnt giving up a sack in 360 snaps. so how much of a difference would your draft pick make there? nothing.

i doubt very much we make NFL history and draft a Center in the top 10. but even so MGV has played well too. the upgrade wouldnt be that much.

now Rotten is..well Rotten. but like i said before if Tardif plays well or we could get one in the later rds or FA. 

despite Rottens play we know this line is good enough for Zach to develop. the little improvement your OL 1st rd pick will give us will be nothing compare to what it would be like if we used it at the gaping holes all over the defense. 

dont you think it helps Zach to have a defense that can make a stop. to not always be playing from behind? 

and yes pal i did crack the code. for what NOT to do.

out of 31 teams 10 teams have zero 1st rd picks including some of the best teams...BUF, KC, PIT, TB, GB, ..

now as you mentioned before they have elite QBs. not developing one like us. ok lets see who is..

NE, CIN, LAC, MIA, HOU, GIANTS, SF. all have one 1st rd pick. and Chicago and JAX  has zero. that just shows you that nobody is thinking like you and loading up the OL with 1st rd picks to protect the developing QB.

but there were 2 teams that had 3. Atlanta who is bad and the Detroit Lions the worst team in NFL history. is that who you want to follow? or are we going to be the only team with 3 to be good?

wanna laugh? i found a 4th first rd pick of Det on SF. no wonder why they didnt do anything with Stafford. 

this is why im so against it. the best teams dont have 3, the teams with new QBs dont have 3. only the 2 worst teams in the league has 3. 

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10 hours ago, BurntDice said:

As I said before trade the first pick down and take one of the wrs or ojabo/karlaftis/hill to pair with dean. If it can’t be traded down then take hutch/thib and dean. No OL involved here 

Not a fan of the top ten off ball linebacker or the defense double dip but you’re totally entitled to the perspective.

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10 hours ago, doitny said:

see you want to draft the best available player and if that is an OL then so what. but it is a big deal. how much do you think adding another OL helps Zach?

where not getting rid of Becton. so he starts at one spot. you want to draft a Tackle to replace Fant even though he has another year on his contract? right now he hasnt giving up a sack in 360 snaps. so how much of a difference would your draft pick make there? nothing.

i doubt very much we make NFL history and draft a Center in the top 10. but even so MGV has played well too. the upgrade wouldnt be that much.

now Rotten is..well Rotten. but like i said before if Tardif plays well or we could get one in the later rds or FA. 

despite Rottens play we know this line is good enough for Zach to develop. the little improvement your OL 1st rd pick will give us will be nothing compare to what it would be like if we used it at the gaping holes all over the defense. 

dont you think it helps Zach to have a defense that can make a stop. to not always be playing from behind? 

and yes pal i did crack the code. for what NOT to do.

out of 31 teams 10 teams have zero 1st rd picks including some of the best teams...BUF, KC, PIT, TB, GB, ..

now as you mentioned before they have elite QBs. not developing one like us. ok lets see who is..

NE, CIN, LAC, MIA, HOU, GIANTS, SF. all have one 1st rd pick. and Chicago and JAX  has zero. that just shows you that nobody is thinking like you and loading up the OL with 1st rd picks to protect the developing QB.

but there were 2 teams that had 3. Atlanta who is bad and the Detroit Lions the worst team in NFL history. is that who you want to follow? or are we going to be the only team with 3 to be good?

wanna laugh? i found a 4th first rd pick of Det on SF. no wonder why they didnt do anything with Stafford. 

this is why im so against it. the best teams dont have 3, the teams with new QBs dont have 3. only the 2 worst teams in the league has 3. 

Becton hasn’t played in most games in his career. Fant hasn’t played well on the left side. McGovern has experience at guard. Three offensive linemen have one year left on their deal. There’s quite literally nothing to say that another good offensive lineman would have little impact. If they signed Scherff he’d have an impact, good players impact football teams.

The defense gets very gassed because the offense can’t stay on the field. Complementary football works both ways.

All those teams have established quarterbacks. Pittsburgh isn’t that good this year and their offensive line is a problem. They lost two first round offensive linemen from last year’s playoff team. Kansas City traded a first round pick for an offensive lineman to replace the first round offensive lineman who they let go in FA and was out in the Super Bowl.

Tampa actually does have a first round pick on their offensive line.

Atlanta and Detroit are bad. Both are in awkward stages of a rebuild with bad quarterback play and bad defenses. Lots of reasons they’re bad.

I don’t think if Detroit had taken Surtain instead of Sewell or Atlanta had taken N’Keal Harry instead of Kaleb McGary that they’d be meaningfully different teams. I also don’t think if Minnesota, Dallas, New Orleans, Philadelphia, or Indianapolis take a first round offensive lineman next year they’ll be the dregs of the league.

Effectively, you’re saying crossing two first round picks on the offensive line is a line in the sand that makes teams bad. To the point that if the best player available is an offensive lineman you say pass. I just don’t agree and think if you look at teams on both sides of that 2/3 line I don’t see the offensive linemen being a differentiator.

To be clear, my way of thinking isn’t “the Jets need to add a first round offensive lineman”. I actually think day two picks would be best for their longer term needs which exist at multiple spots. I do, however think that if the best player available is an offensive lineman they should probably take the best player. That’s where we disagree.

I'm sure you’ll continue to feel the same way you have, that’s fine. I don’t think we’re getting anywhere though so I’m just going to agree to disagree and I won’t be adding anything.

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46 minutes ago, derp said:

Becton hasn’t played in most games in his career. Fant hasn’t played well on the left side. McGovern has experience at guard. Three offensive linemen have one year left on their deal. There’s quite literally nothing to say that another good offensive lineman would have little impact. If they signed Scherff he’d have an impact, good players impact football teams.

The defense gets very gassed because the offense can’t stay on the field. Complementary football works both ways.

All those teams have established quarterbacks. Pittsburgh isn’t that good this year and their offensive line is a problem. They lost two first round offensive linemen from last year’s playoff team. Kansas City traded a first round pick for an offensive lineman to replace the first round offensive lineman who they let go in FA and was out in the Super Bowl.

Tampa actually does have a first round pick on their offensive line.

Atlanta and Detroit are bad. Both are in awkward stages of a rebuild with bad quarterback play and bad defenses. Lots of reasons they’re bad.

I don’t think if Detroit had taken Surtain instead of Sewell or Atlanta had taken N’Keal Harry instead of Kaleb McGary that they’d be meaningfully different teams. I also don’t think if Minnesota, Dallas, New Orleans, Philadelphia, or Indianapolis take a first round offensive lineman next year they’ll be the dregs of the league.

Effectively, you’re saying crossing two first round picks on the offensive line is a line in the sand that makes teams bad. To the point that if the best player available is an offensive lineman you say pass. I just don’t agree and think if you look at teams on both sides of that 2/3 line I don’t see the offensive linemen being a differentiator.

To be clear, my way of thinking isn’t “the Jets need to add a first round offensive lineman”. I actually think day two picks would be best for their longer term needs which exist at multiple spots. I do, however think that if the best player available is an offensive lineman they should probably take the best player. That’s where we disagree.

I'm sure you’ll continue to feel the same way you have, that’s fine. I don’t think we’re getting anywhere though so I’m just going to agree to disagree and I won’t be adding anything.

Do you know that Fant hasnt allowed a single sack since moving to LT?  Hes played very well and is easily outplaying the $9 million he is earning.  I personally think that if his play continues at this level, Becton should move to the right side and we should extend fant.

As far as Linderbaum, I really dont understand the argument of "dont take a center in the top 10".  So if there is an elite player (which linderbaum is), at a position of need we should pass due to his position and take a player that has a higher bust potential simply due to the position they play?

I watched a lot of the Iowa game on Friday and Linderbaum seems like an almost flawless prospect.  He moves well, commands the line/makes the calls and is excellent run and pass blocking.  I also believe that OL play is a sum of the parts and if you have an elite center, that can pull and does not need "help", then it makes life easier for the guards and in turn the line play as a whole elevates.  

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1 hour ago, BCJet said:

Do you know that Fant hasnt allowed a single sack since moving to LT?  Hes played very well and is easily outplaying the $9 million he is earning.  I personally think that if his play continues at this level, Becton should move to the right side and we should extend fant.

As far as Linderbaum, I really dont understand the argument of "dont take a center in the top 10".  So if there is an elite player (which linderbaum is), at a position of need we should pass due to his position and take a player that has a higher bust potential simply due to the position they play?

I watched a lot of the Iowa game on Friday and Linderbaum seems like an almost flawless prospect.  He moves well, commands the line/makes the calls and is excellent run and pass blocking.  I also believe that OL play is a sum of the parts and if you have an elite center, that can pull and does not need "help", then it makes life easier for the guards and in turn the line play as a whole elevates.  

Yes, I am aware of Fant's pass protection prowess since taking over at least tackle. What they do at tackle is an interesting debate. I’d be surprised if they move Becton to the right side but there’s certainly a rationale to the idea. I believe pass protection is more important than run blocking for the tackles but in this outside zone scheme tackle run blocking is important and Fant is absolutely below average there. Having two tackles who can run block would be big. So I think you can argue both ways.

Very much agree with your last two paragraphs.

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4 hours ago, BCJet said:

As far as Linderbaum, I really dont understand the argument of "dont take a center in the top 10".  So if there is an elite player (which linderbaum is), at a position of need we should pass due to his position

It’s not a position of need…

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On 11/25/2021 at 10:12 PM, David Harris said:

I’d love the kid but I wouldn’t ever consider drafting him over a premium position like Edge, CB, OT if we actually end up with 2 top 10 picks

I put an all pro center as a premium position as much as a RT.   Edge we need for sure, that is #1 prior for this team.

I am just terrified we will pass up linderbaum for an lb or safety. (our two weakest positions on d imo)

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3 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

I put an all pro center as a premium position as much as a RT.   Edge we need for sure, that is #1 prior for this team.

I am just terrified we will pass up linderbaum for an lb or safety. (our two weakest positions on d imo)

I’d be shocked if JD went that way, S or LB.  I want nothing to do with Hamilton from ND.  Taking a Safety in the top 10 would destroy me, hopefully some sucker takes him before us.

Regarding Linderbaum, in another post I discussed how I think the Mangold acquisition was actually a BAD trade for the Jets.  An all time Center isn’t worth a quality edge with baggage like John Abraham.  Top 10 picks should be elite players and high value positions.  Thibideaux, Hutchinson, Stingley, Neal, Ikonwu, maybe Booth Jr if available (imo).

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2 minutes ago, David Harris said:

I’d be shocked if JD went that way, S or LB.  I want nothing to do with Hamilton from ND.  Taking a Safety in the top 10 would destroy me, hopefully some sucker takes him before us.

Regarding Linderbaum, in another post I discussed how I think the Mangold acquisition was actually a BAD trade for the Jets.  An all time Center isn’t worth a quality edge with baggage like John Abraham.  Top 10 picks should be elite players and high value positions.  Thibideaux, Hutchinson, Stingley, Neal, Ikonwu, maybe Booth Jr if available (imo).

A 10 year pro bowl player is always good vs an oft injured guy.  I agree about pass rusher being a higher value but abraham simply did not play enough and Dbrick and mangold were the foundation of the teams we last had success with.

Of course i am biased towards oline.  I think a great oline covers up a lot of other ills on a team.  I do not want an okay oline, i want one of the best in the league.

 

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