No PI call on the first INT

[slimjasi]

8 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Blantant implies intention.  I don't agree with that assesment.  If you flip a coin 10 times and it comes up heads 10 consecutive times it still doesn't mean the odds aren't 50/50.

I disagree that blatant implies intention. Blatant just means clear and obvious. I believe the refs displayed incompetence that happened to be lopsided against us, not bias. 

[Barry McCockinner]

11 hours ago, AFJF said:

Didn't notice in real time but somebidy mentioned a missed PI call on Corey Davis so I went back and had a look.  Seems legit.  Davis clearly hit well before the ball arrives.  Sucks.

 

 

Would have been nice to have those 3 points back at the end...

[Biggs]

2 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

I disagree that blatant implies intention. Blatant just means clear and obvious. I believe the refs displayed incompetence that happened to be lopsided against us, not bias. 

Again I disagree.  Blatant does imply intention.  That said The NFL has made the refs jobs almost impossible.  The refs are victims of rules that are based on judgements by people who have vastly different takes on the same thing.  

The Jets this year have gotten their share of calls go their way.  Not blatant or obvious.  The call in the moment based on judgement that by league intention has a lot of variables based on who's judging.  

Every holding call on the Jets DB's was a hold.   The illegal contact call was an illegal hit on a defensless player.  None of them had to be called but they were all correct.  The non PI call was a judgement on a bang bang play that's not reviewable.   PI is always a judgement call in the NFL.  The Jets have been huge benificiaries of the league being more lienent to contact in the passing game.  PI is a judgement call that's not reviewable.  The refs aren't seeing instant replay or slow motion that makes a judgement on contact before PI and after not PI.  What's obvious in replay isn't as obvious in real action.   

Fant's block in the back was obvious and right in front of the official.  

Holding could be called on every single NFL snap.  It's only called on obvious aggresious holds and often the fans see them all as obvious and aggresious. 

I'm not a fan of the way games are offiiciated because there is way to much judgement but that's intent by the league.  

 

[OtherwiseHappyinLife]

2 hours ago, SuicidalSince98 said:

I thought the whitehead call was the right one. He went unnecessarily high and the top of his helmet hit or nearly hit his chin 

Yep- the hold on DJ was a good call too.  Let’s not get carried away as fans.

[JTJet]

I too... can pause any play and claim it was a penalty. 

You play that in real time, it looks much different. Especially from eyes on the field.

But let's sit here in our armchairs with HDTVs and TiVo and claim 100 non calls that should have happened in a game.

Seems reasonable. 

[slimjasi]

21 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Again I disagree.  Blatant does imply intention.  That said The NFL has made the refs jobs almost impossible.  The refs are victims of rules that are based on judgements by people who have vastly different takes on the same thing.  

The Jets this year have gotten their share of calls go their way.  Not blatant or obvious.  The call in the moment based on judgement that by league intention has a lot of variables based on who's judging.  

Every holding call on the Jets DB's was a hold.   The illegal contact call was an illegal hit on a defensless player.  None of them had to be called but they were all correct.  The non PI call was a judgement on a bang bang play that's not reviewable.   PI is always a judgement call in the NFL.  The Jets have been huge benificiaries of the league being more lienent to contact in the passing game.  PI is a judgement call that's not reviewable.  The refs aren't seeing instant replay or slow motion that makes a judgement on contact before PI and after not PI.  What's obvious in replay isn't as obvious in real action.   

Fant's block in the back was obvious and right in front of the official.  

Holding could be called on every single NFL snap.  It's only called on obvious aggresious holds and often the fans see them all as obvious and aggresious. 

I'm not a fan of the way games are offiiciated because there is way to much judgement but that's intent by the league.  

 

FYI, you are ascribing a meaning to “blatant” that does not exist in any dictionary I am aware of. Regardless, I’ve been to enough NFL games to know a poorly officiated game when I see one. 
 

we can agree to disagree and you can have the last word. 

[Biggs]

48 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

I disagree that blatant implies intention. Blatant just means clear and obvious. I believe the refs displayed incompetence that happened to be lopsided against us, not bias. 

No it doesn't.  Blatant classically means "noisily conspicuous".    It's now used to describe almost any objectionable behaviour.   When you use blatant as oppossed to mistaken it certainly implies intention.  noisily conspicuous

[56mehl56]

2 hours ago, Biggs said:

Vegas doesn’t care who wins or losses.  Unless you mean Phil Vegas?

Sorry can't agree here - when big money is involved they absolutely care . Now you might be saying they don't root/promote  one team over another but they definitely have a team they prefer in every game based on which side the bets lie. 

[Biggs]

1 minute ago, 56mehl56 said:

Sorry can't agree here - when big money is involved they absolutely care . Now you might be saying they don't root/promote  one team over another but they definitely have a team they prefer in every game based on which side the bets lie. 

Possibly when you get to the playoffs and they're more money on a handful of teams.  Doubt it plays any role in a roster of 15 NFL games and scores of College football and now pro and college basketball.  Especially when you consider all the combinations people are betting on during the actual games.

It's rare during a regular season that one game will have a huge discrepency of the money to impact the big Vegas sports books negatively. 

[Barry McCockinner]

3 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Possibly when you get to the playoffs and they're more money on a handful of teams.  Doubt it plays any role in a roster of 15 NFL games and scores of College football and now pro and college basketball.  Especially when you consider all the combinations people are betting on during the actual games.

It's rare during a regular season that one game will have a huge discrepency of the money to impact the big Vegas sports books negatively. 

72% of the bets were on the Titans yesterday. 70% were on the lions. 55% were on the Jets.

that data is just number of bets, not how much money which would be a better stat. 

[56mehl56]

5 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Possibly when you get to the playoffs and they're more money on a handful of teams.  Doubt it plays any role in a roster of 15 NFL games and scores of College football and now pro and college basketball.  Especially when you consider all the combinations people are betting on during the actual games.

It's rare during a regular season that one game will have a huge discrepency of the money to impact the big Vegas sports books negatively. 

Vegas hasn't survived all these years by not caring about "smaller $ amounts" , its why their lines and spreads are amazingly mostly spot on in all sports.

Do I think there's influence on games from Vegas ?. Yeah I think it happens in smaller controlled amounts unlike the older days where it was much easier to payoff players and refs. Today there's so much scrutiny and sports stars make too much money to be tempted, which is why most scandals today involve lower paid officiating personel.  

[clayton163v]

The NFL could even out the officials if they wanted.  The NBA and - to a lesser extent - Major League Baseball have shown what can be done.  Baseball ended the personal strike zone of individual umpires and forced obedience to a new strike zone.  Like it or not, it altered longstanding practice and the game itself.

The NBA has completely transformed itself.  Years ago, the paint was a dangerous place.  Charles Oakley would be thrown out of today's game for what was routine in his day.  Never mind Bill Lambier and those Pistons' teams.  Today ANY contact results in a foul.  Today the NBA calls EVERYTHING.  There are multiple refs and instant replay.

The NFL could change the way the game is called.  But like Major League Baseball and the NBA, it would change the game a great deal.

Oh yeah, the Jets got ripped off yesterday all game long.  There were multiple instances of the coverage climbing up the backs of Jets receivers before the ball arrived  They evidently teach the tactic.  I think the film will reveal a lot.

[DoubleDown]

I am not one to use this excuse often, but the officiating was abysmal yesterday.  It was completely one sided and inconsistent, particularly in the first half.

The game was much closer than the 20-6 halftime score indicates, and the officials were the #1 reason for that disparity.

[IndianaJet]

6 hours ago, VJphillyfan said:

You guys do know that most nfl and nba refs are on Vegas’s payroll?  All those guys are degenerate gamblers

Lol.

No, they're not.

You think Vegas casinos want to risk their gaming licenses....on of all things...sports betting?....Which accounts for a minor percentage of casino revenue?

Ever been in a casino?  There's a reason why you can't walk 2 feet without bumping into a slot machine, yet the sports book is tucked away into some corner.

 

[clayton163v]

10 minutes ago, IndianaJet said:

Lol.

No, they're not.

You think Vegas casinos want to risk their gaming licenses....on of all things...sports betting?....Which accounts for a minor percentage of casino revenue?

Ever been in a casino?  There's a reason why you can't walk 2 feet without bumping into a slot machine, yet the sports book is tucked away into some corner.

 

I do not know much about casinos.   Anything really.   I do know that the people who try to influence sporting events are not the guys running the casino.  The casino is where they place their bets. 

[Origen]

10 hours ago, Barton said:

Refs were trash. How about the penality on whitehead hitting jefferson? He led with his head.....and hit his shoulders. 

And the when GW clearly got a helmet to helmet hit no one seemed to mind...

[Origen]

3 hours ago, IndianaJet said:

Lol.

No, they're not.

You think Vegas casinos want to risk their gaming licenses....on of all things...sports betting?....Which accounts for a minor percentage of casino revenue?

Ever been in a casino?  There's a reason why you can't walk 2 feet without bumping into a slot machine, yet the sports book is tucked away into some corner.

 

Yeah, with Sports they could actually Lose and they don't want that to be the prime draw!

[Hex]

This is the reality. The Jets aren't going to get the fancy calls, and in some scenarios teams will use that against them. The Jets have to be good enough that they can overcome this obstacle while beating good teams.

It will be much harder but the reward of overcoming it will be much greater.

[Barton]

2 hours ago, Origen said:

And the when GW clearly got a helmet to helmet hit no one seemed to mind...

Un frickin real.

Jets were hosed by the refs. 

[Joe Willie White Shoes]

13 hours ago, Biggs said:

What a bunch of crybabies.  We lost because we didn’t finish when the game was on the line.   

That's just BS when a game comes down to 1-2 plays as this one did. Those first half penalties changed the game as much as each of the four failed plays inside the 3 yard line.  

[Jet Nut]

On 12/4/2022 at 11:18 PM, the Claw said:

The holding non-call on Cousins third down scramble was so bad.

Q was held and it sprung Cousins for a first down that led to a TD, instead of punting  
Horrid. 

[Jet Nut]

9 hours ago, JTJet said:

I too... can pause any play and claim it was a penalty. 

You play that in real time, it looks much different. Especially from eyes on the field.

But let's sit here in our armchairs with HDTVs and TiVo and claim 100 non calls that should have happened in a game.

Seems reasonable. 

Thought it was pretty obvious live.  Didn’t bother to freeze frame it, it was a blown call. 

[greenwave81]

21 hours ago, the Claw said:

The holding non-call on Cousins third down scramble was so bad.

I saw that lol…the OLman had a grab of BOTH of Q’s shoulder pads out wide of his chest. 

[Jet Nut]

14 minutes ago, greenwave81 said:

I saw that lol…the OLman had a grab of BOTH of Q’s shoulder pads out wide of his chest. 

One hand on the back of Q’s shoulder/pad

[T0mShane]

22 hours ago, AFJF said:

Didn't notice in real time but somebidy mentioned a missed PI call on Corey Davis so I went back and had a look.  Seems legit.  Davis clearly hit well before the ball arrives.  Sucks.

 

 

 

22 hours ago, Beerfish said:

It was very blatant.  PI calls on curls and inside passe seem to get missed much more than a little tug on a guy running to the outside.

IMO, part of it is that Davis plays small and lets himself get pushed around whether or not there’s PI. It’s one of the reasons Tennessee let him walk. He’s a tenacious blocker, so it’s not like he’s soft, but he has to be more competitive on contested catch situations, especially with White at QB. 

[OCCH23]

13 hours ago, More Cowbell said:

Where they placed the ball was past the marker. It was a generous  spot. 

You thought that based on the yellow line?  I don't have a screen shot but the initial placement barely reached it

[JTJet]

7 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

Thought it was pretty obvious live.  Didn’t bother to freeze frame it, it was a blown call. 

Again... YOU thought it was from your HDTV eye in the sky. 

On the field from the refs view at full speed? Not at all obvious. It's close enough to go either way from their view. 

[rangerous]

On 12/4/2022 at 10:43 PM, AFJF said:

This was my issue.  Make calls or don't make calls, but make them consistently.

yep and not too long after someone said sauce was handsy did he get called for a PI.

[More Cowbell]

9 hours ago, OCCH23 said:

You thought that based on the yellow line?  I don't have a screen shot but the initial placement barely reached it

The nose of the ball was clearly past the marker and yellow line. It was a third of the way over. Also, that line is very accurate.  

[Barton]

10 hours ago, T0mShane said:

 

IMO, part of it is that Davis plays small and lets himself get pushed around whether or not there’s PI. It’s one of the reasons Tennessee let him walk. He’s a tenacious blocker, so it’s not like he’s soft, but he has to be more competitive on contested catch situations, especially with White at QB. 

Yes. Jesus. I thought I was the only one seeing this. He's practically on the ground already. 

[Jet Nut]

5 hours ago, JTJet said:

Again... YOU thought it was from your HDTV eye in the sky. 

On the field from the refs view at full speed? Not at all obvious. It's close enough to go either way from their view. 

I’m not making excuses for the refs based on the speed of the game.  They have no problems making other bang bang calls and that’s what they’re trained and paid to do.  I don’t think this was that hard a call, he was clearly hit early.  Sorry IMO it’s a case of a missed call.

[Charlie Brown]

On 12/5/2022 at 9:06 AM, Bugg said:

No idea how prevalent it is, but know it's out there. At some point there will be a scandal that won't be able to be swept under the rug as the NBA managed to do. Tim Donaghy showed that every ref knows what the spread and under/over number are. Some may be betting directly or through 2nd parties. The 1st half yesterday was a total disgrace. 

Hmmmmm game was called differently second half.
 

Could be the officiating crew got a call at half cause the difference between how they called the rest of the game was obvious!

A similar pattern happened in the Green Bay game if folks remember. 

[Barry McCockinner]

I didn't even notice this during the game. I remember GW complaining but thought he was just doing what every WR does on a missed third down attempt. 

 

[OCCH23]

7 hours ago, More Cowbell said:

The nose of the ball was clearly past the marker and yellow line. It was a third of the way over. Also, that line is very accurate.  

You're saying "1/3 of the ball being over the line" equates with "clearly past"?  I've seen measurements taken that resulted in 1/2 the ball being over.  there is NO reason for them to not at least make sure, yet they were clearly determined not to . . . 

[More Cowbell]

30 minutes ago, OCCH23 said:

You're saying "1/3 of the ball being over the line" equates with "clearly past"?  I've seen measurements taken that resulted in 1/2 the ball being over.  there is NO reason for them to not at least make sure, yet they were clearly determined not to . . . 

I think it's  questionable if they actually got a first down. What I am talking about is the spot that was given. They gave them a first down spot.