How did Joe Douglas Miss so bad?

[CanadienJetsFan]

2 minutes ago, Big_Slick said:

He needs to be held accountable

not only are we “resetting with Zack ” we are resetting at the quarterback position, organizationally speaking. That’s a huge set back.

What do you propose?We take him out back and shoot him? Lol

JD is not getting fired because of this pick because overall, the team is getting good. We’re actually talking playoff possibilities for this year! you gotta remember just how void of talent this roster was and has been for a long time.

Pointing the finger at JD doesn’t change the matter… It just makes you feel better by venting, yes, but the hardest thing to figure out as you know, is the quarterback position. And boy do we Jets fans know it!

yesterday was a sad day for the franchise AGAIN.

but just as quickly as things got ugly, things could improve.

 

I choose to be optimistic.

 

 

 

 

[derp]

46 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

Fields has a separated shoulder and takes way too many hits.  If he were here we’d all be lamenting how he won’t last 5 years.  Not the right qb, but his talent is undeniable.

Time will tell if he’s the right one, agree it’s possible he’s not, but better than the one they have now regardless. I think Chicago overcorrected not running him and will need to find a better middle ground.

[Big_Slick]

Just now, CanadienJetsFan said:

not only are we “resetting with Zack ” we are resetting at the quarterback position, organizationally speaking. That’s a huge set back.

What do you propose?We take him out back and shoot him? Lol

JD is not getting fired because of this pick because overall, the team is getting good. We’re actually talking playoff possibilities for this year! you gotta remember just how void of talent this roster was and has been for a long time.

Pointing the finger at JD doesn’t change the matter… It just makes you feel better by venting, yes, but the hardest thing to figure out as you know, is the quarterback position. And boy do we Jets fans know it!

yesterday was a sad day for the franchise AGAIN.

but just as quickly as things got ugly, things could improve.

 

I choose to be optimistic.

 

 

 

 

Yes - QB is the toughest to predict, but you don't take a WAG with the #2 OA pick. 

JD gets way too much credit for his draft picks. Hell - 5 guys on this board could have come away with better players given the same number of high picks as JD has had.

 

[RJIII]

13 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

Serious question? Zach seems to be a disaster in so many ways. 

1) Did he not pick up on his very unlikeable nature?

2) The casual footwork has always been an issue, did JD think it get coached out?

3) His lack of accountability. With more research, it seems this was an issue a bit at times at BYU as well. 

4) He never played anyone good. When they actually weren't playing a team like North Alabama and decent team like Utah he lost. Did JD not care? 

Seriously this guy collapsed in so many ways, off and on the field. 

How did JD mess this up so bad?

Should have drafted MAHOMES II at 6

[CanadaSteve]

Its also not Joe Douglas.

EVERY team that drafts in the top ten are there for a reason: They sucked the previous year.  And there is such a void of NFL caliber QB talent, that every year, a team drafts one and starts them right away.  

And every year the QB's coming out of college show more and more that they are NOT EVEN CLOSE to being ready for the NFL.  But like a lamb to the slaughter, there they are trying to save a franchise.

You need an owner who will trust his GM to draft a QB and let him sit a year.  build a team in front of him, THEN let him play.  JD has built the team, but Zach may already be ruined.  So, now what?

[Irish Jet]

4 minutes ago, CanadaSteve said:

And every year the QB's coming out of college show more and more that they are NOT EVEN CLOSE to being ready for the NFL.  But like a lamb to the slaughter, there they are trying to save a franchise.

This is quite the opposite of the trend actually. 

[ChewyandtheJets]

12 hours ago, undertow said:

Everyone is looking for the next Mahomes so they are taking QBs like Wilson and Lance way too high and forcing them on the field way too soon.  Wilson was always a high bust prospect which is why I wanted to move back and draft Fields...even if Fields busts at least you have the extra 1st rounders. 

I would have loved to trade back with San Fran, get 3 first rounders or maybe more, and the. Traded up to grab Fields when he dropped.  Of course that scenario is predicated on the fact that we knew Fields would drop.   Had we traded and Fields went 3rd and there were no QBs left than we would be the ones without a seat when the music stopped.  Pretty big risk. 

[kevinc855]

2 minutes ago, ChewyandtheJets said:

I would have loved to trade back with San Fran, get 3 first rounders or maybe more, and the. Traded up to grab Fields when he dropped.  Of course that scenario is predicated on the fact that we knew Fields would drop.   Had we traded and Fields went 3rd and there were no QBs left than we would be the ones without a seat when the music stopped.  Pretty big risk. 

They fell in love at a stupid pro day. 
 

reason number 13828 I hate pro days. It’s shorts people! 

[CanadienJetsFan]

8 minutes ago, Irish Jet said:

This is quite the opposite of the trend actually. 

That’s the big problem… if you wanna blame the GM It’s for having Zach start in year 1.

But that’s the way the current NFL works.

[Jetsplayer21]

8 minutes ago, Irish Jet said:

This is quite the opposite of the trend actually. 

Qbs coming from some programs, not the programs like BYU lol. And some of more pro geared programs still have qbs Coming out too early. Remember Pete carroll saying sanchez wasn’t ready. He only played 1 full yr as ufc. Darnold only 2. Jets love the project kids ha.

[Maynard13]

2 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

When people respond with deflection I know they have no substantial comment to add. Thanks for validating my post 

When one person does it, ok. But when 99.9% of your posts are deflected, then no.

[Green DNA]

10 hours ago, bitonti said:

the coastal carolina loss wasn't good 

There's this play at the end of the first half, Zach does his signature spin move against air, throws a hail mary INT (fine, whatever), gets pancaked by the blockers and then the benches clear

the first block by 34 was legal, the second one by 94 wasn't but no flags. 

It irks me on many levels. First why was the BYU team reacting to Zach taking a hit like it was the worst thing ever?  Why can't Zach defend himself? is it because he's the QB or because he's fragile/injury prone? why isn't Zach trying to make the tackle even?  it's like this guy doesn't want contact he's standing around like he's waiting for an Uber, and they ended up losing that game. To Coastal Carolina. 

the whole exchange reeked of entitlement. He was Zach Wilson not late stage Wayne Gretzky but the bench felt the need to protect their guy so much they stormed the field. I just wish he did a better job protecting himself, but at least bounce back, get angry and win the game. Some guys you bloody their lip they turn it up. Zach turtles in the face of hits. 

the scouting report on Zach (which BB has mastered) is easy. He's allergic to contact. If you hit him he will panic and eventually make a mistake. That's just bad film and again it's against Coastal Carolina not Clemson. 

 

The only thing I got out of your post was the word "entitlement".  The QB gets pancaked twice by a D lineman unnecessarily and his teammates rushed to defend him as would happen with most teams.  That makes him entitled?  Seems like "evidence" to prop up a narrative.

[undertow]

41 minutes ago, ChewyandtheJets said:

I would have loved to trade back with San Fran, get 3 first rounders or maybe more, and the. Traded up to grab Fields when he dropped.  Of course that scenario is predicated on the fact that we knew Fields would drop.   Had we traded and Fields went 3rd and there were no QBs left than we would be the ones without a seat when the music stopped.  Pretty big risk. 

Another option was trading back with Carolina to 9 there would have been a QB at that spot and you would have recieved a few top ten picks in return....I guess in the end it was all about how in love with WIlson you were....I personally didn't think he was a #2 overall pick in any draft. 

[AFJF]

14 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

Serious question? Zach seems to be a disaster in so many ways. 

1) Did he not pick up on his very unlikeable nature?

2) The casual footwork has always been an issue, did JD think it get coached out?

3) His lack of accountability. With more research, it seems this was an issue a bit at times at BYU as well. 

4) He never played anyone good. When they actually weren't playing a team like North Alabama and decent team like Utah he lost. Did JD not care? 

Seriously this guy collapsed in so many ways, off and on the field. 

How did JD mess this up so bad?

I dunno.  How did Ozzie Newsome miss so bad with Kyle Boller?  

It's almost as if the draft is an inexact science and any GM can miss on any player at any spot.

Just a theory, of course.

[bitonti]

19 minutes ago, Green DNA said:

 

The only thing I got out of your post was the word "entitlement".  The QB gets pancaked twice by a D lineman unnecessarily and his teammates rushed to defend him as would happen with most teams.  That makes him entitled?  Seems like "evidence" to prop up a narrative.

I'm not going to repeat it all but it was like Zach didn't expect contact and everyone reacted like how dare you sir 

He's a football player not the king of England. Go make a tackle on the int you just threw. Expect the contact and turn it up. That play as ugly as it was a net positive for coastal because they got in his head. And ultimately, to all the wins are a qb stat folks, they lost to coastal Carolina. How can you beat BB when coastal Carolina gets in your head? 

[Green DNA]

3 minutes ago, bitonti said:

I'm not going to repeat it all but it was like Zach didn't expect contact and everyone reacted like how dare you sir 

He's a football player not the king of England. Go make a tackle on the int you just threw. Expect the contact and turn it up. That play as ugly as it was a net positive for coastal because they got in his head. And ultimately, to all the wins are a qb stat folks, they lost to coastal Carolina. How can you beat BB when coastal Carolina gets in your head? 

Usually when you see a QB trying to make a tackle on an interception he is the last line of defense and gives it the old okey doke by diving at the ball carriers legs.  Most (all?) teams do not want their QB sticking his nose in and getting injured.  Did they get in his head or did he just not do enough to win?  I don't know and I'm pretty sure you don't either.  I think we can agree that BB has taken up residence in Zach's head.

[bitonti]

Just now, Green DNA said:

Usually when you see a QB trying to make a tackle on an interception he is the last line of defense and gives it the old okey doke by diving at the ball carriers legs.  Most (all?) teams do not want their QB sticking his nose in and getting injured.  Did they get in his head or did he just not do enough to win?  I don't know and I'm pretty sure you don't either.  I think we can agree that BB has taken up residence in Zach's head.

If Zach did not try to make the tackle because his coaches did not want him getting injured, that's the first piece of coaching he ever listened to. 

I'm sure they also told him not to throw off his back foot and all the other middle school qb errors. He can listen when it comes to self preservation but he can't listen to basic mechanics? 

Scouting is an art not a science sometimes you see a piece of film and it turns your stomach. 

I mean if we're talking about the Zach pick he's not looking great for return on investment. It doesn't matter why I found that clip so terrible, but the Zach defenders should know that he wouldn't have been on my board. Probably because of the shoulder injuries, all coachablity aside. He's just not special enough an athlete to play schoolyard ball in the NFL 

[bitonti]

33 minutes ago, AFJF said:

I dunno.  How did Ozzie Newsome miss so bad with Kyle Boller?  

It's almost as if the draft is an inexact science and any GM can miss on any player at any spot.

Just a theory, of course.

You keep bringing up Kyle boller who went 19th overall. That's almost a reasonable gamble. The end result is the same as missing at 2 or 3 but the Jets are paying retail 

Zach aside it always was insane to trade 3 2nd Rd picks for Sam Darnold. When they could have just stayed at 6 and taken the hall of fame guard. Quenton Nelson was the easiest guard to scout for a decade everyone knew he'd be an instant star. The jets did not just miss on darnold they missed huge. Without looking it up one of the 2nds became Darius Leonard 

Missing at 1,2 or 3 these are bad self inflicted wounds. Missing at 19 hurts but it's a lower priced gamble 

[maury77]

I'm just going to chalk up Becton and Zach as Douglas having to learn on the job under Covid and making mistakes. The last draft was arguably my favorite Jets draft ever and they are playing better. Sign Mariota if he gets cut, pick a QB on day 2 next year. Let all 3 QBs compete next year and if WIlson doesn't win the competition, keep him on the roster until its economically feasible to cut him (unless his camp starts demanding a trade which I can absolutely see happening). 

[kevinc855]

2 hours ago, AFJF said:

I dunno.  How did Ozzie Newsome miss so bad with Kyle Boller?  

It's almost as if the draft is an inexact science and any GM can miss on any player at any spot.

Just a theory, of course.

The 19th pick and 2nd is apples and oranges

Bad comparison 

[xJayce]

16 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

Serious question? Zach seems to be a disaster in so many ways. 

1) Did he not pick up on his very unlikeable nature?

2) The casual footwork has always been an issue, did JD think it get coached out?

3) His lack of accountability. With more research, it seems this was an issue a bit at times at BYU as well. 

4) He never played anyone good. When they actually weren't playing a team like North Alabama and decent team like Utah he lost. Did JD not care? 

Seriously this guy collapsed in so many ways, off and on the field. 

How did JD mess this up so bad?

1 and 3 where called out during the draft process (people questioned his leadership, birthday gate, etc)

For 2, I wonder how Zach was scouted. Who wanted him? Did JD fall in love? Was it Saleh? Lafleur? This being a 'young' coaching staff / FO, there may have been a lot of "Oh yeah, we can fix all that, but look at that arm". Maybe they over-evaluated what can and cannot be fixed?

For point 4, that's always tricky. Sauce was a smaller school guy as well and I think only play limited talent for most of the year. That's worked out well.

All that said, hindsight is giving us a much clearer view on these red flags today.

[Ron Rico]

Second guessing is for chumps. I just refuse to do it. We all make mistakes. 

[southparkcpa]

[greenwave81]

4 hours ago, Big_Slick said:

Yes - QB is the toughest to predict, but you don't take a WAG with the #2 OA pick. 

JD gets way too much credit for his draft picks. Hell - 5 guys on this board could have come away with better players given the same number of high picks as JD has had.

 

You have the best GM we’ve had in decades staring you in the face…and you belittle his accomplishments. SMDH 

[greenwave81]

3 minutes ago, southparkcpa said:

That wouldn’t have been the case 7 years ago, so makes no sense. Maybe in 2030 ZW figures it out. The NYJ didn’t see what Geno Smith could become near a decade and 3 teams later. Wow

[greenwave81]

2 hours ago, bitonti said:

 

Missing at 1,2 or 3 these are bad self inflicted wounds. Missing at 19 hurts but it's a lower priced gamble 

It looks Like the Jets are going to get the chance to miss on a QB mid first round. 

[Beerfish]

He deserves great credit for the good things he has done and he deserves great blame for the things he has failed at. 

Like most things in life people want everything in black and white, for or against.  It's grey.

Missing both on a #2 overall QB and #11 overall LT when in both cases others he could have had are doing better is a black mark.

His excellent trades allowed him to build more picks and thus look good as a GM.

 

[doitny]

5 minutes ago, greenwave81 said:

That wouldn’t have been the case 7 years ago, so makes no sense. Maybe in 2030 ZW figures it out. The NYJ didn’t see what Geno Smith could become near a decade and 3 teams later. Wow

not only that but why do some people this he is not a bust? cause he is having one good year in 10. 

[southparkcpa]

10 minutes ago, greenwave81 said:

That wouldn’t have been the case 7 years ago, so makes no sense. Maybe in 2030 ZW figures it out. The NYJ didn’t see what Geno Smith could become near a decade and 3 teams later. Wow

Went to an Ohio state game and drove through WV.  Amazing how many GENO fans still in WV. They remember his glory years as WVU QB.  

[Ron Rico]

That is one strange football town. 

[greenwave81]

1 minute ago, southparkcpa said:

Went to an Ohio state game and drove through WV.  Amazing how many GENO fans still in WV. They remember his glory years as WVU QB.  

College programs all have their ‘boys’. Chase Daniel for Mizzou, along with Drew Lock lol. Patrick Ramsey for my alma mater Tulane. 
 

it’s a thing. 

[HessStation]

Bc judging what’s inside their head is the hardest part. Zach has an elite skill set. He’s also a flaming pansy boy 

[southparkcpa]

7 minutes ago, greenwave81 said:

College programs all have their ‘boys’. Chase Daniel for Mizzou, along with Drew Lock lol. Patrick Ramsey for my alma mater Tulane. 
 

it’s a thing. 

I worked for PWC in NYC and quite a few Tulane grads worked at PWC.  PW back then.  Good business school.  

[Ron Rico]

[AFJF]

3 hours ago, bitonti said:

You keep bringing up Kyle boller who went 19th overall. That's almost a reasonable gamble. The end result is the same as missing at 2 or 3 but the Jets are paying retail 

Zach aside it always was insane to trade 3 2nd Rd picks for Sam Darnold. When they could have just stayed at 6 and taken the hall of fame guard. Quenton Nelson was the easiest guard to scout for a decade everyone knew he'd be an instant star. The jets did not just miss on darnold they missed huge. Without looking it up one of the 2nds became Darius Leonard 

Missing at 1,2 or 3 these are bad self inflicted wounds. Missing at 19 hurts but it's a lower priced gamble 

It's still a first-round pick on a QB that suuuuucked.  This GM just had what may go down as the best draft of our lives and we're going to find a reason to complain?  Nope.  You add Jimmy G in free agency and you're a lock for the playoffs as long as you don't get overrun by injuries.