Saleh's press conference - Sounds like Flacco does have a shot to be the qb this year

[Jimmy 2 Times]

Just now, southparkcpa said:

We either see if Wilson is it or we don't. This playing Flacco to get 6-9 wins is loser mentality.  IMO.  

If Wilson is healthy he needs to play.

But playing Flacco isn't a loser mentality.  He's helping to develop our 1st and 2nd year studs.  

 

Again, if Zach turns out to be bad, this team is poised to be a great location for a vet unhappy with his situation.  

[southparkcpa]

31 minutes ago, Darnold Schwarzenegger said:

Neither is Wilson 

I'm OK knowing that for certain.   Not sure management believes that but if that's true, we need to draft another QB or get Garrapalo.

[Sperm Edwards]

I stayed out of this thread - including reading - past the first few pages, figuring it’d die out. Wow.

20 hours ago, ZachEY said:

Why should anyone within this organization care about the fans "need" to see it?  They're in practices and meetings.  No one on this website actually needed to "see what we have in Hackenberg" despite the ongoing refrain.

Yeah, this isn’t a true statement . I’m not going to spend my morning looking up examples by guessing the right keyword searches through pronoun use regarding Hackenberg, but there plenty of posters & posts to the contrary here.

For those, there was no regard for, well just because we haven’t seen him doesn’t mean the coaches haven’t seen him, and haven’t been facepalming after every 3rd throw. They needed to see it themselves, as though to insinuate the coaches needed to see, too. Wasn’t unlike the ‘start Tebow’ from some back when he was here. It was dumb in both cases. Even a below-average QBC/OC can see in practice when there’s no point, as can the rest of the players on the roster. Some fans stubbornly don’t accept that until they see firsthand. 

19 hours ago, FidelioJet said:

But there you go again..

300 yards a game is a 5100 yard season.  235 yards per game average is a 4000 yard season. (250 is you're going by the 16 game sched.)

If ZW is winning, say at a .500 clip -  averaging 250 a game, 2:1 TD:INT ration - 58-62% completion

I don't know how you could see those #'s as anything but a massively positive sign.  

Again, I think eye test is everything - but if you're going strictly by numbers....these are realistic, attainable and are about where I think he'll end up.

I think @Warfish responded to this but it was already in my multi-quote. He didn’t say Wilson has to average 300 yards a game. He said have “a 300-yard game” not a 300-yard average for all his games. For an average I think his own benchmark is in the 250-yard range. If it’s 225 he’s less thrilled with it, but that’s at least in the ballpark, and could grade a little on a curve since it’s a 2nd season from a QB who shouldn’t have started as a rookie, and some guys grow into good veterans slower than others. But it’d be obvious progress.

19 hours ago, ChuckkieB said:

I want to learn this season if Zack Wilson is a franchise QB, and I also want to win games.  It would be great if both happen concurrently, but as long as Flacco continues to win games, he is going to remain the starter. We've had so many games over the last 20 seasons handed over to backup bums that had no business being in the NFL, and now that we have a decent NFL veteran, we want to yank him off the field as soon as possible.  Don't worry, Flacco will eventually play down to his late career averages and take his rightful spot on the bench, but until that happens, you have to ride him like a pack mule. Zack will get his chance this season.

This. Also wins are relative, too. If we beat Cincinnati 6-3 on Sunday despite Flacco throwing 0 TDs and committing 2 turnovers we’ll be 2-1, but it’d be in spite of him. Eye test, like his first 300-yard game that required nearly 2 games of attempts.

I said in preseason, while there was 90% poster opinion that he serves no purpose on the roster, that he’s one of the better backups in the league. There are young receivers to develop, too. There’s also an offense that needs to show it can find some rhythm as well, beyond throwing 5-yard passes en route to one of the Bengals’ 7 losses. Important because, if Wilson looks lousy again when he’s in there, there should be more than just insinuation that the offense could look competent with someone else & that these young players around him aren’t Mims-like busts as well. 

19 hours ago, win4ever said:

WTF?  We were a Nick Chubb kneeling down away from 0-2, why the hell is Joe Flacco starting threads.  Now we pulled a miracle out, and all of a sudden, he's in play?  If Saleh starts Flacco over Wilson, he's making the same idiotic mistake toilet Bowles made with Fitzpatrick and Flores made with....Fitzpatrick.  The short term clarity doesn't matter when the long term outlook needs to be deciphered.  

You start Wilson, and you find out one way or another what you have.  If Wilson has it, great.  If Wilson doesn't, you know the area that needs to be addressed.  

100%, and the post should have that much more weight since I know how much you didn’t want to draft him & made a blog of film & excruciating detail as to why. 

Except we did draft him, and Flacco has done at least enough dirty work to show this offense isn’t a hopeless case where “Tom Brady couldn’t move the ball on this offense,” excuses aren’t going to fly now. Appreciate Flacco for doing that. Now when Wilson’s cleared medically, or fully cleared, or whatever 110% means, he plays.

Between now & Sunday, if people want to fulfill fantasy what-ifs of “What if Flacco throws for [unlikely yardage & TD #s] and the Jets win because of it?” they’re welcome to do so.

The thing you hope to get in drafting a QB early isn’t just acquiring a young QB who’s otherwise unavailable; it’s also a 4-year window at a 75% discount over the overwhelmingly most expensive veteran position. He’s a $10MM starter (hopefully starter) in an era of $40-50MM/year FQBs. Seattle’s early-Wilson championship team flourished under that advantage (except Wilson wasn’t even $1MM for years). Is this Wilson as good as that one? Seems pretty unlikely, but he has to play to determine exactly where his ceiling - and floor - is beyond a weak rookie season.

He plays. If he’s unusably-awful again & again, then he gets benched & there’s no what-if for next year.

17 hours ago, doitny said:

why was he bad? cause we lost 24-9 ? 

cause he only threw 1 TD?

again, 2 drives killed 1 by the Hall fumble at the 16. thats points lost that has nothing to do with Flacco.  that was a 75 yd drive that he got 66 of those yds and no points. 

Conklin killed a 1st down at the 21 cause of his fumble. we had to settle for 3 points. 

Carter drops a TD and we turn it over on downs. do you remember how wide open he was? that was a 62 yd drive killed.

im not sure what QB can win with the drive killing redzone killing mistakes. 

TB12 couldnt win this game. i mean look at these mistakes. they all came on critical plays. Carters drop was on 4th down. Conklin fumble on 3rd down. there wasnt even another play for Flacco to right the ship. 

 

All true, but his yardage totals were also based on ~60 dropbacks. A 300-yard game is supposed to come from a QB averaging 8-10 yards/attempt, not 5-6 per attempt. Never-mind 1/6 of it came in garbage time, dinking & dunking against a prevent defense, culminating in a meaningless TD with 1-minute left that merely made the final score 24-9 instead of 24-3.

Point being, we don’t get to pocket a garbage-time drive as though it’d have happened anyway, even if not for the other facepalms along the way that you rightly outline. For all we know, had Conklin not fumbled, Flacco may have thrown a pick-6 on his next attempt. He doesn’t get awarded any TDs he didn’t throw (Carter’s being the only, obvious one).

Wilson had plenty of receiver drops himself last year from “#1 WR” Davis, and iirc Ty Johnson dropped 3 passes in a half (among others’ drops/fumbles). Davis had 2 drops vs Denver & one of Wilson’s picks first went through Berrios’s hands. While still acknowledging them, we don’t hyper-focus on them as the reason for his failure because Wilson still sucked on balance even without those occurrences. 

3 hours ago, southparkcpa said:

That's the attitude that got us to be the worst team in the league (bottom 3).  Passing on Mahommes and Watson because you have McCown.   If you sell the 3-4 year rebuild to get hired and afterwards play a 37 year old journey man you are a snake oil fraud or your current QB truly sucks.  When Zach is healthy. we will see which is true.  I believe they will play Zach.  We MUST know if he can play or not.  If not, we're drafting a new QB this year.

Agree. I’d say they should be drafting (or otherwise acquiring) a new QB in all circumstances short of Wilson showing - in games that count - that he’s a legit NFL starter. If he sucks OR if he’s hurt/benched all year, those are both reasons to seek a serious replacement. Since the latter is less likely, he needs to play, and the sooner the better.

If he’s terrible for a handful of games, then Flacco comes in and again does at least a credible job again - even if not great himself - that’d close any excuse loopholes & do away with finger-crossing endeavors into going all-in on Wilson in ‘23. Right now there are plenty of excuses, many of them legitimate, over a small sample size.

Plus, if this young core is as good as they want us to believe, it won’t last forever. It won’t last 3 more years without effective retooling in future drafts. Each young guy gets a 4-year window under that cheap rookie contract. They won’t be able to retain all of them - certainly not all the good ones - once they show their FA value is 10-fold what they’re making today. If Wilson can give the team 2-3 cheap starter years without major cap hits, it’s a real advantage.

[Sorry for bunching you all together; I’d have lost my place if I responded one at a time. Plus this way I keep my words:post ratio stats where they need to be for my contract extension.]

[Mogglez]

25 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I stayed out of this thread - including reading - past the first few pages, figuring it’d die out. Wow.

Yeah, this isn’t a true statement . I’m not going to spend my morning looking up examples by guessing the right keyword searches through pronoun use regarding Hackenberg, but there plenty of posters & posts to the contrary here.

For those, there was no regard for, well just because we haven’t seen him doesn’t mean the coaches haven’t seen him, and haven’t been facepalming after every 3rd throw. They needed to see it themselves, as though to insinuate the coaches needed to see, too. Wasn’t unlike the ‘start Tebow’ from some back when he was here. It was dumb in both cases. Even a below-average QBC/OC can see in practice when there’s no point, as can the rest of the players on the roster. Some fans stubbornly don’t accept that until they see firsthand. 

I think @Warfish responded to this but it was already in my multi-quote. He didn’t say Wilson has to average 300 yards a game. He said have “a 300-yard game” not a 300-yard average for all his games. For an average I think his own benchmark is in the 250-yard range. If it’s 225 he’s less thrilled with it, but that’s at least in the ballpark, and could grade a little on a curve since it’s a 2nd season from a QB who shouldn’t have started as a rookie, and some guys grow into good veterans slower than others. But it’d be obvious progress.

This. Also wins are relative, too. If we beat Cincinnati 6-3 on Sunday despite Flacco throwing 0 TDs and committing 2 turnovers we’ll be 2-1, but it’d be in spite of him. Eye test, like his first 300-yard game that required nearly 2 games of attempts.

I said in preseason, while there was 90% poster opinion that he serves no purpose on the roster, that he’s one of the better backups in the league. There are young receivers to develop, too. There’s also an offense that needs to show it can find some rhythm as well, beyond throwing 5-yard passes en route to one of the Bengals’ 7 losses. Important because, if Wilson looks lousy again when he’s in there, there should be more than just insinuation that the offense could look competent with someone else & that these young players around him aren’t Mims-like busts as well. 

100%, and the post should have that much more weight since I know how much you didn’t want to draft him & made a blog of film & excruciating detail as to why. 

Except we did draft him, and Flacco has done at least enough dirty work to show this offense isn’t a hopeless case where “Tom Brady couldn’t move the ball on this offense,” excuses aren’t going to fly now. Appreciate Flacco for doing that. Now when Wilson’s cleared medically, or fully cleared, or whatever 110% means, he plays.

Between now & Sunday, if people want to fulfill fantasy what-ifs of “What if Flacco throws for [unlikely yardage & TD #s] and the Jets win because of it?” they’re welcome to do so.

The thing you hope to get in drafting a QB early isn’t just acquiring a young QB who’s otherwise unavailable; it’s also a 4-year window at a 75% discount over the overwhelmingly most expensive veteran position. He’s a $10MM starter (hopefully starter) in an era of $40-50MM/year FQBs. Seattle’s early-Wilson championship team flourished under that advantage (except Wilson wasn’t even $1MM for years). Is this Wilson as good as that one? Seems pretty unlikely, but he has to play to determine exactly where his ceiling - and floor - is beyond a weak rookie season.

He plays. If he’s unusably-awful again & again, then he gets benched & there’s no what-if for next year.

All true, but his yardage totals were also based on ~60 dropbacks. A 300-yard game is supposed to come from a QB averaging 8-10 yards/attempt, not 5-6 per attempt. Never-mind 1/6 of it came in garbage time, dinking & dunking against a prevent defense, culminating in a meaningless TD with 1-minute left that merely made the final score 24-9 instead of 24-3.

Point being, we don’t get to pocket a garbage-time drive as though it’d have happened anyway, even if not for the other facepalms along the way that you rightly outline. For all we know, had Conklin not fumbled, Flacco may have thrown a pick-6 on his next attempt. He doesn’t get awarded any TDs he didn’t throw (Carter’s being the only, obvious one).

Wilson had plenty of receiver drops himself last year from “#1 WR” Davis, and iirc Ty Johnson dropped 3 passes in a half (among others’ drops/fumbles). Davis had 2 drops vs Denver & one of Wilson’s picks first went through Berrios’s hands. While still acknowledging them, we don’t hyper-focus on them as the reason for his failure because Wilson still sucked on balance even without those occurrences. 

Agree. I’d say they should be drafting (or otherwise acquiring) a new QB in all circumstances short of Wilson showing - in games that count - that he’s a legit NFL starter. If he sucks OR if he’s hurt/benched all year, those are both reasons to seek a serious replacement. Since the latter is less likely, he needs to play, and the sooner the better.

If he’s terrible for a handful of games, then Flacco comes in and again does at least a credible job again - even if not great himself - that’d close any excuse loopholes & do away with finger-crossing endeavors into going all-in on Wilson in ‘23. Right now there are plenty of excuses, many of them legitimate, over a small sample size.

Plus, if this young core is as good as they want us to believe, it won’t last forever. It won’t last 3 more years without effective retooling in future drafts. Each young guy gets a 4-year window under that cheap rookie contract. They won’t be able to retain all of them - certainly not all the good ones - once they show their FA value is 10-fold what they’re making today. If Wilson can give the team 2-3 cheap starter years without major cap hits, it’s a real advantage.

[Sorry for bunching you all together; I’d have lost my place if I responded one at a time. Plus this way I keep my words:post ratio stats where they need to be for my contract extension.]

Perfect post.

[Mogglez]

20 hours ago, win4ever said:

WTF?  We were a Nick Chubb kneeling down away from 0-2, why the hell is Joe Flacco starting threads.  Now we pulled a miracle out, and all of a sudden, he's in play?  If Saleh starts Flacco over Wilson, he's making the same idiotic mistake toilet Bowles made with Fitzpatrick and Flores made with....Fitzpatrick.  The short term clarity doesn't matter when the long term outlook needs to be deciphered.  

You start Wilson, and you find out one way or another what you have.  If Wilson has it, great.  If Wilson doesn't, you know the area that needs to be addressed.  

Couldn’t have said it better myself.  The Flores example is absolutely perfect.

[Matt39]

2 hours ago, dbatesman said:

It’s just a proxy for whether or not you think Wilson is good. If you do (or at least think he can be), you obviously want him out there ASAP. If you think he sucks, you don’t want to flush any more games on his behalf, especially when we’re trying to develop all these young skill position players, so you’d rather stick with Flacco.

Doesn’t how these guys look in practice count for anything anymore? 

[Bugg]

4 hours ago, T0mShane said:

I think it’s as simple as Nick Bosa and Fred Warner are human erasers and this defensive system doesn’t work without them. The guys we have playing those spots are trash, generally, but also trash by comparison. 

This week will go a long way to tell us if this is so. Bengals' OL has been terrible so far. Burrow is getting very familiar with th sensation of being smushed into the turf. if they Jets cannot find a pass rush this week, all these draft picks spend on and big contracts they've handed out to front 7 guys really become suspect. And Clemons and Q need to show up. 

[Bugg]

7 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

Couldn’t have said it better myself.  The Flores example is absolutely perfect.

We have no idea what the CS is seeing in practice and in meetings. Not saying this is the case with Wilson, but there were good reasons Hackenberg never saw the field. 

Informed speculation: if Saleh sees Wilson is not now and won't be a starting NFL QB, hard pressed to fault the guy for not betting his career on him. Doesn't appear this is the case-yet. 

[doitny]

24 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I stayed out of this thread - including reading - past the first few pages, figuring it’d die out. Wow.

Yeah, this isn’t a true statement . I’m not going to spend my morning looking up examples by guessing the right keyword searches through pronoun use regarding Hackenberg, but there plenty of posters & posts to the contrary here.

For those, there was no regard for, well just because we haven’t seen him doesn’t mean the coaches haven’t seen him, and haven’t been facepalming after every 3rd throw. They needed to see it themselves, as though to insinuate the coaches needed to see, too. Wasn’t unlike the ‘start Tebow’ from some back when he was here. It was dumb in both cases. Even a below-average QBC/OC can see in practice when there’s no point, as can the rest of the players on the roster. Some fans stubbornly don’t accept that until they see firsthand. 

I think @Warfish responded to this but it was already in my multi-quote. He didn’t say Wilson has to average 300 yards a game. He said have “a 300-yard game” not a 300-yard average for all his games. For an average I think his own benchmark is in the 250-yard range. If it’s 225 he’s less thrilled with it, but that’s at least in the ballpark, and could grade a little on a curve since it’s a 2nd season from a QB who shouldn’t have started as a rookie, and some guys grow into good veterans slower than others. But it’d be obvious progress.

This. Also wins are relative, too. If we beat Cincinnati 6-3 on Sunday despite Flacco throwing 0 TDs and committing 2 turnovers we’ll be 2-1, but it’d be in spite of him. Eye test, like his first 300-yard game that required nearly 2 games of attempts.

I said in preseason, while there was 90% poster opinion that he serves no purpose on the roster, that he’s one of the better backups in the league. There are young receivers to develop, too. There’s also an offense that needs to show it can find some rhythm as well, beyond throwing 5-yard passes en route to one of the Bengals’ 7 losses. Important because, if Wilson looks lousy again when he’s in there, there should be more than just insinuation that the offense could look competent with someone else & that these young players around him aren’t Mims-like busts as well. 

100%, and the post should have that much more weight since I know how much you didn’t want to draft him & made a blog of film & excruciating detail as to why. 

Except we did draft him, and Flacco has done at least enough dirty work to show this offense isn’t a hopeless case where “Tom Brady couldn’t move the ball on this offense,” excuses aren’t going to fly now. Appreciate Flacco for doing that. Now when Wilson’s cleared medically, or fully cleared, or whatever 110% means, he plays.

Between now & Sunday, if people want to fulfill fantasy what-ifs of “What if Flacco throws for [unlikely yardage & TD #s] and the Jets win because of it?” they’re welcome to do so.

The thing you hope to get in drafting a QB early isn’t just acquiring a young QB who’s otherwise unavailable; it’s also a 4-year window at a 75% discount over the overwhelmingly most expensive veteran position. He’s a $10MM starter (hopefully starter) in an era of $40-50MM/year FQBs. Seattle’s early-Wilson championship team flourished under that advantage (except Wilson wasn’t even $1MM for years). Is this Wilson as good as that one? Seems pretty unlikely, but he has to play to determine exactly where his ceiling - and floor - is beyond a weak rookie season.

He plays. If he’s unusably-awful again & again, then he gets benched & there’s no what-if for next year.

All true, but his yardage totals were also based on ~60 dropbacks. A 300-yard game is supposed to come from a QB averaging 8-10 yards/attempt, not 5-6 per attempt. Never-mind 1/6 of it came in garbage time, dinking & dunking against a prevent defense, culminating in a meaningless TD with 1-minute left that merely made the final score 24-9 instead of 24-3.

Point being, we don’t get to pocket a garbage-time drive as though it’d have happened anyway, even if not for the other facepalms along the way that you rightly outline. For all we know, had Conklin not fumbled, Flacco may have thrown a pick-6 on his next attempt. He doesn’t get awarded any TDs he didn’t throw (Carter’s being the only, obvious one).

Wilson had plenty of receiver drops himself last year from “#1 WR” Davis, and iirc Ty Johnson dropped 3 passes in a half (among others’ drops/fumbles). Davis had 2 drops vs Denver & one of Wilson’s picks first went through Berrios’s hands. While still acknowledging them, we don’t hyper-focus on them as the reason for his failure because Wilson still sucked on balance even without those occurrences. 

Agree. I’d say they should be drafting (or otherwise acquiring) a new QB in all circumstances short of Wilson showing - in games that count - that he’s a legit NFL starter. If he sucks OR if he’s hurt/benched all year, those are both reasons to seek a serious replacement. Since the latter is less likely, he needs to play, and the sooner the better.

If he’s terrible for a handful of games, then Flacco comes in and again does at least a credible job again - even if not great himself - that’d close any excuse loopholes & do away with finger-crossing endeavors into going all-in on Wilson in ‘23. Right now there are plenty of excuses, many of them legitimate, over a small sample size.

Plus, if this young core is as good as they want us to believe, it won’t last forever. It won’t last 3 more years without effective retooling in future drafts. Each young guy gets a 4-year window under that cheap rookie contract. They won’t be able to retain all of them - certainly not all the good ones - once they show their FA value is 10-fold what they’re making today. If Wilson can give the team 2-3 cheap starter years without major cap hits, it’s a real advantage.

[Sorry for bunching you all together; I’d have lost my place if I responded one at a time. Plus this way I keep my words:post ratio stats where they need to be for my contract extension.]

what did this take you 3 hours to write? lol

yes Zach had drops too but the difference was that Zach had alot of garbage time last year and he got nowhere near 300 yds. the Tenn game doesnt count cause that was not garbage time. you still got to make the throws. and thats the difference between the drop passes. 

thats why he got 300 yds in week 1. and thats why we won in week2. even though Clev kept us in the game FLacco still had to make those throws. he still had to drive 50 plus yards for the winning score. 

my point was that people say he was bad in week one and i say how? all those mistakes cost us points, not Flacco. 

even the INT which i saw you said might still have been a INT. and you might be right....maybe . but we will never know but still another mistake by someone not named Flacco. honestly i think he slipped because the field was wet. 

i just dont think you can say Flacco was bad in week 1 or even week 2 before the miracle. we out of any fan base who sat thru 3 years of Sam Darnold and last year with Zach should be able to tell the difference between good and bad QB play

[dbatesman]

13 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Doesn’t how these guys look in practice count for anything anymore? 

To me? Not really. Teams don’t practice that much, and the reports we get are conflicting anyway. I would hope it matters inside the building though.

[56mehl56]

1 hour ago, Jimmy 2 Times said:

If Wilson is healthy he needs to play.

But playing Flacco isn't a loser mentality.  He's helping to develop our 1st and 2nd year studs.  

 

Again, if Zach turns out to be bad, this team is poised to be a great location for a vet unhappy with his situation.  

But is he really, the offense while still controlled by Lafleur is different for Flacco then it is for Wilson who is more of a WCO type QB. Where I feel Flacco provides stability is in his game awareness, calling audibles but more importantly helping the OL.  

[Sperm Edwards]

9 minutes ago, Bugg said:

We have no idea what the CS is seeing in practice and in meetings. Not saying this is the case with Wilson, but there were good reasons Hackenberg never saw the field. 

Informed speculation: if Saleh sees Wilson is not now and won't be a starting NFL QB, hard pressed to fault the guy for not betting his career on him. Doesn't appear this is the case-yet. 

Agree, but he was talking like he’d return to the starting role when he’s cleared to return to the active roster.

In the unlikely event Flacco balls out like his SB playoff run, sure that could delay things a couple extra games, but not more than that. 

He’s got to balance a need to find out what Wilson is - this year - without making the roster resent being treated like they play for the NY Zachwilsons. If Wilson suddenly looks Hackenberg-hopeless in practice, then there’s no need to bother wasting live games, but there’s been no evidence of that & it seems incredibly unlikely. 

[Mogglez]

21 minutes ago, Bugg said:

We have no idea what the CS is seeing in practice and in meetings. Not saying this is the case with Wilson, but there were good reasons Hackenberg never saw the field. 

Informed speculation: if Saleh sees Wilson is not now and won't be a starting NFL QB, hard pressed to fault the guy for not betting his career on him. Doesn't appear this is the case-yet. 

I get what you are saying, but people have got to stop comparing this situation to Hackenberg. Wilson was actually performing well and “outplaying” (in quotes, because there was no actual competition) Flacco all of camp.  Hackenberg was never good enough to have a good camp or beat out anyone.  There is no universe where the two situations are comparable.  Not playing Wilson would be an astronomically stupid decision by Saleh.  If he plays poorly, you can go back to Flacco; that’s fine. However, for better or worse, Zach needs to play this year, preferably when he is healthy.

[56mehl56]

17 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Doesn’t how these guys look in practice count for anything anymore? 

Not really , have you seen what NFL practices look like these days .

[Mogglez]

10 minutes ago, doitny said:

what did this take you 3 hours to write? lol

yes Zach had drops too but the difference was that Zach had alot of garbage time last year and he got nowhere near 300 yds. the Tenn game doesnt count cause that was not garbage time. you still got to make the throws. and thats the difference between the drop passes. 

In what universe does the Tennessee game “not count”?  “Zach almost threw for 300 yards but it doesn’t count because it’s not garbage time”

What does this even mean?

thats why he got 300 yds in week 1. and thats why we won in week2. even though Clev kept us in the game FLacco still had to make those throws. he still had to drive 50 plus yards for the winning score. 

my point was that people say he was bad in week one and i say how? all those mistakes cost us points, not Flacco. 

even the INT which i saw you said might still have been a INT. and you might be right....maybe . but we will never know but still another mistake by someone not named Flacco. honestly i think he slipped because the field was wet. 

i just dont think you can say Flacco was bad in week 1 or even week 2 before the miracle. we out of any fan base who sat thru 3 years of Sam Darnold and last year with Zach should be able to tell the difference between good and bad QB play

Flacco was absolutely atrocious in week 1, and there is no spin in the world that can change that.

 

[Sperm Edwards]

15 minutes ago, doitny said:

what did this take you 3 hours to write? lol

yes Zach had drops too but the difference was that Zach had alot of garbage time last year and he got nowhere near 300 yds. the Tenn game doesnt count cause that was not garbage time. you still got to make the throws. and thats the difference between the drop passes. 

thats why he got 300 yds in week 1. and thats why we won in week2. even though Clev kept us in the game FLacco still had to make those throws. he still had to drive 50 plus yards for the winning score. 

my point was that people say he was bad in week one and i say how? all those mistakes cost us points, not Flacco. 

even the INT which i saw you said might still have been a INT. and you might be right....maybe . but we will never know but still another mistake by someone not named Flacco. honestly i think he slipped because the field was wet. 

i just dont think you can say Flacco was bad in week 1 or even week 2 before the miracle. we out of any fan base who sat thru 3 years of Sam Darnold and last year with Zach should be able to tell the difference between good and bad QB play

Not quite 3 hours, but yeah more than 3 minutes . I do type fast.

Understand I’m neither optimistic nor pessimistic on Wilson. I’m not a true believer that he’s the one, nor that he’s already shown he’s a bust with maybe a 1% chance of being a good QB.

My counterpoint was that only the Carter drop took points off the board. Flacco is not immune to making mistakes that could change a possession. He doesn’t get credit for points lost unless it’s literally a TD drop that didn’t result in a TD despite it.

I don’t think you can lump Flacco’s week 1 & pre-miracle week 2 performances together. I don’t think you’d get any argument from him that he played much better in the 2nd game.

He’s not going to QB the rest of the season, nor should he. He’s one of the better backups in the league, and in cases of a QB injury a team could do worse than having him out there. The Jets have put on a clinic of having worse than Flacco out there over most of the past decade.

I’m going to skip the Tenn game comment because I admit I don’t understand what you mean by it.

Wilson should play most of the season unless they’re already convinced they need to go in another direction next year, or unless he’s so injured he can’t, which still should convince them to go in another direction next year anyway, tbh, or at least bring in another serious starter in case he doesn’t turn into y3 Matt Stafford following his first 2 years of being mostly bad and/or injured.

[56mehl56]

7 minutes ago, doitny said:

what did this take you 3 hours to write? lol

yes Zach had drops too but the difference was that Zach had alot of garbage time last year and he got nowhere near 300 yds. the Tenn game doesnt count cause that was not garbage time. you still got to make the throws. and thats the difference between the drop passes. 

thats why he got 300 yds in week 1. and thats why we won in week2. even though Clev kept us in the game FLacco still had to make those throws. he still had to drive 50 plus yards for the winning score. 

my point was that people say he was bad in week one and i say how? all those mistakes cost us points, not Flacco. 

even the INT which i saw you said might still have been a INT. and you might be right....maybe . but we will never know but still another mistake by someone not named Flacco. honestly i think he slipped because the field was wet. 

i just dont think you can say Flacco was bad in week 1 or even week 2 before the miracle. we out of any fan base who sat thru 3 years of Sam Darnold and last year with Zach should be able to tell the difference between good and bad QB play

Yeah but you need to keep context of the actual game situations. The Jets had 7 offensive possessions in the 1st half against Balt, how many times last year did that happen . I can probably count on two hands the number of 3 and outs our D generated last season. You can argue the Jets played from behind a lot last season which gave Zach more chances to throw , but in those scenarios the D knows you have to pass which gives them the advantage . Sure you can rack up stats in garbage time , but most of the times garbage time doesn't start in the 2nd qtr as defenses are still pinning their ears back going for the kill

Both the Balt and Cleve games were closer early which lets a QB/OC run the offense as intended as opposed to constantly playing from behind .  

[Matt39]

40 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

To me? Not really. Teams don’t practice that much, and the reports we get are conflicting anyway. I would hope it matters inside the building though.

Kind of what I meant. I also felt Wilson should have played a lot more in preseason last year. 

[Matt39]

45 minutes ago, 56mehl56 said:

Not really , have you seen what NFL practices look like these days .

Varies from team to team.

[Warfish]

44 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Understand I’m neither optimistic nor pessimistic on Wilson. I’m not a true believer that he’s the one, nor that he’s already shown he’s a bust with maybe a 1% chance of being a good QB.

Well said, and +1

44 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Wilson should play most of the season unless they’re already convinced they need to go in another direction next year, or unless he’s so injured he can’t, which still should convince them to go in another direction next year anyway

Again, well said, and +1

[jgb]

2 hours ago, Jimmy 2 Times said:

If Wilson is healthy he needs to play.

But playing Flacco isn't a loser mentality.  He's helping to develop our 1st and 2nd year studs.  

 

Again, if Zach turns out to be bad, this team is poised to be a great location for a vet unhappy with his situation.  

I hope to hell we go the vet route whether or not we draft a new young savior.

[56mehl56]

8 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Varies from team to team.

Not really , CBA has a big say in what can be done. Practices are like walkthroughs these days. 

[jgb]

3 minutes ago, 56mehl56 said:

Not really , CBA has a big say in what can be done. Practices are like walkthroughs these days. 

Meaning Geno doesn’t go to them?

[Matt39]

6 minutes ago, 56mehl56 said:

Not really , CBA has a big say in what can be done. Practices are like walkthroughs these days. 

Not true. Especially in camp. The Jets are notably lighter than others. But Wilson barely played last preseason which was a mistake. 

[56mehl56]

4 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Not true. Especially in camp. The Jets are notably lighter than others. But Wilson barely played last preseason which was a mistake. 

Do you have proof of that , or its just speculation because its the Jets . Teams are limited to padded practices and the amount of practices they are allowed . And with Wilson many here say he should have sat last season , now you say he sat too much. Such a bi-polar fanbase .  

[56mehl56]

8 minutes ago, jgb said:

Meaning Geno doesn’t go to them?

Huh ?

[dbatesman]

1 hour ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Wilson should play most of the season unless they’re already convinced they need to go in another direction next year, or unless he’s so injured he can’t, which still should convince them to go in another direction next year anyway, tbh, or at least bring in another serious starter in case he doesn’t turn into y3 Matt Stafford following his first 2 years of being mostly bad and/or injured.

I think this is exactly right, but if (and I know it’s a huge if) Flacco wins the next two, it gets really dicey. At minimum, they’d have to have the hook out and ready to go at a moment’s notice.

[slimjasi]

1 minute ago, dbatesman said:

I think this is exactly right, but if (and I know it’s a huge if) Flacco wins the next two, it gets really dicey. At minimum, they’d have to have the hook out and ready to go at a moment’s notice.

If Flacco wins the next two starts, I suspect he'll play until he losses or has a bad game. 

You almost have to ride that wave. Huge IF, of course. 

[Mogglez]

Lock ‘er up boys and girls

 

[JoeNamathsFurCoat]

1 hour ago, jgb said:

a great location for a vet unhappy with his situation.  

[Warfish]

"Get him on the field" is not the same thing as "will start at QB".

Dear lord, do these guys ever just say something unambiguous without leaving themselves ways to weasel out of it?

[JoeNamathsFurCoat]

2 minutes ago, Warfish said:

"Get him on the field" is not the same thing as "will start at QB".

Dear lord, do these guys ever just say something unambiguous without leaving themselves ways to weasel out of it?

Would love to see Kapono at RB

He liked to taunt and stand over guys after scrambling at BYU like the big bad man he is

[Matt39]

31 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

Lock ‘er up boys and girls

 

 

I guess the next question should be- is it Wilson’s doctors or the Jets doctors who need to clear him?

[batman10023]

4 minutes ago, Warfish said:

"Get him on the field" is not the same thing as "will start at QB".

Dear lord, do these guys ever just say something unambiguous without leaving themselves ways to weasel out of it?

you are grasping for straws now that the coach basically refuted your talking points for the last 2 weeks.

most smart people don't double down on bad ideas.

[batman10023]

3 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

I guess the next question should be- is it Wilson’s doctors or the Jets doctors who need to clear him?

 

lol.