#27TheDominator Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 16 hours ago, Alka said: If it were only my opinion than it's your opinion vs. mine But that's just not the case. You're just trying to stoke up a debate. You either are not knowledgeable or you are ignorant, or you are just trying to be contrary. How about this: There are only 2 defensive players in the history of the NFL who was named MVP of the NFL. Those 2 people are Lawrence Taylor and Alan Page. LT was not only the greatest linebacker who ever lived, he was the best defensive player who ever lived. I put him in the tip 5 players of all time. I don't think I am wrong. Anybody standing up for Alan Page as the all-time greatest? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 21 hours ago, CanadaSteve said: Are we better with Kayvon Thibodeaux and Garrett Wilson Or are we better with Sauce Gardner, Garrett Wilson, and Jermaine Johnson.? Answer that question and you will have the more important answer for which you seek. That isn't really a fair question. You are talking about #4, #10 and #26 vs #5 and #10. Not exactly apples to apples. Why are you giving Douglas the benefit of another 1st round pick? It would be Sauce, Wilson, Johnson and Ruckert vs. Thibs, Wilson, + 35, 69 and 163. McCreary, Petit-Frere, and Kyle Philips were the Titans picks, but we would not have been limited. Everybody is squawking about Ruckert, but Jelani Woods and Dulcich were still there at 69. They could have taken Hall at 35 which would have left them with 38 and 146. Ebiketie and Micah McFadden were those picks, but again we would not have been limited. We could have probably still had McCreary at #38 (or Kyler Gordon, Boye Mafe, Walker, Booth Jr., Wan'Dale, etc.) and there were plenty of bodies available at 146, but I think the best choice would be based on where we went earlier in the draft. This is why the pff nerds and Jason were talking about no liking our process. The front loaded draft is nice. It is nice to read an article saying that we got 3 of our top 8, but if Johnson doesn't play like the 8th best player in the draft, it doesn't seem so smart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FootballLove Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 I recall one game. Parcells, Belichick, LT, the whole lot. All they had to do was defeat the lowly NY Jets last game of the season and they're in the POs, possible going for another ring. Anyone recall how the game turned out? I do!!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadaSteve Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 25 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said: That isn't really a fair question. You are talking about #4, #10 and #26 vs #5 and #10. Not exactly apples to apples. Why are you giving Douglas the benefit of another 1st round pick? It would be Sauce, Wilson, Johnson and Ruckert vs. Thibs, Wilson, + 35, 69 and 163. McCreary, Petit-Frere, and Kyle Philips were the Titans picks, but we would not have been limited. Everybody is squawking about Ruckert, but Jelani Woods and Dulcich were still there at 69. They could have taken Hall at 35 which would have left them with 38 and 146. Ebiketie and Micah McFadden were those picks, but again we would not have been limited. We could have probably still had McCreary at #38 (or Kyler Gordon, Boye Mafe, Walker, Booth Jr., Wan'Dale, etc.) and there were plenty of bodies available at 146, but I think the best choice would be based on where we went earlier in the draft. This is why the pff nerds and Jason were talking about no liking our process. The front loaded draft is nice. It is nice to read an article saying that we got 3 of our top 8, but if Johnson doesn't play like the 8th best player in the draft, it doesn't seem so smart. If we take Thibs at 4, we don't move up to take Johnson at 26. Doesn't matter if he fell or not. BUT, we take Sauce Gardner instead, (Wilson would have been the pick either way), and we move up to get our edge guy because he falls. So, the question stills stands: However good you think Thibs is, do you think we would have been better with just him, or having Sauce Gardner and Jermaine Johnson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggs Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 1 hour ago, #27TheDominator said: Everybody is flapping their gums, saying top defender of all time. Nobody is disputing he is among the top few defenders of all time. Then someone said said top 5 player all time. You guys are bashing @johnnysd but I'd bet if there was an all-time draft that LT is not going top 5. Probably 10 QBs go before him. You could draft Jim Brown and match them up. I doubt Brown would be intimidated. Not sure why you need more than 1 QB but if you want to draft 10 in your first 10 my all time team is going to kill yours. If I was picking an all time team it would be tough for me to pick the QB. LT would be my second pick ahead of Jim Brown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 38 minutes ago, Biggs said: Not sure why you need more than 1 QB but if you want to draft 10 in your first 10 my all time team is going to kill yours. If I was picking an all time team it would be tough for me to pick the QB. LT would be my second pick ahead of Jim Brown. Fair enough, but a guy who thinks LT isn't in the top 5 overall is not crazy. You are picking LT 33rd, right? I think Jim Brown will be gone before 65. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 52 minutes ago, CanadaSteve said: If we take Thibs at 4, we don't move up to take Johnson at 26. Doesn't matter if he fell or not. BUT, we take Sauce Gardner instead, (Wilson would have been the pick either way), and we move up to get our edge guy because he falls. So, the question stills stands: However good you think Thibs is, do you think we would have been better with just him, or having Sauce Gardner and Jermaine Johnson. What about the other three players you are leaving out of the equation? I just squint and pretend that the Titans didn't get them? No matter how you word it, Jermaine Johnson wasn't free. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 7 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said: Fair enough, but a guy who thinks LT isn't in the top 5 overall is not crazy. You are picking LT 33rd, right? I think Jim Brown will be gone before 65. Unless you're talking 5 QBs or Jim Brown , it sure is crazy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 48 minutes ago, Biggs said: Not sure why you need more than 1 QB but if you want to draft 10 in your first 10 my all time team is going to kill yours. If I was picking an all time team it would be tough for me to pick the QB. LT would be my second pick ahead of Jim Brown. FWIW, in the Jetnation all-time draft LT went third behind Rice and Montana. I picked 18 and took Elway who was the 5th QB off the board. Seems dumb in retrospect, but I had a team theme going and planned to run a ton of RPO. july-madness-all-time-draft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 4 minutes ago, Jet Nut said: Unless you're talking 5 QBs or Jim Brown , it sure is crazy. You don't think 5 QBs go first? Are you filling out a depth chart or deciding who were the best/most valuable players of all time? The times have changed. There was an era where 5 RBs would go first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UntouchableCrew Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 I wanted him at 4 over Sauce, but I'm happy with how things played out. With the benefit of hindsight I think it's fair to ask which you'd rather have: 4 Sauce 10 Wilson 26 Johnson 36 Hall 101 Ruckert OR 4 Thibodeaux 10 Wilson 35 Hall 38 Kyler Gordon 69 Jelani Woods 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadaSteve Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 1 hour ago, #27TheDominator said: What about the other three players you are leaving out of the equation? I just squint and pretend that the Titans didn't get them? No matter how you word it, Jermaine Johnson wasn't free. ACTUAL FIRST ROUND 4. Sauce Gardner 10. Garrett Wilson 26. Jermaine Johnson HYPOTHETICAL FIRST ROUND 4. Kaylon Thibodeaux 10. Garrett Wilson There is no other three players. He asked might we have been better if we drafted Thibodeaux instead of Gardner in the first round (I am presuming Wilson would be the same pick). I prefer what we did do in the first round (3 players) over his hypothetical 2 players. Who knows? Maybe if we also trade up hypothetically in his hypothetical round 1, perhaps I would like his better (say if the 26th pick hypothetically would be Davonte Wyatt). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 23 minutes ago, CanadaSteve said: ACTUAL FIRST ROUND 4. Sauce Gardner 10. Garrett Wilson 26. Jermaine Johnson HYPOTHETICAL FIRST ROUND 4. Kaylon Thibodeaux 10. Garrett Wilson There is no other three players. He asked might we have been better if we drafted Thibodeaux instead of Gardner in the first round (I am presuming Wilson would be the same pick). I prefer what we did do in the first round (3 players) over his hypothetical 2 players. Who knows? Maybe if we also trade up hypothetically in his hypothetical round 1, perhaps I would like his better (say if the 26th pick hypothetically would be Davonte Wyatt). This take seems ridiculous. I didn't see anybody limiting it to the first round. The dude said: Quote I'm very happy with our draft and couldn't be happier where we are headed. That being said, part of me worries that we should have taken Thibs. I know its all speculation until the rubber meets the road but I can shake the feeling he's going to be the next LT for the Giants. Anyone else had these thoughts? That's what you responded to, but you want to pretend that somehow we should pretend that we got Jermaine Johnson as a free throw in? Be my guest, but it seems silly. I guess then in August of 2021 if you asked if the Seahawks were better off for making the Adams trade the answer would be yes, since he is better than Bradley MacDougald? I mean all those future picks don't mean sh*t, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRy56 Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 Sauce will have a better career than KT. At the end of the day I think Sauce may end up being the best pick of the draft. Love that dude's game Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy 2 Times Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 3 hours ago, FootballLove said: I recall one game. Parcells, Belichick, LT, the whole lot. All they had to do was defeat the lowly NY Jets last game of the season and they're in the POs, possible going for another ring. Anyone recall how the game turned out? I do!!!! Toon in the corner of the end zone! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted May 13, 2022 Share Posted May 13, 2022 1 hour ago, Jimmy 2 Times said: Toon in the corner of the end zone! Suck it LT! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted May 14, 2022 Share Posted May 14, 2022 9 hours ago, #27TheDominator said: You don't think 5 QBs go first? Are you filling out a depth chart or deciding who were the best/most valuable players of all time? The times have changed. There was an era where 5 RBs would go first. Thats what I said. not counting QBs. Who go first because of the importance of the position today, agreed. Lawrence Taylor is easily a top 5 player even with that though IMO. NFLN has him at #3 on their top 100 list. I think he was so much better compared to his contemporaries, I dont see a QB who is as far ahead of others the way LT was Nothing makes for varied differences of opinions than an all time list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadaSteve Posted May 14, 2022 Share Posted May 14, 2022 8 hours ago, #27TheDominator said: This take seems ridiculous. I didn't see anybody limiting it to the first round. The dude said: That's what you responded to, but you want to pretend that somehow we should pretend that we got Jermaine Johnson as a free throw in? Be my guest, but it seems silly. I guess then in August of 2021 if you asked if the Seahawks were better off for making the Adams trade the answer would be yes, since he is better than Bradley MacDougald? I mean all those future picks don't mean sh*t, right? Not sure what to say dude. He asks what the thoughts are if we took Kayvon Thibodeaux. Which would have meant him and (probably) Wilson in the first compared to our first. My take? I like our first round better. Not sure what else to say or explain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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