This is not on Zach.

[DireJet]

7 minutes ago, jgb said:

He got very lucky that his prayer balls mostly broke the jets way today. Not sustainable but nonetheless I expected like 140 yards so credit where credit is due.

Yeah, FWIW if he played like he did today AT Buffalo it would’ve been a multiple INT performance. Poyer prob would’ve had 2 picks all by himself. Lions were pretty atrocious in the secondary. 

[Charlie Brown]

6 minutes ago, FidelioJet said:

I actually think it might be because they're trying to "develop" him.  I think they want him to learn to play from the pocket.

I think it's kinda silly - play to win - help your QB out...but it might just be an organizational deacons.

Honesltly, it's hard for me to see why else they wouldn't be rolling him out more often?  Could it be incompetence?

Thank you!

People put up the false equivalent of having Zach roll out is akin to just chucking the ball up, when it is not!

Indeed, Justin Fields has developed nicely when many thought he wouldn't be any good using just this type of approach......

As you said help your QB out, not prove how good your system is!

[jgb]

10 minutes ago, JetsYanks13 said:

Zach’s no beauty what so ever, but he can go over the top of a defense effortlessly. I believe before the half, he had 28 seconds and even had a chance for a TD. White can not make those deep passes over the top, does not have the arm strength. Now, White at times when in rhythm is pinpoint accurate on intermediate routes. When teams play him, just like Pennington back in the day, he’s not beating you over the top, takes away a chunk of the field to defend. Both him and Zach are flawed for different reasons, unfortunately, they can’t combine their strengths into one player, then you would have a good player.


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Yes everyone knows he has a strong arm, I mean not Jamarcus Russel or Jeff George strong but strong.

[Jet Nut]

3 hours ago, bitonti said:

Zach Wilson had several amazing off schedule throws like the last one to Moore but it's like an adventure everytime he drops back 

He had an ugly pick start of the 3q (which led to a Det FG in a game they lose by 3) and an almost ugly duck pick that Michael Carter bailed him out on. He had below average accuracy on several easy throws, and an intentional grounding 

The people who say this game is not on Zach are starting at that conclusion and working backward from there 

Because after all of this we gave away 7 on a punt return and 7 more on a 4th and inches play that went for 51 yards and a TD  
Thats 14 points in a game we lost by 3.  Putting it all on ZW is silly.  It was a team loss

[Augustiniak]

1 minute ago, Jet Nut said:

Because after all of this we gave away 7 on a punt return and 7 more on a 4th and inches play that went for 51 yards and another 7.  
Thats 14 points in a game we lost by 3.  Putting it all on ZW is silly.  It was a team loss

There’s maybe 2 guys who you can’t blame for this loss on the team.  And the coaches lead the way today.

[JetsYanks13]

The Jeff Smith bomb Smith had to stop and come back 3 yards. The Carter sideline throw was a wounded duck. 
Watching the uzomah pass from the QB POV angle it didn’t look as bad as from the television default angle. Uzomah had a lot more lateral separation than it appeared live but a great throw still would’ve pushed more vertically and led an open uzomah to open daylight downfield. It was a good throw on re-watch though so mea culpa on that one 

The TD Pass to Uzomah was 40 yards in the air over the top of the D, that’s the type of passes White can’t make. The issue is when you can’t throw that pass, the D attacks your O much differently.


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[DireJet]

4 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

Because after all of this we gave away 7 on a punt return and 7 more on a 4th and inches play that went for 51 yards and a TD  
Thats 14 points in a game we lost by 3.  Putting it all on ZW is silly.  It was a team loss

As every loss is. So let’s all make a pact to stop saying a QB’s W/L record is evident of anything in terms of the QB’s overall worth. 

[FidelioJet]

3 minutes ago, Charlie Brown said:

Thank you!

People put up the false equivalent of having Zach roll out is akin to just chucking the ball up, when it is not!

Indeed, Justin Fields has developed nicely when many thought he wouldn't be any good using just this type of approach......

As you said help your QB out, not prove how good your system is!

Yeah, Just Fields last year they asked him to stay in the pocket - and "develop". 

It seems this year the new coach is playing to his strengths.  He's still throwing for 150 yards - but he's taking off and putting pressure on the defense - and they're scoring a lot more points.

If they designed a few plays for Zach - so he could do on purpose, what he did by improvising - I think will go a long way to helping him..  Why wait for a play to break down?

[Jet Nut]

Just now, DireJet said:

As every loss is. So let’s all make a pact to stop saying a QB’s W/L record is evident of anything in terms of the QB’s overall worth. 

I’m not, I’m saying it wasn’t all on him.  

[Barton]

1 minute ago, JetsYanks13 said:

The TD Pass to Uzomah was 40 yards in the air over the top of the D, that’s the type of passes White can’t make. The issue is when you can’t throw that pass, the D attacks your O much differently.


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White doesnt have the arm to make that throw? Whats that comment based on? White could easily make that throw. 

We have seen White throw the ball 35+ yards downfield and if anything he has overshot his receiver sometimes. 

[DireJet]

6 minutes ago, JetsYanks13 said:

The TD Pass to Uzomah was 40 yards in the air over the top of the D, that’s the type of passes White can’t make. The issue is when you can’t throw that pass, the D attacks your O much differently.


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And when you can’t make basic on-schedule screen passes, slants & dump offs the defense will stack the box and force you to throw those deep prayers or run repeatedly into a wall. This stuff all works both ways, guys. ZW has to get the basic sh*t down and then we can marvel at his over the top throws. 

[T0mShane]

5 minutes ago, JetsYanks13 said:

The TD Pass to Uzomah was 40 yards in the air over the top of the D, that’s the type of passes White can’t make. The issue is when you can’t throw that pass, the D attacks your O much differently.


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It’s easier to line up and defend against Zach Wilson than it is against most QBs. Line up in man coverage, scheme up a few blitzes, and Zach Wilson will melt down. Every so often he’ll rip one into the seam, but not enough to be a consistent issue. 

[JetsYanks13]

And when you can’t make basic on-schedule screen passes, slants & dump offs the defense will stack the box and force you to throw those deep prayers or run repeatedly into a wall. This stuff all works both ways, guys. ZW has to get the basic sh*t down and then we can marvel at his over the top throws. 

%, Zach has his faults as I mentioned earlier, simply illustrating Whites inability to go over the top of the D.


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[DireJet]

2 minutes ago, Barton said:

White doesnt have the arm to make that throw? Whats that comment based on? White could easily make that throw. 

We have seen White throw the ball 35+ yards downfield and if anything he has overshot his receiver sometimes. 

In the snow. In the rain. Rips into tight windows. ZW has more fast twitch though and it looks effortless.

[RevisIsland610]

Total fing team effort today. Punt return for a TD. 4th and 1 and you allow a 50 yard TD when you have the lead under 2 minutes. Horrible time management at end of game. How do you have 3 TO's and have to kick a 58 FG because you run out of time? Couldn't run the ball. Wilson made some plays but was inaccurate as usual, missing open receivers and throwing a horrible INT. Total team effort. 

[football guy]

24 minutes ago, DireJet said:

He looked good rolling out chucking the ball but didn’t show MW’s quality of throws within the offense. Too much off-schedule. Too random & not repeatable. The offense is a system. You don’t get to break the system unless you’re Pat Mahomes. 

Most of the rollouts today were designed; it was the game plan going in. Today’s offensive design is what they have envisioned for a long time… this was the Shanahan offense we all speak of. We’ve been running more Walsh-like WCO due to personnel of late, but today’s version is what the goal is (naturally plus a more effective OL and run game). If you’re able to establish the outside zone run blocking, it makes play action that much more lethal

[JetsYanks13]

White doesnt have the arm to make that throw? Whats that comment based on? White could easily make that throw. 
We have seen White throw the ball 35+ yards downfield and if anything he has overshot his receiver sometimes. 

Disagree, Zach threw the ball from beyond the opposite hash to the sideline 40 yards in the air over the top of the defender. If White had the ability to make that pass, then he would of attempted it in the Bills game at the end.


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[DireJet]

1 minute ago, JetsYanks13 said:

%, Zach has his faults as I mentioned earlier, simply illustrating Whites inability to go over the top of the D.


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I think he could. Wouldn’t look as effortless or pretty though. They are just totally different QBs. It’s kinda weird bc ZW is so much different than JF & MW. Offense will naturally look a lot different when one or the other is in. It’s weird the Jets built the QB room like this. 

[DireJet]

Just now, JetsYanks13 said:

Disagree, Zach threw the ball from beyond the opposite hash to the sideline 40 yards in the air over the top of the defender. If White had the ability to make that pass, then he would of attempted it in the Bills game at the end.


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It was a big time throw. No doubt. 

[JetsYanks13]

Most of the rollouts today were designed; it was the game plan going in. Today’s offensive design is what they have envisioned for a long time… this was the Shanahan offense we all speak of. We’ve been running more Walsh-like WCO due to personnel of late, but today’s version is what the goal is (naturally plus a more effective OL and run game). If you’re able to establish the outside zone run blocking, it makes play action that much more lethal

O line was a turnstile and the run game was non existent.


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[Barton]

5 minutes ago, DireJet said:

In the snow. In the rain. Rips into tight windows. ZW has more fast twitch though and it looks effortless.

Right. I have no idea what people are watching. Mike White has a stronger arm than Garoppolo or Kirk Cousins.

But yea, Zach can flick it with a wrist snap. Its impressive. It is. But everything else is just horrible in terms of QB play. Horrible. 

[ylekram]

8 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

It’s easier to line up and defend against Zach Wilson than it is against most QBs. Line up in man coverage, scheme up a few blitzes, and Zach Wilson will melt down. Every so often he’ll rip one into the seam, but not enough to be a consistent issue. 

whats wrong with rolling him out? good things happen when he is on the move? do you agree?

[Jet Nut]

1 hour ago, Augustiniak said:

There’s maybe 2 guys who you can’t blame for this loss on the team.  And the coaches lead the way today.

People were predicting <50% comp, 125 yards, 1 TD and 2 picks.  Now he sucks for >50%, 315 yards, 2 TDS and 1 pick.  
Not exonerating him but it’s not all on him.  Hell, give up that 1st down but hold them to a FG and they win.  Don’t give up a punt return and the win is a given

[JetsYanks13]

I think he could. Wouldn’t look as effortless or pretty though. They are just totally different QBs. It’s kinda weird bc ZW is so much different than JF & MW. Offense will naturally look a lot different when one or the other is in. It’s weird the Jets built the QB room like this. 

White has positives such as when in rhythm, he is pinpoint accurate on intermediate routes. To be honest, if White had the ability to go over the top down field, then with his skill set he would of been a 1st round pick. As I mentioned, I don’t think he has that ability.


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[T0mShane]

1 minute ago, ylekram said:

whats wrong with rolling him out? good things happen when he is on the move? do you agree?

Yes, but you can’t make a living throwing to a third of the field on every pass play as you would with a rollout. 

[Augustiniak]

3 minutes ago, JetsYanks13 said:

O line was a turnstile and the run game was non existent.


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The problem with the team now is that the OL can’t block.  There’s no run game.  It puts too much on these qbs b/c they can’t generate any rushing yards.  Then the pocket collapses too quickly and white has busted ribs.  Wilson can escape but then people here complain he scrambles too much.  The offense is a mess right now, and starts as usual with the OL.  Becton can never be relied upon and fant may not return so even if mitchell returns the OL is still a priority.  

[DireJet]

1 minute ago, JetsYanks13 said:

White has positives such as when in rhythm, he is pinpoint accurate on intermediate routes. To be honest, if White had the ability to go over the top down field, then with his skill set he would of been a 1st round pick. As I mentioned, I don’t think he has that ability.


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I mean he missed GW on a 50yd bomb over the top by inches. Looked like a good ball to me and not an arm strength issue. You need an arm to fit the ball into tight windows on intermediate throws, too. One could say those are more important and harder to execute than deep bombs. 

[JetsYanks13]

Good night Gentleman, it was a pleasure discussing our beloved NY Jets, terrible loss today as they all are, but at least we didn’t lose the way the Patriots did, haha.


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[Augustiniak]

3 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

People were predicting <50% comp, 125 yards, 1 TD and 2 picks.  Now he sucks for >5-%, 315 yards, 2 TDS and 1 pick.  
Not exonerating him but it’s not all on him.  He’ll, give up that 1st, hold them to a FG and they win.  Don’t give up a punt return and the win is a given

Today’s loss is on the entire team and coaching staff.  That doesn’t mean wilson played well.  

The lions made no mistakes today.  No turnovers and no special teams screw ups.  The jets had one turnover and one special teams screwup.  That’s why they lost.  

[ylekram]

4 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Yes, but you can’t make a living throwing to a third of the field on every pass play as you would with a rollout. 

true, but why not call the plays that the player excels at? at least a little more?

[DireJet]

4 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

People were predicting <50% comp, 125 yards, 1 TD and 2 picks.  Now he sucks for >5-%, 315 yards, 2 TDS and 1 pick.  

Yeah, people in NY are tough. No doubt about it. But comes w/territory and needs to be factored into the equation. Doubly so for a #2 overall pick at QB. Doesn’t mean it’s right but it’s reality. 

[JoJoTownsell1]

38 minutes ago, JetsYanks13 said:

White has positives such as when in rhythm, he is pinpoint accurate on intermediate routes. To be honest, if White had the ability to go over the top down field, then with his skill set he would of been a 1st round pick. As I mentioned, I don’t think he has that ability.


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If White could make the big plays Wilson made today he would have a real chance to be our franchise QB. 

If Wilson could go through progressions and make the simple throws like White he would have a real chance at being our franchise QB. 

[DireJet]

Just now, JoJoTownsell1 said:

If White could make the big plays Wilson made today he would have a real chance to be our franchise QB. 

If Wilson could make go through progressions and make the simple throws like White he would have a real chance at being our franchise QB. 

Wilson would ACTUALLY be Pat Mahomes if he had MW’s processing speed and accuracy.

MW’s accuracy is severely underrated. There’s a reason guys get a lot of YAC when he plays. He’s putting the ball in a perfect spot more often than not for the pass catcher. 

[ylekram]

6 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Yes, but you can’t make a living throwing to a third of the field on every pass play as you would with a rollout. 

these cocktails are catching up with me , tom, catch up with you tomorrow

[T0mShane]

3 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

If White could make the big plays Wilson made today he would have a real chance to be our franchise QB. 

If Wilson could make go through progressions and make the simple throws like White he would have a real chance at being our franchise QB. 

White has to set his feet to make the deeper throws that Zach can make on the move. White definitely lacks the arm to push it unless he’s able to wind up. Zach sucks, but his arm talent is rare.