Jermaine Johnson to the Jets at 4 buzz

[Augustiniak]

25 minutes ago, bitonti said:

Becton is completely unreliable and Fant (only average) needs a new deal. OT is a huge need, despite what certain posters maintain 

I think plan A is ekongwu.  Relying on becton is risking not only the season and Wilson’s development, but douglas’ job.  If douglas drafts D 2x in round 1 and the D improves but becton bails again and Wilson’s protection sucks, douglas could get canned.  But if they draft ekongwu, becton bails again and wilson improves as the protection and run game improves, we’re all happy and douglas keeps his job.  And if becton somehow stays healthy and they work him in this season even if ekongwu plays, that’s all the better, someone can get traded.

saleh said there’s no chase young edge guy in this class but there’s a lot of good pass rushers.  I think plan A is to take ekongwu, then grab an edge at 10 and trade up for a wr or trade for one like deebo.  But if plan B is to grab the best edge at 4 (and i think thibs is in play, i don’t believe the jets wouldn’t take him even over JJ), then they would still have a huge risk at OT that I’m not sure how they would address in the draft.

[jamesr]

21 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

Relying on becton is risking not only the season and Wilson’s development, but douglas’ job.  If douglas drafts D 2x in round 1 and the D improves but becton bails again and Wilson’s protection sucks, douglas could get canned.  But if they draft ekongwu, becton bails again and wilson improves as the protection and run game improves, we’re all happy and douglas keeps his job.  And if becton somehow stays healthy and they work him in this season even if ekongwu plays, that’s all the better, someone can get traded.

 

We're not as reliant on Becton as you make out - IMHO. Becton was a non-entity last year but his protection from Becton's position (LT) was not an issue. Most of the protection issues came from holding the ball too long, and inside pressure (leading to rolling out / scrambling etc).

If we're that worried about Becton - start Fant at LT and acquire a RT (draft or FA). But no need to pick a RT at #4 overall.

(As an aside - I'm dreading us drafting Ickey due to the multiple misspells of his name - it's Ekwonu. At least you didn't add an h to Becton  ).

[Augustiniak]

1 minute ago, jamesr said:

We're not as reliant on Becton as you make out - IMHO. Becton was a non-entity last year but his protection from Becton's position (LT) was not an issue. Most of the protection issues came from holding the ball too long, and inside pressure (leading to rolling out / scrambling etc).

If we're that worried about Becton - start Fant at LT and acquire a RT (draft or FA). But no need to pick a RT at #4 overall.

(As an aside - I'm dreading us drafting Ickey due to the multiple misspells of his name - it's Ekwonu. At least you didn't add an h to Becton  ).

The reason the OL survived last year was b/c of Moses.  Now that he’s gone, there’s no real depth.  

[jamesr]

4 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

The reason the OL survived last year was b/c of Moses.  Now that he’s gone, there’s no real depth.  

But we can get depth without picking it at #4 overall, that's all I'm saying.

If we draft a guy as depth in Round 1 I'll be very upset. I'm not saying we won't / shouldn't pick Ekwonu, but if we draft him he better be starting day 1. Which means we shelve or bench either Becton or Fant. In terms of moving the team forward and upward, I just don't feel it moves the needle, going from a decent LT to ... hopefully a decent LT. Or maybe he starts at RT with Becton at LT ... not a bad thing, but not the sort of move that makes me feel we'll be far better in 2022 as a result.

 

 

[Augustiniak]

5 minutes ago, jamesr said:

But we can get depth without picking it at #4 overall, that's all I'm saying.

If we draft a guy as depth in Round 1 I'll be very upset. I'm not saying we won't / shouldn't pick Ekwonu, but if we draft him he better be starting day 1. Which means we shelve or bench either Becton or Fant. In terms of moving the team forward and upward, I just don't feel it moves the needle, going from a decent LT to ... hopefully a decent LT. Or maybe he starts at RT with Becton at LT ... not a bad thing, but not the sort of move that makes me feel we'll be far better in 2022 as a result.

 

 

The obvious concern is that becton is perpetually rehabbing and can’t get on the field.  Fant starts at LT and RT becomes a ?  The jets can’t develop wilson like that.  

[Irish Jet]

Pass rush win rate last year was 17% (Thibodeaux was 30% for reference) - This is widely considered the best predictor for future success for pass rushers with a strong correlation between the elite rushers and high college win rate. 

Almost all of his pressures (84%) came longer than 2.5 seconds after the ball was snapped. This is why his production is deceiving. Coverage sack merchant. 

This would be one of the worst top 5 picks I can remember if we were to do this. I would take Hamilton, Stingley, Davis - Just about f*cking anyone who's been linked with us over the last 12 months over a guy who's analytics all suggest mediocrity at best. That said, it would be the classic Jets pick. Outsmarting themselves as always. 

[King P]

It seems the Giants are high on him too.

Hoping he goes early so KT can slide to 10

[peekskill68]

1 hour ago, bitonti said:

Becton is completely unreliable and Fant (only average) needs a new deal. OT is a huge need, despite what certain posters maintain 

If this is truly how JD and Saleh see it (you could be right), then I still maintain that Becton will be traded. Carrying a 1st round bench warmer like Becton still on his rookie deal is equally inept as Macc ignoring the OL for his entire tenure.  All signs indicate they love Fant so an extension ala JFM seems likely...

[football guy]

11 hours ago, slimjasi said:

@football guysays London is WR1, which I didn’t expect

I actually think London will be a good pro, but I hate that he didn’t run. Hate it  

I was told they love him and that he’s probably going to be their WR1. Personally I’m a little skeptical as he doesn’t have the kind of speed of the guys the Jets have been interested in acquiring, but theorizing that they may be looking at him more from a long-term perspective and less of “we need a WR1 right now”

Guys from the Shanahan tree preach a “position-less offense”, where they can be flexible and line up guys all around the formation based on their abilities. London is someone who can line up at each of the X/Y/Z spots, is a YAC nightmare, terrific blocker, and has extremely special ball-skills. His game is Brandon Marshall-esque, but even if he didn’t become a “No. 1 receiver” he would have a place in the offense as an ideal long-term replacement for Corey Davis, figuring the Jets would still aim to pair him and Elijah Moore with one of the top options who figure to be available in 2023 (absent significant improvement from Davis + Mims). 

[Augustiniak]

1 minute ago, football guy said:

I was told they love him and that he’s probably going to be their WR1. Personally I’m a little skeptical as he doesn’t have the kind of speed of the guys the Jets have been interested in acquiring, but theorizing that they may be looking at him more from a long-term perspective and less of “we need a WR1 right now”

Guys from the Shanahan tree preach a “position-less offense”, where they can be flexible and line up guys all around the formation based on their abilities. London is someone who can line up at each of the X/Y/Z spots, is a YAC nightmare, terrific blocker, and has extremely special ball-skills. His game is Brandon Marshall-esque, but even if he didn’t become a “No. 1 receiver” he would have a place in the offense as an ideal long-term replacement for Corey Davis, figuring the Jets would still aim to pair him and Elijah Moore with one of the top options who figure to be available in 2023 (absent significant improvement from Davis + Mims). 

So is the jets favorite scenario, thibs/london?

[section314]

3 minutes ago, football guy said:

I was told they love him and that he’s probably going to be their WR1. Personally I’m a little skeptical as he doesn’t have the kind of speed of the guys the Jets have been interested in acquiring, but theorizing that they may be looking at him more from a long-term perspective and less of “we need a WR1 right now”

Guys from the Shanahan tree preach a “position-less offense”, where they can be flexible and line up guys all around the formation based on their abilities. London is someone who can line up at each of the X/Y/Z spots, is a YAC nightmare, terrific blocker, and has extremely special ball-skills. His game is Brandon Marshall-esque, but even if he didn’t become a “No. 1 receiver” he would have a place in the offense as an ideal long-term replacement for Corey Davis, figuring the Jets would still aim to pair him and Elijah Moore with one of the top options who figure to be available in 2023 (absent significant improvement from Davis + Mims). 

From what you've heard, do they have any interest in Traylon Burks at WR?

[Irish Jet]

3 minutes ago, football guy said:

I was told they love him and that he’s probably going to be their WR1. Personally I’m a little skeptical as he doesn’t have the kind of speed of the guys the Jets have been interested in acquiring, but theorizing that they may be looking at him more from a long-term perspective and less of “we need a WR1 right now”

Guys from the Shanahan tree preach a “position-less offense”, where they can be flexible and line up guys all around the formation based on their abilities. London is someone who can line up at each of the X/Y/Z spots, is a YAC nightmare, terrific blocker, and has extremely special ball-skills. His game is Brandon Marshall-esque, but even if he didn’t become a “No. 1 receiver” he would have a place in the offense as an ideal long-term replacement for Corey Davis, figuring the Jets would still aim to pair him and Elijah Moore with one of the top options who figure to be available in 2023 (absent significant improvement from Davis + Mims). 

LOL we're actually gonna go Johnson/London.

This is the nightmare draft for me. Oh well I've been wrong before. 

[slimjasi]

4 minutes ago, football guy said:

I was told they love him and that he’s probably going to be their WR1. Personally I’m a little skeptical as he doesn’t have the kind of speed of the guys the Jets have been interested in acquiring, but theorizing that they may be looking at him more from a long-term perspective and less of “we need a WR1 right now”

Guys from the Shanahan tree preach a “position-less offense”, where they can be flexible and line up guys all around the formation based on their abilities. London is someone who can line up at each of the X/Y/Z spots, is a YAC nightmare, terrific blocker, and has extremely special ball-skills. His game is Brandon Marshall-esque, but even if he didn’t become a “No. 1 receiver” he would have a place in the offense as an ideal long-term replacement for Corey Davis, figuring the Jets would still aim to pair him and Elijah Moore with one of the top options who figure to be available in 2023 (absent significant improvement from Davis + Mims). 

 I'm skeptical, as well. But it's plausible. And I could absolutely see him being good, even though he's not  my favorite WR in this draft. 

Can't wait for Thursday night

[slimjasi]

2 minutes ago, Irish Jet said:

LOL we're actually gonna go Johnson/London.

This is the nightmare draft for me. Oh well I've been wrong before. 

I have a hard time believing they will take Johnson at 4 over Ickey. 

[section314]

2 minutes ago, Irish Jet said:

LOL we're actually gonna go Johnson/London.

This is the nightmare draft for me. Oh well I've been wrong before. 

Take a deep breath....Kyrie will get vaccinated before this happens.?

[nycdan]

2 minutes ago, football guy said:

I was told they love him and that he’s probably going to be their WR1. Personally I’m a little skeptical as he doesn’t have the kind of speed of the guys the Jets have been interested in acquiring, but theorizing that they may be looking at him more from a long-term perspective and less of “we need a WR1 right now”

Guys from the Shanahan tree preach a “position-less offense”, where they can be flexible and line up guys all around the formation based on their abilities. London is someone who can line up at each of the X/Y/Z spots, is a YAC nightmare, terrific blocker, and has extremely special ball-skills. His game is Brandon Marshall-esque, but even if he didn’t become a “No. 1 receiver” he would have a place in the offense as an ideal long-term replacement for Corey Davis, figuring the Jets would still aim to pair him and Elijah Moore with one of the top options who figure to be available in 2023 (absent significant improvement from Davis + Mims). 

This is an interesting take on London.  If you knew he would essentially be a young Brandon Marshall (who was a little bigger but not much), I think it would be an easy win with the #10 pick IMO.  I've seen the Keenan Allen comp as well.  Also a win.  There probably just isn't a Calvin Johnson hiding in this year's draft class.  There are a few thin 6'0" options and there is London, who is more unique of a prospect in this class.  They all have strengths and questions.  I like London and would be fine with him as our selection. 

The only wrench in the plans could be NYG or ATL (at 7 and 8 ) surprising us.

 

[Irish Jet]

Just now, slimjasi said:

I have a hard time believing they will take Johnson at 4 over Ickey. 

Never underestimate this team's ability to piss me off. 

[nycdan]

6 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

So is the jets favorite scenario, thibs/london?

 

4 minutes ago, Irish Jet said:

LOL we're actually gonna go Johnson/London.

This is the nightmare draft for me. Oh well I've been wrong before. 

These are probably my two most comfortable outcomes.  Barring a trade, we come away with an upgrade at DE and WR - two of our positions of biggest need right now.  I love Gardner as a prospect but don't think he will help the defense as much as a quality Edge options.  I love Ekwonu as a prospect, but without an upgrade at WR, I think we would be treading water.  

This is an impact 1st round at two premium positions.

[Asymmetrical]

17 minutes ago, nycdan said:

This is an interesting take on London.  If you knew he would essentially be a young Brandon Marshall (who was a little bigger but not much), I think it would be an easy win with the #10 pick IMO.  I've seen the Keenan Allen comp as well.  Also a win.  There probably just isn't a Calvin Johnson hiding in this year's draft class.  There are a few thin 6'0" options and there is London, who is more unique of a prospect in this class.  They all have strengths and questions.  I like London and would be fine with him as our selection. 

The only wrench in the plans could be NYG or ATL (at 7 and 8 ) surprising us.

 

 

I have felt like London is a fit since he can play the big slot, blocks, yac etc plus he gives Wilson the "go get it" option he loved in college. 

 

I also realize that my aesthetic preference for funky WR plays into this. Keenan Allen is cool to watch! This by itself is probably not a great reason to draft a guy at ten but I'm not in charge.

[Lith]

Only [mention=28279]Lith[/mention] will be pleased.  Or at least conflicted…

Conflicted would be the right way to describe it. I would hate the pick. There are other guys who likely would have a bigger impact than Davis at 4.

But he is easy to root for. Seems like a genuinely good kid who I would love to see on our team. But not at 4.

[Augustiniak]

24 minutes ago, nycdan said:

 

These are probably my two most comfortable outcomes.  Barring a trade, we come away with an upgrade at DE and WR - two of our positions of biggest need right now.  I love Gardner as a prospect but don't think he will help the defense as much as a quality Edge options.  I love Ekwonu as a prospect, but without an upgrade at WR, I think we would be treading water.  

This is an impact 1st round at two premium positions.

I’m not buying that the jets are out on thibs.  I do think the top 3 picks will be walker, hutch and eknongwu.  That leaves the jets picking between sauce and thibs and thibs should impact the d more.  It also would allow the jets more flexibility in picking at 10 or in a trade back b/c they’d already have the edge rusher.  If ekongwu/thibs/hutch are the top 3, would the jets pick JJ or sauce, that’s a good question.

[Cp561]

12 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

I’m not buying that the jets are out on thibs.  I do think the top 3 picks will be walker, hutch and eknongwu.  That leaves the jets picking between sauce and thibs and thibs should impact the d more.  It also would allow the jets more flexibility in picking at 10 or in a trade back b/c they’d already have the edge rusher.  If ekongwu/thibs/hutch are the top 3, would the jets pick JJ or sauce, that’s a good question.

It's impressive how many different ways you can butcher Ekwonu's name lol. But I agree that those will be the top 3 picks, and in this scenario I think I'm leaning Sauce. I've been a Thibs guy but everything I'm hearing is really scaring me. Corner isn't as much of a need but we need to hit on these picks. I'd then look at one of the pass rushers that fall with 35 (Karlaftis maybe?)

[Litez]

43 minutes ago, nycdan said:

This is an interesting take on London.  If you knew he would essentially be a young Brandon Marshall (who was a little bigger but not much), I think it would be an easy win with the #10 pick IMO.  I've seen the Keenan Allen comp as well.  Also a win.  There probably just isn't a Calvin Johnson hiding in this year's draft class.  There are a few thin 6'0" options and there is London, who is more unique of a prospect in this class.  They all have strengths and questions.  I like London and would be fine with him as our selection. 

The only wrench in the plans could be NYG or ATL (at 7 and 8 ) surprising us.

 

Barring injury I think you can pencil London in to be at least Tee Higgins and the potential to be a Brandon Marshall / Keyshawn Johnson. I think even if he's Higgins in this Offense its worth the 10th pick. Niners never had a big X but it's very easy to see how we would use him with our scheme by just watching the Bengals. A lot of Digs, Outs, Slants, some slot, seam streaks, bigtime contested catches here and there, back shoulders against man press, and just overall a security blanket for his QB especially on third downs. What Corey Davis was supposed to be.

London is going to be a really good route runner too. Kids only 20 and only playing football full time for 1 year and already is pretty technical in his releases and routes. Only going to get better. He's a very skilled basketball player too and a lot of it translates. He's going to be a stud.

[IntoTheGreen]

Interesting question that just crossed my mind. If we do draft Sauce, could Hall play FS? He has played well outside, but cant play inside. I think hes big and physical enough and has shown decent enough ball skills. It would be a way to get all the talent on the field in the back end. 

[Warfish]

4 hours ago, jamesr said:

If we're that worried about Becton - start Fant at LT and acquire a RT (draft or FA). But no need to pick a RT at #4 overall.

This.  

I like O-line, I usually clamor for more O-line, but this is a year where O-line can be a late-in-draft plan, not a 1st round plan.

[RedBeardedSavage]

From WalterFootball rumors today

Quote

 

• While Thibodeaux's poor reputation has gotten publicity leading up the 2022 NFL Draft, another edge rusher who is receiving poor marks for character has flown under the radar, Florida State defensive end Jermaine Johnson. Multiple team sources say Johnson's character issues are significant, with one director of player personnel labelling Johnson as worse than Thibodeaux. Teams received negative feedback from Georgia, and the character issues played a part in Johnson transferring from the Bulldogs for his senior year. Johnson did well in the pre-draft workouts and at the Senior Bowl, so he is probably safe as a top-20 selection. But if he slides, the makeup question will be what is dragging him down.

https://walterfootball.com/nflhotpress/article/2022-NFL-Draft-Week-Rumors-Tuesday

I despise the formatting of his website. I have no idea if his sources are genuine. 

But you can't just 'print the good, ignore the bad' about a prospect, even if he's your Vontae Mack No Matter What. 

[derp]

My personal take on how things are starting to look:

• First overall pick is projected to be Travon Walker currently
• Top three remaining guys on the Jets' big board are going to be Hutchinson, Ekwonu, and Gardner in some order
• They're going to want to add offensive line, secondary, defensive line, and offensive skill player help with the first four picks, but remain flexible
• Pick 4 is likely CB/OL barring Hutchinson slipping, leaving pick 10 to be WR/edge (Samuel on the table as a WR option)
  • Hutchinson slipping potentially opens the door to fill another big need at 10 and package 35/38 as I think OL/secondary are more nice to have than important
  • I don't think the Saints moving up is especially likely, but with the talk they want OL - pending what Houston does I could see the 16+19 for 4 move. Saints get aggressive and Giants at 5 and Panthers at 6 are real OL threats. Would open up a lot of flexibility for Douglas. Still think 4 is no man's land. That and a Samuel trade would be huge. Get Samuel and still have four of the top 40 picks? Would be impressive.
• Picks 35/38 leave them some room. See which WR's slip if they can't address it earlier or don't think RB is completely off the table, some interesting safeties/CB's (Cine, Brisker, Hill, Booth, Gordon), potential DE options (Ebiketie, Mafe, maybe Karlaftis, Jackson) or they could go DT (Winfrey, Jones), chance Linderbaum slips - or they could move down for guys like Alec Pierce, Abraham Lucas
  • I think they like the late R1/early R2 DL options comparably to the guys at 10 - we talk about a move up for a WR but a move up for their favorite in this tier wouldn't surprise me
  • The realistic possibility Linderbaum slides, as I think it's hard to find a clean team fit but he's perfect for the Jets, and they can get a big impact player at the top of the second is another reason OL at 4 would be tough to swallow
• Best case to add talent/impact to the roster - albeit unlikely - is Hutchinson at 4, 10 for Samuel, Linderbaum at the top of the second, and best overall other player with the other two

[Bronx]

 

[Irish Jet]

1 hour ago, nycdan said:

 

These are probably my two most comfortable outcomes.  Barring a trade, we come away with an upgrade at DE and WR - two of our positions of biggest need right now.  I love Gardner as a prospect but don't think he will help the defense as much as a quality Edge options.  I love Ekwonu as a prospect, but without an upgrade at WR, I think we would be treading water.  

This is an impact 1st round at two premium positions.

Johnson at 4 will probably be the biggest reach in the draft. 

You don’t just want an upgrade on Shaq Lawson at #4. You should be drafting a special talent that will be a game changer. Johnson just isn’t that. It would be unbelievable negligence to make that pick. 

[bitonti]

6 hours ago, Irish Jet said:

Johnson at 4 will probably be the biggest reach in the draft. 

You don’t just want an upgrade on Shaq Lawson at #4. You should be drafting a special talent that will be a game changer. Johnson just isn’t that. It would be unbelievable negligence to make that pick. 

Agree that JJ is a reach at 4

If I'm jd I have these 3 players on my board first, in any order:

OT Icky 

EDGE Hutch

EDGE Walker 

If those guys go 1, 2, 3, JD could see that as a worst case scenario for the NYJ

EDGE JJ could actually be 4th on their board 

EDGE thibs would not be on the board at all.

OT Cross is another long shot possibility. OT Neal has rumors of bad medical. 

Cb Gardner, any WR, Hamilton is smoke at 4. 

 

 

 

[Grandy]

Damien Woody is gushing over how much he loves JJ and thinks he has the best moves. Says we should all be excited if he's the pick at 4. 

[TuscanyTile2]

14 hours ago, football guy said:

I was told they love him and that he’s probably going to be their WR1. Personally I’m a little skeptical as he doesn’t have the kind of speed of the guys the Jets have been interested in acquiring, but theorizing that they may be looking at him more from a long-term perspective and less of “we need a WR1 right now”

Guys from the Shanahan tree preach a “position-less offense”, where they can be flexible and line up guys all around the formation based on their abilities. London is someone who can line up at each of the X/Y/Z spots, is a YAC nightmare, terrific blocker, and has extremely special ball-skills. His game is Brandon Marshall-esque, but even if he didn’t become a “No. 1 receiver” he would have a place in the offense as an ideal long-term replacement for Corey Davis, figuring the Jets would still aim to pair him and Elijah Moore with one of the top options who figure to be available in 2023 (absent significant improvement from Davis + Mims). 

The Jets "love" Drake London?  I wonder how much it ties into a marketing scheme for Woody.

_(kidding)

 

 

[JoeNamathsFurCoat]

Disgusting 

Fire Joe Douglas if this happens 

[mrcoops]

Follow the money.

 

[SomebodytoAnybody47]