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Moore not at practice?


Zachtomims47
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19 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Yeah, it’s pretty clear that Moore is the odd man out when Zach plays, dating back to last year. He’s currently the—what—fourth or fifth option in the passing game right now? It’s also pretty clear that he’s disgruntled by it. This is AJ Brown’s best friend. Brown knows a thing or two about suffering in—and escaping from—and underwhelming, run-first offense. I don’t see how it’s “trolling” to suggest flipping an asset that they don’t seem to have much use for. 

I would posit that 6'1"'ish Zach may have trouble seeing 5'10" Moore when he is open....

Field vision is one of my larger concerns with Zach (vision and progressions) along with his short-game and timing pass accuracy.

With that said, Moore has been targeted 29 times through 6 games (4.8 TPG).

That's not really meaningfully different than Davis (5.5 TPG), but is well behind the team #1 G. Wilson (8.0 TPG).

A big part this year is the targets to RB's and TE's, siphoning off a goodly number of targets from all the WR's, frankly.

Hall is 5.1 TPG, Carter is 3.7 TPG, and Conklin is 5.3 TPG. 

That's 14 or so targets going away from all the WR's, so the pool is (I think) smaller than in year's past overall for the WR's.

Ultimately, having several worthy receivers (like we do) is a GOOD problem to have, for all involved.  Everyone is more likely to get open if other guys demand coverage.  Hopefully, Moore understand this, and can come to terms with his role on the team.  Because he should be a key asset in our Offense for some time to come.  He is, as some others have noted, open ALOT.  Zach will hopefully see that.

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12 minutes ago, undertow said:

The Jets invested a ton of capital in 5 WRs who they don't throw the ball to so it's not a terrible idea to move Moore and give Berrios his time. We are probably gonna need that extra one to move up or trade for a QB next year anyway. 🤔

It would have the added benefit of pissing off @BornJetsFan1983

 

So, count me in.

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7 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I would posit that 6'1"'ish Zach may have trouble seeing 5'10" Moore when he is open....

Field vision is one of my larger concerns with Zach (vision and progressions) along with his short-game and timing pass accuracy.

With that said, Moore has been targeted 29 times through 6 games (4.8 TPG).

That's not really meaningfully different than Davis (5.5 TPG), but is well behind the team #1 G. Wilson (8.0 TPG).

A big part this year is the targets to RB's and TE's, siphoning off a goodly number of targets from all the WR's, frankly.

Hall is 5.1 TPG, Carter is 3.7 TPG, and Conklin is 5.3 TPG. 

That's 14 or so targets going away from all the WR's, so the pool is (I think) smaller than in year's past overall for the WR's.

Ultimately, having several worthy receivers (like we do) is a GOOD problem to have, for all involved.  Everyone is more likely to get open if other guys demand coverage.  Hopefully, Moore understand this, and can come to terms with his role on the team.  Because he should be a key asset in our Offense for some time to come.  He is, as some others have noted, open ALOT.  Zach will hopefully see that.

FWIW, Wilson is legitimately over 6'2" if barely.  He actually should be slightly taller than Rodgers and considerably taller than Tua, Wilson, Murray, etc.  I believe that he is the exact same height as Mahomes.  I never heard that Mahomes or Tua couldn't see Tyreek Hill.  Moore, on the other hand, is closer to 5'9 than 5'10", but that is still more than a full inch taller than Hill. 

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28 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Is it out of the realm of possibilities that he may just not be that good? It seems the Jets like Berrios more as the gadget guy. 

I think they're not using him correctly and should be used in the slot more. Honestly flip how him and Garrett are being used. Either way, no WR is getting a ton of targets being a run first offense. It'll just come sporadically  

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58 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

The Jets. Whose passing game is bad and getting worse, and who have a disgruntled asset that a lot of other teams could use. 

In all seriousness our passing game won't be much better this week because the gameplan should not change. Denvers defense and secondary in particular are strong.

We should not have zach dropping back 35 times to prove a point. Keep doing whats working until it is not and then have a viable back up plan.

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50 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Yeah, it’s pretty clear that Moore is the odd man out when Zach plays, dating back to last year. He’s currently the—what—fourth or fifth option in the passing game right now? It’s also pretty clear that he’s disgruntled by it. This is AJ Brown’s best friend. Brown knows a thing or two about suffering in—and escaping from—and underwhelming, run-first offense. I don’t see how it’s “trolling” to suggest flipping an asset that they don’t seem to have much use for. 

Lol, there is no one as adept at stirring the **** while simultaneously being completely full of it as you are. A true gift. 

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33 minutes ago, SuicidalSince98 said:

Wilson is 6”2 and a quarter, stop inventing crap

here are all of Moore’s routes from last week, tell me what Wilson missed 

 
let’s stick to the facts please 

 

Doesn't look like he is running full speed on some of these routes.

Forget which analyst called him out for dogging a route in the Pittsburgh game costing Zach an INT right before the half

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36 minutes ago, SuicidalSince98 said:

Wilson is 6”2 and a quarter, stop inventing crap

here are all of Moore’s routes from last week, tell me what Wilson missed 

 
let’s stick to the facts please 

 

People tend to think - QB throws for a lot of yards = QB played well, QB throws for very few yards = QB played badly. 

Sometimes you are playing a top 5 passing defense that blankets your WRs. 

The biggest issue I had with Wilson in this game were the sacks he took and the almost picks he threw. 

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5 minutes ago, WhartonJet said:

Doesn't look like he is running full speed on some of these routes.

Forget which analyst called him out for dogging a route in the Pittsburgh game costing Zach an INT right before the half

Yes, forgot about that.  Maybe wilson isn’t looking much his way b/c of this.

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1 hour ago, Warfish said:

I would posit that 6'1"'ish Zach may have trouble seeing 5'10" Moore when he is open....

Field vision is one of my larger concerns with Zach (vision and progressions) along with his short-game and timing pass accuracy.

With that said, Moore has been targeted 29 times through 6 games (4.8 TPG).

That's not really meaningfully different than Davis (5.5 TPG), but is well behind the team #1 G. Wilson (8.0 TPG).

A big part this year is the targets to RB's and TE's, siphoning off a goodly number of targets from all the WR's, frankly.

Hall is 5.1 TPG, Carter is 3.7 TPG, and Conklin is 5.3 TPG. 

That's 14 or so targets going away from all the WR's, so the pool is (I think) smaller than in year's past overall for the WR's.

Ultimately, having several worthy receivers (like we do) is a GOOD problem to have, for all involved.  Everyone is more likely to get open if other guys demand coverage.  Hopefully, Moore understand this, and can come to terms with his role on the team.  Because he should be a key asset in our Offense for some time to come.  He is, as some others have noted, open ALOT.  Zach will hopefully see that.

I think one stat above all might explain Moore’s grievance and future outlook with this franchise. His catch percentage with Zach Wilson? 44% (52 targets, 23 catches). His catch% with non-Zach QBs? 83% (48 targets, 40 catches. His targets, catches, yards, ypg, ypc are all higher with non-Zach QBs than they are with Zach Wilson, and Zach Wilson is going to be the QB here for the foreseeable future. Say what we want about how Moore should be a team player and wait for his chances while Zach develops, but that’s not how Moore is getting to Pro Bowls and that’s not going to get him paid. 
 

For reference: Moore with Zach—10 games, 52 targets, 23 catches, 266 yards, 1 TD.

Moore non-Zach—seven games, 48 targets, 40 catches, 475 yards, 4 TDs. 

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28 minutes ago, Lurker89 said:

In all seriousness our passing game won't be much better this week because the gameplan should not change. Denvers defense and secondary in particular are strong.

We should not have zach dropping back 35 times to prove a point. Keep doing whats working until it is not and then have a viable back up plan.

Iirc, we face 5 of the top 7 defenses against the pass in our next seven games. The passing game is unlikely to improve much over the next two months

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9 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Iirc, we face 5 of the top 7 defenses against the pass in our next seven games. The passing game is unlikely to improve much over the next two months

When one of those teams is inevitably shutting down the run during a game it will be sink or swim time for Zach and the gang, until that time I don't see the need to pontificate profusly over the matter.

When that time comes and if Zach fails as you believe  I will fully understand your need to expunge your bowels all of these here message boards.

You may get your wish as early as this weekend but between Denver's offensive struggles and their middle of the pack Run D  I believe we should once again be able to establish the run and win on the ground. 

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10 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

I think one stat above all might explain Moore’s grievance and future outlook with this franchise. His catch percentage with Zach Wilson? 44% (53 targets, 23 catches). His catch% with non-Zach QBs? 83% (48 targets, 40 catches. His targets, catches, yards, ypg, ypc are all higher with non-Zach QBs than they are with Zach Wilson, and Zach Wilson is going to be the QB here for the foreseeable future. Say what we want about how Moore should be a team player and wait for his chances while Zach develops, but that’s not how Moore is getting to Pro Bowls and that’s not going to get him paid. 
 

For reference: Moore with Zach—10 games, 52 targets, 23 catches, 266 yards, 1 TD.

Moore non-Zach—seven games, 48 targets, 40 catches, 475 yards, 4 TDs. 

If you look at his numbers during the three pass-happy Flacco games THIS year, they suggest that his issue isn’t really the QB, it’s his role in the offense.

His touches are being taken away by a vastly improved running game, Garrett Wilson, Conklin, and both running backs out of the backfield, not to mention Berrios on gadget runs. 

It also appears that the Jets are insisting on using him as an outside WR on longer developing routes down the field, which many here have questioned. 
 

And guess what? If we can run the ball effectively again against another elite passing defense, he’s unlikely to get many touches this week, either. 

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1 minute ago, slimjasi said:

If you look at his numbers during the three pass-happy Flacco games THIS year, they suggest that his issue isn’t really the QB, it’s his role in the offense.

His touches are being taken away by a vastly improved running game, Garrett Wilson, Conklin, and both running backs out of the backfield, not to mention Berrios on gadget runs. 

It also appears that the Jets are insisting on using him as an outside WR on longer developing routes down the field, which many here have questioned. 
 

And guess what? If we can run the ball effectively again against another elite passing defense, he’s unlikely to get many touches this week, either. 

How many moore times are we going to see #8 get zero separation on a deep route and wilson throw it up there with no chance of him jumping up to get it.  Truth, if you’re going to play mims, play him over moore, and see if having a very tall wr improves the passing game. 

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