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Maybe Jets History ISN’T Repeating Itself


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7 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I'd like to see immediate and material improvement in the quality of play and the Win/Loss record in 2022.

That feels like a good place to start for this Coaching staff.

Everyone should be able to agree that a LARGE step forward in 2022 is the only thing that can prevent the entire JD-Saleh-Wilson regime from being placed firmly on a scalding hot seat.

For the avoidance of doubt, a LARGE step forward is being featured in the "In the Hunt" graphic this time next year.

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I think we all want to see that... To me progress is w/l, but it also shows improved discipline, improved consistency, etc... I believe those things plus more talent should get us to the 8-10 win total we think we should be at for improvement from 2021.

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9 minutes ago, slats said:

Zach and the Jets both need to be -at least- middle of the pack next season. Zach with a passer rating north of 90, and the team in the .500 range. And they need to have a solid backup plan at QB if Wilson can’t make that jump. I never expected anything in terms of wins this year, but I was hoping for better play down the stretch. Next year, they need some of these grand plans to transform into results. 

I agree completely.

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52 minutes ago, slats said:

Zach and the Jets both need to be -at least- middle of the pack next season. Zach with a passer rating north of 90, and the team in the .500 range. And they need to have a solid backup plan at QB if Wilson can’t make that jump. I never expected anything in terms of wins this year, but I was hoping for better play down the stretch. Next year, they need some of these grand plans to transform into results. 

More than reasonable without being too lenient and I completely agree.

After a brutal start, Elijiah, the OL, Carter RB all seem to be jelling nicely.

Wilson seems to have settled down and has shown improvement…still need more time and to see more improvement.

LaFleur looks like he really found his groove

Saleh I’m eh on it. Not convinced either way, but I did expect a motivated and fiery team. Too many zombie walk thru games.

The DL has massively underperformed (groundhogs day)

I do have some real concerns about the DC though….if we can upgrade that (shouldn’t be hard to do considering how bad he‘s been) we should look to dk that.

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1 hour ago, OtherwiseHappyinLife said:

Dating back to the late 90s—  Parcells, Groh, Edwards, Mangini, Ryan and Bowles all had winning records in their first season.  Heck, Gase was 7-9 which we should all consider a strong first season for a man of his uh uh .. ‘considerable’ talents.  

Edwards, Mangini and Ryan all had their teams in the playoffs year 1 while Parcells, Groh and Bowles narrowly missed.  Gase was even flirting with the playoffs down the stretch.

All later quit or imploded.  

Heck, our recent first round QBs still looked like potential future saviors after year 1.  Most fans were still optimistic (maybe more) about Pennington, Sanchez and Darnold going into year 2.  (** Geno Smith was a 2nd round pick **).

Which brings us to now.  Saleh has (rightfully) comer under heavy criticism from the fan base his first year and there was a recent poll on this site asking whether Zach Wilson was already a bust!  

Who knows??  Maybe this is the reversal we need, to have a team that completely starts from scratch year 1 for the benefit of year 2.

Do I still think the leadership has made silly mistakes?  Of course and don’t even get me started on our Defensive Coordinator?  But could we reap some major benefits of this unwatchable foundation laying in year 2?  All the other HC and QB arrows were pointing up and went down in rather short order (Pennington aside).  Let’s hope Saleh and Wilson start slow and move up.

i see many parallels with 1977 and the beginning of the michaels era.  michaels got rid of lots of dead wood and got good players drafted.  anyone remember his bookend tackles?  granted he missed badly on lam jones but did pretty well otherwise.

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5 minutes ago, Joe W. Namath said:

Patience and build through the draft.  We have never done it this way.  Thank goodness we finally have smart people like Douglas and Saleh running this franchise.

The future is bright Jet fans.  Its happening!!!

The Bengals are a great example of this.  It took YEARS of meandering at the bottom of the division before they made the big improvement.  In fact, the Jets are in Year 1 of Saleh and Wilson.  The Bengals are in Year 2 of Burrow and Year 3 of Coach Taylor.

I'm not saying the Jets will end up with the same turnaround but the idea that this shouldn't be given a couple years is crazy.

Imagine canning Saleh and pivoting off Zach next year to bring in our third HC/QB combo in 3 years! LULZ!!!!  Then watching whoever that is go 5-12 next year and the fans wanting to get rid of them.

 

1888376737_ScreenShot2021-12-28at9_38_29AM.png.1b0a68d49e64c20f4e69ab5396943e31.png

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3 minutes ago, jetstream23 said:

The Bengals are a great example of this.  It took YEARS of meandering at the bottom of the division before they made the big improvement.  In fact, the Jets are in Year 1 of Saleh and Wilson.  The Bengals are in Year 2 of Burrow and Year 3 of Coach Taylor.

I'm not saying the Jets will end up with the same turnaround but the idea that this shouldn't be given a couple years is crazy.

Imagine canning Saleh and pivoting off Zach next year to bring in our third HC/QB combo in 3 years! LULZ!!!!  Then watching whoever that is go 5-12 next year and the fans wanting to get rid of them.

 

1888376737_ScreenShot2021-12-28at9_38_29AM.png.1b0a68d49e64c20f4e69ab5396943e31.png

The only people who dont think this is going well are a certain portion of miserable Jet fans.  NFL experts, coaches across the league, league insiders and EVERYONE inside the the Jets building are absolutely thrilled with what is happening at Florham Park.  

It is an absolute dream we have Douglas, Saleh, LaFluer, Ulbrich, Wilson, Moore, Carter, AVT, Bryce hall. Echols, tons of draft picks etc.

If you cant see where this team is headed, you are blind.  

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1 hour ago, FidelioJet said:

This is the first true rebuild we've ever done.

JD and Saleh are trying to do this the right way.  Wether it works or not is still an outstanding question.  I'm still bullish on this group.  

Idzik literally did the same thing. Stripped the team down of talent, got rid of bad contracts, traded players for draft picks. 

He was just never given a 3rd year with his own coach.

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1 minute ago, Prodigal Syndicate said:

Idzik literally did the same thing. Stripped the team down of talent, got rid of bad contracts, traded players for draft picks. 

He was just never given a 3rd year with his own coach.

Correct. If Idzik's 2013 draft wasn't so pathetic, he would have gotten more time. That and he had no ability to relate to or handle the media. The New York media despised him

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8 minutes ago, Prodigal Syndicate said:

Idzik literally did the same thing. Stripped the team down of talent, got rid of bad contracts, traded players for draft picks. 

He was just never given a 3rd year with his own coach.

He also led what was arguably the worst draft in Jets history.  He was the right guy to strip it down, but not the right guy to build it back up.

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Move the Sticks pod *fwiw*
DJ sees the glass half full
did say a “miracle turnaround” actually a possibility.
picks, cap, rookie play.
all turns on ZW obviously.
in any event I’d much rather be in the Jets situation than the Giants if nothing else.

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19 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

Correct. If Idzik's 2013 draft wasn't so pathetic, he would have gotten more time. That and he had no ability to relate to or handle the media. The New York media despised him

 

11 minutes ago, MykePM said:

He also led what was arguably the worst draft in Jets history.  He was the right guy to strip it down, but not the right guy to build it back up.

Yeah he stunk no doubt about that. Just disputing the narrative we have never seen this before.

Idzik also had the misfortune of coming at a time when we just had some recent success and the fan base didnt want to lose that and didnt want to accept a rebuild after we finally saw a glimmer of hope. There was so much anger back then.

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43 minutes ago, Prodigal Syndicate said:

 

Yeah he stunk no doubt about that. Just disputing the narrative we have never seen this before.

Idzik also had the misfortune of coming at a time when we just had some recent success and the fan base didnt want to lose that and didnt want to accept a rebuild after we finally saw a glimmer of hope. There was so much anger back then.

Yeah it’s a fair point that we’ve seen the tear down before. The slight but maybe significant difference this time is the GM hired the head coach and those guys seem to be on the same page - GM is drafting guys for the schemes the coaching staff wants to run.

What happened after Idzik is also kind of a cautionary tale. It’s easy to go hog wild in free agency with cap space and piece together a team that’s a borderline playoff contender. That usually doesn’t last too long though and multiple years later there’s still leftover dead cap hits and the Mosley contract.

Free agency definitely has its place but those big long term contracts usually aren’t beneficial.

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20 minutes ago, sec101row23 said:

With only 2 weeks remaining in the season you only have 3 teams in the AFC that aren’t in the mix for the playoffs. Just 3.   Given the parity and additional playoff spot, there is no reason the Jets shouldn’t be “in the mix” at this point of the season next year.  
 

2022 is about wins and losses.   No more moral victories, no more just looking good while losing.  No more of Saleh getting in front of the reporters and saying it’s not about winning.  Expecting an 8-9 win team isn’t unrealistic.  Play meaningful football on Christmas weekend.  

I’ll settle for meaningful football in November at this point.

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1 hour ago, Prodigal Syndicate said:

Idzik literally did the same thing. Stripped the team down of talent, got rid of bad contracts, traded players for draft picks. 

He was just never given a 3rd year with his own coach.

So you're saying, it wasn't done right.  As I stated.  

The next GM came in and spent frivolously and stupidly on FA, continued to draft DT's and treated the most important position in all of sports as an afterthought.  

The tear down is only half the battle - which took almost 3 years to unravel.  It's finally complete.  This is the first year of the rebuild - Idzik didn't get a chance to get this far..  

Woody Johnson caved to fan pressure and dumb banners....Doesn't seem like he's going to this time and JD will get his chance to do it right.

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1 hour ago, FidelioJet said:

So you're saying, it wasn't done right.  As I stated.  

The next GM came in and spent frivolously and stupidly on FA, continued to draft DT's and treated the most important position in all of sports as an afterthought.  

The tear down is only half the battle - which took almost 3 years to unravel.  It's finally complete.  This is the first year of the rebuild - Idzik didn't get a chance to get this far..  

Woody Johnson caved to fan pressure and dumb banners....Doesn't seem like he's going to this time and JD will get his chance to do it right.

Nah what you said was this is the first true rebuild we have seen. Which is the company line Saleh and Douglas are pushing to excuse being bad and having little to no talent.

We saw Idzik starting a true rebuild and going through the hard part already. So Douglas is pretty much at the same point idzik got to. Having no talent and being bad. 

The actual rebuild part where you get good neither idzik or Douglas have done yet. Douglas has already been GM longer than idzik was so he has had more opportunity so far.

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1 hour ago, sec101row23 said:

With only 2 weeks remaining in the season you only have 3 teams in the AFC that aren’t in the mix for the playoffs. Just 3.   Given the parity and additional playoff spot, there is no reason the Jets shouldn’t be “in the mix” at this point of the season next year.  
 

2022 is about wins and losses.   No more moral victories, no more just looking good while losing.  No more of Saleh getting in front of the reporters and saying it’s not about winning.  Expecting an 8-9 win team isn’t unrealistic.  Play meaningful football on Christmas weekend.  

Eh, half the people on this board are already chalking up next year as it's okay we are bad for some reason.

 

But I agree. If we cant compete for a wildcard in a GMs 4th year what are we doing here.

7-10 wins is what I want next season.

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2 hours ago, johnnysd said:

Many people said all they want to see from Zach is continuous improvement. I think we all anticipated a higher starting point but the reality is that Zach is showing improvement each week. 

Also I think people are forgetting a little just how dramatically different next years team will be. We will likely have 20+ new players on the roster at a bare minimum. If we draft well and have a good offseason we could should a dramatic uptick

I wanted us to draft Wilson. I think his ceiling is insanely high.

I also thought he NEEDED to and should have say at least 1/2 the season.

I get it, they went with the “we aint making the playoffs and we’re starting rookies anyway” approach….but I still think having Wilson watch and learn and play the last 5-6 games would have been the best approach.

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