Scathing and sad article in today's star ledger on Manfred and Baseball by Bob Klapisch

[slimjasi]

20 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

I enjoy baseball but if you don't think the sport is in decline you probably have blinders on. 

Watch a Sunday Night Baseball national broadcast on ESPN and pay attention to the ads they run. Half of them are for erectile dysfunction. The audience continues to age and they aren't building new stars in what is increasingly a local game with no national drama or importance. It's not an "event."

Any comparison to the NFL is ludicrous, as is the notion that youth sports participation has any correlation whatsoever with popularity as a spectator sport.

Age is a big factor.

 

As of 2017, the average age of MLB’s audience was 57. Compare that to the other major sports. 
 

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/the-sports-with-the-oldest-and-youngest-tv-audiences-2017-06-30

[UntouchableCrew]

14 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

Age is a big factor.

 

As of 2017, the average age of MLB’s audience was 57. Compare that to the other major sports. 
 

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/the-sports-with-the-oldest-and-youngest-tv-audiences-2017-06-30

The change in the NHL numbers are fairly shocking.

[Larz]

Matt Barnes is from my hometown. Cool guy. Really down to earth. 
 

that’s it. That’s all I got for MLB ?

[Anthony Jet]

22 hours ago, RoadFan said:

MLS started with 10 teams in ‘96, and the league was totally broke for years.  Now they have like 30 teams and cities fighting over expansion franchises.

There are now matches regularly televised from around the world; Premier League, Bundesliga, La Liga, Champions League.

When I was a kid in the 80s and 90s you could watch some matches on the one Spanish channel, and every 4 years during the World Cup.  That’s it.

So yeah, I would call that growth…
 

Yeah, your right. I’m on my way to the pub right now to watch the match

[RoadFan]

2 hours ago, Anthony Jet said:

Yeah, your right. I’m on my way to the pub right now to watch the match

You’re sure as hell not watching baseball this Spring.  

Might have to try some melatonin to help you sleep instead…

[Jetsfan80]

On 3/3/2022 at 12:27 PM, CSNY said:

Totally disagree. You are a Major League Baseball played you should be able to hit the ball against the shift. Change the mindset of having to hit a 500 foot 5 run homer every dam at bat.
when you go out there with the mindset of swinging from your heels you strike out more often than not which is a predetermined fate 
Hit the ball run hard to first cause you never know if there will be an error and walla your on base instead of carrying your bat to the dugout 

One of the big reasons players stopped hitting the ball on the ground is infield defense has gotten so good.  You can’t legislate to account for that.

It’s easy to say “hey ya never know, might get an E6”.  Then you look at the #’s and realize those just don’t happen that often in todays game.  

Perhaps it’s pitchers who need to adjust, too.  Throwing more pitches higher in the zone to induce easier fly outs has to be part of the strategy.

[CSNY]

4 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

One of the big reasons players stopped hitting the ball on the ground is infield defense has gotten so good.  You can’t legislate to account for that.

It’s easy to say “hey ya never know, might get an E6”.  Then you look at the #’s and realize those just don’t happen that often in todays game.  

Perhaps it’s pitchers who need to adjust, too.  Throwing more pitches higher in the zone to induce easier fly outs has to be part of the strategy.

Come on now Jet. Pitchers always change pitch locations. The tried and true way of pitching is “ up and in down and away”changing speeds, different arm angles etc.etc Also the umpires have also squeezed the zone as it used to be “ from the letters to the knees”. Don’t recall seeing too many letter high strikes in today’s game. 
My opinion is this, The year baseball canceled the World Series people stayed away from the game in droves and only when Sosa and MaGuire started their chase of Roger Maris’s  season home run record did the interest come back. More and more players took note of this and started with the PEDs Fans started packing the stadiums to see homers being hit by roided up behemoth’s ( hell one year Brady Anderson hit 50 ) Players then started getting record amounts of money in their contracts and everything was fine Players were getting paid Owners we’re making stoopid cash , everyone was happy. Then it became public that it was all done artificially and interest waned once again, but baseball players saw that homers are the easiest way to garner a generational wealth contract Owners also took note and started holding cities that had MLB teams hostage to build new stadiums which are “ band boxes” that are more conducive for the long ball and here we are. Everyone wants to hit homers instead of playing winning baseball. Bunting, stealing, hit and runs are all going the way of the dodo bird and making the game much less enjoyable to watch. I get the adage of singles hitters driving Chevy’s home run hitters drive Caddy’s but the “ homer happyness “ is ruining the game. 
Now get off my lawn?

[Bay Ridge Jet]

A major issue for MLB is the lack of promotion and ability to mainstream their star players. I coach youth and high school basketball and the NBA has done an amazing job marketing their best players. A lot of kids don’t even root for a team anymore. They root for their favorite player. Instead of a Knicks fan they are Durant, Harden, Giannis etc. fans. Baseball’s best player is on a bad team who plays his games at 10:30 east coast time.  It’s made the sport from a national one to a regional one. 

[JustInFudge]

On 3/3/2022 at 1:49 PM, Warfish said:

Just curious, do any of you "Baseball is boring" guys watch Golf?

I love both, but Golf gets a bad wrap from a viewing standpoint.  For the most part, unless your watching a final group, its highlight watching.  You don’t follow a golfers every step and shot, they go from shot to shot to shot and it’s never stops. 

[Matt39]

9 hours ago, RoadFan said:

You’re sure as hell not watching baseball this Spring.  

Might have to try some melatonin to help you sleep instead…

I’ve tried with soccer. It’s boring as all hell though to me.

[JustInFudge]

I think Chris Rock hit the nail on the head a few years ago about his rant on Baseball and I’m sure that will trigger many so I won’t post the video or say more.  Lol

[RoadFan]

31 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

I’ve tried with soccer. It’s boring as all hell though to me.

I understand that.  Some games are boring, others are fabulous.   
 

The way the game flows is most similar to hockey, albeit at a significantly slower pace with no line changes.  Moving the puck around the perimeter and blue line, trying to create space for a scoring chance.   A rapid counter attack similar to a 3 on 2.

Occasionally when I point that out, somebody sees the game a little differently as opposed to “nothing happening.”

Like hockey, when a team is down a goal late or has to win in the midst of a tie game… they push forward and press furiously for an “equalizer” or winner.  That is when soccer can be really fun, especially when they get it.  Or the other team ices it with a counter attack.

 

[CSNY]

1 hour ago, Matt39 said:

I’ve tried with soccer. It’s boring as all hell though to me.

Soccer is pretty boring but I do enjoy the World Cup. Not for the games so much but all the fans from different countries and how they really really get into it just makes it a great environment for a sporting event 

[Snell41]

Baseball is dying at the little league level imo. I grew up playing baseball and it was fun. My son started at 5, and immediately is bombarded with swing exercises, batting cages, hit off the tee, everything was designed around the technicalities of how to be great at baseball vs how to have fun playing baseball. When I was 5 there literally was no baseball for kids my age. I didn’t even start until 8, and it was a silly ragtag bunch of kids having fun, not all trying to be the next superstar. It’s draining these days and it takes place in all sports, but I find it’s especially prominent in baseball


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

[GreenReaper]

As a Yankees fan...I used to watch BB games a long time ago.  But got disgusted when the home run record... the crown jewel of the sport...was debased by PED performers.  Where several players all of a sudden were breaking the all time season record.   Hitting like over 62+ to 70+ homers in a season for several years.  There was one player from the Cubs that broke Roger Maris 61 homer record three years in a row with homer totals in the 60s.  Yet didn't win a single home run crown...because other players were out homering him and reaching like 70+.  It was ridiculous.

It took over 30 years before Roger Maris came along in 1961 to break Babe Ruth's 60 homer season.  And even longer before the PED players broke the 61 homer total.    

They were making a mockery of the game with PED jacked up stats.  And the owners knew it and allowed it.  They just counted the money they were hauling in.  

When the scandal broke...it was then...I stopped spending my money and watching BB games.  IMO those records should've been thrown out of the record books.   That goes for PED pitchers too...like Roger Clemens.       

 

[TheMo]

On 3/3/2022 at 12:47 PM, Jet Nut said:

Yes, the 25 year olds are twins

I am his 34 year old son. Don't let him deny it. He'll claim I'm Indian but I'm really just an Italian with an excellent year round tan. When @Mogglez gets real outta line I still give him noogies. 

[Bugg]

Was a time I did not miss a Yankees game. Now, haven't watched an inning in at least 5 years.

It's too slow. Everything else in life sped up,and MLB instead did nothing as the games went on for-f___in'-ever. 

Nothing happens. Ball may be in play for barely 5 minutes over 3-4 hours. Now there is drama between the pitcher and the batter, but not when there's what seems like an eternity between pitches. 

Was a time thought people who said soccer would take over. It's not crazy any more. If EPL ever figured out how to either incorporate  MLS teams as part of their league or simply opened up or moved teams here, look out. It is in fact a more entertaining game evena way for the ball. 

Again I do not watch. But the season is too long. Owners seem cool with losing April games, But they really have April to themselves since the NBA and NHL playoffs aren't yet in full swing.  Reality is with expanded playoffs, there's no point to September since there is no pennant race. And further once college football and then the NFL start, nobody is watching MLB. Marketing wise, that's a huge mistake. 

 

[Bugg]

18 hours ago, UntouchableCrew said:

The change in the NHL numbers are fairly shocking.

I am an "older demo". But pretty much reduced the the Jets and the NFL and the Rangers and the NHL. MLB used to say not much happens in football, but it's an 11 on 11 gang fight/chess game every play. Hockey shares that with the NFL, crossed with soccer. 

Readily will watch a good game like the Stars/Jets last night go to OT, which could never imagine doing  that with 2  teams I don't care about in  MLB even when I cared about the Yankees. 

[Jet Nut]

32 minutes ago, TheMo said:

I am his 34 year old son. Don't let him deny it. He'll claim I'm Indian but I'm really just an Italian with an excellent year round tan. When @Mogglez gets real outta line I still give him noogies. 

Don’t make me older than I am!  
I’ve been asked if I was Indian also.  Tans seem to confuse people

[Jetsfan80]

16 hours ago, RoadFan said:

I understand that.  Some games are boring, others are fabulous.   
 

The way the game flows is most similar to hockey, albeit at a significantly slower pace with no line changes.  Moving the puck around the perimeter and blue line, trying to create space for a scoring chance.   A rapid counter attack similar to a 3 on 2.

Occasionally when I point that out, somebody sees the game a little differently as opposed to “nothing happening.”

Like hockey, when a team is down a goal late or has to win in the midst of a tie game… they push forward and press furiously for an “equalizer” or winner.  That is when soccer can be really fun, especially when they get it.  Or the other team ices it with a counter attack.

 

And at least a soccer match doesn’t take 4 hours.

[Jimmy 2 Times]

imo, they either need to lower the number of playoff teams or shorten the regular season.  Since neither will happen they need to lower the number of off days.  Every team plays Friday through Wednesday and Thursday is the make up day.  Force double headers to make up rain outs.   

 

Baseball is a game of attrition.  

162 game season whittled out the lesser teams and the fluke games and the best team rose to the occasion and won the pennant.  

Now all it takes is to barely make it in and have a couple monster starters to win it all.  It makes the 162 games they played practically meaningless.  

[section314]

8 minutes ago, Jimmy 2 Times said:

imo, they either need to lower the number of playoff teams or shorten the regular season.  Since neither will happen they need to lower the number of off days.  Every team plays Friday through Wednesday and Thursday is the make up day.  Force double headers to make up rain outs.   

 

Baseball is a game of attrition.  

162 game season whittled out the lesser teams and the fluke games and the best team rose to the occasion and won the pennant.  

Now all it takes is to barely make it in and have a couple monster starters to win it all.  It makes the 162 games they played practically meaningless.  

MLB has turned itself into tee ball....everyone gets a trophy. Look no further than last year. Boston eliminated Tampa after finishing 9 games behind them during the season. They should go to 3 5 team divisions in each league, with only one wildcard. And that wildcard can't play the division winner from their division until the LCS. First rd is best of 5, with said WC only getting 1 home game. LCS, best of 7, WC gets one home game. Have to make regular season mean something. 

[Anthony Jet]

162 games. Cream rises to the top. No need for all these playoff teams 

[Anthony Jet]

On 3/4/2022 at 10:34 AM, Warfish said:

Agreed.  People who don't see the growth in interest in US Based soccer just aren't looking at the big picture.

Folks gotta stop using "themselves and their five friends" as if that represented the who pool of American sports fans, lol.

On the other hand, does it really matter if the sport is growing in places that have no relevance to someone’s life? 
 

Not disagreeing with the “growth” of soccer, but my comment about hearing about this growth for the passed 25 years still stands. I don’t know enough of the country wide numbers to say it’s not, but in my daily life in this totally connected age soccers footprint has not really changed. If I’m being completely unbiased, yes they have added maybe 3 fields I can think of. But those fields haven’t  translated into a influx of young American kids playing soccer. Any time I pass those fields I see adults who are from the countries that soccer reigns supreme playing, or flag football leagues. 
Then with this 24/7 access to news, rarely do I ever see an American Soccer story outside international competition. 
 

Again I’m not saying it’s not growing, as I don’t know one way or another, but in my “five friend straw poll” it’s not, and honestly that’s all that matters as my kids won’t be young forever 

[Jetsfan80]

1 hour ago, Anthony Jet said:

162 games. Cream rises to the top. No need for all these playoff teams 

Exactly.  If they want more playoff teams/games, then shorten the regular season.

[Larz]

It’s actually a shame I don’t like baseball. 162 freaking games a year. Must be something to really love your teams shortstop or whatever and get to see him like 4 times a week 

[Warfish]

9 hours ago, Anthony Jet said:

On the other hand, does it really matter if the sport is growing in places that have no relevance to someone’s life? 

If a tree falls in the woods, and you're not there to hear it, or don't care about hearing it anyway...the tree still fell.

9 hours ago, Anthony Jet said:

Not disagreeing with the “growth” of soccer, but my comment about hearing about this growth for the passed 25 years still stands. I don’t know enough of the country wide numbers to say it’s not, but in my daily life in this totally connected age soccers footprint has not really changed. If I’m being completely unbiased, yes they have added maybe 3 fields I can think of. But those fields haven’t  translated into a influx of young American kids playing soccer. Any time I pass those fields I see adults who are from the countries that soccer reigns supreme playing, or flag football leagues. 
Then with this 24/7 access to news, rarely do I ever see an American Soccer story outside international competition. 

Again I’m not saying it’s not growing, as I don’t know one way or another, but in my “five friend straw poll” it’s not, and honestly that’s all that matters as my kids won’t be young forever 

There are objective measures for things like this. 

I'm not a soccer fan, so I don't really care either way tbqh.  

[Anthony Jet]

5 minutes ago, Warfish said:

If a tree falls in the woods, and you're not there to hear it, or don't care about hearing it anyway...the tree still fell.

What good is a sound if no one heard it 

[Anthony Jet]

11 hours ago, Warfish said:

 

There are objective measures for things like this. 

 

I can get a good look at a T-bone by sticking my head up a bulls ass but I’d rather take the butchers word for it 

[Warfish]

1 hour ago, Anthony Jet said:

What good is a sound if no one heard it 

[Charlie Brown]

For me when you had teams openly cheating on their way tothe World Series and “winning “ it that essentially did it for me ….especially when that cheating hurt the Yankees and I’m a Mets fan!