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A Pragmatic Mike White Thread


Dunnie
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White had a good game and overall probably the best QB performance of the year. It was against one of the worst defenses in the league, but he did everything asked of him. Right now I think this is his offense to lose. We'll see what he does against another playoff contender next week.

White strikes me as a QB who needs a system that fits his skillset. I think LaFleur has a compatible system but I remain unconvinced that LaFleur can adjust the system against better defenses. Does White look worse as LaFleur needs to do more? 

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2 minutes ago, Arsis said:

I'll pay you $123 if you post 3 in game  NFL examples of each one from Mr. Zach Wilson in a game where he doesn't have 5 examples of not having those same traits.

Done. I’ll do it tomorrow when I’m at my office (don’t have the ability on my laptop/phone), I’ll DM you my zelle/venmo, and once completed I can text/email them to you or just post on here- totally up to you

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4 minutes ago, sirlancemehlot said:

Considering he's had only a fraction of the snaps in camp and practice, yet can still run this offense efficiently and aggressively,  I'd say he has a huge upside. 

I think this is what gets lost with any Mike White analysis: he’s only had four starts in the NFL. He’s only scratching the surface of what he might be. 

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14 minutes ago, doitny said:

that has alot to do with his decisiveness. he gets rid of it quick. Zach double pumps alot.

what i really like was that play where the Bear beat our LT and was right in his face and he threw it to TY about 4 yds away for a nice gain. if that was Zach he would still be running backwards. 

So true. I remember that play. He was cool under pressure and got it to his check down and the play went for 15 yards. I remember thinking ZW would have never made that play. 

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1 minute ago, Mogglez said:

I agree with most of this, but another big reason for the offensive line success is White’s ability to identify things pre and post snap.  As of right now, he sees the field better than any QB on the roster.  Whether or not his success continues will depend on a lot of things that he has yet to answer, but having that part of your game down is half the battle.  He will never have the howitzer that Wilson has.  What he will do though, that Wilson has yet to figure out, is go through his reads, identify the open man, and hit him consistently, allowing the playmakers we have to make the most out of a play. 

I agree with you.  Zach's downfall is his inability to read defenses.  What impressed me most about MW was his decision making.  Those long TD's and YAC were a result of putting the ball in the right hands, as you pointed out.  I'm just interested to see what happens with greater pressure and receivers who are covered.  If he has similar results in the next two games, I'll be on board.  

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2 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Game managers don't average 11.3 Yards per Attempt.  

He certainly may have some game manager-like performances the remainder of the season.  But he was decidedly better than a game manager today. 

That first pass to Elijah Moore was a thing of beauty!! That was not a game manager throw.

Narratives..

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47 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

I think this is what gets lost with any Mike White analysis: he’s only had four starts in the NFL. He’s only scratching the surface of what he might be. 

That's actually true. If a guy we drafted high was doing stuff like this in his first few games he'd have a street named after him already. There's no reason why he can't improve as well. 

I actually believe White can be our Jimmy G/ Cousins type of guy at a fraction of the cost. Would be huge. 

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7 hours ago, T0mShane said:

I think this is what gets lost with any Mike White analysis: he’s only had four starts in the NFL. He’s only scratching the surface of what he might be. 

Thats right Tom ... let that sink in .... 4 starts in 5 years. He has an amazing opportunity next week and the week after.   He comes out like da bomb and wins those two games ... there will be no denying the ability of Mr White.

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I’m excited about mike white’s play, but I’ve been a jet fan a long, long time and i cannot help but feel that this is a Lucy holding the football for Charlie Brown scenario. Everything looks great, but at the last second we’re flat on our back cursing ourselves for believing that this time it will be different. 

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3 minutes ago, Irish Jet said:

The game is a bigger commentary on Wilson than it is on White - We'll learn a lot more about the latter in the next two games but seeing White routinely hitting the easy stuff highlighted how hamstrung we were by Zach. Everything looked difficult with Zach, even the positive plays. 

It's sad because this has been obvious all season - @T0mShane and others were joking about how Garrett Wilson's production would drop off a cliff with Zach and so it came to be. When Moore spoke out and demanded a trade we tore into him but also knew he wasn't' wrong that he was being wasted. We've lost games we should have won because of Zach and made close things of should-be blowouts. We alienated one of our better talents and likely would have alienated more by sticking with Zach. 

The team knows White is better and to be honest it was obvious they knew last season as well. Mike White gives the team the best chance to win. What he is beyond that I don't know but I don't think you can go back to Zach unless he comes out looking like prime Aaron Rodgers in next year's camp.

Is it? At some point we have to acknowledge that white is putting up historic numbers in 2/3 starts. And they Colts game was looking the same until the injury. 

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12 hours ago, the Claw said:

If White was pedestrian today, and just got the Jets over the hump against a mediocre Bears defense, I would agree that pragmatism is the way to go. He didn’t, though. He had better numbers against them than any other qb this season. At this point it’s basically Mike White or nothing so, after today, I’m behind MW for the foreseeable future. 

The Bears went into full tank mode right before the trade deadline and had a lot of key injuries on D today.  They also didn't have a QB who could run, move the chains and keep the O off the field.  

White played really well and the Bears without Fields and their current D is the worst team in the league right now.   Teams will now have tape and adjust.  Mike White will have to adjust.  Liked what we saw but lots of bad QB's have done really well in limited looks against bad teams. 

It would be great if we found our long term solution at QB in Mike White.  It's got to play out. 

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9 hours ago, T0mShane said:

I think this is what gets lost with any Mike White analysis: he’s only had four starts in the NFL. He’s only scratching the surface of what he might be. 

I think we’re seeing what he is, but perhaps he can become a better version of it.  Reminds me of joe Montana, the smooth playing style, the way he get the ball out calmly with a spiral.  

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20 minutes ago, Irish Jet said:

The game is a bigger commentary on Wilson than it is on White - We'll learn a lot more about the latter in the next two games but seeing White routinely hitting the easy stuff highlighted how hamstrung we were by Zach. Everything looked difficult with Zach, even the positive plays. 

It's sad because this has been obvious all season - @T0mShane and others were joking about how Garrett Wilson's production would drop off a cliff with Zach and so it came to be. When Moore spoke out and demanded a trade we tore into him but also knew he wasn't' wrong that he was being wasted. We've lost games we should have won because of Zach and made close things of should-be blowouts. We alienated one of our better talents and likely would have alienated more by sticking with Zach. 

The team knows White is better and to be honest it was obvious they knew last season as well. Mike White gives the team the best chance to win. What he is beyond that I don't know but I don't think you can go back to Zach unless he comes out looking like prime Aaron Rodgers in next year's camp.

The game is a huge commentary on wilson, for several reasons.  To me the biggest commentary is that wilson just doesn’t seem to want throw those short ‘boring’ passes that white completes.  There was one play white was looking downfield while scrambling but eventually threw it to a TE i think for 2 yards.  2nd and 8.  But that was instead of a dumb pass that could get picked or incomplete or running backwards in the rain where he could take a sack or fumble.  The maturity factor is huge, and it plays into the decision making wrt what constitutes a successful play and risk vs reward.  

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3 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

The game is a huge commentary on wilson, for several reasons.  To me the biggest commentary is that wilson just doesn’t seem to want throw those short ‘boring’ passes that white completes.  There was one play white was looking downfield while scrambling but eventually threw it to a TE i think for 2 yards.  2nd and 8.  But that was instead of a dumb pass that could get picked or incomplete or running backwards in the rain where he could take a sack or fumble.  The maturity factor is huge, and it plays into the decision making wrt what constitutes a successful play and risk vs reward.  

"Doesn't want to" or "is not good at it"?

 

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5 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

I think we’re seeing what he is, but perhaps he can become a better version of it.  Reminds me of joe Montana, the smooth playing style, the way he get the ball out calmly with a spiral.  

I think where White can improve is, obviously, with the timing on the quick-hitting stuff (where he missed Corey Davis twice), and also his anticipation on the mid-range throws where he was putting the ball in harm’s way a couple of times. Eddie Jackson almost pick-sixed him, and even the long TD to Garrett Wilson could have been an easier throw for both of them. 

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The thing that impresses me the most about White is his pocket presence   He always keeps his eyes downfield. He has a self imagined box that he moves around in when he senses pressure.  Because his eyes are always looking infront of him he can get the ball out quickly before taking a sack. 

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Just now, T0mShane said:

I think where White can improve is, obviously, with the timing on the quick-hitting stuff (where he missed Corey Davis twice), and also his anticipation on the mid-range throws where he was putting the ball in harm’s way a couple of times. Eddie Jackson almost pick-sixed him, and even the long TD to Garrett Wilson could have been an easier throw for both of them. 

Yeah, I’ll give any qb a ‘pass’ in that weather though.  I do like that he used both TEs.  Gotta use them more.  Also was interesting to see davis/mims out there along with wilson/moore.  Tough to cover everyone when your qb is getting the ball out quickly.

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13 hours ago, Arsis said:

You guys are focusing on the wrong things. Watch him play. He has better fundamentals, footwork, vision, pocket presence, he leads the receivers better, makes fewer mental mistakes, misses fewer open throws, teammates like him, he's better looking, his penis is bigger.

It’s like these guys never heard of the word priorities! 

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Just now, T0mShane said:

I think where White can improve is, obviously, with the timing on the quick-hitting stuff (where he missed Corey Davis twice), and also his anticipation on the mid-range throws where he was putting the ball in harm’s way a couple of times. Eddie Jackson almost pick-sixed him, and even the long TD to Garrett Wilson could have been an easier throw for both of them. 

Agreed, with one exception.  On one of the Corey Davis passes (6:55 in the video), he had to throw it behind him because there was a defender (#53) in the way.  It doesn't look as obvious from the angle in the video but they mentioned it during the game and it looked legit.  

 

 

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12 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Game managers don't average 11.3 Yards per Attempt.  

He certainly may have some game manager-like performances the remainder of the season.  But he was decidedly better than a game manager today. 

What's funny is the titles people make up in this league one being "game manager" Its every QB's job to be a game manager so what's being referenced exactly with this title ?

First things I read on this board about Mike White from Jets fans ... 

Mike White has a weak arm (LOL)

Mike White is only Dink and dunk (LOL)

Mike White can't Move in the pocket (LOL)

Mike White is the Check Down KING (LOL)

Every single one of these is Wrong ! If the naysayers just bothered to pay attention to last year and to the preseason this year they would know this. All we got was a bunch of nonsense from Zach Wilson fans who could not even pay attention to what that QB was actually doing to the point they didn't pay attention to either QB.

What exactly is this game manager title attached to Mike White or any QB for that matter ? Trent Dilfer ? Is that where this started ? 

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4 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

What's funny is the titles people make up in this league one being "game manager" Its every QB's job to be a game manager so what's being referenced exactly with this title ?

First things I read on this board about Mike White from Jets fans ... 

Mike White has a weak arm (LOL)

Mike White is only Dink and dunk (LOL)

Mike White can't Move in the pocket (LOL)

Mike White is the Check Down KING (LOL)

Every single one of these is Wrong ! If the naysayers just bothered to pay attention to last year and to the preseason this year they would know this. All we got was a bunch of nonsense from Zach Wilson fans who could not even pay attention to what that QB was actually doing to the point they didn't pay attention to either QB.

What exactly is this game manager title attached to Mike White or any QB for that matter ? Trent Dilfer ? Is that where this started ? 

The most overrated criterion of qbs is arm strength.  Most throws are 20 yards or less, you just need to move the chains.  Didn’t we watch Brady kill us with dinks his whole career?

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37 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

I think where White can improve is, obviously, with the timing on the quick-hitting stuff (where he missed Corey Davis twice), and also his anticipation on the mid-range throws where he was putting the ball in harm’s way a couple of times. Eddie Jackson almost pick-sixed him, and even the long TD to Garrett Wilson could have been an easier throw for both of them. 

The key to being a great QB or even a good QB is not just in the hands of the QB sometimes your receivers have got to bail you out. That's why you see the great QB's have a relationship with their great receivers. Manning/Harrison come to mind Rodgers/Adams come to mind (theres many others) you know that guy who is obviously covered but the QB trusts them enough to win the Battle for the football. White will develop that trust with someone on this team soon enough and that's when you will see more growth.

White has to be afforded the same chance to grow as Zach Wilson, not because of where he was drafted but because he went out and earned it . Whites going to deal with the same things every QB in this league deals with, even the greats, he's gonna throw an Int and he's gonna have a tough game here and there and he will learn from both just like he said he learned from the Bills game last year. He can't just be tossed aside like he was last year for one bad outing or some bad plays. Last year it was Obvious why Zach got back in there. This year ? Not so much

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6 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

The most overrated criterion of qbs is arm strength.  Most throws are 20 yards or less, you just need to move the chains.  Didn’t we watch Brady kill us with dinks his whole career?

Exactly what I've been saying for years. Coll thing though is White has a strong arm but he also has touch something Zach never displayed at any point in the last 2 years.

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The key to being a great QB or even a good QB is not just in the hands of the QB sometimes your receivers have got to bail you out. That's why you see the great QB's have a relationship with their great receivers. Manning/Harrison come to mind Rodgers/Adams come to mind (theres many others) you know that guy who is obviously covered but the QB trusts them enough to win the Battle for the football. White will develop that trust with someone on this team soon enough and that's when you will see more growth.
White has to be afforded the same chance to grow as Zach Wilson, not because of where he was drafted but because he went out and earned it . Whites going to deal with the same things every QB in this league deals with, even the greats, he's gonna throw an Int and he's gonna have a tough game here and there and he will learn from both just like he said he learned from the Bills game last year. He can't just be tossed aside like he was last year for one bad outing or some bad plays. Last year it was Obvious why Zach got back in there. This year ? Not so much
I agree.. he needs at least two consecutive bad game to have a chance at returning to his spot as a backup QB.

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