Daniel Jeremiah- “Mims, I have been told, is off the charts in the offseason stuff."

[slimjasi]

2 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

So, Corey Davis, in games played with Zach Wilson, averaged 53 yards per game, scored three TDs in those six games, and had a catch percentage of 59%. He put up a catch percentage of 70.7% playing with Tannehill the year prior to joining the Jets. 

LOL, but that's not the argument you were making. 

Compare his stats with and without Wilson. 

Stop deflecting. You were wrong. 

[Dunnie]

So, Corey Davis, in games played with Zach Wilson, averaged 53 yards per game, scored three TDs in those six games, and had a catch percentage of 59%. He put up a catch percentage of 70.7% playing with Tannehill the year prior to joining the Jets. 

Interesting... how did he do with Rookie Tannehill ... uh wait .... nvm

[ZachStepdad]

Adam Gase became a better offensive genius every offseason

[slimjasi]

Just to put this very silly notion to bed:

Corey Davis - game by game

 

Braxton Berrios - game by game

 

@T0mShane We good?

 

 

 

 

 

[T0mShane]

7 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

LOL, but that's not the argument you were making. 

Compare his stats with and without Wilson. 

Stop deflecting. You were wrong. 

Mike White to Corey Davis:

vs New England: 4 catches on 5 targets, 47 yards and a TD

vs Bengals: 5 catches on 7 targets, 93 yards.

[T0mShane]

3 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

Just to put this very silly notion to bed:

Corey Davis - game by game

 

Braxton Berrios - game by game

 

@T0mShane We good?

 

 

 

 

 

I just gave you the stats.

[slimjasi]

Just now, T0mShane said:

I just gave you the stats.

No, I have YOU the stats!

LOL

I feel like I am taking crazy pills. 

[slimjasi]

2 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Mike White to Corey Davis:

vs New England: 4 catches on 5 targets, 47 yards and a TD

vs Bengals: 5 catches on 7 targets, 93 yards.

So, is your plan just to keep changing your argument until you stumble into something that isn't total nonsense? 

[T0mShane]

8 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

So, is your plan just to keep changing your argument until you stumble into something that isn't total nonsense? 

You’re remembering the one 53 yard bomb against the Titans and it’s making you think that Zach to Corey Davis was more productive and/or dangerous than it was.

[slimjasi]

4 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

You’re remembering the one 53 yard bomb against the Titans and it’s making you think that Zach to Corey Davis was more productive and/or dangerous than it was.

No. I'm just looking at production. 

 

You made a blanket (and frankly absurd) statement that all of the WRs sucked until Zach Wilson was out of the lineup. But this simply isn't true. Both Corey Davis and Braxton Berrios had their best 2 or 3 games with Wilson throwing them the ball. Then, when challenged on this, you posted two Mike White games, which wasn't even the argument. The argument wasn't Wilson vs Mike White - it was Wilson or no Wilson. (i.e., Why not post all of the non-Zach Wilson games, since that was what we were discussing?) And what about Berrios? 

 

[T0mShane]

27 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

No. I'm just looking at production. 

 

You made a blanket (and frankly absurd) statement that all of the WRs sucked until Zach Wilson was out of the lineup. But this simply isn't true. Both Corey Davis and Braxton Berrios had their best 2 or 3 games with Wilson throwing them the ball. Then, when challenged on this, you posted two Mike White games, which wasn't even the argument. The argument wasn't Wilson vs Mike White - it was Wilson or no Wilson. (i.e., Why not post all of the non-Zach Wilson games, since that was what we were discussing?) And what about Berrios? 

 

Davis played in three games without Zach Wilson: two with White playing and one with Flacco playing. He put up 175 of his 492 yards in those games. He was quiet against Miami, but that’s the game where Elijah Moore went off for 141 yards and a TD. Moore put up 336 of his 538 yards in non-Wilson games, and four of his five TDs. 
 

Berrios averaged 26 yards per game and scored two TDs all season. He is statistically insignificant.

[slimjasi]

54 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Davis played in three games without Zach Wilson: two with White playing and one with Flacco playing. He put up 175 of his 492 yards in those games. He was quiet against Miami, but that’s the game where Elijah Moore went off for 141 yards and a TD. Moore put up 336 of his 538 yards in non-Wilson games, and four of his five TDs. 
 

Berrios averaged 26 yards per game and scored two TDs all season. He is statistically insignificant.

Ok, this is actually funny. 

You are basing your Davis argument on a sample size of 2 (or 3) while noting that Berrios was statistically insignificant. Lol. 

If we are going to worry about what is ACTUALLY statistically significant, it should be noted that NONE of this is statistically significant. At best, we are comparing a sample size of 13 games (all Wilson games) to a sample size of 4 (all non Wilson games). 
 

but I digress 

[freestater]

[Jet Nut]

6 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

There were several reports by observers that he was dogging it during typical WR drills.

I honestly dont remember reports that he was dogging it, could be and obviously with the right sources saying it happened, it did.  I agree we all thought he had to be dogging it.  But was it him dogging it or was it the result of being ill after the weight loss etc due to his  food poisoning episode?   Did reports just surmise he was without knowing the extent of his illness?  I sure hope that was the case

[jNYC1]

Just trying to push this thread to 8 pages…

Rewatching the Bengals game where Mims had a nice catch and run for 24 yards in the 1Q and that “bum” Elijah was called for holding… all jokes aside - when Mims takes the leap he will be a yac monster in this offense.

Side note - the 1Q of the Bengals game was insane… obviously the rest of the game was just as wild.

[FootballLove]

Wait....so they have a chart now for underperforming wide receivers? Cool. So how far off his chart was he? Did he make it to the bottom of the 'Wide Receivers Who Can Catch' chart?

[Jet Nut]

15 hours ago, T0mShane said:

One wonders what information Douglas is working off of that would lead him to trust Becton even a little bit. It was Dane Brugler who said he heard from several executives that Becton had played his last game in a Jets uniform. Brugler, who was exceedingly complimentary of the Jets draft, is hardly a click-whoring beat guy. He got this information while talking to people around the league about draft prospects. I guess Douglas could hope and pray Becton keeps it together for the next eight months, but how could he be at all confident in that belief? 

Actually one wonders how Brugler got it so wrong.  The statement that Becton has played his last game with the Jets seems comical at this point and hardly a quote to keep citing.

[T0mShane]

5 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Actually one wonders how Brugler got it so wrong.  The statement that Becton has played his last game with the Jets seems comical at this point and hardly a quote to keep citing.

Becton have that baby yet or what

[jamesr]

36 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Becton have that baby yet or what

Is that why his weight went up in the offseason?   

[Jet Nut]

34 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Becton have that baby yet or what

No one actually cares.  Training as he is now seems to be working fine.

Has absolutely nothing to do with Bruglers statement that Becton has played his last game as a Jets being so monumentally wrong. 

[#27TheDominator]

5 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

No one actually cares.  Training as he is now seems to be working fine.

Has absolutely nothing to do with Bruglers statement that Becton has played his last game as a Jets being so monumentally wrong. 

I get being a positive dude, but exactly what ******* evidence do you have that anything is "working fine?"  He has not played a down or even been to the facility.  Color me unimpressed with videos of him doing farmer's carries.  Just like last year when we read about his private chef and that he was keeping his weight down and then he was getting his ass handed to him all camp and not looking great against the Panthers.

I imagine Brugler got his info from sources that were expecting the Jets to move Becton at the draft.  They didn't, but that doesn't mean they weren't close.  Example: If the Jets were super high on Sauce, they might have been looking to put a deal in place and take a tackle at 10.  That may have been negated by all 3 tackles going between 5 and 9.  Or maybe they just weren't getting enough back for Becton.  We have him and he has potential, but I have not seen anything to make us particularly confident.  Were you this confident all of last season when he was constantly a week or two away? 

[Warfish]

16 hours ago, Dunnie said:

Interesting... how did he do with Rookie Tannehill ... uh wait .... nvm

What point are you trying to make here exactly?

[slats]

13 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

I get being a positive dude, but exactly what ******* evidence do you have that anything is "working fine?"  He has not played a down or even been to the facility.  Color me unimpressed with videos of him doing farmer's carries.  Just like last year when we read about his private chef and that he was keeping his weight down and then he was getting his ass handed to him all camp and not looking great against the Panthers.

I imagine Brugler got his info from sources that were expecting the Jets to move Becton at the draft.  They didn't, but that doesn't mean they weren't close.  Example: If the Jets were super high on Sauce, they might have been looking to put a deal in place and take a tackle at 10.  That may have been negated by all 3 tackles going between 5 and 9.  Or maybe they just weren't getting enough back for Becton.  We have him and he has potential, but I have not seen anything to make us particularly confident.  Were you this confident all of last season when he was constantly a week or two away? 

Moses took the same money the Jets were offering because he wanted a chance to start. If the Jets were seriously thinking about replacing Becton, I don’t think they let him go. I think they let him know that he has a very real chance to be the starter here. That didn’t happen. They only added a free agent guard, and did little to no sniffing around OTs. They drafted a guy in the fourth who’s probably a year in the weight room away. Just think a GM who’s been so focused on the OL doesn’t just leave the tackle position to, “hey, maybe a good guy will be there at #10… ” I suspect the plan at #10 was WR all along. It was just too obvious. 
 
Becton didn’t help himself this offseason, spending way too much time feeding his Twitter trolls. Bullies want to see the reactions from the people they’re picking on, and they got plenty of it from Big Bust. It was mostly a fan driven narrative, driven by the frustration of a 4-8 week injury lasting the whole season. That injury is one of the great mysteries, too. That narrative allowed the Jets to hide their real plans. 

[EM31]

On 5/4/2022 at 5:33 AM, southparkcpa said:

Yea.. seems like yesterday, EVERY off season, Gholsten was bustin it!!!!

And before that every Chad Pannington shoulder reconstruction came with 20%-30% extra on has fastball

[derp]

If Becton’s ability to play a position that was capably filled almost all of last year by a guy signed to a one year, $3M deal last June is the second most significant question facing the Jets - and arguably the most polarizing - things are pretty good.

It’s a fun time. Tons of questions but a lot more potential than we’re used to. Hopefully a fun camp and lots of those questions are answered in the affirmative.

[#27TheDominator]

12 minutes ago, slats said:

Moses took the same money the Jets were offering because he wanted a chance to start. If the Jets were seriously thinking about replacing Becton, I don’t think they let him go. I think they let him know that he has a very real chance to be the starter here. That didn’t happen. They only added a free agent guard, and did little to no sniffing around OTs. They drafted a guy in the fourth who’s probably a year in the weight room away. Just think a GM who’s been so focused on the OL doesn’t just leave the tackle position to, “hey, maybe a good guy will be there at #10… ” I suspect the plan at #10 was WR all along. It was just too obvious. 
 
Becton didn’t help himself this offseason, spending way too much time feeding his Twitter trolls. Bullies want to see the reactions from the people they’re picking on, and they got plenty of it from Big Bust. It was mostly a fan driven narrative, driven by the frustration of a 4-8 week injury lasting the whole season. That injury is one of the great mysteries, too. That narrative allowed the Jets to hide their real plans. 

Maybe. 

Maybe they didn't like Moses as much as the board did.  He was okay, but not exactly a powerhouse and I thought he was a curious fit in the first place.  I don't think expecting Icky, Neal or Cross to be there at 10 was a stretch.  I think all three gone was a surprise.  I would also have expected to address WR, but maybe you are right.  It is possible they expected something decent back that could have been used at WR.  

I think they want a long term solution at T.  I don't think they wanted to be dealing with Moses and Fant as the starters going forward, so it is worth seeing what they have in Becton.  We act like they need an established T, but the team won 4 games.  Becton played in none of the wins.  I think that Fant missed most of the Bengals game and Moses missed part of the Jacksonville game.  In one of their best offensive performances against the Bucs, Fant only lasted about 1/3 the game.  Rolling with Becton and these backups might not be seen as a downgrade from Moses even if they don't love Becton.

You likely might be right, but the idea they wanted to move on from Becton is not a wild one.  

[Jet Nut]

5 hours ago, #27TheDominator said:

I get being a positive dude, but exactly what ******* evidence do you have that anything is "working fine?"  He has not played a down or even been to the facility.  Color me unimpressed with videos of him doing farmer's carries.  Just like last year when we read about his private chef and that he was keeping his weight down and then he was getting his ass handed to him all camp and not looking great against the Panthers.

I imagine Brugler got his info from sources that were expecting the Jets to move Becton at the draft.  They didn't, but that doesn't mean they weren't close.  Example: If the Jets were super high on Sauce, they might have been looking to put a deal in place and take a tackle at 10.  That may have been negated by all 3 tackles going between 5 and 9.  Or maybe they just weren't getting enough back for Becton.  We have him and he has potential, but I have not seen anything to make us particularly confident.  Were you this confident all of last season when he was constantly a week or two away? 

I’d say getting into shape, working hard is doing fine.  Anyone have any proof that it’s not going fine for him?  Why assume the worst?  Just because it’s what some do, assume the worst?  There’s nothing that comes close to saying there’s problem at this point.    The fact that we didn’t trade him, didn’t move on from him or draft his replacement makes me believe that right now things are fine.

Burger can have sources.  They obviously ****ed this one up.  They were wrong.  So we’re going to keep saying he has his sources and try to justify those sources aren’t solid?  Keep making comments like it doesn’t mean they weren’t close to moving `Becton when there isn’t anything close to proving that was the case.  There hasn’t been even a hint that the Jets were trying to move him.   I’m not doing total fantasy projections to justify how Brugler and his sources may have been right.  They weren’t.  If the Jets wanted to move Becton there would have been lots of teams interested, it wouldn’t have been hard.  

Last year was a disaster for Becton, agreed.  I don’t know the problems with his rehab to his knee.  No one’s talking.  I’m not going to make worst case scenarios up in my head to explain what happened.  I’ve seen evidence that he’s in shape.  He’s not fat and lazy today.  I’ll leave it at that and hope he stays on the field because unlike many, I remember how good he was when he was on the field and want to see him with an AVT or Tomlinson next to him 

[slats]

10 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

I don't think expecting Icky, Neal or Cross to be there at 10 was a stretch.

I really do think it would’ve been. I was mildly surprised none of them went in the top three, but the Giants, Panthers, and Seahawks were all extremely likely OT destinations in the first round before the draft started. Only real wildcard was if any of them were willing to take a chance on one of the QBs, but they obviously dropped like rocks. League insiders (like JD) probably had a good feeling about where those tackles and QBs were likely to be picked. 

[derp]

24 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Maybe. 

Maybe they didn't like Moses as much as the board did.  He was okay, but not exactly a powerhouse and I thought he was a curious fit in the first place.  I don't think expecting Icky, Neal or Cross to be there at 10 was a stretch.  I think all three gone was a surprise.  I would also have expected to address WR, but maybe you are right.  It is possible they expected something decent back that could have been used at WR.  

I think they want a long term solution at T.  I don't think they wanted to be dealing with Moses and Fant as the starters going forward, so it is worth seeing what they have in Becton.  We act like they need an established T, but the team won 4 games.  Becton played in none of the wins.  I think that Fant missed most of the Bengals game and Moses missed part of the Jacksonville game.  In one of their best offensive performances against the Bucs, Fant only lasted about 1/3 the game.  Rolling with Becton and these backups might not be seen as a downgrade from Moses even if they don't love Becton.

You likely might be right, but the idea they wanted to move on from Becton is not a wild one.  

I could absolutely see them wanting to move on from Becton, and I kind of think they do, but timing is significant. How likely is it that he bounces back this year and rebuilds some of his value? It’s pretty low right now, to the point that coming back and being just good and nothing more this year at right tackle probably increases it.

Him being good at football and them not feeling that they want to pay him that next contract aren’t mutually exclusive. He had a great rookie year. 

If they think he’s going to bomb this year then by all means the move is to cut bait and replace him. Their actions don’t seem to think they feel that way. If they can get a solid season out of him they can probably get a whole lot more in return. And playing right tackle for this team last year wasn’t exactly terribly difficult, with worse right guards next to them and a young quarterback.

[JoeNamathsFurCoat]

It’s an unpopular take, but the coaches are partially to blame for Mims’ lack of involvement/ production.

If they actually cared, they would do what they did with Moore, start scheming him easy touches around the LOS to get him into the flow of the game.

Mims was probably the 4th or 5th option on every play any time they put him on the field.

And Zach Wilson hasn’t exactly mastered patience in the pocket and/or full read progressions yet.

As much as Mims has been ripped by fans and media, those rookie year catches / plays actually happened.

[Sperm Edwards]

On 5/8/2022 at 4:42 PM, T0mShane said:

One wonders what information Douglas is working off of that would lead him to trust Becton even a little bit. It was Dane Brugler who said he heard from several executives that Becton had played his last game in a Jets uniform. Brugler, who was exceedingly complimentary of the Jets draft, is hardly a click-whoring beat guy. He got this information while talking to people around the league about draft prospects. I guess Douglas could hope and pray Becton keeps it together for the next eight months, but how could he be at all confident in that belief? 

I can't speak for others, but I don't care even if Becton has already played his last game for the Jets I still wouldn't burn the #4 overall pick on a RT. 

Far better to choose an available veteran and take the more uniquely-skilled playmaker at #4, while also letting a day 3 pick give it a homerun try to take the position if/when said veteran misses time to injury (if not eventually on IR outright).

QBs don't turn into busts because their team didn't invest a top 5 pick to field a rookie RT. If Wilson sucks (again) it'll be on him. 

[JohnnyLV]

On 5/7/2022 at 5:04 AM, slats said:

I love all the Mims happy talk, but he’s no lock to make the team. He’s currently #5 behind four locks. And JD won’t hesitate to upgrade if the right WR hits the waiver wire. 

That might be true but when JD and Saleh talk about Mims it is in VERY positive language and not the "positive" vague language they used for someone like Adams, you know the "we expect Jamal to be here/no plans to trade him" blah blah blah. I still maintain there was much more to the Mims story last year than the Jets disclosed. 

[JohnnyLV]

47 minutes ago, JoeNamathsFurCoat said:

It’s an unpopular take, but the coaches are partially to blame for Mims’ lack of involvement/ production.

If they actually cared, they would do what they did with Moore, start scheming him easy touches around the LOS to get him into the flow of the game.

Mims was probably the 4th or 5th option on every play any time they put him on the field.

And Zach Wilson hasn’t exactly mastered patience in the pocket and/or full read progressions yet.

As much as Mims has been ripped by fans and media, those rookie year catches / plays actually happened.

Maybe Mims will bust but I do remember him being consistently WIDE open his rookie year.  Also if you look at his physique this year versus last year it is night and day. I do think they handled him poorly, he is a shyer more introverted player, a lot like Braylon was so hopefully they adjust their coaching too.

[slats]

36 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

That might be true but when JD and Saleh talk about Mims it is in VERY positive language and not the "positive" vague language they used for someone like Adams, you know the "we expect Jamal to be here/no plans to trade him" blah blah blah. I still maintain there was much more to the Mims story last year than the Jets disclosed. 

This regime is tight-lipped. There’s obviously a lot more to Becton’s injury last year, too, that no one’s talking about. I wanted Mims in that draft and I’d like nothing more than for him to succeed. I also think it’s likely that the Jets open the season with a WR on the roster who isn’t currently on the team. 

[Dunnie]

What point are you trying to make here exactly?

Comparing results of a rookie to a vet with a better OL will lead u to the results u posted.