TuscanyTile2 Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 16 minutes ago, TNJet said: I miss Darnold. Never wanted to trade him, now thats a kid we gave up on too soon. He's a UFA this offseason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 Just now, jgb said: What this stat says to me is he is 101.2 rating when his first read blows his man up in the first 5 yards of the route. Funny you should say that my friend! His time to throw from a clean pocket: 2.50 seconds. Time to throw when pressured? 3.19. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nj meadowlands Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 9 minutes ago, T0mShane said: RE: the “clean pocket” mirage. Zach is under pressure 40% of the time because he doesn’t seem to know what he’s doing and holds the ball endlessly. His QB rating on “clean pocket” throws is 101.2, 5 TDs, 1 INT. On the 40% of plays he’s under pressure, his rating drops to 18.6. It’d be one thing if those number were closer and it was just about bridging that divide, but this is really about taking a player and turning him into something he’s miles and miles away from being right now. The thing that makes Zach seem so unfixable is that he, himself, creates the cluttered pockets. Either by (a) bailing on the play too early (given his fetish for the "improvised play") or (b) taking a 12 step dropback straight out of the pocket, like a 12 year old playing Madden. Zach clearly has all the arm talent in the world. He also seems like a good guy, someone who cares, a competitor, someone who his teammates like, all that good stuff. The problem is... he never learned how to play quarterback. At BYU he got to run around, flicking the ball in a spread offense, lighting up inferior competition. It didn't matter that he didn't really know how to play quarterback, because backyard hero ball was sufficient. And because of a few December games, and the Boca Raton Bowl, and a stupid combine throw, the Jets (being the Jets) got tricked into taking him second overall. Zach should've been picked in the 2nd-4th round and held a clipboard for several years. If he had, he might've had a chance to be a very good quarterback. He's cooked now, at least here. 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 3 minutes ago, T0mShane said: Funny you should say that my friend! His time to throw from a clean pocket: 2.50 seconds. Time to throw when pressured? 3.19. He is a see it-sling it player. It worked in college when he could ride his arm but in the pros… not so much because once you see it, good chance it’s too late to sling it. 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRy56 Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 Of course they plan to - they had the same plan with Sam Darnold. Regardless of his play and how the Jets badly the Jets feel about it, do we really think Zach wants to come back next year? The fans, the media, the team l, social media are all down on you. It’s over here - the wolves are out and I really don’t see him ever starting again for the Jets Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FootballLove Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 Look, if Saleh/LeFleur needs to sit ZW all of next season, then let him compete his 4th season, fine. But the potential benefit to the whole organization of having a FQB already on the roster is far too great to cut and run this soon. Zack Wilson is an enigma for sure. No one knows what to make of his horrible play, mixed with moments of true great throws. Having to start completely over with Mike White and some Vet backup, hoping another FQB just falls into our lap is devastating, even if MW gives us our best chance to win next week. Some said at the time we cut Sam too soon, never gave him the chance to play with a real HC, Oline, WRs, on and on. Turned out we were right on that one (probably). But trading/cutting ZW now, after a season and a half of terrible/mixed results could come back to bite us in the ass in ways the Sam trade never did. So yes, something's not right with ZW's brain. The game is still too fast, and defenses are too complex. Some young athletes never get it right in the head. Others take years, but it eventually clicks in all the right ways. So yes, we have FAR too much invested in Zack, plus if he ever turns it around, it would be huge for our entire org, including us fans. So much better than starter from scratch. Let him sit a full year. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 2 minutes ago, FootballLove said: Look, if Saleh/LeFleur needs to sit ZW all of next season, then let him compete his 4th season, fine. But the potential benefit to the whole organization of having a FQB already on the roster is far too great to cut and run this soon. Zack Wilson is an enigma for sure. No one knows what to make of his horrible play, mixed with moments of true great throws. Having to start completely over with Mike White and some Vet backup, hoping another FQB just falls into our lap is devastating, even if MW gives us our best chance to win next week. Some said at the time we cut Sam too soon, never gave him the chance to play with a real HC, Oline, WRs, on and on. Turned out we were right on that one (probably). But trading/cutting ZW now, after a season and a half of terrible/mixed results could come back to bite us in the ass in ways the Sam trade never did. So yes, something's not right with ZW's brain. The game is still too fast, and defenses are too complex. Some young athletes never get it right in the head. Others take years, but it eventually clicks in all the right ways. So yes, we have FAR too much invested in Zack, plus if he ever turns it around, it would be huge for our entire org, including us fans. So much better than starter from scratch. Let him sit a full year. We call this the bargaining stage of dealing with grief 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FootballLove Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 Sit Zack his entire 3rd year, play him his entire 4th. It will work out one of two ways: Zack finally masters the game and we win, or Zack is still a total failure and hands us a young Manning in it the 2025 draft. Win Win! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FootballLove Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 7 minutes ago, jgb said: We call this the bargaining stage of dealing with grief Ya, I know.... 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 Just now, FootballLove said: Ya, I know.... No one ever told me that 40 years in as a Jets fan and I’d still be “in the process.” 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoFlaJets Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 51 minutes ago, T0mShane said: RE: the “clean pocket” mirage. Zach is under pressure 40% of the time because he doesn’t seem to know what he’s doing and holds the ball endlessly. His QB rating on “clean pocket” throws is 101.2, 5 TDs, 1 INT. On the 40% of plays he’s under pressure, his rating drops to 18.6. It’d be one thing if those number were closer and it was just about bridging that divide, but this is really about taking a player and turning him into something he’s miles and miles away from being right now. I got this from Jake Asman's latest broadcast Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangers9 Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 I don't believe it I think JD will trade him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TuscanyTile2 Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/nyj/2022.htm The QB TD passing battle is going down to the wire! Zach Wilson: 6 Joe Flacco: 5 Mike White: 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunnie Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 (edited) 15 minutes ago, SoFlaJets said: I got this from Jake Asman's latest broadcast AIR YARDS PER PASS TOTALS 2022 ZACH 878 MIKE WHITE 482 YAC AVERAGE PER PASS ZACH 6.1 MIKE WHITE 5.9 GAMES WON ZACH 5 MIKE WHITE 1 TD % ZACH 2.5 MIKE WHITE 2.3 YOU CAN READ MORE HERE ... https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2022/passing_advanced.htm Edited December 27, 2022 by Dunnie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNJet Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 43 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said: He's a UFA this offseason. Would you bring him back? Lol do you think he'd come back after we screwed him? No way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNJet Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 3 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said: https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/nyj/2022.htm The QB TD passing battle is going down to the wire! Zach Wilson: 6 Joe Flacco: 5 Mike White: 3 Haha less than half of the games started by the other cats and they are right with him! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNJet Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 38 minutes ago, BigRy56 said: Of course they plan to - they had the same plan with Sam Darnold. Regardless of his play and how the Jets badly the Jets feel about it, do we really think Zach wants to come back next year? The fans, the media, the team l, social media are all down on you. It’s over here - the wolves are out and I really don’t see him ever starting again for the Jets If Rosen is out of the league already Zach will be next after 1 more year somewhere else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TuscanyTile2 Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 13 minutes ago, TNJet said: Would you bring him back? Lol do you think he'd come back after we screwed him? No way. I realize there would be a huge risk if we brought him back. I think JD just has to evaluate what's out there and make the best decision, regardless. Do I think Sam would come back? Yes, I do. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNJet Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 1 minute ago, TuscanyTile2 said: I realize there would be a huge risk if we brought him back. I think JD just has to evaluate what's out there and make the best decision, regardless. Do I think Sam would come back? Yes, I do. I'd be all for it but talk about JD admitting he fcked up lol, trade Sam for Zach...trade Zach bring back Sam...not happening man. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlito1171 Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 50 minutes ago, jgb said: He is a see it-sling it player. It worked in college when he could ride his arm but in the pros… not so much because once you see it, good chance it’s too late to sling it. This is one of the best statements I've seen on Zach....he rarely throws with anticipation....and he hesitates on his throws because he still doesn't understand what "open" means in the NFL. This is why I believe he can't be fixed. If you can't throw to a spot on the field with trust and anticipation....you're not gonna be in the league for long. He shot up the draft boards because of the backyard ball he played at BYU and I had a hard time believing it would translate in the pros..... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TuscanyTile2 Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 3 minutes ago, TNJet said: I'd be all for it but talk about JD admitting he fcked up lol, trade Sam for Zach...trade Zach bring back Sam...not happening man. Interesting point. Moving on from ZW would look bad enough. It didn't even occur to me that he'd be moving back to a guy he previously traded. Though admittedly he did say something about resetting the clock (on the QB salary). Not sure what Sam would cost as a UFA btw. If only around $15-$20M then I think he's still going to have to consider it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunnie Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 2 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said: Interesting point. Moving on from ZW would look bad enough. It didn't even occur to me that he'd be moving back to a guy he previously traded. Though admittedly he did say something about resetting the clock (on the QB salary). Not sure what Sam would cost as a UFA btw. If only around $15-$20M then I think he's still going to have to consider it. Sam takes that Carolina team into the playoffs and wins one ... hes not leaving Carolina. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 20 minutes ago, TNJet said: If Rosen is out of the league already Zach will be next after 1 more year somewhere else. He actually isn't, he is with minnesota. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNJet Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 Just now, Beerfish said: He actually isn't, he is with minnesota. His 5th team in 4 years. Same as out pretty much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TuscanyTile2 Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 29 minutes ago, TNJet said: Would you bring him back? Lol do you think he'd come back after we screwed him? No way. 15 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said: I realize there would be a huge risk if we brought him back. I think JD just has to evaluate what's out there and make the best decision, regardless. Do I think Sam would come back? Yes, I do. The 1st QBs I'd look into would be TB12 and Aaron Rodgers, btw. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adoni Beast Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 If Zack Wilson has any shot at redemption and fulfilling his potential his best option might be • to sit all next year and truly work on mechanics, defensive reads, and playbook. • practice with simulated rush constantly to create that instinctive pocket presence • no pressure of starting or even playing in a game. 3rd string QB flight school Repetition…repetition…repetition and see if there is anything salvageable for 2024… 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonny Werblin Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 1 hour ago, jgb said: He is a see it-sling it player. It worked in college when he could ride his arm but in the pros… not so much because once you see it, good chance it’s too late to sling it. Actually, this is what makes Josh Allen's development so impressive. He had no anticipation and pretty bad accuracy in college. But then again, he has that rare arm where he actually can see it and sling it at the NFL level. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TuscanyTile2 Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 9 minutes ago, Dunnie said: Sam takes that Carolina team into the playoffs and wins one ... hes not leaving Carolina. He's a UFA though. We'd have a chance at him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunnie Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 2 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said: He's a UFA though. We'd have a chance at him. Totally ..but where would you rather be .. with the team you just brought to the playoffs or the team that gave up on you leading into a historic draft of offensive weapons ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Brown Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 52 minutes ago, FootballLove said: Ya, I know.... Hmmmmmmm I will let the cheap shot go this time but next time! Let's Goooooooooooooooooooooooooo Jets! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonny Werblin Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 2 hours ago, Beerfish said: He actually isn't, he is with minnesota. Rosen is in his 5th season and playing on a $46,000 contract with Minnesota. I know 22 year olds with no college who make more. Lucky for him that his career earnings are over $18 million. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Brown Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 17 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said: Interesting point. Moving on from ZW would look bad enough. It didn't even occur to me that he'd be moving back to a guy he previously traded. Though admittedly he did say something about resetting the clock (on the QB salary). Not sure what Sam would cost as a UFA btw. If only around $15-$20M then I think he's still going to have to consider it. Next year's QB room should be Mike White as Starter Sam Darnold as Back up and Zach Wilson as 3rd Stringer... Forget Minshew..... Ok I'm Fickle! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Brown Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 8 minutes ago, Sonny Werblin said: Actually, this is what makes Josh Allen's development so impressive. He had no anticipation and pretty bad accuracy in college. But then again, he has that rare arm where he actually can see it and sling it at the NFL level. It is called coaching! And Daboll now that we see what has done with Jones is a freakin QB genius! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 12 minutes ago, Sonny Werblin said: Actually, this is what makes Josh Allen's development so impressive. He had no anticipation and pretty bad accuracy in college. But then again, he has that rare arm where he actually can see it and sling it at the NFL level. He’s also a centaur whose legs instill fear in the hearts of men Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeNamathsFurCoat Posted December 27, 2022 Share Posted December 27, 2022 The Jets are simply better offensively with White at quarterback than Wilson. How stark is the difference? Well, the Jets’ total yardage with White (421.3 per game) would rank first in the NFL. The Jets’ yardage with Wilson (269) would rank last. Wide receivers Garrett Wilson and Elijah Moore, both in on-field demeanor and words, have made it clear which quarterback they prefer. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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