How did Joe Douglas Miss so bad?

[kevinc855]

Serious question? Zach seems to be a disaster in so many ways. 

1) Did he not pick up on his very unlikeable nature?

2) The casual footwork has always been an issue, did JD think it get coached out?

3) His lack of accountability. With more research, it seems this was an issue a bit at times at BYU as well. 

4) He never played anyone good. When they actually weren't playing a team like North Alabama and decent team like Utah he lost. Did JD not care? 

Seriously this guy collapsed in so many ways, off and on the field. 

How did JD mess this up so bad?

[ACourseinMiracles]

I think QB is an entity unto itself. There are so few good ones you just gotta take a swing. I'd only fault him if there was a clearly better choice. I personally wanted Fields but he had flaws coming out too.

[Beerfish]

1)  No one knows about QBs until they face real adversity in the pros.

2) His and Salehs sin was not drafting a project QB with a good arm that needed a lot of work, the sin was starting him when he was years from being ready and having no viable good backup QB or reliable vet to run the team for a few years.

With QBs coming into this league you have to forget their draft position and be very patient.  Many teams are not patient at all and others start out patient but succumb to the pressure to play the guy as soon as their vet has a bad game.

[kevinc855]

Just now, ACourseinMiracles said:

I think QB is an entity unto itself. There are so few good ones you just gotta take a swing. I'd only fault him if there was a clearly better choice. I personally wanted Fields but he had flaws coming out too.

Its a false narrative of "who else you gona take" Maybe not Wilson? Or maybe you trade back and get the Vet like many of us wanted. We woulda gota a HAUL for number 2

[SuicidalSince98]

He missed on the offensive coaches 

[doitny]

7 minutes ago, SuicidalSince98 said:

He missed on the offensive coaches 

i cant wait till sunday where we will know if its the OC or Zach.

[SuicidalSince98]

1 minute ago, doitny said:

i cant wait till sunday where we will know if its the OC or Zach.

Against one of the worst defenses in the nfl?

[Jetsfan80]

1 minute ago, SuicidalSince98 said:

Against one of the worst defenses in the nfl?

?

[GangGreened]

4 minutes ago, doitny said:

i cant wait till sunday where we will know if its the OC or Zach.

“But it was a bad defense”

Edit: like clockwork

[k-met57]

18 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

Serious question? Zach seems to be a disaster in so many ways. 

1) Did he not pick up on his very unlikeable nature?

2) The casual footwork has always been an issue, did JD think it get coached out?

3) His lack of accountability. With more research, it seems this was an issue a bit at times at BYU as well. 

4) He never played anyone good. When they actually weren't playing a team like North Alabama and decent team like Utah he lost. Did JD not care? 

Seriously this guy collapsed in so many ways, off and on the field. 

How did JD mess this up so bad?

i think you are missing the point of the draft buddy...its to draft prospects not pro-bowlers.

[Grandy]

To be fair, pretty much everyone else would've made the same pick. 

[GangGreened]

Zach Wilson was just the typical, small sample size QB who shot up the boards that year. Hopefully he’s got a good plan to correct it.

[Sammybighead]

First of all, JD didn't miss bad. JD, every coach and every scout missed bad. It was a group decision, they all independently evaluated all qbs, and all came to the same conclusion that zach was the guy. Everyone had a voice.

If you haven't read about the draft process the jets go through, Hughes has an article about, search it out. 

[ACourseinMiracles]

10 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

Its a false narrative of "who else you gona take" Maybe not Wilson? Or maybe you trade back and get the Vet like many of us wanted. We woulda gota a HAUL for number 2

Eh. At some point, for sustained success, you gotta hit one in the draft.

He took a shot one a guy when he was at the top of the draft. I don't blame him for taking a swing on talent. I'd blame him if he passed on someone legit better or not moving on from a miss.

I'm not against a vet option, could give a youngster some time to develop but I think if we want any kind of sustainable success we gotta hit in the draft and that means taking few swings.

Joe seems to be getting better at drafting, maybe his next choice at QB will be the one.

[LSJF]

25 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

Serious question? Zach seems to be a disaster in so many ways. 

1) Did he not pick up on his very unlikeable nature?

2) The casual footwork has always been an issue, did JD think it get coached out?

3) His lack of accountability. With more research, it seems this was an issue a bit at times at BYU as well. 

4) He never played anyone good. When they actually weren't playing a team like North Alabama and decent team like Utah he lost. Did JD not care? 

Seriously this guy collapsed in so many ways, off and on the field. 

How did JD mess this up so bad?

[Vader]

The miss was pretending ZW was a “Brett Favre-esque” finished product. ZW was and still is a big arm project with a high ceiling. He is raw af and needs serious coaching. He could still pan out… it ain’t over but he needs a reset and serious coaching 

[hawk]

Oh for **** sake

[Claymation]

i cant wait till sunday where we will know if its the OC or Zach.

We will find out not this week, but against Minnesota then Buffalo.

[SuicidalSince98]

20 minutes ago, GangGreened said:

“But it was a bad defense”

Edit: like clockwork

Just because you know the counter argument doesn’t make it inaccurate 

[Jetsfan80]

2 minutes ago, SuicidalSince98 said:

Just because you know the counter argument doesn’t make it inaccurate 

For once it’ll be nice to have a QB under center who can maybe take advantage of a bad defense.  

[doitny]

26 minutes ago, SuicidalSince98 said:

Against one of the worst defenses in the nfl?

there better than Pittsburgh. where Zach had a sh*tty 3 qts.

[T0mShane]

The big unknown with Zach Wilson The Prospect was whether or not he could handle a pass rush because it was not something he had to do at BYU. He was only sacked 11 times in 12 games as a Junior. Granted, that’s a pass/fail proposition because he was obviously going to face pressure in the pros, but they gambled on him handling it. He has not 

[RevisIsland610]

ZW has been bad but who in that draft class has actually done anything since being drafted? All of them have struggled. The last few games Fields has played better but he still has his issues. It's just not as good a QB draft class as people thought. 

[BigRy56]

He swung at the physical ability. Looks like a miss right now. Thankfully he’s done such a great job with the rest of the team and his coaching hire that he will get to swing again - likely in a high priced free agent or trade this time around

[Joe Willie White Shoes]

32 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

1)  No one knows about QBs until they face real adversity in the pros.

2) His and Salehs sin was not drafting a project QB with a good arm that needed a lot of work, the sin was starting him when he was years from being ready and having no viable good backup QB or reliable vet to run the team for a few years.

With QBs coming into this league you have to forget their draft position and be very patient.  Many teams are not patient at all and others start out patient but succumb to the pressure to play the guy as soon as their vet has a bad game.

Name one current QB (besides  Rodgers a hundred years ago) who was drafted early, sat for an entire season, and is now a franchise QB.  I'll wait. 

 

I'll save you time. There isn't one, unless you want to count Mahomes, who played one game his rookie season sitting behind Alex Smith on a playoff team (the season before Mahomes was drafted -2016 -and the season after - 2017)

You keep making this point, but no NFL does this any more - ever.  You are citing a belief based on a practice that took place before the salary cap and rookie scale that is now completely obsolete.  

[CanadaSteve]

44 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

Its a false narrative of "who else you gona take" Maybe not Wilson? Or maybe you trade back and get the Vet like many of us wanted. We woulda gota a HAUL for number 2

Easy to say when it isn't your job on the line.  You NEED a QB, and the Jets had none.  We had the second pick and had everyone but Lawrence to choose from.  Trading back and signing Gardner Minshew would have had Jets fans calling for the third GM in 4 years.  

QB's are an ABSOLUTE crapshoot now, and do not get time to progress.  There are so few QB's ready to play in the NFL anymore.  It is a trend that should be concerning the people who run the league, and a solution (such as a minor league system) should be considered. 

 

[undertow]

Everyone is looking for the next Mahomes so they are taking QBs like Wilson and Lance way too high and forcing them on the field way too soon.  Wilson was always a high bust prospect which is why I wanted to move back and draft Fields...even if Fields busts at least you have the extra 1st rounders. 

[WhartonJet]

52 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

Serious question? Zach seems to be a disaster in so many ways. 

1) Did he not pick up on his very unlikeable nature?

2) The casual footwork has always been an issue, did JD think it get coached out?

3) His lack of accountability. With more research, it seems this was an issue a bit at times at BYU as well. 

4) He never played anyone good. When they actually weren't playing a team like North Alabama and decent team like Utah he lost. Did JD not care? 

Seriously this guy collapsed in so many ways, off and on the field. 

How did JD mess this up so bad?

These are fair criticisms IMO.  Anytime you bench the #2 overall pick in year 2, questions should be asked.  I love JD and what he's done as a whole, but he has to own this one.  I think every GM is tantalized by the allure of a cheap rookie QB which should give you a competitive advantage over the rest of the league assuming you can competent-good QB play for small cap dollars on that rookie deal.  So, I think JD saw the tools and took a calculated risk that he could get adequate-good (maybe very good) QB play out of Zach in his first 3-4 years.  In JD's mind, if he got this kind of cheap, good QB play, we should be a very good team with all of the other young studs maturing and growing around Zach at the same time.  Looks like this would have worked out amazingly well if we got even Tua Year 2 level play (65% comp pct, 200 yards per game, 1.5-1 TD-Int ratio) out of Zach but here we are.

Hopefully, we can salvage the season with Mike White.  Making the playoffs would be a huge step for the rebuild and give these guys really valuable experience heading into next year.

[Darnold's Forehead]

32 minutes ago, ACourseinMiracles said:

Eh. At some point, for sustained success, you gotta hit one in the draft.

He took a shot one a guy when he was at the top of the draft. I don't blame him for taking a swing on talent. I'd blame him if he passed on someone legit better or not moving on from a miss.

I'm not against a vet option, could give a youngster some time to develop but I think if we want any kind of sustainable success we gotta hit in the draft and that means taking few swings.

Joe seems to be getting better at drafting, maybe his next choice at QB will be the one.

The reality is, if Zach played like an average starter or promising, young QB, this team would be competing for the 1st seed in the AFC and be absolutely set for the next several years.  Unfortunately, the worst possible scenario has played out: Zach does not understand NFL QB play.  I don't blame JD for picking Wilson.  He's going to have to pick other QBs in future drafts, so he might as well get experience doing so.

[derp]

17 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

The big unknown with Zach Wilson The Prospect was whether or not he could handle a pass rush because it was not something he had to do at BYU. He was only sacked 11 times in 12 games as a Junior. Granted, that’s a pass/fail proposition because he was obviously going to face pressure in the pros, but they gambled on him handling it. He has not 

This is a big one.

He also says the right things and seems like a competitive guy so I bet they bought into that hard. Douglas has a type at QB, competitive guy with arm talent. Wilson has arm talent. Morgan was a cheap version of a similar profile.

The arm talent is real and the college production was great. He also seemed very in control at moments in college so I think they thought that was in there but in retrospect it was probably the OL.

This is an offense that makes things easy on QB’s…I still don’t get why they took one at two. Should’ve picked up the phone when SF called.

[Joe Willie White Shoes]

46 minutes ago, kevinc855 said:

Its a false narrative of "who else you gona take" Maybe not Wilson? Or maybe you trade back and get the Vet like many of us wanted. We woulda gota a HAUL for number 2

It's similarly a false narrative to say "get a vet QB."  What vet was available in 2021?  It's not like going to the supermarket and buying coffee. QBs do not grow on trees and they are not just "available." 

When a team like the Jets has an early draft pick and needs a QB, it makes sense to take a stab and draft one because if you hit, you are set for 10+ years with the first 5 at a bargain price that enables you to build a strong roster.  All the QBs drafted in 2021 are a question. Lawrence is clearly the best so far, but he is far from generational and is still below average.  Fields can run, but his ability to read defenses and pass consistently is still a major issue. Mac Jones has a very low ceiling.  Trey Lance can't get on the field and when he has, he looks ridiculously raw. SF would have been in deep trouble if Garappolo were healthy in the offseason because they would have traded him.  

[Paradis]

1 hour ago, kevinc855 said:

Serious question? Zach seems to be a disaster in so many ways. 

Seriously this guy collapsed in so many ways, off and on the field. 

How did JD mess this up so bad?

Same as you and many others. Fell for the dream. The “off platform” guy is so hot right now 

 

[bitonti]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say they didn't do the work on Zach's character. They looked at the arm talent and his highlights but they breezed right by the douche baggery 

[Paradis]

53 minutes ago, k-met57 said:

i think you are missing the point of the draft buddy...its to draft prospects not pro-bowlers.

What happened to you? 

[Paradis]

31 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

The big unknown with Zach Wilson The Prospect was whether or not he could handle a pass rush because it was not something he had to do at BYU. He was only sacked 11 times in 12 games as a Junior. Granted, that’s a pass/fail proposition because he was obviously going to face pressure in the pros, but they gambled on him handling it. He has not 

This and more. The lack of playing under pressure was glaring. I repeat, glaring… 

but they bet on a long shot and that needs be acknowledged. Wasn’t like a a big 10 QB with a good OLINE.