Connor Hughes on Wilson's inaccuracy

[NIGHT STALKER]

26 minutes ago, jgb said:

The excuse is he sucks. Simplest excuse possible. Occam’s Razor 

QBs make the weaponz not the other way around.

Zach sucks at football. Can you improve? Odds get longer every week.

You’re so far in the tank I’m going to call you Sherman.

The objectivity of a post is inversely proportional to the number of times the word “kid” appears in it.

I'm old enough to be his grandfather...therefore, he's a kid.

[JoeWillieWhiteShoesHOF]

13 hours ago, freestater said:

Orlovsky, Sims, all these guys are like freakin weathermen.  They tout their few hits and forget all the guys they were flat-out wrong on. I wish I could get paid being as wrong as these guys are all the time. 

Simms has been beyond Red-Hot over I think the last 5 years, an incredible run, where his analysis of the QB's drafted in the 1st Rd over that span has been so accurate it's actually difficult to believe.

Guess who looks unfortunately likely to bust his streak?  The new NY Jet QB of course.  He was head over heels and all in on Wilson pre draft, not even debatable to take Wilson over Lawrence.

He still has confidence in his assessment and claims that WIlson has hit "20 passes at the pro level" that proves to him he will be a star and that all the ugly you have seen in Wilson's game since coming to the pros is easily correctable.

Personally I had no doubt that we'd be seeing non stop tight spiral rifle shots between the numbers of all receivers that were open and was happy to think about it.

What I've seen most of the time is only explainable by knowing the Jets are cursed a franchise as though someone has a Zach Wilson voodoo doll somewhere that makes him throw wobbly passes half the time that are so wild they aren't even a threat to be intercepted.

Think how far the projections have been offside.  You don't even have to have a long memory.  It was only a few months ago that Zach Wilson and Aaron Rodgers/Pat Mahomes comparisons were being made.

[Sperm Edwards]

3 hours ago, jgb said:

I was just saying it reminded me of the situation. Wasn’t attacking you.

Oh and I think Wilson is on field dumb also.

I didn't take it as a personal attack. I just think they're 2 people different issues, even if the result was both were inaccurate for the Jets.

[Jackie Treehorn]

I don’t know how much I give for these observations of him in college. Last season he faced no pass rush (guys below 5’8 doesn’t count) and only had his mom in the stands.
 

This season he has NFL pass rushers lined up on the other side and…well you guys. It most likely has f$&ked him up mentally. He wasn’t ready to face that…at all.

The question is if he’s got mentally what it takes to be an NFL QB. 

[Gastineau Lives]

19 hours ago, jgb said:

It's probably because he sucks.

Wow, how ******* astute 

Yeah, Johnny we all know how smart you are which has always been and always will be the point, won't it? Here's your props. Happy now? What do you even root for when you watch the games? It's not Zach Wilson that's for sure. You're far too much in love with being smart and being right for you to want him to succeed. 

Even in a thread about an article where his struggles are trying to be understood in a more comprehensive way, you just HAVE to chime in with the usual.

"Hey you know what this horrible tasting punch that we're all drinking could really use? MY SH1T."

It's ******* gross.

 

[JustInFudge]

19 hours ago, sec101row23 said:

Zach’s biggest and most concerning issue for me is his mental make up,  he just appears to be soft and meek.  I don’t think the locker room has belief in him, and he knows that.  His optics are bad on game day, multiple coaches huddled around him holding his hand, the lost puppy dog look on his face and the lack of enthusiasm around him from his teammates.   His voice gets squeaky in press conferences.   

Oh really?  Weird.  What makes you think that?

 

 

[JustInFudge]

19 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Truth is this is probably the best bet, assuming there's actually a there there.

There's no reason to believe what's likely ailing him most - thinking way too much about way too many things while defenders are trying to take his head off - will suddenly correct between game 13 and games 14-17 this year. He needs major time off working with just 1-2 other guys running routes with nobody or maybe 1 person in coverage, until he regains muscle memory he once had, which he clearly seems to have lost.

His problem (well ok he has multiple, but his primary problem for a rookie) is he's just not accurate. That doesn't get better with experience it gets better with time (unless he's turned himself into a football Knoblauch/Sasser where it never really goes away).

Not recognizing when he should be going for something easier, or not recognizing ways an NFL DC can fool him, or unnecessarily throwing off balance because he's feeling pressure that isn't there? Yeah that stuff will (or anyway it can and often does) improve with experience.

Experience doesn't make yips go away; hopefully time away from live action does. What's most concerning on that front, to me, is he actually had a good amount of time off midseason and when he returned he went right back to his yips (which arguably got worse). 

What I do wonder is if he's also doing this in practice, too, and if Saleh/LaFleur are still sending him out there anyway. 

This is why I'm worried that he is who he is.  He's had a time away, he watched 3 different QB's execute this offense. He even got an extra week of time off so he wasnt embarrassed by the team he's about to face Sunday with half the ammunition as the last time they met.  They hired his personal QB coach, and he got a break 4 weeks in the middle of the season to work this out and yet he's regressing. 

I could sit here and find excuses and claim it will be better and it takes time and yadayada and all of that might be true and then again, the light might never come on and right now if you're the Jets, you have to ask yourself, what is it that you're encouraged by and that you look toward the future and say, ok, man, this kid does this at a high level and we just need to figure out how to expand that but the problem is, I dont see a positive.  I dont see anything other than a fast release and a strong arm which the league has seen thousands of in its history but what's unique about Zach?  Right now, that answer is absolutely nothing, and that's scary.

 

 

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

I wasn’t for a veteran because I just didn’t see the point but next year the fans will give Zach and the offense an even shorter leash. If they go out the first week or two and look like they do this year. Skipping balls off the turf. Woo boy. Get ready to move on quickly and have a back up plan. 

[Bowles Movement]

10 hours ago, jgb said:

You know how opinions work right? You get one and I get one. Mine is that yours is wrong. Deal with it.

What was your opinion on Josh Allen after his first year?

[Larz]

The head of the new sports performance institute is a sports psychologist 

perhaps they should chat 

[slats]

15 hours ago, NIGHT STALKER said:

I'm not giving up on this kid...yet.  Darnold was given 3 years to prove himself and even after that, there were many here who still wanted to keep him, but all he needed was a better surrounding cast of players.  Right now this kid has the yips...can it be fixed?  I don't really know, but I'm not in favor of severing the cord on him...too soon.  There are lot of factors hoovering around this organization besides bad QB play.  You know them well...HC, GM, young players, injuries (especially to key WR's)...oh, and the uniform sucks...lol.  Seriously though, let's give the kid at least 2-3 years before we ship him off and see what develops and see what kind of team JD has built.

He’s the starter the rest of this season. They want him to be the starter for a long time. They also probably would like to hold onto their jobs. I suspect that they’re going to do a little more for the QB room this coming offseason. Bring in a guy who they feel can at least hold the fort if Zach still hasn’t gotten over these mental issues of his. They can’t go thru a second season in a row with this level of QB play. They’ll give him every opportunity to demonstrate that he can be better but, if he doesn’t, they’re likely to go into some sort of self preservation mode and replace him. 
 
The failed Darnold experiment, fairly or not, probably shortens Wilson’s leash. It’s obviously short with a lot of fans, many of whom never wanted the Jets to draft him in the first place. Gase was two years & out and I doubt Saleh wants to follow in his footsteps. If they don’t see real improvement, I think they’ll put themselves in the position to pull the plug early and maybe reset the QB position again in 2023. 

[Sammybighead]

I think we're over thinking this situation worse than zach on the field. If this continues into next year, we'll be looking for a new qb in 2023. Simple. Done. Enjoy the bumpy, tumultuous ride until then. 

[Sperm Edwards]

21 minutes ago, Sammybighead said:

I think we're over thinking this situation worse than zach on the field. If this continues into next year, we'll be looking for a new qb in 2023. Simple. Done. Enjoy the bumpy, tumultuous ride until then. 

The situation is a bit more than that. They can’t just give the team Zach Wilson and no other serious starter options until 2023. I mean they can, but they have more than just the QB position to evaluate, and to a large degree Wilson is holding back such evaluations this year.

A Wilson-Flacco tandem isn’t really an option next year. They’ve spoken with their actions that they will never play Flacco over a healthy Wilson, so they need a real veteran starter. It’s not going to be Aaron Rodgers, but it’s going to have to be someone who isn’t going to cause a mutiny if he’s starting a dozen or more games. 

[section314]

As Orlovsky put it......" he's not playing reactionary, he's playing precautionary."  Or, playing not to lose instead of to win. The problem is from the neck up, which many times is a much tougher oponent.

[More Cowbell]

11 hours ago, Hal N of Provo said:

Ugh.   Everyone forgot to get permission to have an opinion again.  Sorry! 

I seriously  don't  think it's  he doesn't  want anyone to have a opinion but the facts remain, every game Wison plays is another game he can't  play a complete and consistent  4 qrts of good football. This is a huge problem, one I didn't  expect. At this point it seems like mental thing. I think todays game against the Fins is going to be very telling. Everyone and their mother knows Zach is getting blitzed, a lot. If Zach looks like he is not prepared for this, that is on him. It is late in the season and Zach should know what is coming by watching film of the Fins because that D has been living and dying by the blitz. He has to complete short and quick passes, something he has not done with any kind of consistency.  If he starts throwing them in the dirt to wide open receivers,  he may as well shut it down. 

[jgb]

1 hour ago, Bowles Movement said:

What was your opinion on Josh Allen after his first year?

That he is a unicorn. There is a reason everyone knows his story. Because he's in a universe of 1 in the NFL over the last 20+ years.

His existence is a great argument against those who say it's "impossible" for Zach to become a good QB. But no one -- at least not I -- is arguing that. We are saying it's extremely unlikely and that JD should have had a backup plan going into 2021 and must have one going into 2022.

[jgb]

3 hours ago, Gastineau Lives said:

Wow, how ******* astute 

Yeah, Johnny we all know how smart you are which has always been and always will be the point, won't it? Here's your props. Happy now? What do you even root for when you watch the games? It's not Zach Wilson that's for sure. You're far too much in love with being smart and being right for you to want him to succeed. 

Even in a thread about an article where his struggles are trying to be understood in a more comprehensive way, you just HAVE to chime in with the usual.

"Hey you know what this horrible tasting punch that we're all drinking could really use? MY SH1T."

It's ******* gross.

 

I root for Zach Wilson. I also root for my dad to win PowerBall but I don't advocate for him to drain his 401k on tickets.

Block me if you don't appreciate spoilers to Zach's future based on statistics, history, and reality.

[Warfish]

Zach Wilson is Mackey Sasser.

[jgb]

1 minute ago, Warfish said:

Zach Wilson is Mackey Sasser.

Except Mackey was good at the main part of his job (catching).

[section314]

13 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Zach Wilson is Mackey Sasser.

You and I are old enough to remember the most famous one......Steve Blass. 

[Hal N of Provo]

23 minutes ago, jgb said:

I root for Zach Wilson. I also root for my dad to win PowerBall but I don't advocate for him to drain his 401k on tickets.

Block me if you don't appreciate spoilers to Zach's future based on statistics, history, and reality.

You don’t know you speculate 

[T0mShane]

2 hours ago, JiFapono said:

I dont see anything other than a fast release and a strong arm which the league has seen thousands of in its history but what's unique about Zach?  Right now, that answer is absolutely nothing, and that's scary.

Most alarming to me is that he was supposed to be this plus athlete which was going to to be a great equalizer, but he moves like he has arthritic ankles and they’re tied together. I thought it was fishy that he refused to run or do agility drills at his pro day, but now we know why. 

[Hal N of Provo]

1 hour ago, More Cowbell said:

I seriously  don't  think it's  he doesn't  want anyone to have a opinion but the facts remain, every game Wison plays is another game he can't  play a complete and consistent  4 qrts of good football. This is a huge problem, one I didn't  expect. At this point it seems like mental thing. I think todays game against the Fins is going to be very telling. Everyone and their mother knows Zach is getting blitzed, a lot. If Zach looks like he is not prepared for this, that is on him. It is late in the season and Zach should know what is coming by watching film of the Fins because that D has been living and dying by the blitz. He has to complete short and quick passes, something he has not done with any kind of consistency.  If he starts throwing them in the dirt to wide open receivers,  he may as well shut it down. 

Fair take and approach. 

I think before the NFL Zach’s always had a really good grip of what the defense is doing.That he’s a near photographic memory kind of a guy.  

He’s building his library.  He’s got the goods.  
 

He already is elite against cover 2-cover 3 type stuff.  It’s consistent.  So the Oppsoing DCs are giving him a steady diet of what he struggles with.   They are winning the battle (as they should) but losing the war as they tutor Zach. 

Unless Zach has had a jump in progress today will be the ugliest game of the year.  

[Green hat]

1 hour ago, section314 said:

As Orlovsky put it......" he's not playing reactionary, he's playing precautionary."  Or, playing not to lose instead of to win. The problem is from the neck up, which many times is a much tougher oponent.

I agree with this. He's so worried about throwing interceptions that he's lost the feel of the game. Maybe a serious miscalculation to start him from day 1.. 

Now he needs to climb out of it with small successes strung together, without another major disaster.  Last week, no interceptions. This week, hopefully more positive than negative. A win would go a long way. 

[Hal N of Provo]

17 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Most alarming to me is that he was supposed to be this plus athlete which was going to to be a great equalizer, but he moves like he has arthritic ankles and they’re tied together. I thought it was fishy that he refused to run or do agility drills at his pro day, but now we know why. 

He has made lots of great escapes in the pocket.  He has coaches who tell him what to do.  They don’t want him running obviously.  

[T0mShane]

2 minutes ago, Hal N of Provo said:

He has made lots of great escapes in the pocket.  He has coaches who tell him what to do.  They don’t want him running obviously.  

He “escapes” from the pocket like Frenchmen “escaped” from the battlefield in WWI.

[Hal N of Provo]

2 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

He “escapes” from the pocket like Frenchmen “escaped” from the battlefield in WWI.

He’s had plenty of good escapes that everyone on JN takes for granted.  So much so that later there was a big thread of people complaining about him not avoiding a free runner when Moore fell down.  

[KINGDIRK]

10 hours ago, JoeWillieWhiteShoesHOF said:

Simms has been beyond Red-Hot over I think the last 5 years, an incredible run, where his analysis of the QB's drafted in the 1st Rd over that span has been so accurate it's actually difficult to believe.

Guess who looks unfortunately likely to bust his streak?  The new NY Jet QB of course.  He was head over heels and all in on Wilson pre draft, not even debatable to take Wilson over Lawrence.

Classic Jets right there! 

Look, I’m concerned about Zach but not going to jump off the roof just yet. Coming from BYU to the NFL a is a huge jump. I’m not losing all hope yet.  If he still looks like this a year from now, I’ll lead the ritual suicide lol.

[T0mShane]

Just now, Hal N of Provo said:

He’s had plenty of good escapes that everyone on JN takes for granted.  So much so that later there was a big thread of people complaining about him not avoiding a free runner when Moore fell down.  

See, I think his bailing on the pocket is a big part of why he’s struggling so much. He has to move up into the pocket and not automatically run sideways every time there’s pressure in his face. He either panics and rips a fastball at his running back, or he panics and starts running towards the sideline, and he’s not quick enough to get away with that like Russell Wilson or Aaron Rodgers are. His future is as a pocket passer, so he needs to man up and take his beatings between the tackles to get the pass off.

[sec101row23]

4 minutes ago, Hal N of Provo said:

He’s had plenty of good escapes that everyone on JN takes for granted.  So much so that later there was a big thread of people complaining about him not avoiding a free runner when Moore fell down.  

You can’t be serious?  His escapability is terrible and his movement in the pocket is just as bad.  His fundamentals are a mess.  

[Hal N of Provo]

1 minute ago, sec101row23 said:

You can’t be serious?  His escapability is terrible and his movement in the pocket is just as bad.  His fundamentals are a mess.  

Watch a highlight vid.   You guys are going full chicken little lol 

[sec101row23]

1 minute ago, Hal N of Provo said:

Watch a highlight vid.   You guys are going full chicken little lol 

You think the way he is moving in and out of the pocket is good?   My goodness 

[jgb]

49 minutes ago, Hal N of Provo said:

You don’t know you speculate 

Sure, it's "speculating" because we don't know the future. I still contend there's a big difference between speculating based on hope and speculating based on data, history, statistics, and probability. But to each his/her own.

[jgb]

9 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

See, I think his bailing on the pocket is a big part of why he’s struggling so much. He has to move up into the pocket and not automatically run sideways every time there’s pressure in his face. He either panics and rips a fastball at his running back, or he panics and starts running towards the sideline, and he’s not quick enough to get away with that like Russell Wilson or Aaron Rodgers are. His future is as a pocket passer, so he needs to man up and take his beatings between the tackles to get the pass off.

If you watch the Eagles game and really pay attention, you'll notice when Minshew is flushed out, his shoulders are squared with his eyes always aimed downfield and he keeps the ball ready to fire. Zach looks like Jamie Lee Curtis running from Michael Myers when he gets flushed.

[maury77]

1 hour ago, jgb said:

I root for Zach Wilson. I also root for my dad to win PowerBall but I don't advocate for him to drain his 401k on tickets.

Block me if you don't appreciate spoilers to Zach's future based on statistics, history, and reality.

You are better off blocking that poster, made my time on the board more enjoyable.