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The best rookie pass rusher in NY, indeed the best defensive player on the Jets


hmhertz
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38 minutes ago, hmhertz said:

Michael Clemons, what effort.

Watch him on the last play of the game.

Even on the kick pressuring team he breaks his ass

trying to make a play

Hes a man already and will be a better palyer then JJ year 1.  JJ has better upside though.

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9 hours ago, Joe W. Namath said:

Hes a man already and will be a better palyer then JJ year 1.  JJ has better upside though.

Clemons will be a better player in year 1, in year 2 and so on and so on.  Clemons is the real deal.  I need to see a lot from JJ to make any kind of assessment on him.

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I mentioned in game day thread. 
 

#72’s all-out on field intensity was the ONLY Enjoyable aspect from last nights game. If he can maintain that type of fight resulting in constant edge pressure - you see he has the tools: height, limb length, body mass - all season and get a better DE number than 72, We may have a found diamond in the 4th round!

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1 minute ago, RoadFan said:

Taking JJ over Karlaftis is going to be a missed opportunity.  

That would be a good player career parallel for Jets fan to follow & torture themselves for years to come with that ever-present philosophy of “What-if” regarding players selected in the draft and the opportunity cost of who was still available. Lol

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5 minutes ago, RoadFan said:

Taking JJ over Karlaftis is going to be a missed opportunity.  

i dunno about that.  I tho JJ did ok, he was getting good push and showed his speed at times and showed effort.  Thought he did get hung up at times he needs to break away from but it was all small sample.

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11 hours ago, hmhertz said:

Michael Clemons, what effort.

Watch him on the last play of the game.

Even on the kick pressuring team he breaks his ass

trying to make a play

Now we are talking! 

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3 hours ago, Smashmouth said:

exactly what makes you say JJ has better upside ? Clemons is an absolute beast with an incredible motor and he's already started to show that ...he's also in amazing shape and bigger longer and just as fast as JJ so once again what do you mean by JJ has more upside ?

EDGE success is highly correlated with athleticism.  Doesn't mean a pass rusher can't have success without athleticism, but it makes the road a lot easier if you have it.  So this stuff tends to matter when it comes to an EDGE rusher's ceiling:

 

FNK4_OOWUAUeKE6.png

 

FRTRlweX0AMn7Dl.png

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16 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

EDGE success is highly correlated with athleticism.  Doesn't mean a pass rusher can't have success without athleticism, but it makes the road a lot easier if you have it.  So this stuff tends to matter when it comes to an EDGE rusher's ceiling:

 

FNK4_OOWUAUeKE6.png

 

FRTRlweX0AMn7Dl.png

Clemons is a bigger player which translates to 10th's of a second in the 40 being slightly less. I think Clemons motor and aggression makes him a better pass rusher . We will see as preseason and the season move on. What really matters is how fast they get off on the snap because that eliminates 10th's of a second all remains to be seen but I did see Clemons in the back field quite a bit I didn't see much of JJ not sure on how many snaps they each got which obviously can skew the num,bers

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4 hours ago, 92ShaunEllis92 said:

I mentioned in game day thread. 
 

#72’s all-out on field intensity was the ONLY Enjoyable aspect from last nights game. If he can maintain that type of fight resulting in constant edge pressure - you see he has the tools: height, limb length, body mass - all season and get a better DE number than 72, We may have a found diamond in the 4th round!

everyone knew about Michael Clemons the question was about his OTF Character which turned out to be a bad day for him. Hopefully he got the message and walks the line for us moving forward :)

 

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4 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

Clemons is a bigger player which translates to 10th's of a second in the 40 being slightly less. I think Clemons motor and aggression makes him a better pass rusher . We will see as preseason and the season move on. What really matters is how fast they get off on the snap because that eliminates 10th's of a second all remains to be seen but I did see Clemons in the back field quite a bit I didn't see much of JJ not sure on how many snaps they each got which obviously can skew the num,bers

All of this makes sense.  And to be fair, JJ didn't conduct the all-important 3-Cone drill.  For all we know he might have scored no better than Clemons there.  

I just think it's reasonable to be wary about pass rushers who don't have a ton of athleticism, because they can't always rely on being technically sound or stronger to win the battles with OT's.  Hence why Clemons was a mid-rounder.  Doesn't mean we can't get a huge return on investment there, howerver.

The only pass rushers in recent years I can think of who scored poorly but still had success in the NFL are Matt Judon, Za'Darius Smith and Demarcus Lawrence, and in Lawrence's case, his success didn't last very long.

matt-judon-ras-12835.png?resize=806,522&

zadarius-smith-ras-12271.png?resize=806,

demarcus-lawrence-ras-11181.png?resize=8

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9 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

All of this makes sense.  And to be fair, JJ didn't conduct the all-important 3-Cone drill.  For all we know he might have scored no better than Clemons there.  

I just think it's reasonable to be wary about pass rushers who don't have a ton of athleticism, because they can't always rely on being technically sound or stronger to win the battles with OT's.  Hence why Clemons was a mid-rounder.  Doesn't mean we can't get a huge return on investment there, howerver.

The only pass rushers in recent years I can think of who scored poorly but still had success in the NFL are Matt Judon, Za'Darius Smith and Demarcus Lawrence, and in Lawrence's case, his success didn't last very long.

matt-judon-ras-12835.png?resize=806,522&

zadarius-smith-ras-12271.png?resize=806,

demarcus-lawrence-ras-11181.png?resize=8

Clemons is much more athletic than those guys. He has a very good Ras score a decent explosiveness grade and has great size. RAS can be somehwhat predictive but it does not have measures for heart and motor and if last night is an example Clemons is a 10 in that area.

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6 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

Clemons is much more athletic than those guys. He has a very good Ras score a decent explosiveness grade and has great size. RAS can be somehwhat predictive but it does not have measures for heart and motor and if last night is an example Clemons is a 10 in that area.

No, but heart and motor can only take you so far.  He may not have an ability to hit a higher gear.  

Which is fine.  Again, he was a mid-round pick.  And likely a very good one.  I just question those saying he's automatically going to be better than JJ because of his "heart" and "fire".  We all love those qualities, and I'm certainly not saying he can't be successful.

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i dunno about that.  I tho JJ did ok, he was getting good push and showed his speed at times and showed effort.  Thought he did get hung up at times he needs to break away from but it was all small sample.
Watched the game twice ... if JJ had impact... Clemons had an extiction level collision. JJ was largely incosequential last night.

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk

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26 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

No, but heart and motor can only take you so far.  He may not have an ability to hit a higher gear.  

Which is fine.  Again, he was a mid-round pick.  And likely a very good one.  I just question those saying he's automatically going to be better than JJ because of his "heart" and "fire".  We all love those qualities, and I'm certainly not saying he can't be successful.

Wasn't really making a prediction more saying him becoming elite is not impossible. He was impressive last night see if it continues.

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3 hours ago, Dunnie said:

Watched the game twice ... if JJ had impact... Clemons had an extiction level collision. JJ was largely incosequential last night.

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk
 

i dont doubt it Clemons looks like an animal but i tho JJ did ok he only got 15 snaps and they were earlier in game when Eagles had 1/2 team in there.  Clemons came into game early too which i was not expecting but he played 30 snaps.

Did you notice how the Eagles were playing 8 men in box in those 1st couple series?  I tho that was a little odd for a preseason game.

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5 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

EDGE success is highly correlated with athleticism.  Doesn't mean a pass rusher can't have success without athleticism, but it makes the road a lot easier if you have it.  So this stuff tends to matter when it comes to an EDGE rusher's ceiling:

 

FNK4_OOWUAUeKE6.png

 

FRTRlweX0AMn7Dl.png

Why do the exact same 40 times get wildly different RAS scores?

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