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The All Things Zach Wilson Thread: MERGED


Barry McCockinner
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13 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Oh, I get your drift, but I don't think that is accurate in any way whatsoever.

I'll be honest, I feel like every thread in re: Zach goes something like this:

Poster #1:  Zach sure played pretty poorly today.  He missed a number of makeable passes and some open guys.

Poster #2:  SCREEEEE!!!!!! WHY ARE YOU SO IMPATIENT!!!! WHAT, DO YOU WANT TO CUT ZACH TODAY!!!???  WHY DO YOU HAAAAAATE HIM AND WANT HIM TO DIEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!

Poster #1:  Uh, ok.  

Poster #2:  YOU ARE A BAD FAN!!! WHY DON'T YOU ROOT FOR SOMEONE ELSE!!!!  DUH, PAYTON MANNING SUCKED AS A ROOKIE TOO DUMBASS.  THOSE INT'S WERE THE RB, TE AND COACHES FAULT, ZACH DID NOTHING WRONG!!!!

And it only declines from there.

Of course, some posters see this as the exact opposite, so yeah.  Almost like modern day Republicans and Democrats, the forum seems (as it always does with new high-picked QB's) to be both set in their view, with their own separate sets of "facts", very angry about people who don't agree with them to the point of seeing them as the real enemy, and for the most part....completely talking past one another, rather than to one another.

 

The day someone calls those who defend Zach a bad fan, I’ll be more inclined to believe in the moral relativism of both camps.

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17 minutes ago, munchmemory said:

As one of the prime Darnold haters on the board, these words pain me to write:  If he had still been on the team, and JD/Saleh made it a fair fight in camp, Zack Wilson never sees the field.

Zach has had the poorest start of any Jets QB this millennium and it isn’t close. I’d take Geno — who I despise as a player and human being — over him.

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55 minutes ago, jgb said:

Suck is relative. Both are among the top QB2’s in the league and I want a guy like that.

You can lust after Minshew and Trubiski.    

Id rather develop ZW who has more talent than either one of them.  

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38 minutes ago, jgb said:

While sandbagging the options behind him in some misguided attempt to “preserve his psyche.” Although in this case all 3 tomato cans JD put out on the shelf behind Zach have outperformed him.

On one hand you talk about how well the backups have played on the other they’re shlt put in place to preserve ZWs psyche.  

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On 11/29/2021 at 9:00 AM, More Cowbell said:

All the people who have defended Zach are basically saying the same thing. He has only played about 6 games. I understand there is a big jump from college to the NFL but we are seeing the other rookies starting to settle in. Both Michael Carter's, Moore, AVT, even Echoles before he was hurt was showing improvement. Has Zach fixed anything? I think yesterday he made a real effort to play within the offensive system but what we saw is he wasn't really that good at it. More so his receivers bailed him out on some of the short passes by catching the low pass or ball thrown behind them rather than Zach making well timed and placed passes. So do we just give Zach a pass on the rest of the season? I know some are not giving him a pass at all and I don't  think there is a QB in this coming draft class that is worth giving Zach the Rosen treatment, but even as bad a Peyton was in his first season, it was just the massive amount of picks. You could see the other great attributes.  I just don't see it with Zach. Actually every game I see a new issue. This game was the first one I saw he had no touch on some short ones. How long until the light goes on. It already has for the other rookies.

Edit for Maxman

Yes, I know we won. That doesn't  mean our QB is taking the same steps forward the other rookies are.

People still think Sam Darnold is going to be a good QB. Just give him some time.

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Please stop acting like we gave up on Darnold too late, we dumped him as early as humanly possible. 

He had a promising rookie year 

Improved across the board statistically in every single category year 2, despite the whole mono bull sh*t. Comp %, yards, TDs, Wins, etc  -“” significantly improved. 

struggled year 3 - dumped 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

On one hand you talk about how well the backups have played on the other they’re shlt put in place to preserve ZWs psyche.  

The bold says it all... and irrespective of what the HC says about his mental capacity, this maybe his biggest short coming... 

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2 minutes ago, Uncle Nicco said:

Please stop acting like we gave up on Darnold too late, we dumped him as early as humanly possible. 

He had a promising rookie year 

Improved across the board statistically in every single category year 2, despite the whole mono bull sh*t. Comp %, yards, TDs, Wins, etc  -“” significantly improved. 

struggled year 3 - dumped 

 

 

We handled the Darnold situation perfectly.  We gave him 3 years and obviously, Joe and Saleh made the right decision.  And hopefully we wont have to but if we do have to handle the Wilson situation, I have full faith that these 2 will do the right thing again.

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Just now, jgb said:

Only if you agree that sucky QBs outperforming Zach helps your case. Do you, though. 

Sucky?  I thought White was a record setter with a jersey in the HOF?  Who should start over a draft pick with a ton more talent?  
It doesn’t work both ways?  

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1 minute ago, AZSOJ said:

The bold says it all... and irrespective of what the HC says about his mental capacity, this maybe his biggest short coming... 

Dr Phil’s are lining up now.  Diagnosing the kids psyche from their TVs. 

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6 hours ago, Irish Jet said:

Why didn't they include completion %, QB rating or QBR?

For those who don't know, against those teams respectively:

Mac Jones:

Texans - 76.7% - 95.3 Rating - 70.0 QBR - 25 points - Win

Falcon - 84.6% - 96.6 Rating - 39.1 QBR - 25 points - Win

Titans - 71.9% - 123.2 Rating - 72.9 QBR - 36 points - Win

Panthers - 66.7%- 85.2 Rating - 24.8 QBR - 24 points - Win

Zach Wilson

Texans - 58.3% - 58.5 Rating - 9.8 QBR - 21 points - Win

Falcons - 59.4%  - 63.5 Rating - 19.7 QBR - 20 points - Lose

Titans - 61.8% - 97.3 Rating - 45.3 QBR - 27 points - Win

Panthers - 54.1% - 82.9 Rating - 32.7 QBR - 14 points - Lose

-----------------------------------------------

Hilarious.

Even in your cherry picked games and Zach's garbage time inflation Mac absolutely destroys him. This is honestly the saddest attempt at coping that I have ever seen. 

It's just f*cking pathetic reading this place of late. Embarrassing levels of denial, desperately clinging on to any hope that the very clearly very bad QB is good actually. 

Mac Jones is a far better QB than Zach Wilson. The sooner you accept that the less painful it will be. 

To me the most interesting thing about this is that they both had their best games against the Titans.  I thought they were the one of those four teams that was supposed to be for real?

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1 hour ago, Uncle Nicco said:

Ah yes the old "stop cherry picking" argument based around cherry picking of your own. Of course you cherry pick comp % and rating which are directly tied to each other and easily manipulated by scheme and coaching. Of course. Not to mention crediting WINS to the QB. If anything Wilson having 2 wins with this team and "coaching" is significantly more impressive than Mac Jones riding the coat tails of literally the greatest coach in NFL history. 

You know what the pathetic thing is? People like you who decide to throw away any positive shown by your rookie QB that has played 5 games and instead choose to sh*t spray hyperbolic statements about how terrible his is all over a message board. 

I don't think you know what cherry picking is. 

I'm quite happy to compare every stat from every game because Mac Jones has been superior to Zach Wilson in every single area.  

Buddy you signed up to this forum solely to sh*t on Chad Pennington, who was actually a good QB. Don't start crying when someone calls out the bad QB for his bad play. 

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2 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

Sucky?  I thought White was a record setter with a jersey in the HOF?  Who should start over a draft pick with a ton more talent?  
It doesn’t work both ways?  

You’re entitled to your opinion but not to mine. If you want to argue against someone who believes those things you should probably go find them.

 

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1 hour ago, Warfish said:

Oh, I get your drift, but I don't think that is accurate in any way whatsoever.

I'll be honest, I feel like every thread in re: Zach goes something like this:

Poster #1:  Zach sure played pretty poorly today.  He missed a number of makeable passes and some open guys.

Poster #2:  SCREEEEE!!!!!! WHY ARE YOU SO IMPATIENT!!!! WHAT, DO YOU WANT TO CUT ZACH TODAY!!!???  WHY DO YOU HAAAAAATE HIM AND WANT HIM TO DIEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!

Poster #1:  Uh, ok.  

Poster #2:  YOU ARE A BAD FAN!!! WHY DON'T YOU ROOT FOR SOMEONE ELSE!!!!  DUH, PAYTON MANNING SUCKED AS A ROOKIE TOO DUMBASS.  THOSE INT'S WERE THE RB, TE AND COACHES FAULT, ZACH DID NOTHING WRONG!!!!

And it only declines from there.

Of course, some posters see this as the exact opposite, so yeah.  Almost like modern day Republicans and Democrats, the forum seems (as it always does with new high-picked QB's) to be both set in their view, with their own separate sets of "facts", very angry about people who don't agree with them to the point of seeing them as the real enemy, and for the most part....completely talking past one another, rather than to one another.

 

I agree totally with this except you need to change poster #2 to Nico

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1 hour ago, jgb said:

Only if you believe that sucky QBs outperforming Zach helps your case. Do you, though. 

They each had one game.  White had one really good game and a nightmare of a game.  Let’s not overdo the outperformed stuff because of that one game

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1 hour ago, jgb said:

You’re entitled to your opinion but not to mine. I’d you want to argue against someone who believes those things you should probably go find them.

 

You can have your opinions too.  It’s what the point of all of this is.  I agree with some of your opinions but not all of them

Imagine? 

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12 hours ago, the Claw said:

Glad you got a great deal from the dentist. That’s not an option for everyone. Not in my area. I wouldn’t buy one anyway. Besides, you can get cars with less mileage for less money. If it was just a car you’d have one of those. 
 

To answer your question, probably (although there are many things to compensate for not necessarily a tiny p— I dont want to be presumpitous). 

Yea, I could have gotten a car with less mileage. But the BMW, well it was way nicer in every way. And 80k on a BMW that has dealer maintenance records isnt much

It's almost as though you completely ignore any luxuries. It's like you'd be fine with beige cloth seats vs 2 tone leather. Who needs cruise control when my foot works good. A sunroof...why? Electric windows? Whats wrong with the crank?????

Again I totally understand value and thats how I operate but youre a bit much buddy. And when you say you drove your truck until the tranny went out it gives me this image of some rust bucket truck with dirty seat covers and coffee stains on the carpet with the smell of cat urine. Seriously, theres a fine line between frugal and cheap. I suggest you treat yourself to a decent car! you deserve better

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1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

You can have your opinions too.  It’s what the point of all of this is.  I agree with some of your opinions but not all of them

Imagine? 

I’m saying you are arguing against yourself, stating opinions about White that I don’t hold. So basically I disagree with you and your straw man, too. :) 
 

But yes, I of course agree with you sometimes!

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3 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

All these guys can win you football games imho.....that is if Zach never becomes a good QB in this league. What i don't want is the Darnold approach where we feel we need to give 3 years to a guy while the rest of the team suffers

And that is fair.  Perhaps a better approach is to bring in a guy who can get you 6-9 wins with competent play.  Keep building a team, and keep drafting QB's.  Make them compete with your average QB, until within the competition a star emerges, rather than spending high pick after high pick on a guy you want to be the next incarnation of Peyton Manning. 

I mean, Tom Brady sat for a whole season!

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1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

They each had one game.  White had one really good game and a nightmare of a game.  Let’s not overdo the outperformed stuff because of that one game

All 3 have tiny sample sizes to compare with. I acknowledge the small sample size and large potential margin of error but it is a true statement that Zach has looked the worst of the 4 QBs thus far.

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3 hours ago, Uncle Nicco said:

Please stop acting like we gave up on Darnold too late, we dumped him as early as humanly possible. 

He had a promising rookie year 

Improved across the board statistically in every single category year 2, despite the whole mono bull sh*t. Comp %, yards, TDs, Wins, etc  -“” significantly improved. 

struggled year 3 - dumped 

 

 

I actually agree with you, Nico. The only caveat being that by year 3 at latest we probably should’ve had a Plan B in place rather than Flacco. Some will remember that I really wanted Tannehill to come in as QB2 after Darnold’s second (edit: first) year.

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3 hours ago, jgb said:

Zach has had the poorest start of any Jets QB this millennium and it isn’t close. I’d take Geno — who I despise as a player and human being — over him.

Is this opinion or stat based?  Sanchez was worse in nearly every statistical category over his first 6 starts.

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7 minutes ago, HawkeyeJet said:

Is this opinion or stat based?  Sanchez was worse in nearly every statistical category over his first 6 starts.

Honestly didn’t look. Very well could be misremembering. If I get a chance later I’ll check out his stats.

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