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Tom Brady


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2 minutes ago, Hex said:

He has been incredibly fortunate. But luck occurring many times over a space of time = more than just luck. You can argue that any player won something because the other team played badly, or because the refs made a bad call. This applies to pretty much every player that has ever played.

How does Leroy Butler picking off a pass that never should have been thrown a testament to Brady?  I could go on and on.  He is fortunate - over and over.  He threw a game ending interception vs KC 4 years ago and it was called back because Ford's finger was offsides.  Ford had nothing to do with that play and players line up like that 20-30 times a game.  How does Brady get credit for that play?  

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3 minutes ago, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

The GOAT is the best player though.  He is not the GOAT.He's just been doing it a high level for a long time.  He is the GOAT at taking care of his body.  That is if it has all been legal, which, given his history, is quite questionable.  

You make good points here. I can't remember, who did you say was the GOAT?

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Just now, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

How does Leroy Butler picking off a pass that never should have been thrown a testament to Brady?  I could go on and on.  He is fortunate - over and over.  He threw a game ending interception vs KC 4 years ago and it was called back because Ford's finger was offsides.  Ford had nothing to do with that play and players line up like that 20-30 times a game.  How does Brady get credit for that play?  

If a player is going to be written off because of their luck, than pretty much every successful player can be written off in history. They all use luck to their advantage. That's part of being the GOAT.

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14 hours ago, Untouchable said:

Dude just led the NFL in every major statistical category for a QB at 45 years old and most Jets fans still just want to chalk it up to cheating.

He’s not just the greatest QB to ever step on a football field, he’s the greatest player in the sports history.

He’s currently out of the division and working towards his 8th Superbowl victory while thumping his penis on Belichick’s forehead.

Sit back and enjoy it while it lasts

GFY

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27 minutes ago, Hex said:

You make good points here. I can't remember, who did you say was the GOAT?

There is no GOAT.  There is no need for a GOAT.  I don't think you can compare players across eras even if they play the same position.  And you can't compare different positions.  Brady is one of the best QBs of the past 20 years.  Manning is right there with him. So is Rodgers.  Brees as well.  Who is to say that Manning, Rodgers, or Brees would not have 7 rings if they played for the Pats and Bucs??  How can anyone compare Brady and Manning to Montana /Elway/Marino?  Or Unitas. Or Graham.  The game has changed so much to favor the QBs and the passing game.  

How is Brady better than Jim Brown or Walter Payton?  or Bruce Smith or Deacon Jones or Jerry Rice or Dick Butkus.  It's ridiculous to make these comparisons and come up with an answer.  Brady is an all time great who belongs in the HOF with other all time greats.  

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21 hours ago, section314 said:

No, Wayne Gretzky is. Gretzky did things and put up numbers that will never be broken. Guys that win scoring tittles today are still at least 100 pts shy of what Gretzky did. It's a good argument, but Jordan is no Gretzky.

Yeah no.  Gretzky played in an era with no defense and goalies with smaller pads.  While he was "The Great One" and clearly the best of his time, I'd make an argument that McDavid today is a much better athlete than him.  

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30 minutes ago, BallinPB said:

Yeah no.  Gretzky played in an era with no defense and goalies with smaller pads.  While he was "The Great One" and clearly the best of his time, I'd make an argument that McDavid today is a much better athlete than him.  

While Gretzky is clearly the GOAT in hockey, I still maintain the best all around player ever was Bobby Orr. Probably my favorite sports figure ever. Up there with Namath. 

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2 hours ago, BallinPB said:

Yeah no.  Gretzky played in an era with no defense and goalies with smaller pads.  While he was "The Great One" and clearly the best of his time, I'd make an argument that McDavid today is a much better athlete than him.  

McDavid is a great player, best in the league. But to be fair to him, he's not in the same hemisphere as Gretzky. He can't even get his team out of the 1st rd of the playoffs if they even get in at all. McDavid gets some slack because he has only been able to play basically 4 full seasons of games because of Covid and stoppages. In the seasons where he played a full set of games, his best point total was 116. Gretzky had 7 seasons alone where had more assists than that , topped off by 163. Gretzky AVERAGED 2 pts/game for his entire career. Let that sink in. It's not fair to compare any player in the history of hockey to Wayne Getzky. never has been, never will.

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9 minutes ago, section314 said:

McDavid is a great player, best in the league. But to be fair to him, he's not in the same hemisphere as Gretzky. He can't even get his team out of the 1st rd of the playoffs if they even get in at all. McDavid gets some slack because he has only been able to play basically 4 full seasons of games because of Covid and stoppages. In the seasons where he played a full set of games, his best point total was 116. Gretzky had 7 seasons alone where had more assists than that , topped off by 163. Gretzky AVERAGED 2 pts/game for his entire career. Let that sink in. It's not fair to compare any player in the history of hockey to Wayne Getzky. never has been, never will.

To be fair to McDavid, Gretzky played in a completely different era. It was much much easier to score in the 80s than now.  The goalies are better, goalie pads are ridiculously big now, the players are all bigger, stronger, faster on the same size rinks and there is much less space to skate and move, defense is better.  Also, Gretzky played on a tremendous team -- one of the best of all time - with a number of other HOF players.  After Gretzky left Edmonton, he never won another cup.  I'm not saying McDavid is as good, but there are reasons a direct comparison don't fly.

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51 minutes ago, section314 said:

McDavid is a great player, best in the league. But to be fair to him, he's not in the same hemisphere as Gretzky. He can't even get his team out of the 1st rd of the playoffs if they even get in at all. McDavid gets some slack because he has only been able to play basically 4 full seasons of games because of Covid and stoppages. In the seasons where he played a full set of games, his best point total was 116. Gretzky had 7 seasons alone where had more assists than that , topped off by 163. Gretzky AVERAGED 2 pts/game for his entire career. Let that sink in. It's not fair to compare any player in the history of hockey to Wayne Getzky. never has been, never will.

This doesn't prove anything.  Gretzky played in an era where the defense was crap and goalie pads were thin.  You can watch old games where the defense is practically standing around not doing anything but watching him score.  Not to take anything away from Gretzky but the talent level of the league as a whole is much much better.  

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12 minutes ago, BallinPB said:

This doesn't prove anything.  Gretzky played in an era where the defense was crap and goalie pads were thin.  You can watch old games where the defense is practically standing around not doing anything but watching him score.  Not to take anything away from Gretzky but the talent level of the league as a whole is much much better.  

You're right. Gretzky would be lucky to be a 3rd line C today. And maybe kill penalties.

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Just now, section314 said:

You're right. Gretzky would be lucky to be a 3rd line C today. And maybe kill penalties.

Never said that.  I just said it's not right to use points as a comparison in the different eras.  I know one thing for sure and that's Gretzky would not put up those type of numbers in today's NHL.  Would he still be the best?  We will never know.  

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17 minutes ago, BallinPB said:

Never said that.  I just said it's not right to use points as a comparison in the different eras.  I know one thing for sure and that's Gretzky would not put up those type of numbers in today's NHL.  Would he still be the best?  We will never know.  

I think both of us could make a pretty educated guess on that.😁

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