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Why are we being so friggin impatient with Zach?


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33 minutes ago, derp said:

I thought although the arm talent was clear he had a big jump to the pro level after playing in clean pockets at BYU, hunting deep shots, and not facing a lot of adversity last season.

That being the case it seemed pretty obvious he’d benefit from sitting, learning, and working on mechanics while they continued to improve his supporting cast and install s new system.

Instead they gave him the starting job. He’s not handling pressure or running the offense well. That’s evident to everyone who watched the team with White and Flacco. Now it’s evident to him and clearly in his head.

So instead of having a talented guy in their back pocket who hasn’t seen the field while letting experienced guys help develop the rest of the largely young supporting cast and install the new scheme, they’ve got a young guy who knows he’s performing below replacement level as he’s trying to figure out the jump to the pro level on the fly. And continuing to put him out there and have worse results can’t be good for team morale but yanking him can’t be good for his confidence.

Just think they’ve made a mess of his development. It’s not his fault or fair to him but since he’s looking bad it’s annoying.

I don’t understand the need for this organization to rush to start him from Day 1…especially THIS regime which has the luxury of time on their side.

I’m thinking that they legit understood that they wouldn’t be close to a playoff team no matter which QB they had and figured let the kid learn and go through his mistakes and growing pains now…get that out of the way.

If that is indeed by design…I do not agree with it at all but that’s just me. Hopefully, the kid is smart, resilient, and can end the season strong and make a huge leap next year with a (Hopefully) improved roster.

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Why are we being so friggin impatient with Zach? Do you really feel he has no shot to get acclimated to the pro game? When he was drafted it was known that it took him time to adjust at ever

Nice post. Nice thread. May I ask nicely for people to not crap on this one like every other thread on this board? Plenty of threads to repeat “ Zach sucks” on this board. Let’s try and not in this on

My theory is that it is overcompensation for Darnold busting here so recently. People really believed in Sam, so when he didn’t work out, it broke them. Now, they want to throw the new guy out 6 games

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1 hour ago, THE BARON said:

From the eye test, it does not look good.  Accuracy issues.  Issues reading the defense.  Bad decision making.  What's been good with ZW ???

Is our eye tests too critical?

Accuracy? 14-24.

Reading the defense? 5 scoring opportunities yesterday against the 6th rated pass defense

Bad decision making? 1 (weird) INT yesterday , 3 picks over the last 4 starts

What's been good? 2 wins (one against a top opponent and the other on the road coming back from injury), some real good passes in each game, all indications are that he is a hard worker, seems to  handle the NY media without any cringe worthy misquotes during some challenging times, with the pressure of coming off an injury where each QB that started in his place looked more competent than Zach he did not fall on his face and got better as the game progressed

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1 hour ago, LSJF said:

I guess I meant the eighteen current threads on bashing, replacing Zach etc...on JN I mean if you would like to create a Zach sucks thread, have at it...it's just annoying

You know, for the folks who are quite unhappy about those threads, you could, and this is just an idea, just not read or open them.

You should also know, most of these "bashing" or otherwise "replacing" Zach are, like yourself, dedicated green-blooded Jets Fans.

They just don't see Zach like you do.

Now, you can get angry at them, or like some posters here you can demand the site owner squash them, sure.

But honestly, IMO, the best option is to either debate them (show them why they're wrong) or ignore them.

For example, I put Uncle Nicco on ignore.  IMO he is the kind of homer (like Ray Ray on the old JI) that just isn't worth reading or debating.  I don't wan him silenced or banned and I don't message Max every time he says something dumb or trollish.  I just don't read his threads or posts anymore.  

Same way, if you think I (for example) am too negative, you could ignore me.  It'd be like I never posted for you.  Instant annoyance eliminated.

Or, you could read the things I say and tell me why I'm wrong.  Up to you.

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1 hour ago, johnnysd said:

Not sure, but there does seem to be a higher level of just innate bias against Zach than other QBs. Maybe because right now it has a similar feel to Darnold. There are many here who would already give up on him.

edit:

honestly, I think a lot of this, like I said stem from the preseason.  The extremes with this kid are unreal.  You called him the greatest college QB you've ever seen and the best NFL QB prospect you've ever seen.  You said this, lol.  When you read stuff like that and you feel the other way, the responses will be equally as extreme.  And now, he's the worst rookie Jets QB we've ever seen and naturally, the extremist (just like in real life) take the stage.

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1 hour ago, JiFapono said:

Ummm, errrr, sorry?  I mean, he asks questions and stuff.

That was a solid pretty spot on post. Part of a good discussion. It’s the constant simpleton “ Zach sucks” stuff that polluting this place. I mean, pretty sure not a secret. Want this thread to be free of it so we can really  read the stuff said. 

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1 hour ago, LSJF said:

Why are we being so friggin impatient with Zach?

Do you really feel he has no shot to get acclimated to the pro game?

When he was drafted it was known that it took him time to adjust at every level he has played. However when he adjusted he was number two pick worthy...

He's got skills, arm strength, mobility, improvisational ability, moxie...He's kinda skinny, I hope that injuries don't become a thing...if so then it's a bust...

the game is way fast for him now, but this is what experience is about... especially in the same way he had to grow in college, he will have to master the pro game, he's a game smart dude with winning play instincts, he is green right now, deal with it... the weopanz are good enough for plays to happen, I think we will see improvement... He's forcing passes, throwing to hard, trying to do do much...it was smart of Lafleur to do runs, nothing wrong with running the ball the way we did...He will emerge maybe not  today, but which QB outside of Mac and Herbert have already...

I know we have PSTD over Darnold, I agree, but honestly he seemed super nice, but low football IQ, only with a team like N England could Sam seem competent... 

When Zach gets his sh*te together, he will be an exciting QB, he's the same Zach we loved when he was being compared to maholmes and buddying it up with Aaron Rogers... Even the media fell in love with him, like Trevor Lawrence, Fields, etc, they are learning nobody but Mac is doing great...

The line is getting better, and if our LT comes back he will have just enuff time for him to make decisions... Did you see his improv play in the Tennessee game, when he was rookie of the week...

I mean yeah he's gotta lotta ways to go, but I still think he has it, and if he doesn't we will know soon enough... He is GREEN, and players who are green and have talent are  raw, he's not polished but not hopeless at least give him til the middle of next year to see if he is catching on...

Its the same people who overtake every thread moaning and groaning about a kid QB with all of 6 games to his career.   

 

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Top of my head, 2 reasons.

1. He misses the easy stuff. I mean, it's one thing to make rookie mistakes. We expect that. But he needs to at least make basic throws to wide open guys. It's very discouraging.

2. We very recently experienced the Sam Darnold rookie experience, which was far more impressive than what Zach has done so far. Given how that ended, it's hard to be optimistic.

That being said: I'm rooting for him to start showing why he was drafted #2 overall. He needs time. He needs to be better.

Both of those things are not mutually exclusive.

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1 hour ago, kevinc855 said:

So, not sure why all the division among fans. Two things can be simultaneously true 

1) No one is advocating cutting Zach or writing him totally off

2) But also acknowledging Zach has been really bad while he has been on the field. 

I see posters who want to act like Zach is fine, denying reality, and other over dramatic folks comparing him to Hackneberg

It's somewhere in between. 

Lil Kevy Kev, look at you with the level headed take!  Feeling good off that HUGE must win victory?

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2 hours ago, munchmemory said:

We were told to "be patient" with Sanchez, Geno and Darnold.   That's not a great indicator that patience in Wilson will result in success.  Sometimes (even most times), what you see is actually what you see.

Patience doesn’t guarantee success. It just makes sense after 6 1/4 games with one being after a 4 week layoff and a not fully healed knee. He may continue to suck but he has the talent to improve with more experience. If he played great right away it wouldn’t prove anything long term either, like Sanchez in the playoffs. To judge a rookie QB to finished products like the 3 QBs mentioned seems premature at this point. 

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2 hours ago, LSJF said:

Why are we being so friggin impatient with Zach?

Do you really feel he has no shot to get acclimated to the pro game?

When he was drafted it was known that it took him time to adjust at every level he has played. However when he adjusted he was number two pick worthy...

He's got skills, arm strength, mobility, improvisational ability, moxie...He's kinda skinny, I hope that injuries don't become a thing...if so then it's a bust...

the game is way fast for him now, but this is what experience is about... especially in the same way he had to grow in college, he will have to master the pro game, he's a game smart dude with winning play instincts, he is green right now, deal with it... the weopanz are good enough for plays to happen, I think we will see improvement... He's forcing passes, throwing to hard, trying to do do much...it was smart of Lafleur to do runs, nothing wrong with running the ball the way we did...He will emerge maybe not  today, but which QB outside of Mac and Herbert have already...

I know we have PSTD over Darnold, I agree, but honestly he seemed super nice, but low football IQ, only with a team like N England could Sam seem competent... 

When Zach gets his sh*te together, he will be an exciting QB, he's the same Zach we loved when he was being compared to maholmes and buddying it up with Aaron Rogers... Even the media fell in love with him, like Trevor Lawrence, Fields, etc, they are learning nobody but Mac is doing great...

The line is getting better, and if our LT comes back he will have just enuff time for him to make decisions... Did you see his improv play in the Tennessee game, when he was rookie of the week...

I mean yeah he's gotta lotta ways to go, but I still think he has it, and if he doesn't we will know soon enough... He is GREEN, and players who are green and have talent are  raw, he's not polished but not hopeless at least give him til the middle of next year to see if he is catching on...

Because this team has sucked for a decade.  Fans have run out of patience and don't want to hear it.  Even when there are fair points to be made, they'll fall on deaf ears.  Fair or not, Zach was gonna' be the target of their ire the second he struggled, which was inevitable.

 

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52 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

edit:

honestly, I think a lot of this, like I said stem from the preseason.  The extremes with this kid are unreal.  You called him the greatest college QB you've ever seen and the best NFL QB prospect you've ever seen.  You said this, lol.  When you read stuff like that and you feel the other way, the responses will be equally as extreme.  And now, he's the worst rookie Jets QB we've ever seen and naturally, the extremist (just like in real life) take the stage.

I stand by my assessment of him in college. Unquestionably there is some doubt whether he will develop in the NFL as his traits suggested but still early. LaFleur does seem determined to ruin him with run run pass though. 

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2 hours ago, LSJF said:

he's the same Zach we loved when he was being compared to maholmes and buddying it up with Aaron Rogers

He’s also the same Zach that made us puke when he was being compared to Mahomes and Rodgers by draft nitwits

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2 hours ago, JiFapono said:

It probably has to do with how obnoxious the offseason was around here regarding Zach.  There were people outright cursing people out and telling them they "knew nothing about Football" for questioning him as a prospect.   People were so dramatic on both sides, that lines have been crossed in the sand and those lines were dug very deep.  Many of us arent ready to write him off but simultaneously very worried about him because IMO he's the worst rookie QB I've ever seen take a snap for the Jets and that's saying something and not in a good way.

 

 

In fairness, people behave this way over prospects every year. You'd think we'd all be used to it by now.

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Because Mirage Mike was a fun story 

Because Saleh handled the situation very poorly and implied there could be a permanent change in the depth chart 

Because internet commenter’s are the worst 

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6 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

I stand by my assessment of him in college. Unquestionably there is some doubt whether he will develop in the NFL as his traits suggested but still early. LaFleur does seem determined to ruin him with run run pass though. 

All good in the hood, I'm just over here like kind of pointing out the irony of "innate bias" in a thread wondering why people are so impatient.  You're standing by your seemingly wildly inaccurate assessment while simultaneously claiming his OC wants to ruin his own career by ruining Zach Wilson's career.

That's a JN special right there, baby!  lol

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21 minutes ago, AFJF said:

Because this team has sucked for a decade.  Fans have run out of patience and don't want to hear it.  Even when there are fair points to be made, they'll fall on deaf ears.  Fair or not, Zach was gonna' be the target of their ire the second he struggled, which was inevitable.

 

Good post. It was always gonna be a bad scene here for any QB, especially after losing out on Lawrence. Taking a tiny, sheltered kid from the Utah suburbs and subjecting him to this franchise at this point—post-Darnold, post-Gase—was just an absurd concept, and then to compound all of that by anointing him the starter on Day One was so ******* short-sighted that I’m honestly surprised nobody has been fired for it yet. I feel legitimately bad for Wilson, but it’s going to get immeasurably worse for him if he doesn’t get himself IR’ed soon.  

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10 minutes ago, sourceworx said:

In fairness, people behave this way over prospects every year. You'd think we'd all be used to it by now.

True but it was excessive this year, for sure.  It was bleeding into every thread and people were over the top.  And now it's carried over into the regular season.  People like full on have grudges for sharing a bad opinion on Zach, I've never seen it this bad.  For example; I get tagged in every thread about Justin Fields.  Yes, I preferred him to the other prospects but I was steady on the trade down train because overall, I didnt like the class but if we had to go QB, I'd have taken him.  So now I'm a Zach hater/Fields lover and get treated as such and it hurts.

 

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2 hours ago, LSJF said:

Why are we being so friggin impatient with Zach?

Do you really feel he has no shot to get acclimated to the pro game?

When he was drafted it was known that it took him time to adjust at every level he has played. However when he adjusted he was number two pick worthy...

He's got skills, arm strength, mobility, improvisational ability, moxie...He's kinda skinny, I hope that injuries don't become a thing...if so then it's a bust...

the game is way fast for him now, but this is what experience is about... especially in the same way he had to grow in college, he will have to master the pro game, he's a game smart dude with winning play instincts, he is green right now, deal with it... the weopanz are good enough for plays to happen, I think we will see improvement... He's forcing passes, throwing to hard, trying to do do much...it was smart of Lafleur to do runs, nothing wrong with running the ball the way we did...He will emerge maybe not  today, but which QB outside of Mac and Herbert have already...

I know we have PSTD over Darnold, I agree, but honestly he seemed super nice, but low football IQ, only with a team like N England could Sam seem competent... 

When Zach gets his sh*te together, he will be an exciting QB, he's the same Zach we loved when he was being compared to maholmes and buddying it up with Aaron Rogers... Even the media fell in love with him, like Trevor Lawrence, Fields, etc, they are learning nobody but Mac is doing great...

The line is getting better, and if our LT comes back he will have just enuff time for him to make decisions... Did you see his improv play in the Tennessee game, when he was rookie of the week...

I mean yeah he's gotta lotta ways to go, but I still think he has it, and if he doesn't we will know soon enough... He is GREEN, and players who are green and have talent are  raw, he's not polished but not hopeless at least give him til the middle of next year to see if he is catching on...

While I agree with you, it's not just Darnold Ptsd, it's Sanchez, Geno and Darnold ptsd.

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2 hours ago, Uncle Nicco said:

Wilson is 2-1 in his last four starts. He has 3 picks over that span, one a Davis slip (vs Ten) and the unlucky play yesterday which we've covered. 

He had a great game against Ten. He pulled us within 3 with 7 mins to go vs. ATL. He was sharp at the start vs. NE. 

This was his first game back after missing 5 weeks, with a bum knee, without his #1 WR and #1 RB, on the road, vs a GOOD pass defense. 

Does he have some seriously concerning issues to work through? No doubt. But there are positives, and he has barely played. The off the charts raw talent and work ethic is there, unlike some high drafted QBs in our past. 

I posted this in another thread, but for everyone saying how unfathomable it is for a QB to go 24 for 145 in 2021, please see other performances from yesterday. 

 

Burrow 24 for 190

Goff 25 for 175

Taylor 26 for 158

Hurts 31 for 129

Jones 29 for 202

Newton 21 for 92

Tannehill 21 for 93

Ryan 29 for 190

Lawrence 42 for 228 

Bridgewater 18 for 129

Jackson 32 for 165

You sure? 
 

I was told that only a scrub like Wilson could throw for less than 200 yards in 2021. 

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22 minutes ago, AFJF said:

Because this team has sucked for a decade.  Fans have run out of patience and don't want to hear it.  Even when there are fair points to be made, they'll fall on deaf ears.  Fair or not, Zach was gonna' be the target of their ire the second he struggled, which was inevitable.

 

I know the pendulum swung so fast, from preseason hype, to regular season doom… it’s probably somewhere in the middle by the end of the season

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1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

Its the same people who overtake every thread moaning and groaning about a kid QB with all of 6 games to his career.   

 

Not hearing the “six games” argument from the people who decided Mike White can’t play after two full starts, one of which was on the road in Buffalo. 

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6 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

So now I'm a Zach hater/Fields lover and get treated as such and it hurts.

It’s just deflection. Zach fans pray to sweet Christ that Fields busts so they don’t have to live with the guilt and shame.

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1 minute ago, T0mShane said:

It’s just deflection. Zach fans pray to sweet Christ that Fields busts so they don’t have to live with the guilt and shame.

You tagged me about Justin Fields the other day.

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7 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Not hearing the “six games” argument from the people who decided Mike White can’t play after two full starts, one of which was on the road in Buffalo. 

Haha, they tossed Mike White feet first into a wood chipper and then bitched, "He's a terrible dancer!"  LOL

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There are simply too many people that were against Zach being drafted and dug in...

So they can only see the bad and never see the good.

The thing is they don't even realize that's what they're doing...Their bias is so engrained they're simply incapable of even recognizing the positive.

 

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15 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Not hearing the “six games” argument from the people who decided Mike White can’t play after two full starts, one of which was on the road in Buffalo. 

Mike White is a 4th year player who is a never was prospect and at best is a candidate to become the backup QB

While we're at it, he has had what, one game?

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5 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Mike White is a 4th year player who is a never was prospect and at best is a candidate to become the backup QB

While we're at it, he has had what, one game?

His jersey is literally in the Hall of Fame from that “one game.”

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