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Commanders fire OC: Check out some quotes (sound familiar)


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"Unfortunately, we did not live up to the expectations and standard that I expected to see from our offensive unit," Rivera said in a statement. "I felt it was best for a fresh start at the coordinator position going into next year. I have a tremendous amount of respect for Scott and thanked him for his three years of service to our organization."

 

Some players complained that it took too long in some games to get the ball to key playmakers such as McLaurin. Or, some players said, they'd get away from a formula that was working in games. Others said they liked the offense but wanted to see changes in the way it was taught. It also was considered a difficult offense for quarterbacks to learn, with perhaps not as much flexibility built in for them at the line of scrimmage.

 

One person whose team played Washington this season said the Commanders lacked an offensive identity and simply called a collection of plays, leading to some predictability.

 

Rivera also spoke to players during their exit meetings, with some saying they gave him their thoughts on the offense.

"I take into account everything that I get," Rivera said, "not just from players but from coaches themselves, from what I look at, what I observe on the field, on the tape."

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2 minutes ago, slats said:

This would be an example of an organization I wouldn’t want to see the team try to emulate. 

Organizationally, completely agree.  

I'm talking about a HC who took the Panthers to the Super Bowl with a 76-63 overall record and who is trying to elevate Washington's dysfunctional organization he is now the head coach of.

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17 minutes ago, OtherwiseHappyinLife said:

Organizationally, completely agree.  

I'm talking about a HC who took the Panthers to the Super Bowl with a 76-63 overall record and who is trying to elevate Washington's dysfunctional organization he is now the head coach of.

Robert Saleh knows absolutely ZERO about accountability. So dont hold your breath.

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This was one of the more obvious cases of scapegoating I've seen in a while.  And yes, it echos the vibe here with the Jets.

Ron Rivera isn't just the head coach, he is also the de facto GM, and has been since he was hired.

The primary reason the 'Ders O failed is not Scott Turner's system or play-calling. 

The problem in DC was and is the utter and complete failure of GM Ron Rivera to identify, find and acquire a QB.

Compound that with drafting that failed to address the O-line in any meaningful way.

Just like the Jets.

Turner was fired not because Ron Rivera wanted to run a more run-focused offense, as was laughably claimed at Turners firing announcement, as it was Ron Rivera himself, who last offseason was acquiring the total failure of a downfield passer in Wentz, and demanded the 'Ders run a more pass-heavy O focused on the downfield passing game, who has completely failed as both GM and Head Coach, and hasn't produced a season above .500 since 2017 in Carolina.  In point of fact, I don't believe Ron Rivera has ever posted a better than .500 season where his QB was not Cam Newton.

And like JD, Ron has hit on several players, their young WR Dotson is a likely stud for example. 

So yes, this does sound very familiar.  And if we fire MLF to save Saleh and JD, the same story will be at play here.  The failure of our GM to find anything resembling a decent QB, the failure of our Head Coach to win more games than he loses, and the failure to build anything close to an effective O-line.

Some portion of the fanbase here in DC will be placated by this, but Ron Rivera is the problem here.

Of course, with the team likely getting a new Owner, likely this offseason if all goes well, Ron will not be changed, and in fact little big will likely be changed here.  Those calls will be the new Owners calls and saved for the 2024 offseason.

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I don't know if anyone happened to catch Steve Young's interview on The Michael Kay show yesterday.  I know he has a relationship with Zach and the BYU connection but he  he made an interesting comment about MLF's coaching style and his (lack of) development of Zach.  He essentially said that MLF took on a tough love approach and kept Zach "at an arm's length" basically saying it was the wrong approach and ZW really needed more hands on development. 

 

Very interesting comment, if we keep MLF I hope he at least has the ability to self reflect and adjust.  He seems like the type of coach that may not connect well with his players and prefers sitting up in the coach's box/office drawing up plays.

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28 minutes ago, OtherwiseHappyinLife said:

Organizationally, completely agree.  

I'm talking about a HC who took the Panthers to the Super Bowl with a 76-63 overall record and who is trying to elevate Washington's dysfunctional organization he is now the head coach of.

A HC who with a playoff spot on the line decided to sit Heinicke and play Wentz who played poorly and then instead of going back to Heinicke played Howell

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3 minutes ago, drsamuel84 said:

I don't know if anyone happened to catch Steve Young's interview on The Michael Kay show yesterday.  I know he has a relationship with Zach and the BYU connection but he  he made an interesting comment about MLF's coaching style and his (lack of) development of Zach.  He essentially said that MLF took on a tough love approach and kept Zach "at an arm's length" basically saying it was the wrong approach and ZW really needed more hands on development. 

 

Very interesting comment, if we keep MLF I hope he at least has the ability to self reflect and adjust.  He seems like the type of coach that may not connect well with his players and prefers sitting up in the coach's box/office drawing up plays.

It would never happen on the Kay show but I would have asked Steve who developed Mike White? The guy has been in the league 2 more years than Zach and has had no where near the oppotunities afforded him.

When healthy and with the same problems on the OL, Mike White moved this offense. That is not to say Lafleur was great at his job and can't improve because he ceratinly can.

It is excuse after excuse with Wilson and no one wants to face the facts. 

The main issues with Zach - look in the mirror 

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46 minutes ago, slats said:

This would be an example of an organization I wouldn’t want to see the team try to emulate. 

I agree, but I wouldn't necessarily assume that this wasn't an excellent move for that team.  We'll see.  

All you guys who think all 3 should be here next year are nuts.  You are all begging for a repeat of 2022.  That's my opinion, sadly.  We fans have to suffer another year all in the name "dont let the owner meddle"?   That's essentially your position.  Blah.

Get rid of the terrible OC.  Saleh needs to grow up and take it like a man or he should go too.  It's beyond obvious that MLF is a gargantuan problem. Keeping him is just whistling past the graveyard.  

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43 minutes ago, Warfish said:

This was one of the more obvious cases of scapegoating I've seen in a while.  And yes, it echos the vibe here with the Jets.

 

Most Jets fans dont need a scapegoat for the 2022 season.  It's pretty clear that it was the QB situation that doomed post season hopes.  We also saw a few very positive things to go along with the disaster at QB.  Saleh's defense was top notch and will likely continue to be so in 2023. Add to that, JD hit a grand slam in the 2022 draft.

If there is anything to worry about now, it isn't Saleh or LeFleur.  It is still the QB situation.  If that is not corrected to good effect, 2023 will mirror 2022.

My fear is that JD is stubborn about proving the Zach Wilson pick was well founded. 

We can all see that Wilson is a dead end.

If JD arranges his QB solution for 2023 around keeping ZW with the expectation that he will magically become a good NFL QB, then 2023 is doomed and so is JD and his entire CS.

Fans and medial pundits are so justifiably convinced that ZW is a dead end, if JD does not start believing his own eyes while watching tape and continues to push Wilson to the exclusion of good sense, the fan blow-back will be intense and relentless. 

This current regime and all of its parts wont survive another year of ZW.

Book it. 

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13 minutes ago, Jet Nut said:

.......and then instead of going back to Heinicke played Howell

Why should he have gone back to Heinicke when they were eliminated from the postseason?

Playing the rookie Howell was the correct call in the final week vs. Dallas.

Otherwise I agree, the decisions before that at QB, starting with acquiring Wentz in the first place, were quite questionable.

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30 minutes ago, Warfish said:

This was one of the more obvious cases of scapegoating I've seen in a while.  And yes, it echos the vibe here with the Jets.

Ron Rivera isn't just the head coach, he is also the de facto GM, and has been since he was hired.

The primary reason the 'Ders O failed is not Scott Turner's system or play-calling. 

The problem in DC was and is the utter and complete failure of GM Ron Rivera to identify, find and acquire a QB.

Compound that with drafting that failed to address the O-line in any meaningful way.

Just like the Jets.

Turner was fired not because Ron Rivera wanted to run a more run-focused offense, as was laughably claimed at Turners firing announcement, as it was Ron Rivera himself, who last offseason was acquiring the total failure of a downfield passer in Wentz, and demanded the 'Ders run a more pass-heavy O focused on the downfield passing game, has completely failed as both GM and Head Coach, and hasn't produced a season above .500 since 2017 in Carolina.  In point of fact, I don't believe Ron Rivera has ever posted a better than .500 season where his QB was not Cam Newton.

And like JD, Ron has hit on several players, their young WR Dotson is a likely stud for example. 

So yes, this does sound very familiar.  And if we fire MLF to save Saleh and JD, the same story will be at play here.  The failure of our GM to find anything resembling a decent QB, the failure of our Head Coach to win more games than he loses, and the failure to build anything close to an effective O-line.

Some portion of the fanbase here in DC will be placated by this, but Ron Rivera is the problem here.

Of course, with the team likely getting a new Owner, likely this offseason if all goes well, Ron will not be changed, and in fact little big will likely be changed here.  Those calls will be the new Owners calls and saved for the 2024 offseason.

As always, good thoughts Warfish!  You seem to know more about the situation down there than I do.

Stripping that out, I do like his stated approach, however artificial that might seem or be.  Talk to the players, talk to the opponents, demand progress (which didn't really happen over multiple years).

Mike LaFleur's future here should not be based on simply the QB and OL weren't good enough.  Yes, those are very important considerations but so are these:

1. What accountability should he take for the QB taking a BIG step backwards?

2. What input did he have on the OL?

3. Why is the OL still having the same communication problems it had last year?

4. Why didn't he find a way to get the once promising Elijah Moore involved?

5. Why didn't Jeremy Ruckert play more?  Someone posted about his blocking vs. Miami earlier this week.  It was dominant while Uzomah's has been mediocre at best.

6. A week to game plan, yet 1 TD and 1 FG on opening drives?

7. Player feedback (coach related):  Conklin "We came out flat"; G Wilson "Other teams now know how to stop us"; McGovern "It's on the players but also the coaches".  

8. Not only Wilson and Moore, but why have Becton, Carter, Mims, and Berrios taken steps backwards?  

9. We invested in Davis, Conklin, Uzomah.  How did you get the most of them, play to their strengths?

10. The offense showed no fight at the end of the year.  Why is that?

11. What input did you have playing Joe Flacco over Mike White the first 3 games of the season?

12. How do you go 3 straight games without scoring a TD.  Other teams in the NFL have had poor quarterbacking & offensive line play yet found ways to get in the end zone.  This was the only time since 2000 this has happened ..

13. Give me some examples Mike how you adapted your system to the players..

--------------------------------------------

 

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21 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

Certainly a Murderer's Row of teams to emulate!

the good teams are not at the bottom of the league with inept offenses and 2 wins

you suggest they keep these idiots who cant cut it just because? maybe we should call up Adam Gase again then! we made a mistake!

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2 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Why should he have gone back to Heinicke when they were eliminated from the postseason?

Playing the rookie Howell was the correct call in the final week vs. Dallas.

Otherwise I agree, the decisions before that at QB, starting with acquiring Wentz in the first place, were quite questionable.

I’ll give you Howell, I guess given he sat Heinicki for Wentz, blowing any chance of making the playoffs why not.  That Wentz game was puzzling though

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40 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Who do you guys consider to be a good offensive coordinator? 

Ted Marchibroda (sp?); Dan Henning; mike martz; john mcvay and andy reid. Guys who either have a system which they make work with the personnel available or who change their system for the personnel. The key thing is the realization that they must capitalize on the abilities available to them.

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56 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

Who do you guys consider to be a good offensive coordinator? 

It's a good but tough question because our impressions are of course tied to wins / losses -- which is not always fair.  Easy to think Tom Brady's OC is great until he becomes the head coach of Denver and then Oakland.   

 

I would look at

1. Consistent high performance (results) across various stops in his career.

2. Does he have certain attributes that tend to lead to success?

- Successful offensive philosophy (hopefully even 1 step ahead of the curve)

- Flexibility to adapt his system to his players

- Flexibility to adapt his system in the case of unforeseen injuries

- Proven strategic strength in creating offensive mismatches and minimizing weaknesses

- In this case, ability to develop a young QB

- Managerial courage:  tells the HC/GM what he need and when a young player/QB is ready to play (I don't want to hear after 2 years that maybe the guy wasn't ready to play)

- Ability to inspire

- Ability to unite the locker room even during difficult circumstances

- Proven success at developing players

- Someone who runs an offense that gets better throughout the year & over time, keeping defenses on their toes

 

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2 hours ago, OtherwiseHappyinLife said:

"I take into account everything that I get," Rivera said, "not just from players but from coaches themselves, from what I look at, what I observe on the field, on the tape."

Wow, that sounds like a HC... if Saleh puts friendship ahead of the team, he's not HC material... EVERYONE in the NFL Knows it's a Business First. 

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1 hour ago, Warfish said:

This was one of the more obvious cases of scapegoating I've seen in a while.  And yes, it echos the vibe here with the Jets.

Ron Rivera isn't just the head coach, he is also the de facto GM, and has been since he was hired.

The primary reason the 'Ders O failed is not Scott Turner's system or play-calling. 

The problem in DC was and is the utter and complete failure of GM Ron Rivera to identify, find and acquire a QB.

Compound that with drafting that failed to address the O-line in any meaningful way.

Just like the Jets.

Turner was fired not because Ron Rivera wanted to run a more run-focused offense, as was laughably claimed at Turners firing announcement, as it was Ron Rivera himself, who last offseason was acquiring the total failure of a downfield passer in Wentz, and demanded the 'Ders run a more pass-heavy O focused on the downfield passing game, who has completely failed as both GM and Head Coach, and hasn't produced a season above .500 since 2017 in Carolina.  In point of fact, I don't believe Ron Rivera has ever posted a better than .500 season where his QB was not Cam Newton.

And like JD, Ron has hit on several players, their young WR Dotson is a likely stud for example. 

So yes, this does sound very familiar.  And if we fire MLF to save Saleh and JD, the same story will be at play here.  The failure of our GM to find anything resembling a decent QB, the failure of our Head Coach to win more games than he loses, and the failure to build anything close to an effective O-line.

Some portion of the fanbase here in DC will be placated by this, but Ron Rivera is the problem here.

Of course, with the team likely getting a new Owner, likely this offseason if all goes well, Ron will not be changed, and in fact little big will likely be changed here.  Those calls will be the new Owners calls and saved for the 2024 offseason.

Everytime you type ‘Ders I get more pissed off reading lmao

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1 hour ago, Dcat said:

1-7 after the bye week.  Worst 2d half of season out of 32 teams in the NFL.  You must have missed it. 

Worst? I thought the Chicago Bears finished the season on a 10 game losing streak.

Not to mention the Titans or Colts who finished with 7 game losing streaks.

It was bad, really bad, but not the worst. Still something that I think requires some sort of coaching change though.

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5 minutes ago, Hex said:

Worst? I thought the Chicago Bears finished the season on a 10 game losing streak.

Not to mention the Titans or Colts who finished with 7 game losing streaks.

It was bad, really bad, but not the worst. Still something that I think requires some sort of coaching change though.

1-7... oops 2nd worst in last 8 games. 
I guess that's enough to justify the return of MLF?  

MLF is a key reason why we finished 1-7.  But by all means, lets bring him back.

NY Jets = dumb

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5 minutes ago, Dcat said:

1-7... oops 2nd worst in last 8 games. 
I guess that's enough to justify the return of MLF?  

MLF is a key reason why we finished 1-7.  But by all means, lets bring him back.

NY Jets = dumb

Nope it's not. I was just being an annoying fact checker. The first thing I want changed during the offseason is MLF getting fired.

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21 minutes ago, OtherwiseHappyinLife said:

I personally hate that you end your LOL with a period.

Well, way I see it is LOL stands for "Ha, ha, I am laughing out loud right now."

Since I would end that sentence with a period normally, the abbreviated version of LOL also warrants a period.

Not quite sure a grammatician would agree tho. 

LOL.

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