There Was Blame to Go Around For This Loss Besides the Wilson Train Wreck

[undertow]

1 minute ago, RevisIsland610 said:

This is true. The only way we were scoring is if the defense scored which they almost did on the first series. 

I was done with the game when they didn't even try to get in FG range with two minute left....wasn't even pissed with the return we were never winning the game.

[Hex]

1 hour ago, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

Wilson was terrible, awful, horrific today.  There is no doubt about that.  But, with all of that he did and did not do, the game was tied 3-3 with 2 minutes left and the Jets had the ball.

 

It is clear that Wilson's future as the QB of this team is hanging by a thread and that there are serious questions about whether he is an NLF quality QB.  But let's not gloss over the other issues that contributed to the bad loss today.

First, the OL is a mess.  Injuries have completely depleted the OL.  The right side of the OL was manned by  the Jets 4th string RT and 3rd string RG and it showed.  The Jets, who are a run first team,  averaged 1.5 yards a carry today when you take out Wilson's three runs for 26 yards. The pass protection was not much better.  Feeney is not an NFL player.

Second, the punt return TD was an epic special teams failure and was the primary and direct reason for the loss.  That was the first punt returned for TD this season in the NFL.  The punt should have been out of bounds. The coverage should have been better. To give up that TD was ridiculous. Without that horrific breakdown, who knows what happens in OT?

Third, the play calling was bad all day.  Everyone is pointing out how Jones was able to throw for over 200 yards today.  The Pats threw half of their passes to RBs and tight ends on a day when conditions made downfield passing difficult.  The Jets threw 3 passes to RBs all day and one was a long pass to Ty Johnson.  Where were the passes to Carter?????  Conklin got only 3 targets and no other tight end was targeted. Why not?  BB took Wilson out of the game and the Jets had no answer.  On the last drive before the punt disaster, why not take a shot downfield? At that point, you only need one play or a flag and a FG wins the game.  

Fourth, the clock management on the last drive was terrible. Either run the clock out by running the ball (which makes not sense to me with the field position the Jets had on that last set of downs before the punt) or you try to win the game. 

Lastly, as good the defense played today, the ONE fault I found is that they repeatedly let the Pats flip the field in the 3rd and 4th quarter.  Rather than get some key  3 and outs so the Pats had to punt into the wind from deep in their territory, the Jets continually let the Pats gain 20-30 yards so that the punts pinned the Jets deep over and over on a day when the offense needed some help. 

Zach Wilson overthrew checkdowns like 10 times and when he did hit them there were a ton of Pats defenders waiting to tackle.

Belichick's game plan of putting all the defense within 10 yards of the LOS was incredibly smart, seeing that the Jets did nothing the whole day. Zach couldn't hit anybody for the life of him, and the Patriots feasted on that. MLF probably could have called a better game plan but it probably would have gone a similar way.

With the TEs they had to block because the OL was bad, so they weren't available. Not that Zach would hit them anyways.

As to why taking a shot downfield is a bad idea, 1) the wind would make the ball move unexpectedly, and 2) When the game is tied with 2 minutes left you don't throw the ball up for grabs. There's essentially a 50% chance a Patriot catches a ball like that and runs 20+ yards to set up the Pats offense nicely for a field goal or better. Nobody could have seen the ST disaster so it doesn't make sense to do that. 

Zach pinned the CS into a corner. They could have done better but Zach couldn't have done much worse.

[RevisIsland610]

1 minute ago, bitonti said:

The Jets had more punts than pass completions today the offense is historically bad and there's no bottom to how many games this team can lose 

TODAY they did but they don't play Bellicheat anymore this year. It's not historically bad at all. They have some nice pieces but have to figure out the QB thing. 

[Joe Willie White Shoes]

I give up.  I am not giving Wilson a pass.  Other than the 4th quarter of the Steelers game, he has shown nothing other than the ability to be a game manager at times.

 

However, that punt return loses the game if the score is tied 3-3 or 30-30 at that point. Yet, nobody is talking about what a horrible play that was.  Laflear crapped the bed with his play calls today as well.  And how is Ty Johnson even on the field today?  Why trade for Robinson if the plan was to use Johnson?  As bad as Wilson was, and he was terrible, the game was there for the taking with two minutes left and both Lafleur and whoever is responsible for clock management  - and the punt coverage team - all had a massive brain cramp and blew a game that was still winnable with 30 seconds to go....

But it shouldn't surprise me that some of you enter every thread and are one trick ponies - be it Wilson, Saleh or Douglas.  Bench Wilson ("because you knew he stunk from day 1" or "fire Saleh because he keeps playing Wilson" or "fire JD because he made some personnel mistakes."  Today raised serious questions about whether Wilson should be benched and whether a new QB is needed for 2023 - vet or rookie.  But play the last 30 seconds differently and we could be having these discussion after a 6-3 (butt ugly) win and a 7-3 record.  

[Joe Willie White Shoes]

4 minutes ago, undertow said:

I was done with the game when they didn't even try to get in FG range with two minute left....wasn't even pissed with the return we were never winning the game.

That is just not true.  I've seen too much football to conclude that was not still a winnable game.  

[Joe Willie White Shoes]

11 minutes ago, doitny said:

because the offense should not have scored 3 points in 59 and a half minutes. it should have never came down to that punt. 

he completed 40% of his passes. overthrew 2 screen passes, bounce a pass to a wide open Moore. underthrew GW on the sideline, had a pass blocked at the LOS. how can you blame play calling when you QB cant be trusted to complete a pass.

Mac got sacked 6 times and still had a really good game so lets not blame the OL cause Zach cant handle any pressure.

and your defense grip? they beat us in TOP 35-24. the defense cant be on the field that long and yet we still held them to 3 points.

i dont get this Zach defense. you do realize whether its this week or at the end of the year he will never be a FQB. nobody who has played this bad in 2 years has ever done it. he will even be worst than Josh Allen 2nd year. he has a 1- 1000 chance to succeed. 

Reading is fundamental.  I never once defended Wilson in this thread.  Not one single word.  

[undertow]

2 minutes ago, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

That is just not true.  I've seen too much football to conclude that was not still a winnable game.  

We had 2 yards in the second half and didn't even attempt to move the ball with two minutes left....the game was over we were lucky Folk missed 2 FGs....we didn't deserve to win the game.

[bitonti]

7 minutes ago, RevisIsland610 said:

TODAY they did but they don't play Bellicheat anymore this year. It's not historically bad at all. They have some nice pieces but have to figure out the QB thing. 

Spoiler alert the patriots aren't any good either 

This is not a juggernaut patriots team anymore they are mediocre at best 

Teams like the bears and lions put up 30 ppg they are going to get their stuff pushed in for the rest of the season 

[RevisIsland610]

8 minutes ago, bitonti said:

Spoiler alert the patriots aren't any good either 

This is not a juggernaut patriots team anymore they are mediocre at best 

Teams like the bears and lions put up 30 ppg they are going to get their stuff pushed in for the rest of the season 

Spoiler alert: The Patriots have a very good defense and allowed the least points in the league. Patriots offense also scored 3 points and the Jets have one of the best defenses in the league. This team is not their stuffed pushed in the rest of the season but you keep being you. 

[bitonti]

3 minutes ago, RevisIsland610 said:

Patriots offense scored 3 points and the Jets have one of the best defenses in the league. This team is not their stuffed pushed in the rest of the season but you keep being you. 

Folk did miss 2 FG but I agree 

The Jets have a great defense yes 

 defenses can't win games by themselves 

It's 2022 not 1940 a modern nfl offense should be able to score lots of points every game 

This group can't even get first downs let alone score points 

[RevisIsland610]

2 minutes ago, bitonti said:

Folk did miss 2 FG but I agree 

The Jets have a great defense yes 

 defenses can't win games by themselves 

It's 2022 not 1940 a modern nfl offense should be able to score lots of points every game 

This group can't even get first downs let alone score points 

Again, the Patriots have allowed the fewest points in the NFL and they won't be playing the Patriots anymore. As a matter of fact the only team left that has a top defense is Buffalo. Every other team is middle of the pact to bottom in defense. 

[Jetsplayer21]

1 hour ago, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

OK. So Wilson gave up the punt return TD? As terrible as he was today, how do you ignore an 84 yard punt return TD - the only punt return TD in the NFL this season - with 5 freaking seconds left in the game??????  

Dudeee. It didn’t matter how or when pats were scoring. There was NO way Wilson was getting jets into FG range. Best we could have hoped for was tie after 2 OTS

[Joe Willie White Shoes]

29 minutes ago, Jetsplayer21 said:

Dudeee. It didn’t matter how or when pats were scoring. There was NO way Wilson was getting jets into FG range. Best we could have hoped for was tie after 2 OTS

Dude. Know the rules. There is one 10 minute OT, not 2.  And the Jets could have gotten into FG range a number of ways in OT.  

[JustInFudge]

7 hours ago, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

I give up.  I am not giving Wilson a pass.  Other than the 4th quarter of the Steelers game, he has shown nothing other than the ability to be a game manager at times.

 

However, that punt return loses the game if the score is tied 3-3 or 30-30 at that point. Yet, nobody is talking about what a horrible play that was.  Laflear crapped the bed with his play calls today as well.  And how is Ty Johnson even on the field today?  Why trade for Robinson if the plan was to use Johnson?  As bad as Wilson was, and he was terrible, the game was there for the taking with two minutes left and both Lafleur and whoever is responsible for clock management  - and the punt coverage team - all had a massive brain cramp and blew a game that was still winnable with 30 seconds to go....

But it shouldn't surprise me that some of you enter every thread and are one trick ponies - be it Wilson, Saleh or Douglas.  Bench Wilson ("because you knew he stunk from day 1" or "fire Saleh because he keeps playing Wilson" or "fire JD because he made some personnel mistakes."  Today raised serious questions about whether Wilson should be benched and whether a new QB is needed for 2023 - vet or rookie.  But play the last 30 seconds differently and we could be having these discussion after a 6-3 (butt ugly) win and a 7-3 record.  

I mean, I appreciate your effort here.  Truly do.   But nobody is excusing the kick return for a TD.  Nobody is like, oh no big deal.  It was heart wrenching, shouldnt have happened but brother, that was 1 play in a 60 minute game, it didnt need to come down to that play.  The offense produced 2 yards in the second half, they were terrible.  Lil Mikey has been dragged through the coals for his play calling.  Meanwhile the defense in 2 games this season vs. the Pats, has given up 1 TD.   1 TD in 8 quarters of Football in 2 games where the offense continued to hand them ridiculous field position.  The offense gave Greg the Leg, once chance, he nailed it.  

Bro, lol, not the game to start looking for scapegoats not named Wilson.  To put this on the punter, who had more punts than the team had first downs, is next level mental gymnastics, no offense.   And on what planet, even if they did manage to not blow the punt, are you expecting the Jets to do anything on offense after that?  lol  The idea everything would have been different is like you werent watching the same game.  Wilson couldnt do the simplest of asks yesterday, to sit here and try to place blame on any one else after that performance is going to fall of deaf ears. 

[Xtina]

Who cares? Yiu can’t win a football game by scoring 3 points 

[Ecuadorian Jet]

This was always supposed to be the year we find out the truth about Wilson. I hate the loss as much as everyone around here. In the past few weeks I have joined in the fun of us fans about dreaming of an unexpected playoff run this year. But of course, then you have hyperbolic fans that start seducing other fans with these dreams of superbowl even; we catch the attention of the media, and now everyone exaggerates about the Jets. 

We have a mediocre OL that has at times overachieve, but they are not overachievers by nature. We have a QB that became the flavor of the month in the "upside down" year of 2020, who is actually playing exactly the same way he played in college. 

Can Wilson elevate his game through coaching and actually become a professional level player?

That is what this year was always about. 

Would I love to see the Jets make the playoffs and make a deep run? Absolutely. But we have to find, beyond reasonable doubt, if we have to give up draft capital or money in FA to get a top QB, or if we have keep filling talent to this team. 

[68JET11]

8 hours ago, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

First, the OL is a mess.  Injuries have completely depleted the OL.  The right side of the OL was manned by  the Jets 4th string RT and 3rd string RG and it showed.  The Jets, who are a run first team,  averaged 1.5 yards a carry today when you take out Wilson's three runs for 26 yards. The pass protection was not much better.  Feeney is not an NFL player.

Thanks, for not only me being the one to point this out... JD needs to draft or fix this line with young guys who can stay around for a long time TOGETHER. There is no way that we are going to win anything come playoff time without a GOOD, I'm not saying elite, but VERY GOOD OL.

[68JET11]

8 hours ago, bitonti said:

Braden Mann, JD draft pick, out kicked his coverage 

Mekhi Becton, AVT, JD draft picks, no where to be seen 

Breece hall, JD draft pick, injured 

Corey Davis jd free agent, injured again 

Yes there are alot of reasons for this loss besides Zach and it all traces back to the decisions made by the general manager 

Zach wilson is the only one who can fix all these problems just by playing at a competent level, which is why he gets the focus 

This team is where it is, because of the moves JD made. No GM is 100% perfect, and he will have his busts, but so far he's far ahead in effective players than ineffective ones.

[hotrodcharlie]

6 hours ago, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

Dude. Know the rules. There is one 10 minute OT, not 2.  And the Jets could have gotten into FG range a number of ways in OT.  

exactly. the punt and the decision to not punt it out of bounds were atrocious. It speaks to how bad Zach Wilson played that a punt return like that that happens twice in the history of the game is something people are less mad about than Wilson

[Irish Jet]

Belichick took away the running game and he knew the result.

If ever a game was all on the QB this was it. 

[Larz]

Agreed, and I look forward to the “guys we really are a Super Bowl team” after next weeks win ?

[BUM-KNEE]

8 hours ago, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

OK. So Wilson gave up the punt return TD? As terrible as he was today, how do you ignore an 84 yard punt return TD - the only punt return TD in the NFL this season - with 5 freaking seconds left in the game??????  

I saw 2 blocks in the back on that return, where were the flags?

[kdels62]

The blame goes as follows

1) Zach 

2) LaFleur

and that’s really it. 

[Biggs]

8 hours ago, Joe Willie White Shoes said:

This thread was not about JD, who did a great job building this team.  This thread is about the Jets inability to run the ball at all today - a yard a carry?  It is about the awful punt coverage with 20 seconds left in the game and the decision to kick in the middle of the field. It is about not trying to win the game with 30 seconds left when the risk was small at that point.  I am not defending Wilson.  

Agree with you completely.  The problem with this narrative is their is an elephant in the room.  An 11 minute deficiet in TOP.  The Pats don't have an offensive coordinator and they put together an offense that while it couldn't score points against our D flipped field position and kept their D fresh.  Watching that game there were two truths.  Zach Wilson isn't ready to start at QB and the Pats coaching staff is miles better than the Jets coaching staff.  

The defensive effort was borderline heroic down the stretch.  It was an unbelivable effort.  They bent, they were exhusted but they didn't break.  

Watching that game it was like watching a small band of heroes defend an inlet against an overwhelming army.  It was a terrible look for the OC and the QB.  

 

[The Crusher]

8 hours ago, bitonti said:

The only way this team wins another game this year is if Zach gets hurt or benched. That's where this offense is at, realistically. Offense can't function at even a basic level right now 

 

Yep. Yep and Yep. Not bad QB play, historically terrible QB play.,

[Integrity28]

8 hours ago, sciond said:

The only other blame goes to the people who kept him in the game

This.