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I love Michael Carter (RB) but I'm taking Breece Hall if there at 38.


JetBlue
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7 hours ago, JetBlue said:

Hell, I might even consider him at 35, and that is with a very deep running back class.  That is just how good I think he can be.  Give Wilson a true franchise back with Carter as the change of pace back, and this offense will be light years better and Wilson will have a lot of the pressure taken off him.   Draft a WR (Garrett Wilson) at 10 or trade down and take Olave/Williams and a developmental receiver (Justyn Ross/Kyle Phillips) and TE (Jelani Woods/Cole Turner/Charlie Kolar) in the middle rounds and this offense will be special.   CJ, Conklin at TE with Hall/Carter in the backfield.   Moore, Wilson and Davis with Berrios (ST).   I would also have no issue with taking another offensive lineman (Cole Strange or Cade Maye) later.  

I know the odds of this happening are slim and as I mentioned this is a fairly deep running back class so we should end up with a decent player at running back, I just see a chance to add a special talent at the position and make our offense truly dynamic.   It won't happen but  I can dream can't I?  

Pick #35 is a very valuable pick.  My feeling is you don't use it on an easily replaceable position.  

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It's not my preference, far far from it.  This team is so barren of talent everywhere that taking a RB that high makes very little sense.  Especially since this is a system known to make nobodies into studs.  Hell, when this line was cooking last year, Perine stepped in and played great.  RB is not a priority, far from it.  They brought back Coleman and Carter is a dude, for real.

Take a guy like Dameon Pierce in the 5th and the Jets will have a ridiculous 1-2 punch that will wear teams down.

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1 hour ago, kdels62 said:

This is a bad idea.

I think the scheme makes this take very reasonable. Think the idea ends up appealing because running back is such a weird position where teams can find guys they build their offense around in the second round and the hit rate is pretty good overall.

Feel like going in the first round at RB is so hype based and if you can get an solid prospect who just doesn’t have whatever it takes to tick him up into that first day then it’s interesting. If Hall specifically slips to the second round someone’s getting a very good prospect.

I also think WR is getting pushed up boards because of the recent success guys have had and RB has been pushed down for a while. The RB change makes sense but this class may make the way teams look at WR’s correct a little. If my team is running a different scheme and needs offensive skill talent I’d rather add a RB than a WR in this particular class.

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2 hours ago, JiFapono said:

It's not my preference, far far from it.  This team is so barren of talent everywhere that taking a RB that high makes very little sense.  Especially since this is a system known to make nobodies into studs.  Hell, when this line was cooking last year, Perine stepped in and played great.  RB is not a priority, far from it.  They brought back Coleman and Carter is a dude, for real.

Take a guy like Dameon Pierce in the 5th and the Jets will have a ridiculous 1-2 punch that will wear teams down.

 

2 hours ago, kdels62 said:

This is a bad idea.

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13 hours ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Pick #35 is a very valuable pick.  My feeling is you don't use it on an easily replaceable position.  

And you would not be wrong necessarily but I think this guys is really a special talent that can make our offense truly explosive and take a great deal of pressure off of Zack.  I don't see any other back in this draft capable of doing that but I could be wrong.  There are some very good running backs so if we wait until 3rd, 4th or 5th rounds I would not  be upset.   I just think Breece Hall is the best running back to come out since James Taylor. 

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21 hours ago, JetBlue said:

Hell, I might even consider him at 35, and that is with a very deep running back class.  That is just how good I think he can be.  Give Wilson a true franchise back with Carter as the change of pace back, and this offense will be light years better and Wilson will have a lot of the pressure taken off him.   Draft a WR (Garrett Wilson) at 10 or trade down and take Olave/Williams and a developmental receiver (Justyn Ross/Kyle Phillips) and TE (Jelani Woods/Cole Turner/Charlie Kolar) in the middle rounds and this offense will be special.   CJ, Conklin at TE with Hall/Carter in the backfield.   Moore, Wilson and Davis with Berrios (ST).   I would also have no issue with taking another offensive lineman (Cole Strange or Cade Maye) later.  

I know the odds of this happening are slim and as I mentioned this is a fairly deep running back class so we should end up with a decent player at running back, I just see a chance to add a special talent at the position and make our offense truly dynamic.   It won't happen but  I can dream can't I?  

I'd prefer to get a running back later, this system is built for that. If they go WR at 10 they are in good shape.

BUT -- the thought of them having Michael Carter as the 2nd back and someone in front of him on the depth chart, that is interesting. I am a huge MC fan, having him be the 2nd option with another top receiver hear puts this offense in good shape.

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On 3/24/2022 at 9:28 PM, JetBlue said:

And you would not be wrong necessarily but I think this guys is really a special talent that can make our offense truly explosive and take a great deal of pressure off of Zack.  I don't see any other back in this draft capable of doing that but I could be wrong.  There are some very good running backs so if we wait until 3rd, 4th or 5th rounds I would not  be upset.   I just think Breece Hall is the best running back to come out since James Taylor. 

Oh now that sounds like a fun career change :)

James Taylor Opens up About His Marriages, Spouse, New Album and Memoir  Plus His 'Crazy and Dangerous' Streak — James Taylor Interview

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3 minutes ago, Integrity28 said:

35th pick on a RB is a luxury pick. Especially in a RBBC league.

We run an offense known for making RBs. Not a good use of draft capital at all. 

I understand your point about RB not being a need. At the moment we have 4 picks in the top 38. Edge, WR, CB, LB.  

If JD can trade down and pick up a 5th pick in that range,  a RB like Breece Hall to pair with MC, can supercharge the offense quickly.  I wouldn't mind this scenario at all. 

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No comment on Hall specifically as a RB prospect but I really like the idea of getting a 1A or 1B RB to go along with Carter in this Draft.  Round 3 or 4 (again) seems like a good value place.  RB is a position where you want young guys and you want several of them.  Michael Carter was at his best in North Carolina when he was the 1B to Javonte Williams (who should be one of the top 6 or 7 RBs taken in fantasy this year btw).

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On 3/27/2022 at 12:48 PM, Integrity28 said:

35th pick on a RB is a luxury pick. Especially in a RBBC league.

We run an offense known for making RBs. Not a good use of draft capital at all. 

I actually said 38.  I don't think the Colts feel taking Taylor in the first a few years ago was bad use of draft capital. 

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On 3/26/2022 at 11:16 AM, Barry McCockinner said:

I'd be shocked, and pissed if we used a 2nd round pick on this guy. He's a good back and probably a good scheme fit but I don't see anything special about him and you can find good RB's (Jerome Ford, James Cook, Pierre Strong Jr.) in later rounds.

You don't see anything special about him??  6' 215 with 4.3 speed?  Finished with like 24 straight games with a TD?   I know there are other good backs in this draft and I would be okay several of them as well, but don't sit here and tell me Hall is not a special back because the facts don't support that. 

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On 3/24/2022 at 8:31 AM, kdels62 said:

This is a bad idea.

No it isn't.  Just some folks stuck on thinking "in the box".  We need playmakers and talent.  Hall is the best back by far in this draft.  Assuming he lasts to 38 he would not be a bad pick at all, especially for a team with a young developing QB. 

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On 3/27/2022 at 12:58 PM, Untouchable said:

Frankly I don’t know why so many are against it.

Yeah, yeah…”RB has been devalued”, “it would be a luxury pick”, etc.

Unless we land a dude like Metcalf or Brown in the next few weeks, we’re most likely going into next season with Davis, Moore and Berrios as our Top 3 receivers. And every single one of them finished last year on IR.

Garrett Wilson is the only wideout worth taking in the Top 10 IMO and as much as I like him, I’m not remotely convinced that Douglas would take him at #10 over walking away from the 1st round with something like an Ahmad Gardner/Jermaine Johnson combo.

A solid plan for the Jets (and especially Zach) to be successful in 2022, barring a big trade for a legitimate #1 WR, is to run a bunch of 12 personnel with Uzomah and Conklin on the field at the same time and smashing the sh*t out of defenses with a Hall/Carter/Coleman trio behind a fortified OL.

I'm glad someone else can see the possibilities 

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43 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

You don't see anything special about him??  6' 215 with 4.3 speed?  Finished with like 24 straight games with a TD?   I know there are other good backs in this draft and I would be okay several of them as well, but don't sit here and tell me Hall is not a special back because the facts don't support that. 

I'm just going by what I saw from watching him play. He doesn't look like a special player to me. I didn't bother to look at the stats.

 

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1 hour ago, JetBlue said:

I actually said 38.  I don't think the Colts feel taking Taylor in the first a few years ago was bad use of draft capital. 

That team was already loaded. So: luxury. Like I said. Also, 35 vs 38 is splitting hairs.

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9 hours ago, JetBlue said:

No it isn't.  Just some folks stuck on thinking "in the box".  We need playmakers and talent.  Hall is the best back by far in this draft.  Assuming he lasts to 38 he would not be a bad pick at all, especially for a team with a young developing QB. 

It is. Both from a value perspective and a scheme perspective. Breece Hall is a fine player in a vacuum but drafts don’t happen in a vacuum. 

The scheme lends itself to turning any moderately fast guy into a good player. There’s already an exceptional receiver/ tackle breaker on the roster who should play 50% of snaps. There’s a vet with good explosion that’s gonna play 20% of snaps. Why draft a guy at 38 who will take 30% of snaps? It’s bad asset allocation.

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On 3/29/2022 at 3:31 AM, kdels62 said:

It is. Both from a value perspective and a scheme perspective. Breece Hall is a fine player in a vacuum but drafts don’t happen in a vacuum. 

The scheme lends itself to turning any moderately fast guy into a good player. There’s already an exceptional receiver/ tackle breaker on the roster who should play 50% of snaps. There’s a vet with good explosion that’s gonna play 20% of snaps. Why draft a guy at 38 who will take 30% of snaps? It’s bad asset allocation.

I hear you.  You sound like an Accountant.  Too bad those other backs you are referring to are JAGS with no future.  Only Carter is worth talking about and as we saw, he is a bit injury prone.  Hall is a true franchise caliber back and we are talking about pick 38 which is really not to high for a player of his caliber.  That is within a picks where he is expected to go.  I even see him going late first in some mocks.   Sometimes you have to factor in, you know, TALENT.  If we need to cut a couple of guys in camp so be it, to give Zach a true weapon in the backfield along with Carter.   I am sticking to my guns.  If he is there at 38, I have to seriously consider taking him.   This offense goes to whole new level with a Breece Hall/Michael Carter Backfield. 

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On 3/28/2022 at 7:23 PM, Integrity28 said:

That team was already loaded. So: luxury. Like I said. Also, 35 vs 38 is splitting hairs.

Okay so I take him at 38 if he is there and don't look back.  He will make Zachs growth and development a lot easier. 

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39 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

I hear you.  You sound like an Accountant.  Too bad those other backs you are referring to are JAGS with no future.  Only Carter is worth talking about and as we saw, he is a bit injury prone.  Hall is a true franchise caliber back and we are talking about pick 38 which is really not to high for a player of his caliber.  That is within a picks where he is expected to go.  I even see him going late first in some mocks.   Sometimes you have to factor in, you know, TALENT.  If we need to cut a couple of guys in camp so be it, to give Zach a true weapon in the backfield along with Carter.   I am sticking to my guns.  If he is there at 38, I have to seriously consider taking him.   This offense goes to whole new level with a Breece Hall/Michael Carter Backfield. 

I'm inclined to agree.  Assuming we keep four or maybe five RBs, drafting Hall means cutting Walter or Perine.  That's likely a huge upgrade in talent.  And I think if we drafted Hall, he would play more than 30% of the snaps as kdels suggested.  More likely Hall would see closer to 50% with Carter getting most of the rest and the other guys some scraps while being competent backups in case of injury.  

And that's not including 2 RB sets, which I think we might see a few of considering we would now have...two good RBs.

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2 hours ago, JetBlue said:

I hear you.  You sound like an Accountant.  Too bad those other backs you are referring to are JAGS with no future.  Only Carter is worth talking about and as we saw, he is a bit injury prone.  Hall is a true franchise caliber back and we are talking about pick 38 which is really not to high for a player of his caliber.  That is within a picks where he is expected to go.  I even see him going late first in some mocks.   Sometimes you have to factor in, you know, TALENT.  If we need to cut a couple of guys in camp so be it, to give Zach a true weapon in the backfield along with Carter.   I am sticking to my guns.  If he is there at 38, I have to seriously consider taking him.   This offense goes to whole new level with a Breece Hall/Michael Carter Backfield. 

The entire point of the scheme is to turn JAGs into good players. Others have echoed the sentiment so agree to disagree.

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Narratives are misleading.  Green Bay, Bengals, and Rams have all invested in RBs despite running variations of the scheme.  It doesn’t hurt to have a superstar RB which can now commonly be grabbed in 2nd round… reducing the risk of identifying a Jag that will emerge.  RB room is weak besides Carter.  Why not have a potential weapon added - since Zach needs weapons - we’ve invested in O-line - we want to run the ball - and good o-line can make a really good rb elite.

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8 hours ago, kdels62 said:

The entire point of the scheme is to turn JAGs into good players. Others have echoed the sentiment so agree to disagree.

Well of course others had echoed the sentiment just as others have agreed with me.  It is all about our opinions.   You let me know with Ty Johnson and Coleman are "turned" into good players.   If your argument is that this draft has a lot of good running backs that will be available in later rounds, you would be making a better point that I would be hard pressed to disagree with. 

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