Lamar Jackson talk is completely triggering me

[Awesumtenor]

42 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

I thought I posted a reply before but maybe it didn't go through. 

BB said that before a game.  He always gasses an opponent up before a game.  And while Lamar can be an effective passer, the part of his game that makes him a star is his legs.   

https://touchdownwire.usatoday.com/2019/11/11/mythbusters-yes-lamar-jackson-is-a-pocket-passer/
 

https://www.nbcsports.com/washington/ravens/one-metric-rates-lamar-jackson-best-pocket-passer-nfl

 

https://www.patspulpit.com/2022/9/24/23369776/5-questions-patriots-ravens-preview-nfl-week-3
 

There are quite a few others; google “Lamar Jackson pocket passer”. when he is in the pocket his feet are quiet as he goes through his progressions. When a pass is called, he stands in to deliver the ball downfield and runs only when he has to. As I noted in another post in this thread. Daniel Jones and Josh Allen ran the ball about the same number of times for the same number of yards this year; why don’t you besmirch them as running QB’s as you do Lamar?

[Rhg1084]

7 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I'm not overly happy with the available, real-world options, no.

Right now, today, I'm leaning towards a veteran, a Carr, a Minshew, a Mayfield, a Garrapolo type.

Someone with some displayed resume of successful production (if not also actual team success) at the NFL level at QB.

I'm for maximizing likely passing production, and minimizing risk, both short-term and long term.

Lamar is out for me, as he's a inadequate passer and a meaningful injury risk at a massive cost in terms of trade cost, and contract cost.  I think he'd be a disaster here, on a team poorly designed to support his specific style of play.

Brady is out because he is our worst enemy.  And I'm old school about things like that.

Wilson is out because he is a top-10 all-time NFL Draft bust, no matter how long we give him to get his poop together.

I've not yet really looked at this QB draft class, but they're likely out for the same reason.  Huge risk (i.e. Sanchez, Geno, Darnold, Wilson, and over a decade of losing because of them) and low chance of success, but the low cost is nice, and as I said, I haven't really researched this class yet (I don't follow minor league, i.e. college, football till after our season is over.  A curse of not having attended a school with a football team, no rooting interest for me).

So that is where I am today.  Sorry I don't have a definitive hot take as yet, but I prefer to make those calls when I feel they're at least considered and informed, even if I may ultimately prove wrong (which so far hasn't happened much with our QB's, but still).

You’re wrong about Lamar not being an adequate passer btw. Not sure where that narrative came from.

[Tranquilo]

You can’t say all that sh*t and then want Carr. Derek Carr sucks ass 

[JohnnyLV]

18 minutes ago, carlito1171 said:

So in other words, you don't have an answer because he doesn't have any major surgeries LOL. Got it! ?

Otherwise to insinuate that a sprain has the same long term lingering effects as a tear that requires surgery or a broken bone is disingenuous at best. There's a classification between the grades of a sprain, and a tear for a reason. 

But you continue being "triggered" over an unsubstantiated rumor ? 

My god, you did not even read the post. A sprain IS a tear. An ACL tear is a sprain. They are the same. And a Grade 2 is a pretty significant tear. Lol maybe read before flying off the handle. There is no rumor the friggin Ravens list the exact injuries. 

[Green Ghost]

11 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I'd be legit curious what the Venn diagram would look like between "Jets Fans supportive of Lamar healthy-scratching himself from a playoff game" and "Jets Fans who want the Jets to sign Lamar".

Why would you say he “healthy scratched himself”. That’s a pretty shi**y thing to just casually state as fact, and you’re better than that. 

Whether he could play with that injury is open to debate I suppose, as is any opinion of him deciding not to risk making it worse. I haven’t seen one reputable source say he isn’t injured though. 
 

[JohnnyLV]

22 minutes ago, King P said:

No he's not. He's a worse QB and a worse leader. So how is he a better option?

He is a better option because he is cheaper and would not cost draft picks and is a Top 20 ish QB. Lamar goes draft capital AND franchise killing cap hits. People clearly dont even look at the totality of signing the veteran they want. Personally I dont go and get either.

[Biggs]

1 hour ago, Awesumtenor said:

You do realize the more you drag out tropes built on ignorance the more willfully stupid you look…

Daniel Jones and Josh Allen both had nearly the same number carries (Allen slightly more; Jones slightly less) as Lamar and they all had roughly the same yardage…yet you won’t tell the same lies about them; instead you’d say their running was some brilliant stroke of their football genius or some other BS like that…because “everybody knows black quarterbacks aren’t cerebral and have to rely on their athleticism…”

 

Jones has had 292 carries in 53 GS.  Allen has 546 in 76 game starts and Lamar has 727 in 61 GS.   Allen and the Bills negiotated a deal.  Jones is currently not signed.  Lamar turned down a deal with the Ravens and has said he wants to be the highest paid QB.

Jones just put up a 114 plus QBR in his first playoff game on the road.  

This really comes down to price, guaranteed money and what you can resonably expect in future performance.   I believe the current salary rank by QB in the NFL is Rodgers, Watson, Murray, Wilson and Mahomes.   It doesn't make a great argument for throwing top 1 money on Lamar Jackson.   It probably doesn't make the argument for throwing top tier money on any of the QB's that will be available. 

[playtowinthegame]

15 minutes ago, Scoop24 said:

At same point you gotta compete now. The NFL changes to much from year to year to be banking on the future... plus Salah and JD do not have the job security to worry a bout the Future. 

 

You act like it's Lamar or bust for the Jets at quarterback this off-season. As if there are no other pathways for the Jets to find success at quarterback in 2023. Bottom line Lamar Jackson hasn't done jack sh*t in the playoffs and the Ravens ARE A WELL-RUN ORGANIZATION. You don't tie your future to Lamar Jackson at this stage of his career with the desperate Jets. He's going to cost a lot to do nothing better than he did with the Ravens. If you just want to make the playoffs for a year or two and not win sh*t, then by all means go get Lamar. Once Joe Douglas gets fired the Ravens can rehire him as a thank you for the package of draft picks. 

[Green Ghost]

Lamar should just go to Miami and put up video game numbers with McDaniel, Hill, Waddle and Gsiecki.

We can sign Trubisky or Jimmy G to mentor Zach and do whatever it is we do…

[Smashmouth]

2 hours ago, Rhg1084 said:

“Lamar can’t throw” 

 

 

I can Cherry pick Zach Wilson throws and make people think he's the greatest QB in history. Lamar Jackson threw for 3000 yards 1 time in his career what does that mean if he can no longer run the ball due to breaking down physically . Some of you guys are ESPN highlight hero's that get you all excited until you actually watch the guy play.

[Smashmouth]

2 minutes ago, Green Ghost said:

Lamar should just go to Miami and put up video game numbers with McDaniel, Hill, Waddle and Gsiecki.

only problem there is  he NEVER put up video game numbers throwing the ball 

[varjet]

I think as a general matter we will be surprised by how much each of the FA QBs cost.  All of them will get more than they we expect, or that they should.  

[Awesumtenor]

16 minutes ago, Warfish said:

 

Right now, today, I'm leaning towards a veteran, a Carr, a Minshew, a Mayfield, a Garrapolo type.

Minshew and Mayfield both suck and Mayfield is injured more than Lamar. As for Carr, I don’t know if he was resistant to learning the Patriot offense or it was just complex to teach an old dog new tricks…

Someone with some displayed resume of successful production (if not also actual team success) at the NFL level at QB.

Lamar has won a league MVP…which none of the QBs you listed have done

I'm for maximizing likely passing production, and minimizing risk, both short-term and long term.

Putting Lamar behind a decent pass blocking line and giving him more than one viable receiver would maximize passing production and minimize risk, both short term and long term. If you were to put any of the quarterbacks listed on the Ravens as constituted presently, they would not be able to match Lamar’s production.

 

[Green Ghost]

Just now, Smashmouth said:

only problem there is  he NEVER put up video game numbers throwing the ball 

I’d take my chances he would under McDaniel in Miami, Smash. I don’t remember him having guys like Hill, Waddle and Gsiecki around him in Baltimore, do you?

[NYJCAP2]

Patiently waiting for a poll…

Lamar

Carr

Jimmy G

[Smashmouth]

2 hours ago, Awesumtenor said:

You do realize the more you drag out tropes built on ignorance the more willfully stupid you look…

Daniel Jones and Josh Allen both had nearly the same number carries (Allen slightly more; Jones slightly less) as Lamar and they all had roughly the same yardage…yet you won’t tell the same lies about them; instead you’d say their running was some brilliant stroke of their football genius or some other BS like that…because “everybody knows black quarterbacks aren’t cerebral and have to rely on their athleticism…”

 

WTF are you talking about ??? When did I ever mention Josh Allen or Daniel Jones ....what you trying to make this a racial thing ? Both those guys run the ball a lot and its just as much a risk as Lamar. However have you bothered to look at Josh Allens passing numbers ?? Are you really this stupid to bring this crap up and change the narrative to something I was never comparing it too ? Why is it whenever I mention a Black QB do I seem to get accused of this sh*t while not even making comparisons. Don't deny it either I know exactly where you were going with this so take that sh*t somewhere else.

 

[DJF71]

14 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

I can Cherry pick Zach Wilson throws and make people think he's the greatest QB in history. 

Bet you can't. 

[Smashmouth]

2 hours ago, carlito1171 said:

 

Someone go ahead and point out the critical injuries he’s had that’s needed surgery so far? Where’s the ligament tears? Broken bones? 
 

Like I said before I see an argument for both sides but some of the stuff on the anti-Lamar side is completely overblown 

You mean like the people telling me Lamar has similar passing stats to Josh Allen ? When Lamar barely broke 3000 yards in only one of his seasons which happened to be a damn good season but since then ?? Nothing

[bla bla bla]

37 minutes ago, Warfish said:

I'd be legit curious what the Venn diagram would look like between "Jets Fans supportive of Lamar healthy-scratching himself from a playoff game" and "Jets Fans who want the Jets to sign Lamar".

Skipping game because you are you don't want to risk further injury in a contract year and skipping a game because you want a contract when you are 100% healthy are two totally different things IMO.

[Smashmouth]

1 hour ago, bla bla bla said:

Lamar Jackson was injured in the pocket the last 2 seasons, not while running.

That's great man but you're telling me his running for 700 to 1100 yards a year does'nt  bring on wear and tear on his body ? 

You know what I hope the Jets bring him here so I watch all of you guys start saying OMFG Lamar cant throw the ball or why does Lamar throw for 100 yards in the playoffs because thats exactly what every single one of you will be doing

[Biggs]

38 minutes ago, Awesumtenor said:

https://touchdownwire.usatoday.com/2019/11/11/mythbusters-yes-lamar-jackson-is-a-pocket-passer/
 

https://www.nbcsports.com/washington/ravens/one-metric-rates-lamar-jackson-best-pocket-passer-nfl

 

https://www.patspulpit.com/2022/9/24/23369776/5-questions-patriots-ravens-preview-nfl-week-3
 

There are quite a few others; google “Lamar Jackson pocket passer”. when he is in the pocket his feet are quiet as he goes through his progressions. When a pass is called, he stands in to deliver the ball downfield and runs only when he has to. As I noted in another post in this thread. Daniel Jones and Josh Allen ran the ball about the same number of times for the same number of yards this year; why don’t you besmirch them as running QB’s as you do Lamar?

Lamar runs way more than either Jones or Allan.  As I pointed out Allen actually negiotated a deal with the Bills.  He didn't turn down their offer and demand to be the highest paid QB he negoitated a deal.  Jones wasn't offered a deal.

I would not be inclined to sign Jones for top 5 money let alone top money.  Jones just put up numbers in a playoff game that Lamar has never come close to.  

[bla bla bla]

19 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

only problem there is  he NEVER put up video game numbers throwing the ball 

Subtle video game flex I see

[Smashmouth]

16 minutes ago, Green Ghost said:

I’d take my chances he would under McDaniel in Miami, Smash. I don’t remember him having guys like Hill, Waddle and Gsiecki around him in Baltimore, do you?

you very well may be right Lamar may light it up in Miami if they want that type of QB then fine they have enough talent over there to make it work let them take the chance he's not breaking down.

[Smashmouth]

8 minutes ago, DJF71 said:

Bet you can't. 

you might be right LOL

[playtowinthegame]

28 minutes ago, Green Ghost said:

Lamar should just go to Miami and put up video game numbers with McDaniel, Hill, Waddle and Gsiecki.

We can sign Trubisky or Jimmy G to mentor Zach and do whatever it is we do…

Tua has played more games in the last two seasons than Lamar Jackson. Whoever the Dolphins sign this off-season is going to likely see an uptick in their production as a quarterback with those receivers in Miami. That's assuming Tua isn't the quarterback anymore.

[Smashmouth]

3 minutes ago, bla bla bla said:

Subtle video game flex I see

nope just referring to what I quoted 

[Grandy]

5 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

You mean like the people telling me Lamar has similar passing stats to Josh Allen ? When Lamar barely broke 3000 yards in only one of his seasons which happened to be a damn good season but since then ?? Nothing

Since when are total passing yards the end all for being a good passer? Lamar just doesn't have a lot of attempts, but he's been efficient. 

[Warfish]

37 minutes ago, Green Ghost said:

Why would you say he “healthy scratched himself”. That’s a pretty shi**y thing to just casually state as fact, and you’re better than that. 

If he's too hurt to play, why are we discussing his contract or him sitting out?

It's only an issue if he is healthy enough to play and won't.

 

[Smashmouth]

3 minutes ago, playtowinthegame said:

Tua has played more games in the last two seasons than Lamar Jackson. Whoever the Dolphins sign is going to likely see an uptick in their production as a quarterback with those receivers in Miami. 

you have to stop making sense !

[Warfish]

10 minutes ago, bla bla bla said:

Skipping game because you are you don't want to risk further injury in a contract year and skipping a game because you want a contract when you are 100% healthy are two totally different things IMO.

If you say so.  Sounds like rationalization to me.

Looks more and more like that Venn diagram is just a single circle, lol.

[bla bla bla]

1 minute ago, Smashmouth said:

That's great man but you're telling me his running for 700 to 1100 yards a year does'nt  bring on wear and tear on his body ? 

You know what I hope the Jets bring him here so I watch all of you guys start saying OMFG Lamar cant throw the ball or why does Lamar throw for 100 yards in the playoffs because thats exactly what every single one of you will be doing

Lamar doesn't take big shots, or at least not frequently. I think the beating he takes are closer to a WR than that of a RB since he's generally sliding or running out of bounds. I'd have more issue if he threw his body around like Allen at his size.

If the Jets don't get Derek Carr, we'll have other options. Lamar is probably option 3 or 4 for me but I could get behind him here in NY.

[Warfish]

30 minutes ago, Awesumtenor said:

 

Just FYI, when you respond to someone as you did, this is what comes up when you're quoted.

Nothing.

Clearly you're a big Lamar fan, and I'd wager you want us to get him.  Happy to agree to disagree with you on that opinion.

I doubt Lamar is even on JD's radar (same as Brady, Rodgers or some of the other never-gonna-happen daydreams here at JN) so it's likely a moot point.  JD doesn't strike me as a "sell the franchises future in draft picks to order to tie us down financially to a guy with a massive salary despite the huge injury risks and low passing production" IMO.

But who knows.

[bla bla bla]

2 minutes ago, Warfish said:

If you say so.  Sounds like rationalization to me.

Looks more and more like that Venn diagram is just a single circle, lol.

You are implying he skipped the game while 100% healthy. There is no evidence to support that at all. I think you are having a disingenuous argument here.

[Smashmouth]

12 minutes ago, bla bla bla said:

Skipping game because you are you don't want to risk further injury in a contract year and skipping a game because you want a contract when you are 100% healthy are two totally different things IMO.

Nobody said Lamar skipped the game while 100 % healthy not one single person. But you have to keep in mind if Lamar was able to play the QB position but was somewhat limited in being able to run all over the field he should have played after all he is a QB ..Right ? . I'm sure he could have navigated the pocket . BUT if Lamar knowing the biggest part of my game is running the football and he cant run the football and fails in the pocket that could be 40mil down the toilet as well. From a money standpoint Lamar 100 % made the right decision for himself.....for the team is another story

[Warfish]

4 minutes ago, bla bla bla said:

You are implying he skipped the game while 100% healthy. There is no evidence to support that at all. I think you are having a disingenuous argument here.

No, I said "healthy scratch".  Healthy in the NFL means "physically able to play".

I'll repeat, if he is so hurt he is not physically able to play, there is no discussion here.  

Clearly he IS healthy enough to play, otherwise it's a non-issue that he's not playing.