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Zach Wilson is just fine, he's right where he should be, this fanbase has lost their minds!


JetsRay

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3 hours ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Who's better: Joe Burrows or Aaron Rodger?

right now it has to be Burrows. 

We all were happy about the wins especially in GB and Denver. but if you look at it now we only beat one team Miami with a winning record. 

wins. Clev 3-5, Pitts 2-6, Mia 5-3, GB 3-5, Denver 3-5. and the one win against a winner was against their 3rd string QB. 

losses: Balt 5-3, Cin 4-4, NE 4-4. 

now Zach is 1-1 vs winning teams but that win is against someone back bagging groceries at Walmart right now. without better QB play we are in trouble fast.

sorry i went off topic. just had this on my mind .lol

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1 minute ago, Lith said:

I am never going to apologize for winning games in the NFL.  If anything, as Jet fans we have learned that winning is hard and any win is a good win.  All you can do is try to beat the team lining up on the other side of the ball.  Our losses are not asterisked because we have lost 5 starting OLs plus our best offensive weapon.

5-3 is a good record, better than I expected, and despite what happened Sunday, I still think this is a quality team.

 

Agreed. First loss this year to a team we’re better than.

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On 10/31/2022 at 8:08 AM, JetsRay said:

Zach Wilson is a 2nd year QB, still developing, still learning, and is right where he needs to be.

The knee jerk reactions are so over the top ridiculous I feel like this place is being infiltrated with 3rd graders. This fan base is an embarrassment, and many of you should be ashamed.

While the INT's sucked, there was a ton of good that we can take from this game and Zach's performance.


Last week it was "OMG he only threw for 120 yds," this week he throws for 350, exactly as anybody with any logic or reason would suspect with Breece Hall gone and the team having to rely on the pass, and he did a lot of good things, but that isn' enough for our arm chair scouts.

Two of the INT's were Zach trying to do too much, trying to salvage the drive, they were 3rd and long throws, and they sailed on him, both of those plays are plays he's both going to make someday, and learn to not throw them. He'll work on mechanics, it is fixable. The 3rd INT when he was trying to get rid of the ball, he didn't get it far enough out of bounds, also fixable, he knew it right away and the rest of the game you saw him correct that.

He moved the ball, made great throws, the first TD to Conklin was an amazing throw. Our running game was not running on all cylinders just yet with JRob playing in his first game on a limited pitch count because he's had 3 days of practice in our system.

STOP THE BS Jets fans, this is a 2nd year QB, he's played 18 total games.

We are still 5-3, we still have a season, the Pats and Belichick have always been a team that knows how to attack a defense and make QB's look bad. Have some ******* patience.

absolutely this - Zach showed elite throwing ability. The same people that b*tch about his completion percentage are also the people that want him to throw the ball away more. Well his completion percentage isn't great because he DOES throw the ball away a LOT. He just needs to learn to be more decisive with the throw out of bounds. I think he's going to be elite once he stops doing young QB stuff. His mistakes had no relation to the Patriots' scheme - they were on him trying to make something happen when it just wasn't there. He did adjust at the end of the game on the last drive throwing the ball away better and making accurate throws. Jets fans trying to sabotage our season by spewing the hate makes me scratch my head. He is our QB for the entire year and most likely for a long time. By getting on him relentlessly only hurts the Jets chances of winning. Not sure why a fan would want that. I get it, if he doesn't perform well the rest of the year then you can get on him all off season. Did you see Burrows take 5 sacks last night? That's Zach running around and throwing the ball away most games. Burrows will end the game 25-35 with 5 sacks. Zach would be 25-39 with one sack and 4 throw aways. Many QBs don't want throw aways to negatively impact their stats - Zach just wants to win.

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12 minutes ago, Lith said:

I am never going to apologize for winning games in the NFL.  If anything, as Jet fans we have learned that winning is hard and any win is a good win.  All you can do is try to beat the team lining up on the other side of the ball.  Our losses are not asterisked because we have lost 5 starting OLs plus our best offensive weapon.

5-3 is a good record, better than I expected, and despite what happened Sunday, I still think this is a quality team.

 

im not apologizing, just pointing out that i dont know how we beat the rest on the better teams , Buffalo (2), NE, Mia, Minn, Seattle. plus Chicago had the #4 pass defense with this QB. and after that video you posted, damm Garrett Wilson was wide open. the more videos i see of yesterday the more i am siding with Moore. i dont like what he did, but i think he is not the problem

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There are many things to be concerned with Wilson's progression as a QB.  The one that is alarming is his accuracy on short and mid range throws.  So many passes are high and short and often he is throwing behind guys as they are running routes.  

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36 minutes ago, Lith said:

 

The unfortunate part about this video is, he's not even making mistakes consistently.  Like, he'll go from this, to holding the ball and skipping an easy read for something bigger.  Often times, it's not there and he tries to go back and then, that's not there and then boom, there is the pressure and he's bailing.  Now knowing he's making poor predetermined decisions, oh boy.

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56 minutes ago, Lith said:

I am never going to apologize for winning games in the NFL.  If anything, as Jet fans we have learned that winning is hard and any win is a good win.  All you can do is try to beat the team lining up on the other side of the ball.  Our losses are not asterisked because we have lost 5 starting OLs plus our best offensive weapon.

5-3 is a good record, better than I expected, and despite what happened Sunday, I still think this is a quality team.

 

Gotta love the folks that need to caveat wins lol. 

 

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13 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

The unfortunate part about this video is, he's not even making mistakes consistently.  Like, he'll go from this, to holding the ball and skipping an easy read for something bigger.  Often times, it's not there and he tries to go back and then, that's not there and then boom, there is the pressure and he's bailing.  Now knowing he's making poor predetermined decisions, oh boy.

There have been some clips posted where he bails without any pressure.  Honestly, at this point, I don't know what the issue is, there seem to be so many.  On the one hand, you see him rolling right and throwing 50 yards down field to hit Garrett Wilson in stride to set up a score.  Then a few plays later, he bails from a clean pocket and turns a 10 yard throw into a 20 yard throw and we settle for a field goal.  Its is maddening because the glimpses are there, but they are too few and far between.  The struggles are consistent.  The flashes of good play are just that, flashes.

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6 minutes ago, Zachtomims47 said:

What a mess. The Jets need to find the best possible QB coach next off-season. He needs to be, almost, completely reworked. 

He's always need to be reworked!  lmfao.  Nothing he did in college translated.  He was playing flag Football.  It's my biggest frustration w/ this situation.  I get they had Knapp and his unfortunate passing was a big loss for this team but what is his personal coach working on him with?  It's like everyone is telling him (see Chris Simms), that he's special and his off script stuff is awesome, and encouraging it.  Instead of, just working on ******* QB 101 stuff, like how to drop back properly, step up properly, square you shoulders, step into the throw, keep your eyes up not at the pressure, dont fade, dont bail, dont turn your back to the LOS.  lol  Legit, High School sh*t dude. 

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2 minutes ago, Lith said:

There have been some clips posted where he bails without any pressure.  Honestly, at this point, I don't know what the issue is, there seem to be so many.  On the one hand, you see him rolling right and throwing 50 yards down field to hit Garrett Wilson in stride to set up a score.  Then a few plays later, he bails from a clean pocket and turns a 10 yard throw into a 20 yard throw and we settle for a field goal.  Its is maddening because the glimpses are there, but they are too few and far between.  The struggles are consistent.  The flashes of good play are just that, flashes.

For sure, see above.  He still struggles with nailing his drop back.  He still takes the extra step back and fade and yes, he 100% bails when he doesnt need too, which is why I'm telling you I saw Lil Mikey say "how do you call plays with this?" and threw his hands up.  Ugh, cant be the only one that saw that? 

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I’m not making a final judgment until the end of this year.  I need the Jets to push him into the deep end of the pool.  Once Hall went down our playoff chances took a big hit.  I no longer expect to make it.  This season has become one with a sole purpose:  Make Zach prove he’s the guy.  I want to go into the offseason with a definitive answer on if I need a new starting quarterback.  
 

Give him the season with 30+ passes a game.  Run the offense through him sink or swim and let’s find out.

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6 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

He's always need to be reworked!  lmfao.  Nothing he did in college translated.  He was playing flag Football.  It's my biggest frustration w/ this situation.  I get they had Knapp and his unfortunate passing was a big loss for this team but what is his personal coach working on him with?  It's like everyone is telling him (see Chris Simms), that he's special and his off script stuff is awesome, and encouraging it.  Instead of, just working on ******* QB 101 stuff, like how to drop back properly, step up properly, square you shoulders, step into the throw, keep your eyes up not at the pressure, dont fade, dont bail, dont turn your back to the LOS.  lol  Legit, High School sh*t dude. 

Is this what you’ve seen while attending practices? 

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1 hour ago, Lith said:

I am never going to apologize for winning games in the NFL.  If anything, as Jet fans we have learned that winning is hard and any win is a good win.  All you can do is try to beat the team lining up on the other side of the ball.  Our losses are not asterisked because we have lost 5 starting OLs plus our best offensive weapon.

5-3 is a good record, better than I expected, and despite what happened Sunday, I still think this is a quality team.

 

The team is a good team. Many players have improved from last year, but if Zach doesn't  improve on what we have seen from him the last 4 games, it is going to be difficult to beat anyone.  

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1 hour ago, fullblast said:

1. Getting off of your first read

2. Not looking at the pass rush

3. Stepping up in the pocket

4. Consistent footwork

A lot of this is basic QB stuff that you would expect of a #2 pick. The reason why Moore is frustrated is because he's usually the third or fourth read on any given play and Zach never makes it to him. It's also the reason why Garrett's production plummeted until he took Corey Davis' spot on Sunday.

He has a lot of athleticism but seems to use it as a crutch more so than a weapon. He has gotten better at knowing when to throw the ball away but had some bad lapses on Sunday. His comments after the game weren't exactly encouraging, either.

To me, the kid looks overwhelmed. Maybe he works through it, but right now he looks like a QB who's head is barely above water.

Zach threw the ball 41 times and had 355 passing yards.  Tyler Conklin had 6 receptions and was targeted 10 times.  Mims had 2 catches for 76 yards and had 3 targets.

The Jets lost because he was forced to pass the ball more.  The Jets are built to run the ball and they injuries to the OL and running backs along with lossing the lead on the first possession of the second half changed the game plan.

Before yesterday the Jets weren't passing the ball 25 plus times to win games.

Moore maybe frustrated but I suspect it's about a lot more than the game plan or Zach.  Last year with the injuries he was the best WR on the team.  Not really good, not really healthy but the best of who was available.  He's now being expossed for who he is.   He's not as good as Davis or Wilson and while more polished than Mims has less upside and doesn't block.  We have TE who can catch the ball and running backs who are making an impact.  The Jets have upgraded the talent and Moore hasn't progressed.  

Zach was awful on Sunday but targets and passing yards weren't an issue.  

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11 minutes ago, Lith said:

There have been some clips posted where he bails without any pressure.  Honestly, at this point, I don't know what the issue is, there seem to be so many.  On the one hand, you see him rolling right and throwing 50 yards down field to hit Garrett Wilson in stride to set up a score.  Then a few plays later, he bails from a clean pocket and turns a 10 yard throw into a 20 yard throw and we settle for a field goal.  Its is maddening because the glimpses are there, but they are too few and far between.  The struggles are consistent.  The flashes of good play are just that, flashes.

Because this was how he played at BYU and nobody ever fixed it because he got away with it.  

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1 hour ago, Lith said:

I am never going to apologize for winning games in the NFL.  If anything, as Jet fans we have learned that winning is hard and any win is a good win.  All you can do is try to beat the team lining up on the other side of the ball.  Our losses are not asterisked because we have lost 5 starting OLs plus our best offensive weapon.

5-3 is a good record, better than I expected, and despite what happened Sunday, I still think this is a quality team.

 

This is a quality team. Unfortunately we have a bust at the most important position in all of sports. 

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22 minutes ago, JiFapono said:

He's always need to be reworked!  lmfao.  Nothing he did in college translated.  He was playing flag Football.  It's my biggest frustration w/ this situation.  I get they had Knapp and his unfortunate passing was a big loss for this team but what is his personal coach working on him with?  It's like everyone is telling him (see Chris Simms), that he's special and his off script stuff is awesome, and encouraging it.  Instead of, just working on ******* QB 101 stuff, like how to drop back properly, step up properly, square you shoulders, step into the throw, keep your eyes up not at the pressure, dont fade, dont bail, dont turn your back to the LOS.  lol  Legit, High School sh*t dude. 

No f'n idea lol. I do think John Beck here last year actually helped. But they need someone on staff that can do help real time during the season when these bad habits happen. I have no idea what Calaberese is doing. Is he saying "Good job" each time? like how are you not yelling at him and saying HEY MAYBE DON'T THROW FALLING BACKWARDS. No? Nothing?

But it's like after Knapp they just said oh well, let's roll with it and see what happens. And put no further effort into actually developing him.  I am curious to see how he comes back after the BYE week, assuming he meets up with Beck again. Lord help us.

Edit: I just looked up Calabrese. Dude had 2 years experience before coming here. Was quality control coach in Denver. WTF are we doing???? This is who you put in charge of developing your franchise guy? Jesus christ. No wonder he's going backwards.

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2 hours ago, fullblast said:

1. Getting off of your first read

2. Not looking at the pass rush

3. Stepping up in the pocket

4. Consistent footwork

A lot of this is basic QB stuff that you would expect of a #2 pick. The reason why Moore is frustrated is because he's usually the third or fourth read on any given play and Zach never makes it to him. It's also the reason why Garrett's production plummeted until he took Corey Davis' spot on Sunday.

He has a lot of athleticism but seems to use it as a crutch more so than a weapon. He has gotten better at knowing when to throw the ball away but had some bad lapses on Sunday. His comments after the game weren't exactly encouraging, either.

To me, the kid looks overwhelmed. Maybe he works through it, but right now he looks like a QB who's head is barely above water.

I would add not just stepping up, but lateral slides in the pocket.  You take whatever space is there to create throwing lanes for yourself.  As with everything, this takes a lot of practice.

And you have to be willing to do it in-game (when there is a chance you might have to take a hit from a 300 lb lineman).

But Wilson can never improve as a pocket QB because he doesn't stay in the pocket.  He flees even when nobody pursues.

If he doesn't see his primary read wide freaking open right away, he bails as if he thinks he's about to get trapped in Fukushima.

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9 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

Because this was how he played at BYU and nobody ever fixed it because he got away with it.  

Idk man.  His kryponite is something different every play. Mechanics,  timing, getting off read 1, giving up too early. It's always something or some combination of bad things most plays. 

I think if he CS is going to fix him, they need to focus on 1 issue at a time instead of giving him 10 things every week to work on. 

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1 hour ago, Greensleeves said:

absolutely this - Zach showed elite throwing ability. The same people that b*tch about his completion percentage are also the people that want him to throw the ball away more. Well his completion percentage isn't great because he DOES throw the ball away a LOT. He just needs to learn to be more decisive with the throw out of bounds.

LOL

Blaming the WRs for drops used to be the go-to excuse on the incompletion rate

There were no drops on Sunday, so let's find another excuse

Aaron Rodgers has thrown away so many balls this season.  His WRs are trash.

Rodgers' completion rate is still 66.4% on the year

Wilson's completion rate was sub-50% on Sunday because he's a bad QB

He's so inaccurate that (by his own admission), he couldn't even throw it out bounds when he was trying to.

I mean who are we kidding here

 

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1 hour ago, Greensleeves said:

absolutely this - Zach showed elite throwing ability. The same people that b*tch about his completion percentage are also the people that want him to throw the ball away more. Well his completion percentage isn't great because he DOES throw the ball away a LOT. He just needs to learn to be more decisive with the throw out of bounds. I think he's going to be elite once he stops doing young QB stuff. His mistakes had no relation to the Patriots' scheme - they were on him trying to make something happen when it just wasn't there. He did adjust at the end of the game on the last drive throwing the ball away better and making accurate throws. Jets fans trying to sabotage our season by spewing the hate makes me scratch my head. He is our QB for the entire year and most likely for a long time. By getting on him relentlessly only hurts the Jets chances of winning. Not sure why a fan would want that. I get it, if he doesn't perform well the rest of the year then you can get on him all off season. Did you see Burrows take 5 sacks last night? That's Zach running around and throwing the ball away most games. Burrows will end the game 25-35 with 5 sacks. Zach would be 25-39 with one sack and 4 throw aways. Many QBs don't want throw aways to negatively impact their stats - Zach just wants to win.

No. People bitching about lousy how awful Wilson has been has ZERO IMPACT on how he plays. This MB is fun, but you need to get over yourself. This is the toy dept of things.  If Zach Wilson is so weak that what we write on this board impacts his play, we have way bigger problems than we knew. 

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51 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Waste of a season if that's all we care about TBQH.  

exactly. we cant waste this season on Zach. at 5-2 there is no way in hell we can let the playoffs slip away.

the media is in full frenzy mode. they are all killing Zach. another bad game and Saleh will feel serious pressure to make a move. i forget who said this on ESPN yesterday but they said that " we have been quiet on Zach these last few weeks cause there winning. but now we cant hide from the fact that the Jets won is spite of Zach not because of him ".

and when the media starts blowing things up like this the owners start to notice. 

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1 hour ago, PorP said:

Idk man.  His kryponite is something different every play. Mechanics,  timing, getting off read 1, giving up too early. It's always something or some combination of bad things most plays. 

I think if he CS is going to fix him, they need to focus on 1 issue at a time instead of giving him 10 things every week to work on. 

If they are doing that, I would hope the first thing they are going to work on is showing him where the pocket exists  so he knows where he is supposed to stand and move instead of running backwards. One of the things Zach was lauded  for during the draft was his ability  to go off script and make off platform throws. Well more times than not, those off platform throws are getting picked. The really sad thing is when he has his feet under him, he throws the ball as good as any QB in the league. 

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Zach Wilson is incapable of throwing the football out of bounds because he says he's bored.  Yes, this is exactly where I'd hoped he'd be at this point.  Next year we work on showing him how to use the hand warmers correctly in cold weather.  Stop trying to rush the kid.  He's coming along just fine.

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1 hour ago, Lith said:

 

What I have heard is that the coaches and Zach were more upset with this then they were some of the other throws. This stuff comes down to focus. Zach left a lot of yards on the field on these very easy quick-hitters simply because he did not set himself.  

I thought the 3rd interception was a joke and I was livid at the moment it happened, but coaches were less critical given down and situation. It's 3rd down by 9. You don't want it but if he throws it away they're punting anyway.

 

These are a few plays the team was most frustrated with in addition to the first throw Orlovsky points out: 

Q1, 10:44.  If Zach throws the ball a split second sooner, it's a 30-yard gain. Instead, he threw it high and inside to avoid the corner. Needs to drive the ball and anticipate where Conklin will be instead of waiting for him to make the turn.  

Q1, 8:24.  There was a lot of frustration with this play that casual onlookers probably were not privy to. 2nd & 8 first read was Garrett Wilson over the middle if its zone coverage and Uzomah in the flat after a chip if its man coverage. Zach did a number of things wrong on this play: (1) he should've quickly processed that Garrett was likely not his option because they showed man during pre-snap motion; (2) he's supposed to look off the LBs/S first and by the time he reaches his drop release it to the outside of Uzomah's frame inside the sideline... if he does this Uzomah either gains a few yards or walks in for a TD if he makes 48 miss.... (3) If neither are open Zach has the option to go full field back to Berrios behind the LOS, but Zach didn't see it because he turned his whole body 180 degrees and backpeddled despite no pressure after he already lagging on the first two reads, which made it impossible for him to look to the right side of the field... Had he stayed composed and kept his body square he should be able to find Berrios and give him an opportunity to make a play or set up a 3rd and manageable, instead he ran back despite no pressure and made an improvised throw to Carter that was well defended. 

Q2, 0:48.  This Ty Johnson throw is just yuck. The rush is in your face but you cannot, cannot, lean back and throw off your back foot in this situation. 

Q3, 4:41.  2nd & 18 pinned within the 5. Pocket was clean enough but Zach knew he had nothing. He did the right thing to buy a little space but under no circumstances should he still have the ball in his hands when 2 blockers are closing in your own endzone with all the lineman standing upright. THROW IT AWAY. It's a 6-point game... no need to be reckless. 

Q3, 2:34.  Extremely lazy and poor decision-making. It's 1st and 10 on a designed roll-out. People saw Mims was open downfield but that's really not the option for the play- he's doing that to clear out the middle of the field. Conklin is read 1, and Uzomah has the option to peel off after he makes his initial block. The Pats defend it perfectly. At that point, Zach knows he's supposed to run or throw it away. Instead, he stalls to buy a little more time to see if something develops- Garrett smartly peels off to run downfield, but Zach is late to feel the pressure, so he throws it out of bounds, but doesn't put enough on it so its intercepted. This was Zach's worst rep of the game and a hopeful teaching moment. Zach "meant to throw it out of bounds", but again, the coaches don't want him waiting waiting and waiting before making these decisions... it's not 3rd down. Live to fight another down. Sure, if you don't have pressure coming and Uzomah holds the block, see what happens when the play breaks down and if you can fire one downfield go for it. But that wasn't what happened and Zach knew Uzomah's block expired, had options, and instead wanted to exhaust every second before throwing it away; naturally it gets picked. This is not what the Jets want out of him. This is a case where the decision was correct, but the process was wrong and the result was wrong. Just throw it out of bounds earlier and you don't have this. 

 

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