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So in hindsight, where did this go downhill?


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I didn't read the whole thing but once Zack lost his star RB he simply regressed badly.  Breece was the glue holding Zack together.  Zack needs numerous superstars around him since he can't carry the weight.  Bottom line; Zack himself knows he's inadequate.  Zack folded. 

Enough OP?  :)  

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Winning with historically bad QB play was never sustainable. The defence also got figured out and exposed late in the season as teams zoned in on the weaknesses of the front 7. 

We weren't as good as the 6-3 record suggested. Got extremely fortunate with the run of QB's that we played and had an actual miracle play out vs Cleveland. 

The offensive line fell apart, somewhat expectedly in some areas and I think the coaching staff is still extremely poor at managing games. Another horrific example of that today but it was even more apparent in the Detroit and Buffalo losses. 

I wouldn't say there's any point in the season where you can trace it going downhill. Obviously losing Hall and AVT hurt but all teams get big injuries over a season. The issues were of our own making even going back to Mac - Mosley's contract, Passing on Wirfs, Failing the tank, Zach busting, Moses being allowed to walk etc. - Those chickens came home to roost. 

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3 hours ago, AlexVanDyke said:

Did saleh make the wrong move going to Mike white?  Was it a point of no return?  Was it when white  got Injured?  Was it the Detroit 4th down?  The jax fiasco?

part of me thinks all realistic hopes for this team ended in Denver; we just didn’t know it.  Hard to lose our two best offensive players. That really was devastating  

The season ended when Hall and AVT went down.  They are the 2 best offensive players on the Jets team.

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3 hours ago, Flea Flicking Frank said:

The coaching staff and the players trying to blame 100% of all problems on ZW. When things went bad and he wasn't in, they had nothing left to fall back on. It was a terrible display of leadership and coaching by the staff

No one,  even remotely, laid 100% of this at Wilson's feet.   He is bad,  and there is no denying it.   However, there is plenty of blame to go around.   Mostly on offense.   

That said,  great defenses create turnovers.  Huge deficiency in that regard. 

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I know no one wants to hear this but with a decent offensive line and (AVT) and Hall, Wilson didn't look that bad.   Once Hall and AVT got hurt, Wilson was not up to the task of leading this team and MLF got exposed big time.   I mean we forget Wilson didn't look this bad when he came back from injury last year.  Why did he regress so badly?  I have to really look at the CS.  I have never seen a OC refuse to design an offense to benefit or play to the talents of his top drafted quarterback.    No Jet sweeps, no designed roll outs, no go routes to keep defenses honest and see if you can get any PI calls.   In retrospect, I ultimately blame injuries to the OL, Hall and MLF horrific playcalling and game plans.  No way Wilson is this bad with adequate coaching. 

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Saleh needs to understand that the "keeping of receipts" is a two way street

As far as JD is concerned.... Whiffing on a high first round QB is a thing that can happen to anyone but he does need to fix the offensive line and he has not done that so far.

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15 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

I know no one wants to hear this but with a decent offensive line and (AVT) and Hall, Wilson didn't look that bad

This seems to be the narrative gaining the most traction. 

Let's keep in mind, Breece Hall's biggest gains were on busted plays that were called by MLF. I believe the best thing to do preparing for next season is (assuming Hall and AVT are the same players post-operation) is to draft more linemen and a big bruiser back like Cory Dillon. That 1, 2 punch would eat up clock and as long as our defense remains capable of keeping opponents under 19 ppg, this would be a much improved team. 

But I don't see the Jets doing that. MLF is coming back with his play book. 

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1 hour ago, hawk said:

No one,  even remotely, laid 100% of this at Wilson's feet.   He is bad,  and there is no denying it.   However, there is plenty of blame to go around.   Mostly on offense.   

That said,  great defenses create turnovers.  Huge deficiency in that regard. 

Everyone, actually EVERYONE laid 100% of this at Wilson’s feet

clowns said Wilson was holding that team back ?????

Meanwhile he was the best QB on the roster 

michael jordan laughing GIF

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6 hours ago, AlexVanDyke said:

Did saleh make the wrong move going to Mike white?  Was it a point of no return?  Was it when white  got Injured?  Was it the Detroit 4th down?  The jax fiasco?

part of me thinks all realistic hopes for this team ended in Denver; we just didn’t know it.  Hard to lose our two best offensive players. That really was devastating  

Season ended when we benched Zach. We may have still missed with Zach, but benching him right before he plays the worst team in the NFL after a decent performance against the Bills was idiotic. It is obvious now that LaFleur is a huge part of the problem/

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11 hours ago, Irish Jet said:

Winning with historically bad QB play was never sustainable. The defence also got figured out and exposed late in the season as teams zoned in on the weaknesses of the front 7. 

We weren't as good as the 6-3 record suggested. Got extremely fortunate with the run of QB's that we played and had an actual miracle play out vs Cleveland. 

The offensive line fell apart, somewhat expectedly in some areas and I think the coaching staff is still extremely poor at managing games. Another horrific example of that today but it was even more apparent in the Detroit and Buffalo losses. 

I wouldn't say there's any point in the season where you can trace it going downhill. Obviously losing Hall and AVT hurt but all teams get big injuries over a season. The issues were of our own making even going back to Mac - Mosley's contract, Passing on Wirfs, Failing the tank, Zach busting, Moses being allowed to walk etc. - Those chickens came home to roost. 

This.  We should never have been 7-4.  Qb play + injuries led to this.  

Clearly there’s more talent here than in the past 10 yrs.  The problem once again is qb play and coaching.  This is the first time it’s a legitimate discussion of whether bringing in a veteran qb can get them to the playoffs.  

As if we needed more evidence of a systemic failure, the jets haven’t scored a td in 3 games.  That ruined saleh’s entire platform this year that wilson was the root of the problems. Watching the jets yesterday continue to waste plays running when they had a backup OL and the only way they were going to score a td was in the air was yet another indictment of the OC.  Even in the red zone they never took a shot.  You want to know why the jets don’t score tds - when they get in the red zone they never attack the end zone.  My rule of thumb is, the ball should cross the goal line at least once each time you get in the red zone.  Attack, attack.  

Sure we may get a new OC.  But it will take a real leader at qb who isn’t intimidated by NE or BB to get this team over the hump.  Every time we play them we piss in our pants.  They need a qb with the mentality of garrett wilson to elevate the team. 

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13 hours ago, AlexVanDyke said:

Did saleh make the wrong move going to Mike white?  Was it a point of no return?  Was it when white  got Injured?  Was it the Detroit 4th down?  The jax fiasco?

part of me thinks all realistic hopes for this team ended in Denver; we just didn’t know it.  Hard to lose our two best offensive players. That really was devastating  

Winning 2 of our final 3 games in 2020.  

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13 hours ago, AlexVanDyke said:

Did saleh make the wrong move going to Mike white?  Was it a point of no return?  Was it when white  got Injured?  Was it the Detroit 4th down?  The jax fiasco?

part of me thinks all realistic hopes for this team ended in Denver; we just didn’t know it.  Hard to lose our two best offensive players. That really was devastating  

it went downhill when we won 2 years ago and lost out on drafting trevor lawrence. this made joe douglas convince himself zach wilson was going to be the guy mostly off one throw in shorts against air

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