Report: Jets working to bring back Joe Flacco

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

Just now, Warfish said:

Yes, I have a strong opinion on the well known quantity of Joe Flacco specifically.

No, I do not have a strong opinion on the perhaps hundreds of other QB's that would also be available as a potential #2 QB.

I'm sorry if you can't understand that.  Maybe I gave you too much credit earlier.

I'm sorry that you can't understand that I can understand.

[SomebodytoAnybody47]

2 hours ago, Warfish said:

The very definition of managing for mediocrity.

Flacco, like McCown before him, brings nothing of value to this franchise as a player.  

He's a glorified "here, let me hold your dick for you" assistant for Wilson, not a QB.

We can and should do better.  Someone young, hungry, with upside and a future as at least a great #2 QB.

Nothing will be worse than having to watch Flacco play 2-3 games next year (or more) if/when Wilson goes down to injury again.

If Wilson has to have his veteran QB security blanket, hire him as a Coach.  Not as the #2 QB.

Wait, so who would you want to bring in here that provides this that is currently available? 

[Warfish]

10 minutes ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

I'm sorry that you can't understand that I can understand.

So just to be clear, the only scenario you would accept for their being a better option than Flacco is if I, Warfish, name that player. 

Is that right?

[FidelioJet]

6 minutes ago, Warfish said:

A false argument, because the Jets have regularly NOT spent their available resources.  

I'd argue that spending the resources (what we plan to pay Flacco plus unspent resources we will ultimately not spend at all) would be better than sticking with Flacco.

I certainly agree that they haven't been spending the full cap, but I don't agree they didn't spend it to protect Wilson.  They didn't spend it because they were in the midst of a tear down.  I expect that to change this year.  I would be heavily disappointed in the Jets don't spend to the full/near full of the cap this year.

 

9 minutes ago, Warfish said:

So if the Jets do not spend to the cap, and we have resources left on the table unspent, you would then agree that is a failure of JD's part, and money that COULD in fact have been used to acquire a superior backup QB with greater potential/future/upside/abillity?

Yes. Surely. Moreover, based on Wilson's performance last year - I would have NO concern whatsoever if he had to truly earn the job this off-season.  Let him, White and Flacco battle out - equal snaps early in camp etc.  

10 minutes ago, Warfish said:

That is certainly what I'd expect you, perhaps our biggest resident Wilson white-knight, to think.

Guess we'll see.  If we win a bunch of games, and Wilson plays all 17, and vastly improves his production over year 1, you (and the Jets) will be proven right.  I'll eat that Crow, happily.  

If he gets hurt and misses time or plays poorly, and Flacco continues his 0-5 Jets Backup trend to-date, then I guess we'll know I was right.  Not that I would expect you to admit that, of course, lol.

I think ultimately if Wilson doesn't show real, tangible progress this year we will know you were right about Wilson.  
Still not sure that changes the choice to spend big on a back-up that isn't likely to help the team do anything more than a quality FA WR or G or TE is likely to do.  

Point is, I believe bettering the overall starting roster will give the team a better chance to win than spending big on a back up QB that will only play if Wilson fails or gets injured 

[Bronx]

19 minutes ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

If you like mediocrity, more power to you.

I guess perception is reality in your corporate minded world. 

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

6 minutes ago, Bronx said:

I guess perception is reality in your corporate minded world. 

That comment lives rent free in your head. Must have really hit a nerve. Let it go. 

[RichardTodd27]

Jets fans should be sick to their stomach with this news.

Much better (and younger) options out there with higher upside (Minshew, Trubisky, Marriota.......).

The status quo at 2nd string QB is unacceptable. (And would be almost as bad as the Jets drafting another safety at pick #4 overall).

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

10 minutes ago, Warfish said:

So just to be clear, the only scenario you would accept for their being a better option than Flacco is if I, Warfish, name that player. 

Is that right?

We are not clear on that at all. 

[Flightattendant]

2 hours ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

JD botched 2021, no doubt. Flacco backing up Darnold in 2020 was an acceptable move. Bringing back Flacco in 2022 would be an acceptable move. This is an overreaction. 

Yeah I see it this way too. He'll come cheap and he's familiar with the team. One thing that no one wants to talk about is how management is admitting their mistakes and not making them twice. 

[Flightattendant]

3 minutes ago, RichardTodd27 said:

Jets fans should be sick to their stomach with this news.

Much better (and younger) options out there with higher upside (Minshew, Trubisky, Marriota.......).

The status quo at 2nd string QB is unacceptable. (And would be almost as bad as the Jets drafting another safety at pick #4 overall).

We're not looking for upside. We're looking for knowledge.

[munchmemory]

[UntouchableCrew]

Can't understand the fascination with Flacco this admin has.

Walking into last season with zero career starts and then trading for Flacco is Douglas' least defensible move.

[Bronx]

5 minutes ago, Flightattendant said:

We're not looking for upside. We're looking for knowledge.

Saleh needs all the help he can get. 

Sooner or later, the waterboy's minimum qualification is going to be at least coaching of some kind.

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

Did it occur to anyone that you can sign Joe Flacco to be the primary back-up and STILL sign or draft a wildcard young buck as a side project?

 

[Warfish]

Just now, FidelioJet said:

I would be heavily disappointed in the Jets don't spend to the full/near full of the cap this year.

We agree.

Just now, FidelioJet said:

I would have NO concern whatsoever if he had to truly earn the job this off-season.  Let him, White and Flacco battle out - equal snaps early in camp etc.

Lol, White and Flacco.  Oh lols.

Just now, FidelioJet said:

I think ultimately if Wilson doesn't show real, tangible progress this year we will know you were right about Wilson.

We agree....but I bet we don't agree on the metric of what "tangible progress" means, lol.

Just now, FidelioJet said:

 Still not sure that changes the choice to spend big on a back-up that isn't likely to help the team do anything more than a quality FA WR or G or TE is likely to do.

I don't necc. want them to "spend big", I'm not asking for a 2nd round pick or buying Trubisky away from the Commanders on th eopen market per se.

I'll give an example of my type of thinking: 

I'd rather have a young middle-round type prospect like Kyle Trask as our backup QB than a known-loser like Joe Flacco. 

Is Track an amazing, stellar, super-star in waiting?  Nope.  Almost assuredly not.  He's probably a JAG.

But he's a JAG that might have a future, low odds tho it may be.  Flacco is not, he's an 0-5 backup here with no future and no upside and no purpose.

Just now, FidelioJet said:

Point is, I believe bettering the overall starting roster will give the team a better chance to win than spending big on a back up QB that will only play if Wilson fails or gets injured 

I believe we can do both, materially improve our roster and our #2 QB.  

[Warfish]

23 minutes ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

We are not clear on that at all. 

You should probably re-read your posts then.

EDIT:  Actually, don't.  I don't think we're gonna make any progress, better to just agree to disagree I think.

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

14 minutes ago, Warfish said:

You should probably re-read your posts then.

EDIT:  Actually, don't.  I don't think we're gonna make any progress, better to just agree to disagree I think.

You should probably re-read my posts if that is what you took from them.

I agree that this isn't going anywhere and part of that is you not understanding my position. I understood yours. 

[Warfish]

5 minutes ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

You should probably....

Nope, we're good.  Thanks.

[Barton]

Flacco is a SB winning QB who can still sling it. Zach learned alot just watching him play IMO. Seeing the speed at which Flacco plays, not getting flustered, how to stand in the pocket. Flacco should have been the guy starting week 1 last year.

[David Harris]

Why does anyone care this much?  Zach's our QB, Flacco is a quality experienced backup familiar with the offense.  Good enough.

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

2 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Nope, we're good.  Thanks.

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

2 minutes ago, David Harris said:

Why does anyone care this much?  Zach's our QB, Flacco is a quality experienced backup familiar with the offense.  Good enough.

SOJFs need to complain about something. We have a highly drafted QB with a high ceiling and they choose to focus on the back-up QB situation. 

[Warfish]

10 minutes ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

SOJFs need to complain about something.

We have a highly drafted QB with a high ceiling and they choose to focus on the back-up QB situation. 

The thread is about the possible signing of a backup quarterback. 

Should we not be talking about the topic of the thread here?

Also, were you 100% happy with the performance of our highly drafted QB with a high ceiling in 2021?

Do you have any concerns or complaints with Zach Wilson going into 2022?

 

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

3 minutes ago, Warfish said:

The thread is about the possible signing of a backup quarterback. 

Should we not be talking about the topic of the thread here?

Also, were you 100% happy with the performance of our highly drafted QB with a high ceiling in 2021?

Do you have any concerns or complaints with Zach Wilson going into 2022?

 

This thread is about the Jets bringing back Joe Flacco, and people complaining about bringing back a guy who is familiar with the system.

Do I give you the impression that I am 100% happy with the performance of our highly drafted QB with a high ceiling in 2021?

Did I give you the impression that I don't have concerns or complaints about Zach Wilson going into 2022?

[ZachEY]

2 hours ago, Zachtomims47 said:

Now help me understand what Dalton and Foles did for the Bears and Fields that we missed out on? 

I don't suppose I can help someone understand something that they don't actually want to, but perhaps it allowed them to bring Fields in when he was ready?

This team has been out of the playoffs for over a decade, but if you're still willing to sacrifice entire seasons hoping that the worst QB in the NFL gets it, with no contingency plan whatsoever, that's not a strategy I support.

[ZachEY]

3 hours ago, sec101row23 said:

Ultimately if Zach doesn’t take a major step forward this year the Jets will have to seriously consider bringing in some legit competition for him in 2023.   You can’t allow this roster to flounder and not develop because the QB isn’t getting it done.   This coaching staff needs to step up as well, the excuses from last year won’t fly this year.  Time to start winning some games, plain and simple.  

On the contrary, if Zach doesn't take a major step forward this year, the Jets will have to replace him.

There is absolutely no reason to give him a 3rd year if he's a bottom 1/3rd QB next year.  I've been on board with the rebuild, but this year, as @Warfish keeps pointing out, you have to win games.  We have plenty of cap, we have 4 high picks - it's not a playoff mandate by any means, this team has a ways to go, but it should be a competitive mandate.  There's no reason, besides Zach Wilson, that Zach Wilson can't be a capable QB and make the Jets competitive this year.

[ZachEY]

2 hours ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

The type of QB who needs to be pushed by his back-up is not going to be a good QB. Remember how Aarron Rodgers was looking over his shoulder at Tim Boyle or Matt Flynn when he was a young QB? Pat Mahomes was really frightened that Chad Henne was going to take his job. The Bengals have Brandon Allen to really motivate Joe Burrow into being the best QB that he can.

You keep ignoring the fact that these other players you mentioned didn't come in and absolutely suck.

I don't want Zach Wilson to do better because of competition.  I want competition to beat out Zach Wilson if Zach Wilson continues to suck.

[ZachEY]

2 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

As for your third option -This is not about "protecting" Wilson from some made up Boogie man - I don't know a single person looking to protect Wilson from everything.  The idea that they're not bringing in competition for Wilson because they're protection him from criticism, competition, expectations is just silly.   Just a fallacy made up by people that have been against him since before he was drafted.  The reality is they're not signing a better back up because those cap resources can be better used elsewhere.

Except, it's really not.  As, it's the exact same failed playbook from Sanchez and Darnold.

[Warfish]

19 minutes ago, TheNuuFaaolaExperience said:

This thread is about the Jets bringing back Joe Flacco, and people complaining about bringing back a guy who is familiar with the system.

Is that different than saying "The thread is about the possible signing of a backup quarterback. "

You seem to have an issue with that, saying we're "focusing on the backup" in a thread.....about the backup.

Quote

Do I give you the impression that I am 100% happy with the performance of our highly drafted QB with a high ceiling in 2021?

Did I give you the impression that I don't have concerns or complaints about Zach Wilson going into 2022?

I honestly don't know, hence why I asked.

Especially after your "SOJFs need to complain about something." comment.

I think it's fair to ask in response if you're a SOJF too (i.e. you do have some complaints/concerns about Zach or Flacco) or if you're not (you are 100% happy with Wilson and with Flacco).

 

 

 

[Beerfish]

Flacco is awful

Shows no mobility, you have to totally change your offensive game plan if he is playing

If the starter gets hurt it is season over.

Mike White would be a better back up but a good 20 other guys would be better back ups than Flacco.

[TheNuuFaaolaExperience]

9 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Is that different than saying "The thread is about the possible signing of a backup quarterback. "

You seem to have an issue with that, saying we're "focusing on the backup" in a thread.....about the backup.

I honestly don't know, hence why I asked.

Especially after your "SOJFs need to complain about something." comment.

I think it's fair to ask in response if you're a SOJF too (i.e. you do have some complaints/concerns about Zach or Flacco) or if you're not (you are 100% happy with Wilson and with Flacco).

 

 

 

We already agreed to disagree. This conversation is going in three directions and none of them have a destination.

[FidelioJet]

19 minutes ago, ZachEY said:

Except, it's really not.  As, it's the exact same failed playbook from Sanchez and Darnold.

So your thought process here is if the Jets would have spent big money on a back-up QB for Sanchez or Darnold (i.e. Ryan Fitzpatrick) they would have won a Super Bowl?

And that they didn't bring in said back-up QB because they didn't want to hurt the feelings of their QB?

The reality is, the teams are all-in on these QB's and make a decision to try and do their best to build the best team around this QB as possible - and not use big cap dollars to back him up, when understanding spending big money on an already known to be back-up level QB - for the purpose of maybe winning a game or two more - is just poor use of assets.  

It's just silly....

[Jet Nut]

4 hours ago, T0mShane said:

1. Nice to the baby coaches

2. Poses no threat to the baby QB. 

I thought that was what the great Mike White was for

Guess he can’t mentor

[Green Ghost]

2 hours ago, Warfish said:

It's not an either or situation. 

You can develop Zach (which we SHOULD continue to try to do, my doubts notwithstanding) AND have another, lower-cost prospect behind him hungry for his job.

Joe Flacco brings nothing to the table.  He can't win games.  He isn't a coach.  He's just there to cash checks and make our kiddie coaching staff and Wilson feel better because there's an actual adult in the room.

FFS this fanbase really does get what it deserves.....

Normally I’d be completely with you on this, but not with this team, this coming season.

I think we’re going to be awful again. I see another 0-6 division record, and 4-5 wins. Again. I don’t really care about a backup who might get us that elusive 5th win.

i have no confidence in Wilson making a move to the top 15-20 QBs due to both his lack of talent, and the lack of it around him. I think it’s best the Jets (and the fans) watch this QB and see for themselves who he is.

As for the backup? Even if he came in a few games and outplayed Wilson, what would change? Wilson would come right back and do what he did last year.

So if we can’t win with our starter, and they’re content handing the job to him, who cares who the backup is?

We have to let them watch it burn.

[ZachEY]

Just now, FidelioJet said:

So your thought process here is if the Jets would have spent big money on a back-up QB for Sanchez or Darnold (i.e. Ryan Fitzpatrick) they would have won a Super Bowl?

And that they didn't bring in a quality back-up QB because they didn't want to hurt the feelings of their QB.

The reality is, the teams are all-in on these QB's and make a decision to try and do their best to build the best team around this QB as possible - and not use big cap dollars to back him up, when understanding spending big money on an already known to be back-up level QB - for the purpose of maybe winning a game or two more - in case he gets hurt or fails.  

It's just silly....

Not really - I don't recall saying anything about the Super Bowl, although, I suspect if we're being honest, a league average QB may have given us a real shot in 2009 or 2010.  Not so during the Darnold years.

As has been pointed out, ad-naseum, we haven't been spending every last dollar, so there was always money available to do just that.

We all agree on the reality.  This message board is about analysis and opinions.  No one is denying the Jets are going all-in on Zach Wilson.  What some people are saying is that, maybe, just maybe, that isn't a good idea.  We have 4 high draft picks and no one is clamoring for a QB with any of them.  We can absolutely build a football team and bring in weapons and protection and have a QB who isn't just here to collect his NFL version of social security, all at the same time.