Browns franchise going forward

[JohnnyLV]

The reality is that the HBO show and the new Vrentas article basically short circuit he NFLs plan which I believe was to sort of ignore it, slut shame the women in their investigation (which they claimed was finished) and just hope it all goes away after a short term suspension. But that is almost impossible to do now. Particularly damning is the testimony that at least one of the women (who is not suing or pressing charges) just sort of gave in to his behavior. Not only does it back up the other claims but it completely removes the defense that he was not looking for sexual favors which he adamantly claimed when this started. Also with the recent allegations against the Houston organization themselves and the strong likelihood that there are others to come forward, this is just not going away and it it now switches to the NFL needing to distance themselves from Watson significantly. 

[Jetsfan80]

1 hour ago, johnnysd said:

The reality is that the HBO show and the new Vrentas article basically short circuit he NFLs plan which I believe was to sort of ignore it, slut shame the women in their investigation (which they claimed was finished) and just hope it all goes away after a short term suspension. But that is almost impossible to do now. Particularly damning is the testimony that at least one of the women (who is not suing or pressing charges) just sort of gave in to his behavior. Not only does it back up the other claims but it completely removes the defense that he was not looking for sexual favors which he adamantly claimed when this started. Also with the recent allegations against the Houston organization themselves and the strong likelihood that there are others to come forward, this is just not going away and it it now switches to the NFL needing to distance themselves from Watson significantly. 

Kind of like when the video surfaced of Ray Rice hitting his gf.  The laughable 2-game suspension suddenly became 6 overnight, and then he subsequently got cut.  

The NFL is truly a joke with this sh*t.

[RutgersJetFan]

1 hour ago, johnnysd said:

Not only does it back up the other claims but it completely removes the defense that he was not looking for sexual favors which he adamantly claimed when this started. 

Not to mention Hardin's statement on this specific matter which was nothing short of horrific. 

[Jet Life]

On 6/8/2022 at 2:26 PM, bitonti said:

anyone else remember the last time Mekhi Becton faced Myles Garrett? 

it did not go well for Becton 

all this QB drama aside they are a tough team especially on defense 

Actually laughed out loud scrolling this thread and getting to this comment. So random. Becton derangement syndrome 

[FidelioJet]

9 hours ago, johnnysd said:

The reality is that the HBO show and the new Vrentas article basically short circuit he NFLs plan which I believe was to sort of ignore it, slut shame the women in their investigation (which they claimed was finished) and just hope it all goes away after a short term suspension. But that is almost impossible to do now. Particularly damning is the testimony that at least one of the women (who is not suing or pressing charges) just sort of gave in to his behavior. Not only does it back up the other claims but it completely removes the defense that he was not looking for sexual favors which he adamantly claimed when this started. Also with the recent allegations against the Houston organization themselves and the strong likelihood that there are others to come forward, this is just not going away and it it now switches to the NFL needing to distance themselves from Watson significantly. 

While I agree this is a reasonable way to look at things - I just think the NFL is shameless.

The NFL and its media arms, including but not limited to ESPN, will combine together to bury this.  

HBO and NY Times did their story, they're not going to do another one - and they did it in the slowest part of the summer - interesting timing to release a story about the NFL.  It's now been officially covered.

Now, if there's any video evidence all bets are off, but barring that I really think this is an 6-8 week suspicion and done.

[PFSIKH]

17 hours ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

Again, explain to me how going from 22 to 24 changes anything? Because maybe it will go 26 or 28? It was horrible at 1 or 2, worse at 4-5. Once you get to 22 and still say "I am willing to trade 3 1sts and pay him 200 million" it makes zero sense to then draw the imaginary line at 24. 

Again, there has been ZERO from the Browns on this subject. Just a stupid Florio report that the Browns MAY be able to cut him.....IF they wanted to do....with zero report to indicate they have any interest in ever doing so. Yet many here are running with this fake story. 

Well, that is the Browns doing Browns' things.

The ridiculous contract and trade put aside, I understand the Browns move.  The 22 initial women suing Watson was still there, but there were no criminal charges. 

It changed because it keeps going up and more details are coming out.  It is not 40 over 3 years.  It is now 66 in 17 months.  It is not just 24 women suing Watson.  There are quite a few who elected not to press charges and/or sue.  Between the NY Times article and lawyers, there are 20 more women.  it is going from 'happy endings' as his lawyer said to rape.

Is Florio regurgitating the obvious?  Maybe.  Is he putting something out there for someone with in the Browns' FO to lessen the inevitable sh*t storm?  I would think this is more likely.

[JoJoTownsell1]

23 minutes ago, PFSIKH said:

 

It changed because it keeps going up and more details are coming out.  It is not 40 over 3 years.  It is now 66 in 17 months.  It is not just 24 women suing Watson.  

 

LOL, it's 66 different massage therapists in 17 months. It's comical that we have completely bypassed innocent until proven guilty to guilty of crimes that don't even exist. When all 66 come back with assault allegations THEN we have can have that discussion about that 66 number. 

The Browns knew Watson was alleged by a ton of women of being, at BEST a creep and at worst a disgusting human facing 22 sexual assault allegations. Going from 22 to 24 changes nothing. Having gone to more massage therapists changes nothing.

You have just been mislead by Florio trying to get clicks. Even Florio didn't suggest the Browns were even contemplating cutting a player they just traded away 3 1st round picks because.......they won't.

Sure, if he ultimately gets indicted and gets jail time, the Browns may reconsider, but that ain't happening based on the addition of 2 more plaintiffs in a civil suit that already had 22. 

[slats]

4 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

LOL, it's 66 different massage therapists in 17 months. It's comical that we have completely bypassed innocent until proven guilty to guilty of crimes that don't even exist. When all 66 come back with assault allegations THEN we have can have that discussion about that 66 number. 

Yes, I was never raped by a priest, that’s how I know all those allegations against the church are just a bunch of little money grubbers. 

[ScarletKnight89]

Cleveland really came off looking scummy here. Clearly it's all about winning for them at any and all costs. Optics be damned. Isn't Watson only making like $1 million dollars in year 1 because they are planning for a possible year long suspension and they were basically trying to out maneuver the NFL?

[#27TheDominator]

One of the more serious questions in all this is if he has been able to stop.  His behavior seemed like a compulsion and I question whether he would be able to rationally say - oh hey, I'd better not do that any more.  

[JoJoTownsell1]

1 minute ago, slats said:

Yes, I was never raped by a priest, that’s how I know all those allegations against the church are just a bunch of little money grubbers. 

 It's kind of odd that you are suggesting that Priest raping kids and Watson sexual assaulting people is not a big deal. 

[KRL]

2 minutes ago, ScarletKnight89 said:

Cleveland really came off looking scummy here. Clearly it's all about winning for them at any and all costs. Optics be damned. Isn't Watson only making like $1 million dollars in year 1 because they are planning for a possible year long suspension and they were basically trying to out maneuver the NFL?

If the NFL had any guts they would split any suspension Watson gets over two years to spank both the player and team.

So if they're thinking about a full season suspension they should do 8 games in 2022 and 9 games in 2023

[Jet Nut]

23 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

When all 66 come back with assault allegations THEN we have can have that discussion about that 66 number. 

Because 24 aren’t enough for some, there have to file assault charges to make the others who do want to be labeled sluts for the allegations to be true.  Read this thread to see some who don’t see the problems in believing Watson and suggest that the women are just in it for the $

[slats]

5 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

 It's kind of odd that you are suggesting that Priest raping kids and Watson sexual assaulting people is not a big deal. 

Is that what I’m doing? I thought I was pointing out the absurdly bull**** nature of, “When all 66 come back with assault allegations THEN we have can have that discussion about that 66 number.”

[JoJoTownsell1]

2 minutes ago, slats said:

Is that what I’m doing? I thought I was pointing out the absurdly bull**** nature of, “When all 66 come back with assault allegations THEN we have can have that discussion about that 66 number.”

I don't think you understand the details of this situation if this is your response. 

[slats]

8 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

I don't think you understand the details of this situation if this is your response. 

Yeah, and I’m certain that you didn’t read the Vrentas article that originally brought up the 66 different massage therapists in 17 months, how he hit many of them up on Instagram and often let them know that experience wasn’t an issue. 
 
Again, 66 different massage therapists in 17 months. Who does that? I mean, outside of people preying on massage therapists. 

[JoJoTownsell1]

1 minute ago, slats said:

Yeah, and I’m certain that you didn’t read the Vrentas article that originally brought up the 66 different massage therapists in 17 months, how he hit many of them up on Instagram and often let them know that experience wasn’t an issue. 
 
Again, 66 different massage therapists in 17 months. Who does that? I mean, outside of people preying on massage therapists. 

He is facing 24 sexual allegations. As I have said many times, in this thread and others, he is a creep at best and likely committed criminal acts even if they haven't lead to an indictment. 

We don't need to CREATE 42 more victims when they MAY not be, you know, victims. That isn't defending Watson, that's simply defending the facts as we know it. 

[All Gas, No Gase]

5 minutes ago, slats said:

Yeah, and I’m certain that you didn’t read the Vrentas article that originally brought up the 66 different massage therapists in 17 months, how he hit many of them up on Instagram and often let them know that experience wasn’t an issue. 
 
Again, 66 different massage therapists in 17 months. Who does that? I mean, outside of people preying on massage therapists. 

For sure. Having serious back problems, I’ve had many massages to ease the pain. After finding a great massage therapist, I’d go back to that therapist as much as possible. 66 different therapists in 17 month suggests he’s looking for something more than massage therapy. 

[Doggin94it]

20 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

He is facing 24 sexual allegations. As I have said many times, in this thread and others, he is a creep at best and likely committed criminal acts even if they haven't lead to an indictment. 

We don't need to CREATE 42 more victims when they MAY not be, you know, victims. That isn't defending Watson, that's simply defending the facts as we know it. 

You're missing the point. The issue with the "66 therapists" isn't "he had 66 victims". It's that anyone averaging 4 different massage therapists per month for 17 months is (1) clearly not just looking for a massage and (2) either aware that the people he used wouldn't want to see him again or (more likely) getting off in part on doing this to unsuspecting people.

[Biggs]

1 hour ago, #27TheDominator said:

One of the more serious questions in all this is if he has been able to stop.  His behavior seemed like a compulsion and I question whether he would be able to rationally say - oh hey, I'd better not do that any more.  

Sadly the one honest take away I get from Watson is he doesn't believe he did anything wrong.   I think that's a big discountect for people.  We can view his behavior and it seems obviously wrong.   From his POV he hasn't raped anyone, he's paying for the messages and he's giving these women an opportunity to have sex with him or say no.   I think he honestly doesn't believe he's done anything wrong.  

The Texans provided him with hotel rooms and NDA's.   The Browns rewarded him with a new contract that blantantly defies the NFL ability to financialy punish players who tarnish the league image.   He's skated on being indicted.  I wouldn't discount that we see predatory, compulsive behavior, he sees from his history as normal.  He's probably been doing this for a long time.  

[slats]

20 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

He is facing 24 sexual allegations. As I have said many times, in this thread and others, he is a creep at best and likely committed criminal acts even if they haven't lead to an indictment. 

We don't need to CREATE 42 more victims when they MAY not be, you know, victims. That isn't defending Watson, that's simply defending the facts as we know it. 

It’s pointing out the serial nature of his behavior. And some of those 42 are on record as choosing not to pursue cases -not because Watson did not assault them, too, but- because of their own privacy and professional concerns. 

[#27TheDominator]

6 minutes ago, Doggin94it said:

You're missing the point. The issue with the "66 therapists" isn't "he had 66 victims". It's that anyone averaging 4 different massage therapists per month for 17 months is (1) clearly not just looking for a massage and (2) either aware that the people he used wouldn't want to see him again or (more likely) getting off in part on doing this to unsuspecting people.

I think there is an additional importance to the additional women coming forward.  A big part of the defense is the whole Buzbee got these 24 women together to go after Watson.  The fact that others have come forward to corroborate at least portions of the allegations is important for those that think Buzbee has some script he is getting anybody that Watson DM'ed to agree to. 

[JoJoTownsell1]

8 minutes ago, Doggin94it said:

You're missing the point. The issue with the "66 therapists" isn't "he had 66 victims". It's that anyone averaging 4 different massage therapists per month for 17 months is (1) clearly not just looking for a massage and (2) either aware that the people he used wouldn't want to see him again or (more likely) getting off in part on doing this to unsuspecting people.

Those 66 different therapists would be great circumstantial evidence that he MAY have done something if we didn't already have those 24 sexual assault allegations. Circumstantial evidence is a great tool when you don't already have 24 witnesses to a crime. 

It's not like there are people who are going to be like "I don't believe those 24 women, but now that he had 40 more massage therapists I NOW  think Watson is bad guy." 

[JoJoTownsell1]

14 minutes ago, slats said:

It’s pointing out the serial nature of his behavior. And some of those 42 are on record as choosing not to pursue cases -not because Watson did not assault them, too, but- because of their own privacy and professional concerns. 

The serial nature is pretty firmly established by TWENTY FOUR sexual assault allegations. 

[Biggs]

17 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

The serial nature is pretty firmly established by TWENTY FOUR sexual assault allegations. 

Of the 24 only 2 claimed sexual assault.  The other 22 claimed sexual misconduct.  It may seem minor but it's not.  

[slats]

1 hour ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

The serial nature is pretty firmly established by TWENTY FOUR sexual assault allegations. 

So your not generally a fan of corroborating evidence? 

[JohnnyLV]

7 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

While I agree this is a reasonable way to look at things - I just think the NFL is shameless.

The NFL and its media arms, including but not limited to ESPN, will combine together to bury this.  

HBO and NY Times did their story, they're not going to do another one - and they did it in the slowest part of the summer - interesting timing to release a story about the NFL.  It's now been officially covered.

Now, if there's any video evidence all bets are off, but barring that I really think this is an 6-8 week suspicion and done.

It's a possibility. But the attention is now outside of the normal NFL sphere

[JohnnyLV]

4 hours ago, KRL said:

If the NFL had any guts they would split any suspension Watson gets over two years to spank both the player and team.

So if they're thinking about a full season suspension they should do 8 games in 2022 and 9 games in 2023

He should just get 2 years as a starting point. Cases should have concluded by then. NFL should also let him know a "settlement" will confirm that he is more than likely to have committed the crimes than not and his reinstatement is unlikely. (Yeah, I know the NFL wants him to play and disgustingly market the guy more)

[JoJoTownsell1]

2 hours ago, slats said:

So your not generally a fan of corroborating evidence? 

Is there a universe of people out there that were defending Watson until we learned that he had used 66 different massage therapists? If so, do we really care about those idiots opinions? 

Regardless, the point I was originally making was that the Browns aren't more or less likely to cut Watson because of this "revelation." They aren't going to cut bait on him  based on the amount of massage therapists. It's was these women say were done that matters. 

 

 

[CrazyCarl40]

I don’t think this will have a happy ending for the Browns. 

[Dwight Englewood]

On 6/10/2022 at 2:31 PM, johnnysd said:

He should just get 2 years as a starting point. Cases should have concluded by then. NFL should also let him know a "settlement" will confirm that he is more than likely to have committed the crimes than not and his reinstatement is unlikely. (Yeah, I know the NFL wants him to play and disgustingly market the guy more)

A 2 year suspension with no criminal charges or grand jury indictment?  Good luck with that.  Watson will file a grievance with NFLPA and win