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****OFFICIAL JETS V EAGLES MINSHOWDOWN THREAD****


T0mShane
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9 minutes ago, slats said:

That’s fine, I wouldn’t. I was legitimately thrilled when Cousins took less money to choke in Minnesota. 

It’s two different ways of looking at things for sure.

The high draft pick QB always brings a jolt of hope and excitement, I won’t argue that, but don’t you ever wonder what the Jets roster would look like if we’d signed Cousins and been able to use all the picks we wasted on QBs to improve in other areas?

I don’t think it’s hindsight to say we’d probably be a better team if we did.

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2 minutes ago, Green Ghost said:

It’s two different ways of looking at things for sure.

The high draft pick QB always brings a jolt of hope and excitement, I won’t argue that, but don’t you ever wonder what the Jets roster would look like if we’d signed Cousins and been able to use all the picks we wasted on QBs to improve in other areas?

I don’t think it’s hindsight to say we’d probably be a better team if we did.

Good post.   We seem mired in building from the top down.

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13 minutes ago, munchmemory said:

Prepping for the game by having a cup of coffee and watching Flip or Flop on HGTV.  Seems somehow apropos.  Only negative is my doll Christina isn't on this one.

Holy sh*t I'm doing the same! Wondering if younger Christina is better than present Christina. 

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17 minutes ago, Green Ghost said:

I think quite a few of us would gladly take a Alex Smith or Kirk Cousins over what we’ve had the last 10 years, and what we’re looking at now.

Calling those two mediocre is doing them a disservice imo. At any given time in this league you rarely see more than 3-4 teams with elite level play.
i’ll take a top 8-10 QB I can plug in for 10 years with a solid roster rather than throwing darts every 3 years hoping to find the next Mahomes-like unicorn and be very happy.

I agree but the problem is Kirk Cousins doesn't work on a team that has the worst talent in the league...that was why I would have been OK punting on QB the past draft and just worry about building a team..

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3 minutes ago, munchmemory said:

Hmmm.   Tough call.  Gun to my head, I like early Christina.  But in any era, when she flashes that smile, she's gorgeous.

I agree. SOmething more natural about her look in the earlier seasons pre-mega millionaire fame. Age wise I'd say she looks the same now as she did then which is pretty remarkable.

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11 minutes ago, undertow said:

I agree but the problem is Kirk Cousins doesn't work on a team that has the worst talent in the league...that was why I would have been OK punting on QB the past draft and just worry about building a team..

Yeah, but the Jets weren’t really as devoid of talent before the ‘18 season when we tried to sign Cousins as we are now.

Add in the #6 pick in the 1st and three 2nd round picks we gave up to pick Sam and you could’ve started to build a nice team around him immediately in that ‘18 draft.

The ‘19, ‘20 and ‘21 drafts would have been a continuation of that. We’d probably have never been below .500 the first two years, and a very solid team by now. We wouldn’t have been tearing down, we’d be fine tuning.

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17 minutes ago, Green Ghost said:

This is something I see a lot here. It’s such a common, yet strange take a lot of you have… this “it’s only about the QB, I don’t care about anything else” theory. I don’t get it.

I go the opposite way. I’d much prefer to see our team play good defense consistently and our OL and skill players on offense look really good than have a pretty good QB and nothing else around him.

Give me a really good roster any day. I’ll find a QB. Teams can waste 40+ years looking for a superstar QB. (Don’t ask me how I know)

I haven't seen people say "I don't care about anything else." I'd rather be the Buccaneers in 2020 when Brady was brought on. I'd rather be the Broncos when Manning was brought on. Meaning, really good rosters. But we're not. We spent an overall 2nd pick on a QB. We've got to get that right. 

Jets have had years to build a roster. Where is it? They've got to build it, hopefully Saleh and JD have their heads on straight. But if ZW craps out (b/c he's on the roster, and it was a heavy price to get him), we're heading backwards, not forwards.

If we can see him grow, then we can keep building the roster (defense and OL), like you say, and develop into a decent team. It's hard to have continued success with serviceable QBs (meaning, the guys you go out and find). 

 

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58 minutes ago, slats said:

I don’t tell people how to root. You can do whatever you like. Me? I’d rather be aggressively trying to find a true championship caliber QB over getting knocked out of the playoffs in the first round four years in a row with Andy Dalton, and then giving him $100M. 

You're 100% right, no one should tell you how to root.  You know my view on that when folks try and do it to me.

With that said, I think you are wrong.  The Jets will not jump from "sucks" to "championship" without passing through "mediocre" first.

I'd much rather be 9-7 for a few years and try to build on that, than to be 3-14 over and over as we've been.  

I'd much rather have a "mediocre" QB throwing for say, 4,265 yards and 35 TD's to 13 INT's (Kirk Cousins) than not.

And that route doesn't stop you from drafting and developing young QB's behind the Vet.  It just helps you win more and compete while you search for one.

We ultimately want the same thing, a Jets title.  We just have different views on how to get there.

I was good with Fitz, and wanted Cousins.  You preferred Geno and Darnold.  

I just hope, whatever route we take now, that it works. 

I'm tired of sucking horribly waiting for that miracle home run.

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44 minutes ago, Green Ghost said:

It’s two different ways of looking at things for sure.

The high draft pick QB always brings a jolt of hope and excitement, I won’t argue that, but don’t you ever wonder what the Jets roster would look like if we’d signed Cousins and been able to use all the picks we wasted on QBs to improve in other areas?

I don’t think it’s hindsight to say we’d probably be a better team if we did.

Seeing as Macc was still our GM, he'd probably still waste those picks, just in on different positions.

Worse still, we might be just mediocre enough to have kept Macc as our GM.

*shudders*

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8 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Zach’s middle name is “Kapono,” which is Hawaiian for “The Righteous.”

 

Gardner Minshew’s middle name is “Flint,” which is rural American for “Badass.”

Hmmm, when I hear "Flint" the first thing that comes to mind is "poison water".

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11 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Zach’s middle name is “Kapono,” which is Hawaiian for “The Righteous.”

 

Gardner Minshew’s middle name is “Flint,” which is rural American for “Badass.”

I'm good with Righteous. 

 

“The path of the righteous man is beset of all sides by the iniquities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil me. Blessed is he who, in the name of the charity and goodwill, shepherds the weak through the valley of darkness, for he is truly his brother’s keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know that I am the Lord when I lay my vengeance upon you.”

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37 minutes ago, Green Ghost said:

Yeah, but the Jets weren’t really as devoid of talent before the ‘18 season when we tried to sign Cousins as we are now.

Add in the #6 pick in the 1st and three 2nd round picks we gave up to pick Sam and you could’ve started to build a nice team around him immediately in that ‘18 draft.

The ‘19, ‘20 and ‘21 drafts would have been a continuation of that. We’d probably have never been below .500 the first two years, and a very solid team by now. We wouldn’t have been tearing down, we’d be fine tuning.

The difference between Cousins and Minshew is that signing Cousins locks you into Cousins, whereas Minshew’s contract gives you the flexibility to upgrade if the situation presents itself. @slats is presenting a false choice, because drafting Wilson at 2 locks you into him about as much as much as signing Cousins would have, except you at least know what you’re getting with Cousins. The Jets have to hope against hope that Wilson can perform as well as Cousins has—and soon—and then become even better that that to justify giving him an extension that will make the Cousins contract look like pocket change.

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4 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

The difference between Cousins and Minshew is that signing Cousins locks you into Cousins, whereas Minshew’s contract gives you the flexibility to upgrade if the situation presents itself. @slats is presenting a false choice, because drafting Wilson at 2 locks you into him about as much as much as signing Cousins would have, except you at least know what you’re getting with Cousins. The Jets have to hope against hope that Wilson can perform as well as Cousins has—and soon—and then become even better that that to justify giving him an extension that will make the Cousins contract look like pocket change.

I think I mentioned earlier, there are solid arguments to taking a chance on a kid with a top pick.

I just think in our case, back before the ‘18 draft, Cousins was the best move for us.

@Spoot-Face brought up a good point though, Macc would’ve been the guy making the picks though, so there’s that. (Not that JD has been a world beater either)
 

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53 minutes ago, Warfish said:

You're 100% right, no one should tell you how to root.  You know my view on that when folks try and do it to me.

With that said, I think you are wrong.  The Jets will not jump from "sucks" to "championship" without passing through "mediocre" first.

I'd much rather be 9-7 for a few years and try to build on that, than to be 3-14 over and over as we've been.  

I'd much rather have a "mediocre" QB throwing for say, 4,265 yards and 35 TD's to 13 INT's (Kirk Cousins) than not.

And that route doesn't stop you from drafting and developing young QB's behind the Vet.  It just helps you win more and compete while you search for one.

We ultimately want the same thing, a Jets title.  We just have different views on how to get there.

I was good with Fitz, and wanted Cousins.  You preferred Geno and Darnold.  

I just hope, whatever route we take now, that it works. 

I'm tired of sucking horribly waiting for that miracle home run.

Kevin makes a good point about that.  There are other players you are trying to develop, and constantly losing does affect people.

So yeah, I have no issues getting a guy like Dalton, who can get us to 8-8, as long as we are always drafting QB's to find one who can take us to 12-4. 

It is a great point.  Its about one of his only ones, but it's a great point!  :)

 

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14 minutes ago, Green Ghost said:

I think I mentioned earlier, there are solid arguments to taking a chance on a kid with a top pick.

I just think in our case, back before the ‘18 draft, Cousins was the best move for us.

@Spoot-Face brought up a good point though, Macc would’ve been the guy making the picks though, so there’s that. (Not that JD has been a world beater either)
 

I still think taking a chance on a QB in the draft was the right move, personally, it just sucks that we picked the wrong one, and trading two 2nds to move up for him sure does sting.

Finding a franchise QB is just so hard, I think you gotta take the chance when you can pick one high, because that opportunity doesn't come around all too often (well, except if you're the Jets, lol).

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