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The horrible feeling of dread and despair is back


JohnnyLV

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Just now, Beerfish said:

The jets have a lot more A grade talent than they have had in a long time.  They lost a lot of one score or close games when they were playing poorly.  

Injuries to the wrong players is the big bugaboo.  If Breece Hall and AVT do not go down for the year to me we are in the playoffs and all the worry of coaches and QBs is on the back burner.

Sure, but injuries happen and I guarantee you that we will have significant injuries next year. 

The team has scored 3 offensive touchdowns in its last 5 games, during a playoff race. It's just not acceptable and there is no excuse for that level of ineptitude. The Jets need to completely rethink what they are trying to do on the offensive side of the ball. They need new players and new coaches. 

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4 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Firing Paul Hackett Brian Schottenheimer Marty Mornhinweg Jeremy Bates Dowell Loggains Mike LaFleur will fix everything just you watch!!!

Fun fact, each morning I still wake up and thank God to be alive, pet my dogs, kiss the other half, and say "f off Schotty". 

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4 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

The jets have a lot more A grade talent than they have had in a long time.  They lost a lot of one score or close games when they were playing poorly.  

Injuries to the wrong players is the big bugaboo.  If Breece Hall and AVT do not go down for the year to me we are in the playoffs and all the worry of coaches and QBs is on the back burner.

Breece running us into the playoffs on his back would make us smile and cheer but it would just be lipstick on a pig. Whats happening now was inevitable. Saleh and crew just aren't up for the task. 

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18 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

Sure, but injuries happen and I guarantee you that we will have significant injuries next year. 

The team has scored 3 offensive touchdowns in its last 5 games, during a playoff race. It's just not acceptable and there is no excuse for that level of ineptitude. The Jets need to completely rethink what they are trying to do on the offensive side of the ball. They need new players and new coaches. 

The jets got one turnover from their defense in the last 5 games, one.  You win and lose a lot of games due to turnovers in this league.  

The team needs to get better in a lot of areas but the talent level is vastly better than say the 1st year of darnold when he had no talent at all anywhere.

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4 minutes ago, pointman said:

Breece running us into the playoffs on his back would make us smile and cheer but it would just be lipstick on a pig. Whats happening now was inevitable. Saleh and crew just aren't up for the task. 

Quite possibly true but things are better as you narrow down the needs of a team.

We used to have: terrible coaching, terrible, gm, no talent anywhere on the roster.

We actually have some very good players now, that was my point.

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LaFleur’s system might just be fine w a franchise QB it’s somewhat hard to say but one thing that I’m confident of is his play-calling in crucial spots is some of the most spineless, predictable sh*t I’ve ever witnessed. Never felt he had a good sense of the situation to do the opposite of what was expected. Took the safe route every time and loss most of them playing into the opposing DC’s hands. Jmo not impressed 

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8 minutes ago, pointman said:

Fun fact, each morning I still wake up and thank God to be alive, pet my dogs, kiss the other half, and say "f off Schotty". 

 

7 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

And every time you say it, somewhere in America, a Fullback was just sent into motion pre-snap.

Schotty , shameful to say, is the last OC to take us to the playoffs. 

The offense in general did not let us down in 2009 or 2010. Rex's great defense gave up 24 unanswered points in both games.

 

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1 minute ago, southparkcpa said:

 

Schotty , shameful to say, is the last OC to take us to the playoffs. 

The offense in general did not let us down in 2009 or 2010. Rex's great defense gave up 24 unanswered points in both games.

 

Yeah, Schottenheimer wasn't that bad, it was just funny to me how often the FB went into motion with Schottenheimer thinking it was his way of outsmarting the D to figure out what coverage they're in.

And it almost never worked, lol.

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7 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

The jets got one turnover from their defense in the last 5 games, one.  You win and lost a lot of games due to turnovers in this league.  

The team needs to get better in a lot of areas but the talent level is vastly better than say the 1st year of darnold when he had no talent at all anywhere.

Agreed about the talent level, but I think when you collapse like this, at least part of the coaching staff has to take the fall. I don't think you bring back the same coaches/leaders. We need a shakeup. In particular, I think we need a shakeup on the offensive side of the ball, as despite your valid point about the defense not forcing turnovers in crunch time (and generally being overrated), the offense is still the weakness of the team. 

I'd also get rid of Boyer. There have been 3 punts returned for TDs this year across the entire league and we've given up two of them - both in HUGE situations. Not acceptable. Punt coverage has been spotty all season. Mann has been a disaster at times. 

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3 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

Quite possibly true but things are better as you narrow down the needs of a team.

We used to have: terrible coaching, terrible, gm, no talent anywhere on the roster.

We actually have some very good players now, that was my point.

I am with you on that. Not as many as we need, but definitely a good change from the slop we were running out each Sunday before.

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2 minutes ago, southparkcpa said:

 

Schotty , shameful to say, is the last OC to take us to the playoffs. 

The offense in general did not let us down in 2009 or 2010. Rex's great defense gave up 24 unanswered points in both games.

 

Schotty didn't take us anywhere. A stacked roster did. We got there despite him. Rex played scared. 

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1 minute ago, slimjasi said:

Agreed about the talent level, but I think when you collapse like this, at least part of the coaching staff has to take the fall. I don't think you bring back the same coaches/leaders. We need a shakeup. In particular, I think we need a shakeup on the offensive side of the ball, as despite your valid point about the defense not forcing turnovers in crunch time (and generally being overrated), the offense is still the weakness of the team. 

I'd also get rid of Boyer. There have been 3 punts returned for TDs this year and we've given up two of them - both in HUGE situations. Not acceptable. Punt coverage has been spotty all season. Mann has been a disaster at times. 

When you win it’s easier to overlook the problems.  When you lose it’s easy to point out all of them.  For this jets team though, the two obvious things to fix are the qb and the play calling.  The team has scored in single digits 4x this season and in two other games, 12 points.  Clearly the offense should get a boost next season with avt and breece, but it goes deeper than that.  I don’t see how keeping MLF will result in anything good.  

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6 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

Quite possibly true but things are better as you narrow down the needs of a team.

We used to have: terrible coaching, terrible, gm, no talent anywhere on the roster.

We actually have some very good players now, that was my point.

We do. Q and Sauce have a very good chance at being All Pro. And Q, Sauce and quite possibly Wilson and even Reed could make the NFL Top 100 show they do. But Clemons, JJ Huff Breece AVT are all foundational players as well

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Yes, we need to make significant improvements across our Offense.  

JD & Saleh have built a better than average defense with top 5 potential if we upgrade in a few spots this offseason (linebacker & safety).

The Offense is a MESS for many reasons.  MLF should be held accountable for numerous failures and few wins.  Counting on him to turn it around is too risky a proposition.  What exactly has he done well REGARDLESS of the QB issue?  Yes, a lot is connected to the QB but he has shown:

1. No ability to inspire.  Has anyone seen the apathy on offense during must win games?

2. No ability to fix consistent mistakes:  Bad penalties, poor third down conversion rates, costly dropped passes, poor red zone, poor short yardage 

3. No ability to out game plan:  Starting with the failure of his first drive scripts ... which have created 1 TD & 1 FG the entire year across 3 different QBs  

4. No ability to leverage his competitive advantages:  Just read that Tyler Conklin is best 1 on 1 versus LBs, yet has had few opportunities to take advantage of this mismatch

5. No ability to unite.  2 players have requested trades (Mims, Moore), others have questioned readiness (Conklin), or game planning (McGovern)

6. No ability to develop.  Who has gotten better?  I see players going backwards

This offseason, the buck should stop here.  He has been delegated the reins to an offense that is going backwards.  Saleh and JD are not immune to criticism or fault but have done enough to get 1 more year.  That said, to get it they need a corrective action plan to make this team better than includes root cause analysis and creative solutions -- not just the same old script.

 

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Eh its not quite the same. We never normally have this many talented young players on the roster. When you have Gase running Frank Gore, or putting out Chaz Chillens and Jeremy Kerley or just hoping things change because you sent a ton of money on a big free agent pick up like Trumaine Johnson, then yeah...there's some dread and no hope.

 

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I can see Woody "working his channels" to see who is available.  I can then see this being "blabbed" and creating difficult relationships for Woody, JD and Saleh.  

The Saints want the Gruden package for Payton.  That is a hard pass.  We have too many holes.  Let's see what someone else offers.  Payton does not really want to come to NY and would only use our offer to drive the price up.

If Harbaugh wants to come here, we will take him.  

I would offer Reich the OC job, with growth potential.  If he says he would discuss HC, I would have that conversation.  If we need to offer Reich HC to get an offensive coach in the door, that is what we need to do.  

Otherwise I would ride the existing contracts out.  

 

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2 minutes ago, HessStation said:

Didn’t Hall and AVT get hurt in the same game? Think about that. The Jets will never be aloud another SB. The gods have spoken

It's true. Things were going way too well, the football gods had to step in. They thought it was handled with Zach playing like crap but couldn't believe this dynamic RB was doing so well. Could not allow it.

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33 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Firing Paul Hackett Brian Schottenheimer Marty Mornhinweg Jeremy Bates Dowell Loggains Mike LaFleur will fix everything just you watch!!!

What do you suggest instead? Firing the whole regime? Because that's worked in the past

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32 minutes ago, JoeNamathsFurCoat said:

Saleh wants credit for improving the team by 4 wins and improving his players from a "process" POV.

Similar to post-2011 Rex, it all just sounds like white noise at this point.

Different personalities and different messages, but all worthless BS.

I think the Jets and whoever their coach is or will be should have one main focus. And that’s competing for championships. And it should be discussed during their coaching searches. Not by race, or by what their favorite color is, or if they think our uniforms are cool.

 

If their goal is to just improve a little each year and put a positive spin on an atrocious 5 game losing streak in which the coach and team quit.  Then they have their guy. 

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4 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

I don't have a good solution unless it involves Sean Payton.  Or Woody Johnson selling the team.  Neither of which are going to happen.

But that's not the point I'm making.  The point is the OC for the Jets always gets too much blame for the problem.  The # 1 problem with this franchise, by far, is Woody Johnson.  The OC and even the HC in many cases is just window-dressing.

Fair. It does seem clear to me though that MLF needs to get booted anyways, even if Woody Johnson is the main problem. Woody isn't the one calling the plays.

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