McShay and Jeremiah both have Jets taking a corner at pick 10

[derp]

15 minutes ago, BurntDice said:

Sean Ellis and Bryan Thomas were both 1st round picks on that team. That makes 3 first round picks on D. 
 

Could the reason they only played 2 lbs be because there were no starting quality guys on the roster besides Mosley? The run D was a sieve because of that. 
 

Im not saying that I don’t want any offense in the first few rounds. Ideally I want to trade back 4, but if we have to stay then take edge at 4 hutch/thibs, if they aren’t there then take Hamilton. Gardener/Lloyd at 10. At 35/38 take edge if one wasn’t taken at 4 if one was then take McBride/ol/wr/kyler Gordon/Muma 

Fine, two guys from many years prior who got extended for reasonable money. Neither was on a rookie deal by the time that happened. Quinnen Williams is the only possible comparable on this roster.

The reason they played 2 LB’s is that nickel is a base defense in the NFL with how often teams go 3 wide. You have to know that was a ridiculous question, right? The team’s depth chart had a nickel.

I think Hamilton would be a horrible mistake, I’ve outlined why I don’t think a corner makes sense at this stage of a rebuild, linebacker is non-premium and shouldn’t be taken at ten, top of the second round is wildly early for Muma.

[BurntDice]

2 minutes ago, Peace Frog said:

Lol the White offense. Hahahaha. 

Now I get it, was right the first time.  

This offense has zero playmakers. 

Moore. Carter. 

Thats it. 

Yeah, let’s build the defense in an offensive driven league.

 

Sigh this is pointless with you 

[Peace Frog]

2 minutes ago, BurntDice said:

Sigh this is pointless with you 

Thank you. We have zero offensive talent. 

Saleh can scheme defense. 

LaFleur can’t scheme around no playmakers. 

We’re not winning anything with just Moore and Carter.  

[BurntDice]

11 minutes ago, derp said:

Fine, two guys from many years prior who got extended for reasonable money. Neither was on a rookie deal by the time that happened. Quinnen Williams is the only possible comparable on this roster.

The reason they played 2 LB’s is that nickel is a base defense in the NFL with how often teams go 3 wide. You have to know that was a ridiculous question, right? The team’s depth chart had a nickel.

I think Hamilton would be a horrible mistake, I’ve outlined why I don’t think a corner makes sense at this stage of a rebuild, linebacker is non-premium and shouldn’t be taken at ten, top of the second round is wildly early for Muma.

There’s also David Harris who was a 2nd round pick on his rookie deal. Rex was notorious for not being able to develop young players. 
 

In general a base 4-3 happens in 25% of snaps. Having weak lbs definitely hurt the run d paired with the bad safeties. 
 

Brugler has Muma at 46 on his big board so it doesn’t seem that early. 

[kdels62]

15 minutes ago, Peace Frog said:

Thank you. We have zero offensive talent. 

Saleh can scheme defense. 

LaFleur can’t scheme around no playmakers. 

We’re not winning anything with just Moore and Carter.  

There’s no offensive talent worth the 4th or 10th pick. The offense performed better than the defense and was above average with Mike White, Joe Flacco and Josh Johnson. The defense was crap every which way. Saleh’s scheming success involved paying Richard Sherman and spending big on Dee Ford/ drafting Nick Bosa. 

[Peace Frog]

9 minutes ago, kdels62 said:

There’s no offensive talent worth the 4th or 10th pick. The offense performed better than the defense and was above average with Mike White, Joe Flacco and Josh Johnson. The defense was crap every which way. Saleh’s scheming success involved paying Richard Sherman and spending big on Dee Ford/ drafting Nick Bosa. 

Hahahahaaaaaa. I see what you did there. We all do. 

Mike White. Hahahahahahaaaaaaa.  

Ha. 

[kdels62]

6 minutes ago, Peace Frog said:

Hahahahaaaaaa. I see what you did there. We all do. 

Mike White. Hahahahahahaaaaaaa.  

Ha. 

Where is the lie? Experienced players looked good in the system. 

[derp]

32 minutes ago, BurntDice said:

There’s also David Harris who was a 2nd round pick on his rookie deal. Rex was notorious for not being able to develop young players. 
 

In general a base 4-3 happens in 25% of snaps. Having weak lbs definitely hurt the run d paired with the bad safeties. 
 

Brugler has Muma at 46 on his big board so it doesn’t seem that early. 

Aware Harris was on the roster. That defense was heavily built via free agency and trade. Harris doesn’t work as well in the current NFL. Three of the four first round picks on the roster were defensive ends with the fourth being the best corner in the league. No issue with edge rushers. And again, there was a flurry of first round picks on offense before that run.

That’s not a high proportion of snaps to have a third linebacker. The two starting safeties got hurt. They’ll obviously need to revamp there this offseason. They can absolutely add a linebacker but Mosley will certainly be back as will Williams. I’d be surprised if they gave up on Sherwood and Nasirildeen and Cashman will be cheap. They can add a guy or two but I don’t think it’ll be as much as folks want. Edge is a much cleaner need/lack of depth position. 

If 46 if the highest you found Muma then I’m pretty comfortable saying that there’s going to be a better player at a position of need at 35/38. I like Muma but he’s a guy you consider in a trade down off one of those second round picks or ideally take in the third.

[BurntDice]

5 minutes ago, derp said:

Aware Harris was on the roster. That defense was heavily built via free agency and trade. Harris doesn’t work as well in the current NFL. Three of the four first round picks on the roster were defensive ends with the fourth being the best corner in the league. No issue with edge rushers. And again, there was a flurry of first round picks on offense before that run.

That’s not a high proportion of snaps to have a third linebacker. The two starting safeties got hurt. They’ll obviously need to revamp there this offseason. They can absolutely add a linebacker but Mosley will certainly be back as will Williams. I’d be surprised if they gave up on Sherwood and Nasirildeen and Cashman will be cheap. They can add a guy or two but I don’t think it’ll be as much as folks want. Edge is a much cleaner need/lack of depth position. 

If 46 if the highest you found Muma then I’m pretty comfortable saying that there’s going to be a better player at a position of need at 35/38. I like Muma but he’s a guy you consider in a trade down off one of those second round picks or ideally take in the third.

46 isn’t the highest I found Muma. Brugler is just my go to guy for media scouts and it’s the first place I looked. 
 

I know that a player like Harris doesn’t work in the current nfl. Linebackers are better in coverage now. 
 

The problem is that there isn’t even a 2nd linebacker unless you want to give the job to Sherwood or Nas. I’d feel a lot more comfortable if those guys battled for the 3rd lb/backup role. Who knows if Mosley will even be on the team after next season with how his contract is. Williams shouldn’t be a starter. 

[BurnleyJet]

22 hours ago, BurntDice said:

The jets didn’t play just zone last year. They were like 35% man coverage 

Not 35% ?

No team ever plays exclusively zone or man for that matter. We are a zone dominant scheme, that’s predicted on pressure. We don’t need a Revis to run it. 

It’s a league built on offence, we need to keep building the line and weapons. Having a shut down Corner won’t win you 10 games. 

[BurntDice]

1 hour ago, BurnleyJet said:

Not 35% ?

No team ever plays exclusively zone or man for that matter. We are a zone dominant scheme, that’s predicted on pressure. We don’t need a Revis to run it. 

It’s a league built on offence, we need to keep building the line and weapons. Having a shut down Corner won’t win you 10 games. 

What and having another high picked guard will? Come on man. The corners were getting roasted last year on a consistent basis. Hall should be a #2 and Echols should be a #4. If you only need below average cbs for this scheme then why did the hawks and 9ers pay Sherman?

[derp]

8 hours ago, BurntDice said:

46 isn’t the highest I found Muma. Brugler is just my go to guy for media scouts and it’s the first place I looked. 
 

I know that a player like Harris doesn’t work in the current nfl. Linebackers are better in coverage now. 
 

The problem is that there isn’t even a 2nd linebacker unless you want to give the job to Sherwood or Nas. I’d feel a lot more comfortable if those guys battled for the 3rd lb/backup role. Who knows if Mosley will even be on the team after next season with how his contract is. Williams shouldn’t be a starter. 

It’s the highest I’ve heard him ranked anywhere, I’m sure he’s higher somewhere and even then if you think that’s a fair ranking it doesn’t make him a good pick at 35/38.

They can upgrade a linebacker slot and try to get a second starter but that’s largely what they have the room to do depth wise. Williams is probably a good fit as the third linebacker and we don’t know how they feel about the progression of Sherwood and Nasirildeen. 

There’s a very real chance they can find that starting caliber player in the third or fourth round if they so choose. Maybe they do a later pick and have a competition. Could also potentially get a really good player at the top of the second, trade down in the second, or even in the first.

Figure this upcoming year is Mosley’s last. If they love a guy they could have him start with Mosley and soak up the way be does things. They can also just bridge till next year and find that guy once Mosley’s gone.

[Claymation]

16 hours ago, Warfish said:

I like Wilson alot, but folks are selling me on London as a guy that could provide a truly vital role for young Zachy, a safe big guy who will catch what's thrown his way and outfight hungry DB's looking for INT's.  Some have said Londn really isn;t that guy, but others say he is, it's an interesting option. 

Wilson I keep hearing get compared to Maclaurin in DC, and I LOVE that guy (best WR no one seems to know exists, stuck on a piss poor QB'd team).

Would love to get them both, lol.

Bucky Brooks and Daniel Jeremiah have made a point about building a WR Corp like a Basketball team, you need a variety of players with different skillsets.

Here is the actual quote from Jeremiah “You need to have a variety of different body types and skill sets to take advantage of mismatches.” 

Jeremiah grades receivers based on size, toughness, production, dependability, release off the line of scrimmage, quickness in and out of breaks, routes, hands, concentration in traffic, play speed, contact strength, run after catch, how does he adjust to the ball, 3rd down value, and effort and finish as a blocker.

When it comes to team building, and creating a complementary receiving corps, keep two things in mind.

1. Most NFL teams carry SIX receivers, and if you don’t start, you need to prove yourself on special teams.

2. While receivers should be as athletic as possible, they do not require peak ability in every area.

Since the offense dictates the plays and the route concepts, a wide receiver can get away with being either quick/elusive, or fast (elite top speed), or outstanding at competing for the ball against tight coverage (contested catches).

Wilson is a better version of Moore, but the Jets have that type of player, what they need is a vertical threat & big bodied receiver. If they don't resign Braxton they will need that shifty, great hands receiver that defenses sleep on.

The Jets have two receivers on their team that is worth a damn: Davis and Moore.

They need a WR that can finish at the catch point. It's not Davis, and Mims is...well...awful.

Garrett Wilson is a run after the catch guy, he has quickness in and out of his breaks, great hands and incredible play speed.

Can't go wrong with either one, London or Wilson.

This draft lacks marque players/prospects, but it is a sneaky good draft where a player like Johnson, Mafe, Sanders and Ebiketie will land in the 2nd and in future people will ask how in hell did they last till the 2nd. This is the type of draft that differentiates a good scouting department from a piss poor one. I'm just grateful Mac is no longer here.

[Greensleeves]

21 hours ago, doitny said:

and dont forget people on here treat Lawson like hes Mark Gastineau. like hes some sort of sack machine that invokes terror in opposing offenses.

Lawson had 5.5 sacks in his last year. and 5 the year before. yeah hes got some potential but we need to be worried about our Edge position. 

He also had the 3rd highest win rate of any edge player two seasons ago. He was also the best player on our entire team, so yeah, he was that king of impact player before he got by all accounts during the pre-season.

 

[doitny]

1 hour ago, Greensleeves said:

He also had the 3rd highest win rate of any edge player two seasons ago. He was also the best player on our entire team, so yeah, he was that king of impact player before he got by all accounts during the pre-season.

 

why did they let the monster go then? 

in 4 years he played in 51 games and started 14.

im not sure where your getting your stats from but here are the top 10 win rates for 2019 and 2020. and Lawson is not on either of them.

NFL pass-blocking, pass-rushing rankings - 2019 PBWR, PRWR leaderboard (espn.com)

2020 NFL pass-rushing, run-stopping, blocking leaderboard - Win rate rankings (espn.com)

they paid Hendrickson 4 yrs for 60 mil when they could have had Lawson for 3 yrs and 45 mil. 

i guess Cincy values guys who can actually get sacks instead of just winning faceoffs.

[Warfish]

17 hours ago, kdels62 said:

There’s no offensive talent worth the 4th or 10th pick.

According to who? 

You're certainly entitled to your opinion, of course, but that view simply isn't shared by the majority of talent evaluators or fans.

Quote

The offense performed better than the defense and was above average with Mike White, Joe Flacco and Josh Johnson.

Well, Mike White, Joe Flacco and Josh Johnson will not be the starting QB of the NY Jets next year.  

So they're not really very relevant, are they?

Quote

The defense was crap every which way. Saleh’s scheming success involved paying Richard Sherman and spending big on Dee Ford/ drafting Nick Bosa. 

Improving from 32nd in Defense to 26th after dumping a few draft picks into it isn't going to move the needle for us.

[Greensleeves]

59 minutes ago, doitny said:

why did they let the monster go then? 

in 4 years he played in 51 games and started 14.

im not sure where your getting your stats from but here are the top 10 win rates for 2019 and 2020. and Lawson is not on either of them.

NFL pass-blocking, pass-rushing rankings - 2019 PBWR, PRWR leaderboard (espn.com)

2020 NFL pass-rushing, run-stopping, blocking leaderboard - Win rate rankings (espn.com)

they paid Hendrickson 4 yrs for 60 mil when they could have had Lawson for 3 yrs and 45 mil. 

i guess Cincy values guys who can actually get sacks instead of just winning faceoffs.

Also younger than the guys ahead of him. Also, Bengals weren't very good so they weren't playing with many leads that year.

Per The Athletic, Lawson’s 32 quarterback hits in 2020 were second in the NFL

[kdels62]

5 minutes ago, Warfish said:

According to who? 

You're certainly entitled to your opinion, of course, but that view simply isn't shared by the majority of talent evaluators or fans.

Well, Mike White, Joe Flacco and Josh Johnson will not be the starting QB of the NY Jets next year.  

So they're not really very relevant, are they?

Improving from 32nd in Defense to 26th after dumping a few draft picks into it isn't going to move the needle for us.

According to me and I’m comfortable saying that. Follow the talent in the draft don’t force it. I do like Wilson and London tho, just not more than I like any combo of Ojabo, Thibs, Karlaftis, Gardner, Lloyd, Dean. 

It’s relevant because it shows that the offensive scheme has potential to grow with slightly better QB play. I like Zach so I think he’ll at least take the step to barely league average. That step should be enough to get the offense to Josh Johnson/ Joe Flacco heights. 

32-26 is a nice jump. But how about 28th to 2nd? That’s the jump Saleh’s defense took when he added Dee Ford, Nick Bosa, Jason Verrett to the team after locking up Sherman long term. 

[BurnleyJet]

11 hours ago, BurntDice said:

What and having another high picked guard will? Come on man. The corners were getting roasted last year on a consistent basis. Hall should be a #2 and Echols should be a #4. If you only need below average cbs for this scheme then why did the hawks and 9ers pay Sherman?

Revis would get burnt with the lack of pass rush. We need edge and make that line stronger.

[BurntDice]

4 minutes ago, BurnleyJet said:

Revis would get burnt with the lack of pass rush. We need edge and make that line stronger.

Lawson is coming back and the sweet spot for edge is late first early second. Can have both 2 new edges and a guy like sauce. Can even do thibs if he falls and kyler Gordon in the second 

[doitny]

2 hours ago, Greensleeves said:

Also younger than the guys ahead of him. Also, Bengals weren't very good so they weren't playing with many leads that year.

Per The Athletic, Lawson’s 32 quarterback hits in 2020 were second in the NFL

ok cool. i guess win rate is different from pressure rate?

looking at this chart shows why they let him go over Hendrickson. he had the #1 sack rate. Lawson was 63rd

not sure how relevant these stats are. look at Vinny Curry for example. he is ranked 8th in pressure to Lawsons 5th and ranked 19 to Lawsons 63 in sacks yet both only had 5 sacks in 2019. 

look i think Lawson has potential, but he has a lot to prove. i think it would be stupid for us to think were fine at Edge because of him. 

plenty of QBs do just fine under pressure. the only time they dont is when there on the ground. Lawson needs to put them there more than 5 times a year or he isnt special.

QW and JFM both had 6 sacks last year and we both know how good our pass rush was.

[bitonti]

On 2/17/2022 at 5:20 PM, Warfish said:

I like Wilson alot, but folks are selling me on London as a guy that could provide a truly vital role for young Zachy, a safe big guy who will catch what's thrown his way and outfight hungry DB's looking for INT's.  Some have said Londn really isn;t that guy, but others say he is, it's an interesting option. 

Wilson I keep hearing get compared to Maclaurin in DC, and I LOVE that guy (best WR no one seems to know exists, stuck on a piss poor QB'd team).

Would love to get them both, lol.

London is rehabbing a broken ankle suffered in Oct 31 game 

and he wasn't going to run well anyways

im not sure his stock is really as high as everyone makes out 

poor man's Mike Evans 

i'd be interested with the later picks but no way this dude is really worth 10 

[Sperm Edwards]

On 2/17/2022 at 9:51 PM, Peace Frog said:

So Moore and Davis warrant drafting defense over surrounding our young QB with talent?

We have different ideas how to make us competitive.  

To be fair, it’s unlikely they’ll head into the draft with just that.

Right now people are counting the upcoming FAs as roster losses, but with no roster gains, heading into the draft. Not trying to single you out because frankly it seems at least 75% of the people here doing that because of some mantra that no one will sign here even with what’s so far looking like a loaded WR FA class (granted it’s still weeks away).

What if they add Allen Robinson (or a WR you like better; I’m just throwing a name out there); particularly if they also re-up Berrios at ~$6MM?

• Robinson
• Moore
• Davis
• Berrios

Do we still need a top 10 round 1 WR? 

[Jdub03]

35 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

To be fair, it’s unlikely they’ll head into the draft with just that.

Right now people are counting the upcoming FAs as roster losses, but with no roster gains, heading into the draft. Not trying to single you out because frankly it seems at least 75% of the people here doing that because of some mantra that no one will sign here even with what’s so far looking like a loaded WR FA class (granted it’s still weeks away).

What if they add Allen Robinson (or a WR you like better; I’m just throwing a name out there); particularly if they also re-up Berrios at ~$6MM?

• Robinson
• Moore
• Davis
• Berrios

Do we still need a top 10 round 1 WR? 

Nope, in this scenario I'd still add a WR, but on day 2. Someone like Christian Watson or Jalen Tolbert.

[WestCoastMole]

29 minutes ago, Jdub03 said:

Nope, in this scenario I'd still add a WR, but on day 2. Someone like Christian Watson or Jalen Tolbert.

That's where there is value in this draft. None of the guys in the Top Tier of Wide Receivers floats my boat no matter what Mel Kiper thinks of them. And none are worth the 10th Pick in the draft.

Use pick 35 for a TE and pick 38 for a WR.

[Peace Frog]

5 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

To be fair, it’s unlikely they’ll head into the draft with just that.

Right now people are counting the upcoming FAs as roster losses, but with no roster gains, heading into the draft. Not trying to single you out because frankly it seems at least 75% of the people here doing that because of some mantra that no one will sign here even with what’s so far looking like a loaded WR FA class (granted it’s still weeks away).

What if they add Allen Robinson (or a WR you like better; I’m just throwing a name out there); particularly if they also re-up Berrios at ~$6MM?

• Robinson
• Moore
• Davis
• Berrios

Do we still need a top 10 round 1 WR? 

That goes both ways. If we address CB and S in FA, we go edge or the OLineman, then yes I STILL want a WR at 10. Want a young guy around for 10 years. London Burks or Wilson. 

I don’t want a DB before round 4. That’s just me. 

I want real LBers before DBs. And lots and lots of TEs. And a RB. 

[derp]

On 2/17/2022 at 5:20 PM, Warfish said:

I like Wilson alot, but folks are selling me on London as a guy that could provide a truly vital role for young Zachy, a safe big guy who will catch what's thrown his way and outfight hungry DB's looking for INT's.  Some have said Londn really isn;t that guy, but others say he is, it's an interesting option. 

Wilson I keep hearing get compared to Maclaurin in DC, and I LOVE that guy (best WR no one seems to know exists, stuck on a piss poor QB'd team).

Would love to get them both, lol.

I see a lot of people with the security blanket option idea for London, which kind of makes sense in theory but is also basically describing a good tight end and the Jets also have to completely overhaul their TE room.

I’d rather they make serious moves at tight end, run a good deal of 12 personnel (like they tried to early in the year) to take advantage of the big security blanket pass catchers, and use the WR need to add explosiveness to an offense that could really use more of a big play element.

[Warfish]

6 minutes ago, derp said:

I see a lot of people with the security blanket option idea for London, which kind of makes sense in theory but is also basically describing a good tight end and the Jets also have to completely overhaul their TE room.

I don't agree.  A good TE is nice to have, but it's not the same as a big reliable strong WR.

6 minutes ago, derp said:

I’d rather they make serious moves at tight end, run a good deal of 12 personnel (like they tried to early in the year) to take advantage of the big security blanket pass catchers, and use the WR need to add explosiveness to an offense that could really use more of a big play element.

I want both.  WR at #10.  TE with one of our 2nds.

[Matt39]

On 2/18/2022 at 10:16 AM, Claymation said:

Bucky Brooks and Daniel Jeremiah have made a point about building a WR Corp like a Basketball team, you need a variety of players with different skillsets.

Here is the actual quote from Jeremiah “You need to have a variety of different body types and skill sets to take advantage of mismatches.” 

Jeremiah grades receivers based on size, toughness, production, dependability, release off the line of scrimmage, quickness in and out of breaks, routes, hands, concentration in traffic, play speed, contact strength, run after catch, how does he adjust to the ball, 3rd down value, and effort and finish as a blocker.

When it comes to team building, and creating a complementary receiving corps, keep two things in mind.

1. Most NFL teams carry SIX receivers, and if you don’t start, you need to prove yourself on special teams.

2. While receivers should be as athletic as possible, they do not require peak ability in every area.

Since the offense dictates the plays and the route concepts, a wide receiver can get away with being either quick/elusive, or fast (elite top speed), or outstanding at competing for the ball against tight coverage (contested catches).

Wilson is a better version of Moore, but the Jets have that type of player, what they need is a vertical threat & big bodied receiver. If they don't resign Braxton they will need that shifty, great hands receiver that defenses sleep on.

The Jets have two receivers on their team that is worth a damn: Davis and Moore.

They need a WR that can finish at the catch point. It's not Davis, and Mims is...well...awful.

Garrett Wilson is a run after the catch guy, he has quickness in and out of his breaks, great hands and incredible play speed.

Can't go wrong with either one, London or Wilson.

This draft lacks marque players/prospects, but it is a sneaky good draft where a player like Johnson, Mafe, Sanders and Ebiketie will land in the 2nd and in future people will ask how in hell did they last till the 2nd. This is the type of draft that differentiates a good scouting department from a piss poor one. I'm just grateful Mac is no longer here.

I thought I saw Wilson has suspect hands. Believe Matt Waldmas has the other receiver from OSU ahead of him fwiw

[derp]

30 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I don't agree.  A good TE is nice to have, but it's not the same as a big reliable strong WR.

I want both.  WR at #10.  TE with one of our 2nds.

I’m saying I just don’t agree with wanting the type of WR you described, not saying tight end versus wide receiver.

You said, and I quote “a safe big guy who will catch what's thrown his way and outfight hungry DB's looking for INT's“. That role is more than effectively filled by quality tight end play.

This offense has been slow forever. A possession style security blanket guy at WR just continues that at least until Davis leaves.

In my eyes it’s effectively a bigger version of Crowder. And last year’s skill group didn’t threaten defenses which led to things being congested in the only area of the field guys were effective - like it’s been for years.

I’d rather they have a serious tight end in that security blanket role and add someone who is more capable of threatening defenses vertically at WR. Tired of defenses not needing to respect the Jets’ ability to beat them downfield.

[Warfish]

44 minutes ago, derp said:

I’m saying I just don’t agree with wanting the type of WR you described, not saying tight end versus wide receiver.

You said, and I quote “a safe big guy who will catch what's thrown his way and outfight hungry DB's looking for INT's“. That role is more than effectively filled by quality tight end play.

We'll just have to agree to disagree on this point.  TE is the trendy thing in the NFL, but few true elite TE's (who CAN fill such a role) actually exist.  

"Quality TE play" as most of you envision it is a dragon you'll be chasing for a looooong time, because we're not getting it any time soon.  

44 minutes ago, derp said:

This offense has been slow forever. A possession style security blanket guy at WR just continues that at least until Davis leaves.

Moore looks to be very speedy where it counts, as (potentially) is Berrios.  

Now, personally I favor Wilson at #10, who is a similar speedy elusive guy like DC's MacLaurin, or Moore himself.

But "big posession WR" is absolutely a vital need for a QB of Zach Wilson's....current limitations.  

44 minutes ago, derp said:

In my eyes it’s effectively a bigger version of Crowder. And last year’s skill group didn’t threaten defenses which led to things being congested in the only area of the field guys were effective - like it’s been for years.

I’d rather they have a serious tight end in that security blanket role and add someone who is more capable of threatening defenses vertically at WR. Tired of defenses not needing to respect the Jets’ ability to beat them downfield.

Sounds like you want the Jets to try and get back Robby Anderson tbqh (referencing the other thread on him).

We'll just agree to disagree on that as well, lol.

[Greensleeves]

7 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

To be fair, it’s unlikely they’ll head into the draft with just that.

Right now people are counting the upcoming FAs as roster losses, but with no roster gains, heading into the draft. Not trying to single you out because frankly it seems at least 75% of the people here doing that because of some mantra that no one will sign here even with what’s so far looking like a loaded WR FA class (granted it’s still weeks away).

What if they add Allen Robinson (or a WR you like better; I’m just throwing a name out there); particularly if they also re-up Berrios at ~$6MM?

• Robinson
• Moore
• Davis
• Berrios

Do we still need a top 10 round 1 WR? 

Yes because WRs always get hurt. We can't continue to go into games down 2 or 3 receivers. I would be OK taking one in the second with a TE too.

[Sperm Edwards]

1 hour ago, Peace Frog said:

That goes both ways. If we address CB and S in FA, we go edge or the OLineman, then yes I STILL want a WR at 10. Want a young guy around for 10 years. London Burks or Wilson. 

I don’t want a DB before round 4. That’s just me. 

I want real LBers before DBs. And lots and lots of TEs. And a RB. 

Outside of first trading Becton for a high pick, even if it’s not as high as his orig one, I still can’t think of a circumstance where I’d get behind taking another OL prospect at #4. If any OL prospect is so worth it, surely a team with an actual tackle need will want to move up to get him under a cheaper contract for 4 years. The Jets need a #2 guard and a backup tackle; #4 overall is way too steep for either a RG or depth role.

Admittedly, DB wouldn’t be my favorite pick at #4 but a $5-10MM FA guard and an omg elite DB prospect at #4 would improve the team more than a $5-10MM FA DB and a very good but not omg elite OT playing at RG (or at T and moving Becton or Fant to RG).

Outside of RG the Jets’ issues in their OL were injuries and adaptation to a new scheme, not a lack of talent at tackle. 

I don’t hate a round 1 LB nearly as much as some do (though at 4…he’d better be no less than an AP1). Mosley isn’t being retained at a non-guaranteed $16MM a year later, and (while I love his attitude and the leadership he brings) many/most of us were justifiably underwhelmed by his first non-missed season here. QW2 is meh. He’s plenty athletic but his instincts seem meh. But also admittedly all I’d have to go on are keyboard warriors’ rankings, since I’m not agonizing over film myself. But this D sucks ass. 

[Sperm Edwards]

1 hour ago, Greensleeves said:

Yes because WRs always get hurt. We can't continue to go into games down 2 or 3 receivers. I would be OK taking one in the second with a TE too.

I wouldn’t be opposed if the plan is to drop Davis after his guaranteed $ is up after this season, but that’d be a reason to draft another WR, not necessarily a round 1 WR, unless he’s an omg WR prospect and so far no one thinks this draft has any (or none that are obvious on draft day, requiring a top 10 pick to snare him).

But other than that? Round 1 - #10 overall in the draft, at that - is for pure starters, not for pure depth. Particularly on a bleh roster that still needs several of the former. 

[Rangers9]

Well in recent years the Jets have drafted two cornerbacks in the first round, Revis and Milliner. One guy made it big and should be HOF. The other guy didn’t make it and is considered a bust. The question is why didn’t Milliner at least make it enough to have a role on an NFL team. Here is an article from AL.com they basically recall all of his many injuries and quote Marty Lyons who thinks the reason he didn’t make it. https://www.al.com/alabamafootball/2017/05/why_was_all-saban_team_pick_de.html