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Trade Back at #10?


bd71
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The Jets have a glaring hole at TE and the position has been a sore spot for years.  Drafting Trey McBride would go a long way in solidifying TE, but would he really be around when we draft in the 2nd?  Thoughts on trading down with pick #10, getting a later 1st round pick and drafting McBride with that pick?

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yes - let’s let all the teams that want to trade up submit sealed bids - this way ( knowing that at least half the league is desperate for that number 10 pick) we can maximize the return- personally I wouldn’t part with the pick for less than two number ones and two number two’s - and we can set that as the opening bid - then we can conduct another sealed bid for each of the two number ones and set minimum bid at at least 3 number 1’s next year plus 2 more number 2’s this year - this should be totally doable because I hear teams are already contacting JD to beg for a shot at moving up to 10 - if you are a youngster i apologize for this post if not………..


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29 minutes ago, bd71 said:

The Jets have a glaring hole at TE and the position has been a sore spot for years.  Drafting Trey McBride would go a long way in solidifying TE, but would he really be around when we draft in the 2nd?  Thoughts on trading down with pick #10, getting a later 1st round pick and drafting McBride with that pick?

From all indications TE seems to be deep. I would like to trade out of #10 but not necessarily to draft McBride there. If McBride is chosen before pick #35 there are other TE that will be there

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1 hour ago, bla bla bla said:

I don't want to take McBride that high. There are a lot of good TEs in this class I'd be happy getting any number of them. Ruckert and Kolar are 2 that we will be coaching at the Senior Bowl that I'd get on board with.

Your video really piqued my interest in Kolar. 6-6, great hands, good blocker, team captain. 

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I think 90% of the board here has been begging for a trade back in Rd1 for years and years. It never happens. With that being said, yes, I’d like for this to finally be the year the jets trade back and accumulate more premium picks. This team needs so much help. Get as many high upside prospects on this roster as possible! I’d love to see this team move the 4th pick as well if one of the two top pass rushers isn’t there. Turn 4 and 10 into 4 firsts plus some second and 3rds. 

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58 minutes ago, Warfish said:

The Jets need elite talent somewhere.  Apart from a rare few exceptions, we're basically a team full of rookie-level JAG's right now.

I would not trade down, and miss out on a top 5 talent, in order to draft two more rookie-level maybe-they'll-work-out lesser tier talents, especially at TE.

Ask yourself this:  Who on the Jets current roster can take a game and break it open?

Yeah, exactly.  No one.  Not Wilson (yet...).  Not Moore (yet, has the potential).  That's about it.  No elite pass rushers.  No elite RB.  No elite legit #1 WR.  No elite anything.

So if there is a higher chance of an elite talent at #4 or #10, I'm not in preference of trading back, Mims-style, to get some third tier guy the draftniks think "will be just as good" like they did with Mims.  Seems like Karloftis might be this year's version of that tbqh.

No, stick with the four top picks we have, and get the best, highest chance for elite-at-positions-of-major-impact we can get.

If anything, I'd consider trading the two 2nds to get back into the first for a third first rounder, should one that meets my criteria be available.

With the assets we have, find a way to get us the best (available) edge of the top prospects, the best WR and the best TE in this draft class, and I'll be happy., 

agree with this.  the jets need impact players and they're usually found at the higher end of the first round.  they worked hard to get the 4 and 10 picks.  let's hope they don't squander them.

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49 minutes ago, Warfish said:

 

So if there is a higher chance of an elite talent at #4 or #10, I'm not in preference of trading back, Mims-style, to get some third tier guy the draftniks think "will be just as good" like they did with Mims.  Seems like Karloftis might be this year's version of that tbqh.

No, stick with the four top picks we have, and get the best, highest chance for elite-at-positions-of-major-impact we can get.

 

this is it!

no more of that crap about this is a deep draft in this or that we can get one later. we need to stay and get the best we can at Edge and WR in the 1st and best TE in the 2nd. 

we cant draft a OL and wait till rd 2 to get a Edge or WR. i believe most mocks have 6-7 of both going in rd 1. 

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I agree that we need more impact players, im just not sure who is a sure fire, impact guy at 4.  Hopefully someone like Karalfitis differentiates themselves enough to be that guy.

More importantly, there is no QB who will go top 5, so trading out of 4 is very unrealistic.  I think there are 2 other trades that are a lot more realistice.

Detroit has 2, 31 and 34.  They could easily look to package 31 and 34 plus something in the future to move up to 10 for a QB.  The price to go from 31 to 10 in the first round is high, but at least they have a starting point with 34.  Maybe a 2023 second rounder is enough?

The trade I like the most though is Atlanta who picks 8, 43, 58 and 74.  Given that they likely believe they are competitive and the fact that Ryan's contract is essentially untradeable, they likely wont want to use 8 for a QB.  What would be smart though is to use 43 and 58 to move to 35 and take someone like Ridder who falls.  

If JD wound up with 4 and 10 and then 38, 43 and 58 - that could allow us to really fill some holes while also attacking impact positions at 4 and 10.

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2 hours ago, Warfish said:

The Jets need elite talent somewhere.  Apart from a rare few exceptions, we're basically a team full of rookie-level JAG's right now.

I would not trade down, and miss out on a top 5 talent, in order to draft two more rookie-level maybe-they'll-work-out lesser tier talents, especially at TE.

Ask yourself this:  Who on the Jets current roster can take a game and break it open?

Yeah, exactly.  No one.  Not Wilson (yet...).  Not Moore (yet, has the potential).  That's about it.  No elite pass rushers.  No elite RB.  No elite legit #1 WR.  No elite anything.

So if there is a higher chance of an elite talent at #4 or #10, I'm not in preference of trading back, Mims-style, to get some third tier guy the draftniks think "will be just as good" like they did with Mims.  Seems like Karloftis might be this year's version of that tbqh.

No, stick with the four top picks we have, and get the best, highest chance for elite-at-positions-of-major-impact we can get.

If anything, I'd consider trading the two 2nds to get back into the first for a third first rounder, should one that meets my criteria be available.

With the assets we have, find a way to get us the best (available) edge of the top prospects, the best WR and the best TE in this draft class, and I'll be happy., 

If Neal goes #1 and a QB or Hamilton #3 Thibideax would most likely be available at 4. Id be happy grabbing him or Karlaftis whomever is the better fit or depending on how the draft falls. Add London at 10. Trade back into the 1st with the 2 second round picks for TE and I think you got the makings of an effective draft. I would still like to see some help at LB and Safety whether in the 3rd Round or free agency. Those positions were atrocious this season. LB seems deeper so address that in the draft and find a large jets logo'd duffle bag for Marcus Williams since the only way to get guys to come here is to overpay.   

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1 hour ago, rangerous said:

agree with this.  the jets need impact players and they're usually found at the higher end of the first round.  they worked hard to get the 4 and 10 picks.  let's hope they don't squander them.

Or didn't work hard...They pick at 4 because they suck. 😆

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4 hours ago, bd71 said:

The Jets have a glaring hole at TE and the position has been a sore spot for years.  Drafting Trey McBride would go a long way in solidifying TE, but would he really be around when we draft in the 2nd?  Thoughts on trading down with pick #10, getting a later 1st round pick and drafting McBride with that pick?

I also believe that the Jets have a glaring hole at wide receiver, and would much prefer to get one at the #10 spot.  

Let's realize that the signing of Davis as a wide receiver last season was a disappointment, Crowder is leaving, and Mims is nonexistent.  Add that up, and the Jets must take a wide receiver over a tight end, with getting a quality tight end possibly in the 2nd round.

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I don't want to take McBride that high. There are a lot of good TEs in this class I'd be happy getting any number of them. Ruckert and Kolar are 2 that we will be coaching at the Senior Bowl that I'd get on board with.


Yea but those tight ends don’t have a name as cool as Trey McBride.


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Let's turn the biggest weakness on the offense into one of the biggest strengths.  It could flip the script for the Jets on offense and honestly won't take all that much to do it.  A legit veteran TE like Dalton Shultz coupled with one of the Top 2 or 3 TEs in the Draft would really jumpstart the group.  I'd be happy with either Wydermyer or McBride in Round 2.  Ryan Griffin has one more year under contract and he'd be TE3.  I also wouldn't mind the Jets double-dipping in the Draft and coming back later for a Ruckert, Ferguson or Kolar.

If the Jets do something like this then they finally put the TE issue to bed, that nagging problem goes away, and they shouldn't need to think about it for at least a few years.

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54 minutes ago, jetstream23 said:

Let's turn the biggest weakness on the offense into one of the the biggest strengths.  It could flip the script for the Jets on offense and honestly won't take all the much to do it.  A legit veteran TE like Dalton Shultz coupled with one of the Top 2 or 3 TEs in the Draft would really jumpstart the group.  I'd be happy with either Wydermyer or McBride in Round 2.  Ryan Griffin has one more year under contract and he'd be TE3.  I also wouldn't mind the Jets double-dipping in the Draft and coming back later for a Ruckert, Ferguson or Kolar.

If the Jets do something like this then they finally put the TE issue to bed, that nagging problem goes away, and they shouldn't need to think about it for at least a few years.

I’d be thrilled with that TE combo (not that I know one of these draft prospects from another), but don’t know that Schultz is going to reach FA. Njoku might not be a bad consolation prize. He turns just 26 next year, is supposed to be a good and willing blocker, and has real playmaking talent. They just had a logjam at the position, signing Hooper after Njoku’s disappointing first 2-3 seasons, and would have a tough time fitting both under veteran contracts. Couple others, but these two should be the top of their list before they start setting their sights any lower.

Pretty clear that, whatever the available names are once FA starts, they should look to add a serious veteran and a day 2 (or at worst round 4) draftee. These past Jets teams couldn’t put 1 legit TE onto the field, let alone a pair to run 2-TE sets where one may as well be a backup OLman who’s never caught a football before (or wear a neon sign that says, “It’s pretty damned unlikely anyone’s throwing me the ball, and I can’t catch for s**t even if they do, so don’t waste the D’s attention on me.”

I don’t think they need Griffin, honestly. If it meant even thinking about a slightly lesser TE - or lesser any starter - over a couple million a year (money that’d just go to Griffin, who should be invisible unless all else goes wrong), then dump him before this could possibly influence Douglas. TE3s are still available in the summer (like Griffin was himself). Schultz + a rookie + any of the 2020 stiffs is fine. If that stiff is Griffin, ok I guess, but he’d have to take a $2MM pay cut. $3MM is way overboard for a TE3.

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16 hours ago, Warfish said:

The Jets need elite talent somewhere.  Apart from a rare few exceptions, we're basically a team full of rookie-level JAG's right now.

I would not trade down, and miss out on a top 5 talent, in order to draft two more rookie-level maybe-they'll-work-out lesser tier talents, especially at TE.

Ask yourself this:  Who on the Jets current roster can take a game and break it open?

Yeah, exactly.  No one.  Not Wilson (yet...).  Not Moore (yet, has the potential).  That's about it.  No elite pass rushers.  No elite RB.  No elite legit #1 WR.  No elite anything.

So if there is a higher chance of an elite talent at #4 or #10, I'm not in preference of trading back, Mims-style, to get some third tier guy the draftniks think "will be just as good" like they did with Mims.  Seems like Karloftis might be this year's version of that tbqh.

No, stick with the four top picks we have, and get the best, highest chance for elite-at-positions-of-major-impact we can get.

If anything, I'd consider trading the two 2nds to get back into the first for a third first rounder, should one that meets my criteria be available.

With the assets we have, find a way to get us the best (available) edge of the top prospects, the best WR and the best TE in this draft class, and I'll be happy., 

What if the bold isn’t the case? Or it is but to a significantly less degree than usual? Prevailing opinion is it’s possible no prospect in this class would’ve gone in the top ten last year. 

Plus, data shows teams with more picks are more successful. Teams aren’t actually that good at drafting to the point that they actually identify the guys who should be picked earlier. Would be a very different conversation if they were. 

That’s especially true at two of the three positions you mentioned - WR and TE. 

37 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I’d be thrilled with that TE combo (not that I know one of these draft prospects from another), but don’t know that Schultz is going to reach FA. Njoku might not be a bad consolation prize. He turns just 26 next year, is supposed to be a good and willing blocker, and has real playmaking talent. They just had a logjam at the position, signing Hooper after Njoku’s disappointing first 2-3 seasons, and would have a tough time fitting both under veteran contracts. Couple others, but these two should be the top of their list before they start setting their sights any lower.

Pretty clear that, whatever the available names are once FA starts, they should look to add a serious veteran and a day 2 (or at worst round 4) draftee. These past Jets teams couldn’t put 1 legit TE onto the field, let alone a pair to run 2-TE sets where one may as well be a backup OLman who’s never caught a football before (or wear a neon sign that says, “It’s pretty damned unlikely anyone’s throwing me the ball, and I can’t catch for s**t even if they do, so don’t waste the D’s attention on me.”

I don’t think they need Griffin, honestly. If it meant even thinking about a slightly lesser TE - or lesser any starter - over a couple million a year (money that’d just go to Griffin, who should be invisible unless all else goes wrong), then dump him before this could possibly influence Douglas. TE3s are still available in the summer (like Griffin was himself). Schultz + a rookie + any of the 2020 stiffs is fine. If that stiff is Griffin, ok I guess, but he’d have to take a $2MM pay cut. $3MM is way overboard for a TE3.

Njoku keeps talking about how he wants to stay in Cleveland which is so weird to me. Terrible for leverage, crowded, not a great situation his numbers.

Not like he’s from Ohio, born and HS in Cedar Grove NJ which is less than half an hour from the facility. Wonder if he’s got any ties to the area still, I agree he’s a pretty ideal target.

Agree very much agree regarding Griffin. He’s pretty expensive for a third tight end. This class seems pretty deep and I’d think they should have an opportunity to find someone they like in the fourth or fifth round in addition to hopefully someone in the second or third. A vet and two draft picks should go a long way.

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There have been rumours the Jets are shopping the pick, if true it probably tells you something about what they feel about the quality of player that might be there when the pick rolls around on draft night. The only teams that would want to trade into the pick will want a QB, so we're looking at very few contenders for it, crippled even further by the fact this QB draft class is historically bad. 

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Draft is easily 2 rounds deep of elite to very good players in most positions. No reason we couldn’t trade back from that 10 spot and pick up an extra 2nd rounder. We’d have 5 picks then: two #1’s and 3 #2’s.  That’s 5 picks in the top 64 (probably top 50). We could put 5 new starters on the field in 2022. And hopefully JD adds a few premium FA’s and JD focuses on edge, LB, WR, OL, CB, TE, RB, S. I could see 8 to 9 new starters spread out on offense and defense in 2022 that would be new to the Jets. 

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Trade down to say 18 with the saints and pick up a 1st next year. Grab Hamilton at 4 Lloyd/dean at 18, Kinnard at 35, one of the edges like sanders, Johnson, walker, Thomas, hall etc at 38.  End up with a starting safety, lb, rg/rt, and edge. Completely overhaul the D in the first 2 rounds and focus on O the rest of the draft. Ruckert in the 3rd maybe? 

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I want McBride in a bad way, but not within the top 20.  I'd rather see us trade one of our second rounders to move up into the bottom of round 1.

My hope was to grab McBride at 35, but I've seen a couple mocks where he goes late first so I'm not feeling too confident that the TE1 will be available in the second round.   I saw this quote about McBride from a scout in Matt Miller's article from yesterday:

What scouts are saying: “Bar none, the best tight end in the class. Athletic, but also a very good run blocker. Can line up all over the offense for you because he has strength on his frame. No-brainer first-rounder.”

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4 hours ago, derp said:

Njoku keeps talking about how he wants to stay in Cleveland which is so weird to me. Terrible for leverage, crowded, not a great situation his numbers.

Not like he’s from Ohio, born and HS in Cedar Grove NJ which is less than half an hour from the facility. Wonder if he’s got any ties to the area still, I agree he’s a pretty ideal target.

Agree very much agree regarding Griffin. He’s pretty expensive for a third tight end. This class seems pretty deep and I’d think they should have an opportunity to find someone they like in the fourth or fifth round in addition to hopefully someone in the second or third. A vet and two draft picks should go a long way.

I was just reading that myself, even before I posted it.

Hard to know if that means he’s willing to take a major pay cut to stay, or if that’s just because he wants to still be well-regarded after he turns down the Browns’ lowball or non-offer. That could mean well-regarded by fans, by close friends he’s made in his years there, or by close friends on the team. Maybe he met his wife (or fiancee or serious GF) there, and her whole family lives in Cleveland. It’s hardly uncommon to not want to upend one’s family - he does have a daughter - and some go with the flow on that more easily than others. NFL careers are based on perishable skills, and when weighed against the amounts involved and not having a post-NFL career lined up, prudence suggests they be flexible on this during this time, so they can have all life choices that much more open after age 35 (or 40, for some).

What I didn’t realize, until looking it up now, is originally he’s from Cedar Grove, NJ (like 20-30 min from Florham Park; I had to look that up, too, lol). Born there, and lived/played there through HS, before choosing The U. It’s a long time ago, so I don’t know if his parents still live there, but there’s definitely a personal tie to the Jets’ area, too. Quite possible he grew up a Jets fan.

***

Regarding TE3, it’s hard to imagine a roster spot I’m less concerned about.

  • If Griffin can be retained at the vet minimum, with a $1MM cap charge discount ~$250K lower than his actual pay, that’s fine by me. Low ceiling, but in case of injury or slow rookie development, he at least knows what he’s doing.
  • Otherwise? One of our (other, non-Griffin) stiffs from 2021; or even a second rookie - a blocking TE/OL type or a TE/FB hybrid - they pick up as an UDFA; or just some UDFA camp fodder who gets replaced over the summer by an available but nonetheless sleep-inducing veteran like Griffin. In my mind the TE3 can be a pure blocking TE anyway; it could be McDermott, so long as he’s not there also as even the 4th tackle. As a combo OT5/TE3? Yeah, fine.

The only strong opinion I have on the matter is to not pay $3MM in new money to the team’s TE3 — the very player who was the main inspiration for acquiring a new (read: better) TE1 and TE2 in the first place.

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