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Jameson Williams


FidelioJet
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2 minutes ago, JoeNamathsFurCoat said:

There’s no compelling reason I’ve heard for Wilson #1 other than “since everybody’s  (Kiper, McShay, Brugler, etc.) saying it, it must be right”. 

His RAS score suggest a mediocre athlete and his tape is not that of a top-10 player.  Not even close.

Being “twitched up” and healthy isn’t enough for me.

/shrug, sounds like you've made up your mind, so I won't waste my time trying to figure out what you think is "compelling". 

Especially if you're a big RAS guy.  

Ultimately, it may be moot.  Atlanta may take Wilson before we pick at #10, so we may never have a shot at him anyway.

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28 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

I completely get this thought.  The logic is solid.

But I will say he's worth the risk  - you win Super Bowls with true impact players - that's the only way it gets done.  Wilson is not that type of prospects.  Williams is.

Seriously, I get what you're saying - I understand it - just don't agree with it. 

 

Youre way overplaying how good he is.  Most dont rate him as the drafts top WR.  Never mind the idea that hes "clearly" the best WR in the draft.  Add in hes injured.  I like him, but the idea of using a top pick on an injured player, one with one knee to play WR doesnt really work to me if we weren't a team that needs help at so many different positions.  I'd take Wilson or London and move on.  

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7 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

I was higher on London earlier in the process, but him not running bothers me and I don't think he fits in our offense as well as Wilson does. 

6', 5'10", 5'8" three of your top 4 WR's with G. Wilson...ugh...

with your #1 RB being 5'8"

I am sorry, but I just can't get on the Garrett Wilson bandwagon for this team.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

6', 5'10", 5'8" three of your top 4 WR's with G. Wilson...ugh...

with your #1 RB being 5'8"

I am sorry, but I just can't get on the Garrett Wilson bandwagon for this team.

 

 

I favor speed/quickness/agility over height, all things being equal. 

London has some good ability, I'm not knocking him. I just worry about his ability to beat man coverage down the field at the next level and this isn't really a jump ball offense. 

Also, we still have Corey Davis who will play a prominent role and the height of Michael Carter is more or less irrelevant. 

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5 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Youre way overplaying how good he is.  Most dont rate him as the drafts top WR.  

I honestly don't think I am overplaying how good he - or more to the point - how much better he is than the others.

Who are these guys that don't rate him higher?  There's a whole handful of people that have downgraded him because of the injury, but go back 5 months ago and he was easily the #1 WR prospect.  It wasn't close.  What I keep hearing from the "experts" is --- if not for the injury he would be the #1 etc...

Wilson may not have even been the #1 WR on his own team.  Honestly, I watch Wilson play and I see short and ordinary.  

I would have no problem with London though (still prefer Williams) at worst he can be a solid possession receivers and we can try and find a star somewhere else.

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1 hour ago, Greensleeves said:

Just look at the last few seasons - WRs are always in harms way and getting hurt. What if Moore or Davis goes down. Are you OK judging Zach on one of those two, Berrios and Mims or Smith? I'm not.

Then he's gonna have to fight through and still be a good QB. Injuries are a part of the game.  You shouldn't crumble because a couple of guys are hurt. If he's good he'll show it, regardless. 

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9 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Youre way overplaying how good he is.  Most dont rate him as the drafts top WR.  Never mind the idea that hes "clearly" the best WR in the draft.  Add in hes injured.  I like him, but the idea of using a top pick on an injured player, one with one knee to play WR doesnt really work to me if we weren't a team that needs help at so many different positions.  I'd take Wilson or London and move on.  

It's like the forum has become drunk on Jameson.

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4 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

It's like the forum has become drunk on Jameson.

There's still 10 days left to the draft....

At this point a good ole fashion WR debate is really all we have left to talk about...

For the record - this is the "Jameson Williams" thread :-)

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2 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

I honestly don't think I am overplaying how good he - or more to the point - how much better he is than the others.

Who are these guys that don't rate him higher?  There's a whole handful of people that have downgraded him because of the injury, but go back 5 months ago and he was easily the #1 WR prospect.  It wasn't close.  What I keep hearing from the "experts" is --- if not for the injury he would be the #1 etc...

Wilson may not have even been the #1 WR on his own team.  Honestly, I watch Wilson play and I see short and ordinary.  

I would have no problem with London though (still prefer Williams) at worst he can be a solid possession receivers and we can try and find a star somewhere else.

Most are all over the place on who's best.  Some have London, I think most have London as. the top WR. Some have Wilson.  Some may have Jameson top, few do if hes healthy he might be.  But hes not healthy.  

All share one thing about the WRs in the draft, none are J Chase types who you have to have or that will carry your team.  

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Just now, FidelioJet said:

There's still 10 days left to the draft....

At this point a good ole fashion WR debate is really all we have left to talk about...

I only wrote that as a joke.  I actually voted for him in the poll.  And I'm with you that we're running out of topics.  It's going to be crazy next week.

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1 minute ago, FidelioJet said:

There's still 10 days left to the draft....

At this point a good ole fashion WR debate is really all we have left to talk about...

For the record - this is the "Jameson Williams" thread :-)

So are we allowed to have a WR debate or not if we're in the Jameson Williams thread?  😎

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1 minute ago, Jet Nut said:

So are we allowed to have a WR debate or not if we're in the Jameson Williams thread?  😎

Seriously, I keep going back and watching GW tape, videos. Trying to find what people love about him.  I honestly don't see it.  

I see some sick body control in the air and some nice hands - which is really cool...But I just don't get #1WR from him.

Williams I just see explosive speed that can break open games. Sure, he has concerns, but his talent is just far more obvious to me what I watch him.

London, I get it.  He fits nicely what ZW did in college - his leaping ability is wild to see.  

I think we're pretty much locked in on one of those 3.  One of them is likely to be gone by 10 - I just wonder who WR #1 and WR 2 on their board right now.

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24 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

6', 5'10", 5'8" three of your top 4 WR's with G. Wilson...ugh...

with your #1 RB being 5'8"

I am sorry, but I just can't get on the Garrett Wilson bandwagon for this team.

Well, that's ok.

But if we go with risky Williams, and he's still not playing come say, late September into October, and Wilson is last in the NFL is passing offense, you may come to regret your preferences.  No excuses for Zach if Williams isn't ready to play opening day.

Wilson has the highest floor of any WR in this draft.  He will be a reliable NFL Pro #1 WR.  And he fits our scheme perfectly with his high grades on his hands and skillful route running.  And his 4.38 isn't exactly slow.

Interesting how much height is important to you, when it wasn't for Zach Wilson. 

Especially since most of the top NFL WR's are within an inch of each other (Cupp is 6'2", Adams is 6'1", Hill is 5'10", Jefferson is 6'1", Johnson is 5'10", Chase is 6'1", Samuel is 6'0", Diggs is 6'0", etc.)

Garrett Wilson is 6'0".  He's not small by top-flite NFL WR standards.  He's right there with most of these guys.

Moore at 5'10" is the same as Hill at 5'10".

And Corey Davis (who IS still a starting WR for us) is 6'3".

Wilson/Davis/Moore is a perfectly average sized WR group.

Not sure where you got that 5'8" from (is that Berrios?  He's not going to start at WR, he's the #4/tricky guy and KR).  And he's 5'9", not 5'8", lol. 

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14 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

I favor speed/quickness/agility over height, all things being equal. 

London has some good ability, I'm not knocking him. I just worry about his ability to beat man coverage down the field at the next level and this isn't really a jump ball offense. 

Also, we still have Corey Davis who will play a prominent role and the height of Michael Carter is more or less irrelevant. 

I think height is important - Ccatching the ball out of the backfield is a key part of this offense - MC's height does matter.

Look, ZW needs all the help he can - bigger guys require less need for perfection.    When he's looking around at Moore, BB, GW and MC coming out of the backfield - ugh...

Davis is soft - doesn't play big at all.  It's certainly nice to have one larger guy but still...

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1 minute ago, FidelioJet said:

I think height is important - Ccatching the ball out of the backfield is a key part of this offense - MC's height does matter.

Yea - this is a reach. 
 

I think what will help Zach Wilson is his WRs consistently getting open. I have some questions about London being able to do that 

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1 minute ago, Warfish said:

Well, that's ok.

But if we go with risky Williams, and he's still not playing come say, late September into October, and Wilson is last in the NFL is passing offense, you may come to regret your preferences.  No excuses for Zach is Williams isn't ready to play opening day.

Wilson has the highest floor of any WR in this draft.  He will be a reliable NFL Pro #1 WR.  And he fits our scheme perfectly with his high grades on route running.  And his 4.38 isn't exactly slow.

Interesting how much height is important to you, when it wasn't for Zach Wilson.  Especially since most of the top NFL WR's are within an inch of each other (Cupp is 6'2", Adams is 6'1", Hill is 5'10", Jefferson is 6'1", Johnson is 5'10", Chase is 6'1", Samuel is 6'0", Diggs is 6'0", etc.)

Garrett Wilson is 6'0".  He's not small by top-flite NFL WR standards.  He's right there with most of these guys.

Moore at 5'10" is the same as Hill at 5'10".

And Corey Davis (who IS still a starting WR for us) is 6'3".

Wilson/Davis/Moore is a perfectly average sized WR group.

Not sure where you got that 5'8" from (is that Berrios?  He's not going to start at WR, he's the #4/tricky guy and KR).  And he's 5'9", not 5'8", lol. 

I get the risks for sure. 

If Moore wasn't on the other side (I loved the Moore pick last year, he was my guy I wouldn't be worried about GW's height. I have no issues with short WR's...But having our two starting wide outs be little guys is concerning to me.  It's certainly not my primary one - but it surely is something that worries me.

 

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53 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

I honestly don't think I am overplaying how good he - or more to the point - how much better he is than the others.

Who are these guys that don't rate him higher?  There's a whole handful of people that have downgraded him because of the injury, but go back 5 months ago and he was easily the #1 WR prospect.  It wasn't close.  What I keep hearing from the "experts" is --- if not for the injury he would be the #1 etc...

Wilson may not have even been the #1 WR on his own team.  Honestly, I watch Wilson play and I see short and ordinary.  

I would have no problem with London though (still prefer Williams) at worst he can be a solid possession receivers and we can try and find a star somewhere else.

I just feel you can get the equivalent WR in rounds 2 or 3. The OL and DL quality drops off after mid 1st round

 

jets first 4 picks: OL/DE/C/WR

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Daniel Jeremiah does give me pause when he says that although he likes Jameson, but Jameson does not have natural hands. I presume he means he's not a natural catcher of the ball. He adds that receivers without natural hands are the ones that he has found, in the past, most likely to bust.

I think Jameson is worth the gamble of waiting for him to recover at 10 if he's available; but I would double up with Alec Pierce, Christian Watson or Treylon Burks, if one of them falls to the second round.

Not my favorite WR but I have to think that the Jets might go Drake London at 10.

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56 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

This is correct and should be the first factor when considering a WR.

We had serious issues with that last year.

The team really struggled when defenses ran press coverage and Williams has some of the class’ worst numbers against press. That’s my big concern with him.

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7 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

Same issue with Wilson though.   

I don’t like Wilson as a top ten prospect either, but that doesn’t change that it’s a major issue for Williams and his ability to help the Jets have success against a pretty straightforward coverage scheme they really struggled to go up against. I do think Williams’ numbers versus press were pretty significantly worse than Wilson’s, too.

Alabama did a good job protecting him from facing press. I like Williams a lot, but it’s a definite red flag and a significant negative in the context of talking about him doing things the Jets need.

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1 hour ago, FidelioJet said:

Look, ZW needs all the help he can - bigger guys require less need for perfection.    When he's looking around at Moore, BB, GW and MC coming out of the backfield - ugh...

You think a couple of inches of height will make a difference completing passes?                         

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2 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

You think a couple of inches of height will make a difference completing passes?                         

Yes, I absolutely think height matters.   Yes, 2 inches matter.  

Of course there are a myriad of other factors but height is certainly not a small one.

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On 4/1/2022 at 11:40 PM, Hal N of Provo said:

I don’t think teams are nervous about an ACL.  I think he’ll be gone by mid first round at the latest.  

If the Jets love this player then they have to take him at 10.  It's not a given that he'd be there at 10, but I wouldn't risk the number 4 pick on a rehabbing player.   Chances are he's there at 10.

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5 hours ago, slimjasi said:

He's a jack of all trades type who is a really good scheme fit for us, a great route runner, and a YAC monster. I don't think he's a spectacular prospect, but he has the chance to be a very good NFL WR, IMO. 

Yea and you don’t use a top 10 Pick on that kind of prospect.

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5 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

Most are all over the place on who's best.  Some have London, I think most have London as. the top WR. Some have Wilson.  Some may have Jameson top, few do if hes healthy he might be.  But hes not healthy.  

All share one thing about the WRs in the draft, none are J Chase types who you have to have or that will carry your team.  

London is not healthy either.

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3 hours ago, derp said:

I don’t like Wilson as a top ten prospect either, but that doesn’t change that it’s a major issue for Williams and his ability to help the Jets have success against a pretty straightforward coverage scheme they really struggled to go up against. I do think Williams’ numbers versus press were pretty significantly worse than Wilson’s, too.

Alabama did a good job protecting him from facing press. I like Williams a lot, but it’s a definite red flag and a significant negative in the context of talking about him doing things the Jets need.

This isn’t that big of an issue in the Jets system, they will use pre snap motion to get him away from press if that’s needed.  And he can always be taught how to beat press, you can’t teach his game breaking speed.

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21 minutes ago, Lupz27 said:

This isn’t that big of an issue in the Jets system, they will use pre snap motion to get him away from press if that’s needed.  And he can always be taught how to beat press, you can’t teach his game breaking speed.

I think it's less of an issue if you have *someone* who can beat press, but when your entire offense grinds to a halt when defenses press you I think it's noteworthy. Speed also has very little to actually zero correlation to pro success, gets lots of guys overdrafted. I like him but he's got significant warts.

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