General Draft/Prospect news

[section314]

18 hours ago, kdels62 said:

In the throes of 3L, working a clinic and trying to finish strong. Leaves me no time for my true happiness which is being wrong about draft prospects 

Good luck. You and I can be partners for our JN draft. I’ll get the players, you handle all the contract stuff.?

[Chrebetfan80]

1 hour ago, derp said:

Yeah, I think it conceptually makes sense. In my head if basically anyone but Levis is sitting there around 10, you know you don’t have a long term answer at QB so just shoot your shot. But I get it’s not happening. It’ll just be frustrating if it works out for some other team because in retrospect it’ll be so obvious. Hopefully they’re all gone in the top 9. Would help push some better players down too.

I dont think we need to worry about it honestly.  like i said from what I've heard the Colts will make a push to trade for the 1 overall for stroud.  If they dont then the farthest he slides is to them at 4. We'll see what the texans do at 2 but chance they can go stroud or young (i have not heard anything about them). only person i could see lasting to 13 is levis.  

[win4ever]

12 hours ago, Chrebetfan80 said:

Glad to see there are other fans! I thought overall he may have been the most consistently impressive at the Senior bowl practices.   Great kid too

Yeah, I really love his routes, although I'm not sure we go for him with Moore/Wilson are not big targets, and feel like we might go with a bigger body.  But his releases and route stems are just so clean.   I see us more in the AT Perry train.

So far I've been really impressed by Dell.  

I'm a bit intrigued by Jayden Reed, his deep ball efficiency is pretty good, which is exactly what we need.  Also Josh Downs.   

[Chrebetfan80]

8 hours ago, win4ever said:

Yeah, I really love his routes, although I'm not sure we go for him with Moore/Wilson are not big targets, and feel like we might go with a bigger body.  But his releases and route stems are just so clean.   I see us more in the AT Perry train.

So far I've been really impressed by Dell.  

I'm a bit intrigued by Jayden Reed, his deep ball efficiency is pretty good, which is exactly what we need.  Also Josh Downs.   

He's been working on this stuff with this coach since his HS days so its no surprise he's as efficient with his movement patterns and as nuanced a route runner as he is at this point.  He's shown now he can compete against good competition too and really i thought stole the show at the senior bowl. 

But yes, his fit on this team is something I am not sure about.  Moore and Wilson really operate in the same space as Dell would and Dell is I believe a bit smaller than those two.  

Jayden Reed is interesting.. Like you said pretty good deep ball efficiency, and the size that we have liked here recently, he could be a good piece to add especially if we could get him in the 3rd or later (which some people are speculating Wr's wont really fly off the board until rd 2). 

Downs I like alot.  Again I think i posted it before but Dell was the 2nd best Wr. against Single coverage this season, Downs was the 3rd.  He's a guy that can win 1v1 which is huge in the nfl now.  So many teams play matchup quarters or rip liz match coverage that a ton of the game is played in a 1v1 scenario.  Having guys that can consistently win and a QB that can deliver the ball makes an offense deadly.  There is only so much scheming you can do on a game to game basis.  

This is where I go back and forth with my philosophy though.  1 I agree we need a bigger target that can take the top off of defenses to open this offense up, but I also see the value of just getting guys that can operate like moore and wilson, just winning 1v1  and collecting chunks of yards with YAC. 

It will be interesting to see how this all plays out.  The one thing I keep thinking about though is that we have not even come close to seeing the best of Moore or even Mims yet.  The way they were coached this year was pure ass and then take into account that Lafleur just stuffed guys into a dog house for childish reasons.   I think we could have more at the position than we think. 

 

[Beerfish]

Here is a question, if you love a player do you take him even if you have no need in that position?   There have been a LOT of examples of teams getting blasted for taking a guy when they have a position covered and the guy they draft ends up being a big part of their team.

(I am saying this being totally enamored with Tyjae Spears) 

[maury77]

12 hours ago, Chrebetfan80 said:

He's been working on this stuff with this coach since his HS days so its no surprise he's as efficient with his movement patterns and as nuanced a route runner as he is at this point.  He's shown now he can compete against good competition too and really i thought stole the show at the senior bowl. 

But yes, his fit on this team is something I am not sure about.  Moore and Wilson really operate in the same space as Dell would and Dell is I believe a bit smaller than those two.  

Jayden Reed is interesting.. Like you said pretty good deep ball efficiency, and the size that we have liked here recently, he could be a good piece to add especially if we could get him in the 3rd or later (which some people are speculating Wr's wont really fly off the board until rd 2). 

Downs I like alot.  Again I think i posted it before but Dell was the 2nd best Wr. against Single coverage this season, Downs was the 3rd.  He's a guy that can win 1v1 which is huge in the nfl now.  So many teams play matchup quarters or rip liz match coverage that a ton of the game is played in a 1v1 scenario.  Having guys that can consistently win and a QB that can deliver the ball makes an offense deadly.  There is only so much scheming you can do on a game to game basis.  

This is where I go back and forth with my philosophy though.  1 I agree we need a bigger target that can take the top off of defenses to open this offense up, but I also see the value of just getting guys that can operate like moore and wilson, just winning 1v1  and collecting chunks of yards with YAC. 

It will be interesting to see how this all plays out.  The one thing I keep thinking about though is that we have not even come close to seeing the best of Moore or even Mims yet.  The way they were coached this year was pure ass and then take into account that Lafleur just stuffed guys into a dog house for childish reasons.   I think we could have more at the position than we think. 

 

I'm not sure if it was Rosenblatt or Hughes, but one of them mentioned that the front office is still bullish on Mims and thinks he may be able to thrive in Hackett's system. 

[TuscanyTile2]

On 2/11/2023 at 7:54 PM, Beerfish said:

The best Qbs in this league go to already built teams, and get a full year at least to learn the nfl Mahoomes to kc and Hurts to philly.  Put those guys on the team darnold. had to live with and they'd get killed as well.

How about Trevor Lawrence?

[derp]

3 hours ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

How about Trevor Lawrence?

Burrow is probably a better one than Lawrence.

I think the answer is that every few years there’s one guy in the draft who’s just going to be a star. Beyond that guys need an adequate degree of support, and most guys drafted really high go to franchises that just aren’t good enough to provide it.

[Chrebetfan80]

21 hours ago, maury77 said:

I'm not sure if it was Rosenblatt or Hughes, but one of them mentioned that the front office is still bullish on Mims and thinks he may be able to thrive in Hackett's system. 

he's got the talent, we'll see that most of these guys may do better not forced into a square hole or slammed in the dog house

[T0mShane]

On 2/14/2023 at 9:16 AM, derp said:

As a Florida fan who wants Richardson to succeed - setting any pro fandom aside - what organization would you most like to see Richardson go to?

 

On 2/14/2023 at 9:23 AM, JiFields said:

Yes

Fwiw, the hot draft take this week has uniformly been “If I’m picking in the top five, the QB I want to take a chance on is Anthony Richardson.”

[JustInFudge]

10 hours ago, T0mShane said:

 

Fwiw, the hot draft take this week has uniformly been “If I’m picking in the top five, the QB I want to take a chance on is Anthony Richardson.”

If you read my follow up post after that deep analysis I provided, I get it.  He's legit the biggest freak to come out since probably Myles Garrett.  The best athlete on the field every Sunday.  I think the most encouraging aspect of the Richardson analysis is what he was asked to do at the college level.  You just dont see QB's asked to scan the whole field anymore but also w/ freedom at the LOS.  Billy Napier really gave him a pro-style offense to execute.  Almost to his determent because he really didnt have the horses at WR to deploy that system and they didnt make the game easier on him by giving him a ton of designed runs, which I think hurt his his development asking him to do to much on a really bad team.

He's a freakier Josh Allen.  If someone can figure out a way to develop him the way they did Allen, Richardson has an MVP caliber ceiling, no doubt about it.  He's just really really raw and has a long long way to go.  The team that drafts him has to have a full proof plan and patience but if it hits, he could take the league by storm and easily become an MVP caliber QB.

 

[section314]

2 hours ago, JiFields said:

If you read my follow up post after that deep analysis I provided, I get it.  He's legit the biggest freak to come out since probably Myles Garrett.  The best athlete on the field every Sunday.  I think the most encouraging aspect of the Richardson analysis is what he was asked to do at the college level.  You just dont see QB's asked to scan the whole field anymore but also w/ freedom at the LOS.  Billy Napier really gave him a pro-style offense to execute.  Almost to his determent because he really didnt have the horses at WR to deploy that system and they didnt make the game easier on him by giving him a ton of designed runs, which I think hurt his his development asking him to do to much on a really bad team.

He's a freakier Josh Allen.  If someone can figure out a way to develop him the way they did Allen, Richardson has an MVP caliber ceiling, no doubt about it.  He's just really really raw and has a long long way to go.  The team that drafts him has to have a full proof plan and patience but if it hits, he could take the league by storm and easily become an MVP caliber QB.

 

That's the 49'rs to a tee, but do they have any draft capital to get up to get him?  Reading this, he should be the 1st QB off the board.

[derp]

16 hours ago, T0mShane said:

 

Fwiw, the hot draft take this week has uniformly been “If I’m picking in the top five, the QB I want to take a chance on is Anthony Richardson.”

Because he's so obviously a boom or bust prospect, it definitely behooves analysts to have this kind of a take if they think he's got legitimate potential. If they just straight up say he's terrible, then if he becomes a superstar they look bad. But if they say he's a really appealing prospect - if he becomes a star then great and if he busts well then it obviously was on the team that didn't develop him properly and we knew that might happen anyway.

That said, I've said it before but I love a) that he's so obviously raw that he's going to get time b) that he's flashed stuff like pocket presence, looking guys off, pre-snap reads and c) that he didn't play with a clear talent advantage every week. To me, probably every draft prospect but one every couple years would benefit from sitting a little.. Giving that time to the freakiest guy who's already shown flashes of being able to do the stuff he needs to learn how to do? Pretty appealing.

I know it won't happen but to me a Tannehill/Brissett for 2 years plus Richardson cheap at 13 is the possible plan for the franchise. Get better QB play and improve the team in the short term and hopefully get this team to the playoffs. Then after a couple years when it becomes evident the ceiling is limited because of the quarterback, you plop in a freak who's been learning the scheme, developing as a quarterback, and building chemistry with the team for two seasons. And you didn't have to give up an arm and a leg to get a guy with MVP upside.

We'll see if another team implements something like that. If he doesn't land here I'd like to see him in Detroit. Good situation for a young QB, I'd rather be right and see another miserable franchise to turn around than see a historically good team get a franchise QB, they're not another AFC team to worry about having an elite QB, and if I'm being completely honest if he busts it'd be nice to be able to blame it on the Lions being the Lions haha.

[OilfieldJet]

On 2/17/2023 at 4:14 PM, Beerfish said:

Here is a question, if you love a player do you take him even if you have no need in that position?   There have been a LOT of examples of teams getting blasted for taking a guy when they have a position covered and the guy they draft ends up being a big part of their team.

(I am saying this being totally enamored with Tyjae Spears) 

No. Just MHO.

[Doggin94it]

On 2/15/2023 at 6:34 PM, kdels62 said:

In the throes of 3L, working a clinic and trying to finish strong. Leaves me no time for my true happiness which is being wrong about draft prospects 

Had no idea you were joining the ranks of the damned. Got your job lined up?

[win4ever]

On 2/17/2023 at 10:07 AM, Chrebetfan80 said:

He's been working on this stuff with this coach since his HS days so its no surprise he's as efficient with his movement patterns and as nuanced a route runner as he is at this point.  He's shown now he can compete against good competition too and really i thought stole the show at the senior bowl. 

But yes, his fit on this team is something I am not sure about.  Moore and Wilson really operate in the same space as Dell would and Dell is I believe a bit smaller than those two.  

Jayden Reed is interesting.. Like you said pretty good deep ball efficiency, and the size that we have liked here recently, he could be a good piece to add especially if we could get him in the 3rd or later (which some people are speculating Wr's wont really fly off the board until rd 2). 

Downs I like alot.  Again I think i posted it before but Dell was the 2nd best Wr. against Single coverage this season, Downs was the 3rd.  He's a guy that can win 1v1 which is huge in the nfl now.  So many teams play matchup quarters or rip liz match coverage that a ton of the game is played in a 1v1 scenario.  Having guys that can consistently win and a QB that can deliver the ball makes an offense deadly.  There is only so much scheming you can do on a game to game basis.  

This is where I go back and forth with my philosophy though.  1 I agree we need a bigger target that can take the top off of defenses to open this offense up, but I also see the value of just getting guys that can operate like moore and wilson, just winning 1v1  and collecting chunks of yards with YAC. 

It will be interesting to see how this all plays out.  The one thing I keep thinking about though is that we have not even come close to seeing the best of Moore or even Mims yet.  The way they were coached this year was pure ass and then take into account that Lafleur just stuffed guys into a dog house for childish reasons.   I think we could have more at the position than we think. 

 

Yeah, this is one of those drafts where I'm not sure what is going to happen, everything seems unsure.  Last month, Anthony Richardson was a "Hmm, I wonder if we should pick him in the second" type prospect, and now I'm seeing top 10 reports.  

I have no idea with this WR group because I'm seeing a bunch of different takes, albeit size seems to be missing this year.  I generally tend to like one on one guys that can run routes because those guys are the most difficult to scheme against.   However, Moore/Wilson already provide that, but man watching Dell makes me wonder if that size is necessary.  

One of the reasons being the Miami offense this year was really good with Waddle/Hill being the main focus points, but both of them a extremely talented YAC guys, and I'm not sure someone of that caliber exists in this draft.  But if they can do it without size, an offense that can put Wilson/Moore and one of Dell, Reed, or Downs has all kinds of misdirection possibilities.  

I'm interested to see how the new coaching staff handles Mims because I've felt that he's had talent, but MLF just couldn't scheme anything different than the system he knew.  Felt like it was one of "you fit into our system, or it's done" type events.  There was no reason whatsoever a guy like Jeff Smith saw significant snaps the last 2 years, and guys like Moore ran clear outs.  I'm hoping the new WR coach can help too, and see if they can put a system around him.  

 

[Chrebetfan80]

9 hours ago, win4ever said:

Yeah, this is one of those drafts where I'm not sure what is going to happen, everything seems unsure.  Last month, Anthony Richardson was a "Hmm, I wonder if we should pick him in the second" type prospect, and now I'm seeing top 10 reports.  

I have no idea with this WR group because I'm seeing a bunch of different takes, albeit size seems to be missing this year.  I generally tend to like one on one guys that can run routes because those guys are the most difficult to scheme against.   However, Moore/Wilson already provide that, but man watching Dell makes me wonder if that size is necessary.  

One of the reasons being the Miami offense this year was really good with Waddle/Hill being the main focus points, but both of them a extremely talented YAC guys, and I'm not sure someone of that caliber exists in this draft.  But if they can do it without size, an offense that can put Wilson/Moore and one of Dell, Reed, or Downs has all kinds of misdirection possibilities.  

I'm interested to see how the new coaching staff handles Mims because I've felt that he's had talent, but MLF just couldn't scheme anything different than the system he knew.  Felt like it was one of "you fit into our system, or it's done" type events.  There was no reason whatsoever a guy like Jeff Smith saw significant snaps the last 2 years, and guys like Moore ran clear outs.  I'm hoping the new WR coach can help too, and see if they can put a system around him.  

 

I think the best bang for our buck may be a guy like Hyatt who can flat out fly. That type of speed and playmaking ability opens up a lot in this offense and plays into what Hackett has traditionally liked to do.   The combine will be interesting though because i want to see what some of these guys run (dell and downs specifically).  Their 40s can really help push the narrative we're talking about.

 

This draft will be frustrating from the sense that 

1) I think we will end up trading our first away for Rodgers so we'll have less capital to play with 

2) I don tthink we'll be addressing WR as much or as early as we would want.  Seems like reading the tea leaves it will be OL with the first 2 picks possibly.  ESPECIALLY if we keep the 13th pick, good chance its a T and a C in 2

[derp]

21 minutes ago, Chrebetfan80 said:

I think the best bang for our buck may be a guy like Hyatt who can flat out fly. That type of speed and playmaking ability opens up a lot in this offense and plays into what Hackett has traditionally liked to do.   The combine will be interesting though because i want to see what some of these guys run (dell and downs specifically).  Their 40s can really help push the narrative we're talking about.

 

This draft will be frustrating from the sense that 

1) I think we will end up trading our first away for Rodgers so we'll have less capital to play with 

2) I don tthink we'll be addressing WR as much or as early as we would want.  Seems like reading the tea leaves it will be OL with the first 2 picks possibly.  ESPECIALLY if we keep the 13th pick, good chance its a T and a C in 2

It’s extra annoying that Douglas has known there will be holes on the OL for years and has either traded mid-late round picks and/or burned them on defense instead of bringing in offensive linemen to develop. Especially center. There’s no reason they shouldn’t have a guy ready to take over for McGovern on the roster already.

[Chrebetfan80]

1 hour ago, derp said:

It’s extra annoying that Douglas has known there will be holes on the OL for years and has either traded mid-late round picks and/or burned them on defense instead of bringing in offensive linemen to develop. Especially center. There’s no reason they shouldn’t have a guy ready to take over for McGovern on the roster already.

I think the real issue is just that Becton did not pan out the way they hoped.  Had Becton been a big hit in the draft then this line would not be as maligned as we think it is.  Realistically from what I had heard, he was looking to grab a young center as far back as Zachs draft, but for whatever reason (I'm assuming the board never fell the way he wanted) they didnt select one.  I would assume this year in Rd 2 they will address the Center position and look to either add a T in rd 1 or through FA again to start opposite of Becton.  I also think they will bring in a Vet cheap option in case Becton cant get it done.  

If Rodgers does end up coming here I have a feeling Baktiari will be coming with him, which sures up at least 1 Tackle spot.  Then its just drafting a Center and bringing in someone competent to give insurance for both Tackles as well as hopefully Mitchell progressing.  

It does 100% fix your problem, but with the way the team is structured this year you werent going to 100% fix it anyway.  It was always going to slightly hinge on Becton rounding back into form. 

[#27TheDominator]

15 minutes ago, Chrebetfan80 said:

I think the real issue is just that Becton did not pan out the way they hoped.  Had Becton been a big hit in the draft then this line would not be as maligned as we think it is.  Realistically from what I had heard, he was looking to grab a young center as far back as Zachs draft, but for whatever reason (I'm assuming the board never fell the way he wanted) they didnt select one.  I would assume this year in Rd 2 they will address the Center position and look to either add a T in rd 1 or through FA again to start opposite of Becton.  I also think they will bring in a Vet cheap option in case Becton cant get it done.  

If Rodgers does end up coming here I have a feeling Baktiari will be coming with him, which sures up at least 1 Tackle spot.  Then its just drafting a Center and bringing in someone competent to give insurance for both Tackles as well as hopefully Mitchell progressing.  

It does 100% fix your problem, but with the way the team is structured this year you werent going to 100% fix it anyway.  It was always going to slightly hinge on Becton rounding back into form. 

Does that mean that you think Brown is gone?  What is his contract status?  I thought they were paying him anyway. 

[section314]

1 hour ago, Chrebetfan80 said:

I think the real issue is just that Becton did not pan out the way they hoped.  Had Becton been a big hit in the draft then this line would not be as maligned as we think it is.  Realistically from what I had heard, he was looking to grab a young center as far back as Zachs draft, but for whatever reason (I'm assuming the board never fell the way he wanted) they didnt select one.  I would assume this year in Rd 2 they will address the Center position and look to either add a T in rd 1 or through FA again to start opposite of Becton.  I also think they will bring in a Vet cheap option in case Becton cant get it done.  

If Rodgers does end up coming here I have a feeling Baktiari will be coming with him, which sures up at least 1 Tackle spot.  Then its just drafting a Center and bringing in someone competent to give insurance for both Tackles as well as hopefully Mitchell progressing.  

It does 100% fix your problem, but with the way the team is structured this year you werent going to 100% fix it anyway.  It was always going to slightly hinge on Becton rounding back into form. 

Cam Clarke having to retire was a big hit too. I think he would have been solidly entrenched at one of the two guard spots.

[win4ever]

2 hours ago, Chrebetfan80 said:

I think the best bang for our buck may be a guy like Hyatt who can flat out fly. That type of speed and playmaking ability opens up a lot in this offense and plays into what Hackett has traditionally liked to do.   The combine will be interesting though because i want to see what some of these guys run (dell and downs specifically).  Their 40s can really help push the narrative we're talking about.

 

This draft will be frustrating from the sense that 

1) I think we will end up trading our first away for Rodgers so we'll have less capital to play with 

2) I don tthink we'll be addressing WR as much or as early as we would want.  Seems like reading the tea leaves it will be OL with the first 2 picks possibly.  ESPECIALLY if we keep the 13th pick, good chance its a T and a C in 2

I like Hyatt, I was a bit worried he's going to blow up the combine (I actually expect a sub 4.3 from him) and move into the later first round area.  His speed is absolutely real, I don't recall a guy running away from SEC secondary like him in quite awhile.  However, for a first round pick, I'm really concerned about his route tree and release, because he really only seemed to do great with a free release and deep go/post routes.  

I expect JSN to drop after the combine, I'd be shocked if he came in under 4.5.  His short field agility is great, route stems are elite, but I just don't see the deep speed.  I think Downs/Reed may go into that second round range but I just don't have a read on this WR class.  

So I've been going back to 2021 film, and really liking Reed.  The All 22 against Michigan (I usually only like to see tape vs. good defenses, don't really care if he torched Youngstown State) and he was cooking them on a bunch of routes, but wasn't really targeted as much.  

Yeah, I don't see us going WR in the first two rounds, because we have other holes to fill.  Can't rely on Becton to come back at this point, so I see some form of OL plus maybe LB/S in the second.  Been trying to figure out who could drop a bit, which was why I was somewhat high on Demus.  I just don't know how to scout OL/DL so I expect a somewhat boring draft for me.  

[Chrebetfan80]

1 hour ago, #27TheDominator said:

Does that mean that you think Brown is gone?  What is his contract status?  I thought they were paying him anyway. 

I was under the impression he would be cut as a cap savings but maybe I'm incorrect.

[Chrebetfan80]

24 minutes ago, win4ever said:

I like Hyatt, I was a bit worried he's going to blow up the combine (I actually expect a sub 4.3 from him) and move into the later first round area.  His speed is absolutely real, I don't recall a guy running away from SEC secondary like him in quite awhile.  However, for a first round pick, I'm really concerned about his route tree and release, because he really only seemed to do great with a free release and deep go/post routes.  

I expect JSN to drop after the combine, I'd be shocked if he came in under 4.5.  His short field agility is great, route stems are elite, but I just don't see the deep speed.  I think Downs/Reed may go into that second round range but I just don't have a read on this WR class.  

So I've been going back to 2021 film, and really liking Reed.  The All 22 against Michigan (I usually only like to see tape vs. good defenses, don't really care if he torched Youngstown State) and he was cooking them on a bunch of routes, but wasn't really targeted as much.  

Yeah, I don't see us going WR in the first two rounds, because we have other holes to fill.  Can't rely on Becton to come back at this point, so I see some form of OL plus maybe LB/S in the second.  Been trying to figure out who could drop a bit, which was why I was somewhat high on Demus.  I just don't know how to scout OL/DL so I expect a somewhat boring draft for me.  

Hyatt has some concerns for sure, im trying to find out who he is working with for the combine to see if i can get some intel.  Like I did not know who DK was working with during his time at OLE Miss and he surprised everyone with his releases and break points. Hyatt i feel like may be in a similar boat since the offense just did not ask alot of him there.  But yes his speed is REAL, I've had guys tell me he can be the most explosive playmaker to come out since Hill. He definitely doesnt have the twitch that hill has but they feel like any time this kid touches the ball it can be a TD. 

This WR group is an odd one.  Because I could see 3-4 going in  rd 1 but i could also see only 1-2 going in the first.  It's going to be really interesting to watch after the combine to see where some of these guys fall

Rice in rd 2 is also someone im looking at as well, but a very idfferent player than those two. 

From what I can tell its going to be a boring draft if you want skill players.  I just dont see us going that direction if we hold onto all of our picks.  My hope would be to somehow hold onto this years first and then trade down into the 20s add someone but it will be hard as Tackles will be at a premium and we definiteyl need to add 1 this year.  

Ive also heard they want to draft a center fairly early on so there probably goes our 2nd rounder.  

 

[#27TheDominator]

24 minutes ago, Chrebetfan80 said:

I was under the impression he would be cut as a cap savings but maybe I'm incorrect.

I am not totally sure.  Initially, I had read that he was guaranteed for both years with void years added to spread the bonus hit.  Jason's site seems to say that cutting him saves about $5M, but they will have $6M+ in dead money.  Post June 1 it says they'd save $9M (his 2023 base), but I don't see how that works.  Isn't that just shuffling the money from year to year?

[maury77]

30 minutes ago, Chrebetfan80 said:

Hyatt has some concerns for sure, im trying to find out who he is working with for the combine to see if i can get some intel.  Like I did not know who DK was working with during his time at OLE Miss and he surprised everyone with his releases and break points. Hyatt i feel like may be in a similar boat since the offense just did not ask alot of him there.  But yes his speed is REAL, I've had guys tell me he can be the most explosive playmaker to come out since Hill. He definitely doesnt have the twitch that hill has but they feel like any time this kid touches the ball it can be a TD. 

This WR group is an odd one.  Because I could see 3-4 going in  rd 1 but i could also see only 1-2 going in the first.  It's going to be really interesting to watch after the combine to see where some of these guys fall

Rice in rd 2 is also someone im looking at as well, but a very idfferent player than those two. 

From what I can tell its going to be a boring draft if you want skill players.  I just dont see us going that direction if we hold onto all of our picks.  My hope would be to somehow hold onto this years first and then trade down into the 20s add someone but it will be hard as Tackles will be at a premium and we definiteyl need to add 1 this year.  

Ive also heard they want to draft a center fairly early on so there probably goes our 2nd rounder.  

 

I realize it does not necessarily line up with the Jets needs at the moment, but I think there is a solid argument to go TE instead of WR this year as the former is a strong position group up top. With the Jets WR room lacking size, I think a Darnell Washington if he drops to the 2nd is intriguing as a large red zone target. I wonder how much the lack of size in the WR room contributed to the Jets red zone struggles last year. 

[win4ever]

6 minutes ago, Chrebetfan80 said:

Hyatt has some concerns for sure, im trying to find out who he is working with for the combine to see if i can get some intel.  Like I did not know who DK was working with during his time at OLE Miss and he surprised everyone with his releases and break points. Hyatt i feel like may be in a similar boat since the offense just did not ask alot of him there.  But yes his speed is REAL, I've had guys tell me he can be the most explosive playmaker to come out since Hill. He definitely doesnt have the twitch that hill has but they feel like any time this kid touches the ball it can be a TD. 

This WR group is an odd one.  Because I could see 3-4 going in  rd 1 but i could also see only 1-2 going in the first.  It's going to be really interesting to watch after the combine to see where some of these guys fall

Rice in rd 2 is also someone im looking at as well, but a very idfferent player than those two. 

From what I can tell its going to be a boring draft if you want skill players.  I just dont see us going that direction if we hold onto all of our picks.  My hope would be to somehow hold onto this years first and then trade down into the 20s add someone but it will be hard as Tackles will be at a premium and we definiteyl need to add 1 this year.  

Ive also heard they want to draft a center fairly early on so there probably goes our 2nd rounder.  

 

Yeah, just a pure talent wise, Hyatt is exactly what we need because he's an automatic cover 2 like Hill on deep routes.  Right now I have him as a possible Henry Ruggs type guy, that might just blow up at the combine.  Although the downside is some speedster like Anthony Schwartz, although Hyatt is far more refined than him.  Yeah, he doesn't have the stop/start movement like Hill, more of a straight line guy, but him on the outside means a safety is shading over more times than not.  

It's just a hard draft to predict, because the last few years, you knew who the clear cut top guys were, but this year the talent seems more spread out.  Even the QBs are not really cementing themselves, can make arguments in many legitimate ways.  

I've decided to just break down film after the draft this year, because it's too much work for someone we don't even pick.  Just watching some film for basic knowledge, but in-depth rewinding for 20 times type stuff is just not promising.  Last year, I was so high on Garret Wilson, that I think I watched a ton of film since we were likely going to draft a WR.  

I've very interested to see what the Saints are up to, if someone like Levis drops to 13.  They're very aggressive in moving up usually, and I think that's a bad team next year (especially if Kamara has any consequences from the fighting issue).  If the Jets sign Carr (and assuming Packers don't deal within the NFC), they are going to be desperate for a QB.  If they offer 2 firsts (Denver, and their own in '24), that would be interesting.  I'm not a fan of dropping that far down, but I think the jewel would be next year's pick.  

 

[derp]

Regarding the recent chatter in here without quoting everyone (going OL/OL, trading down and picking up a 2024 first) if a) the Jets hang on to 13 and b) can move down it’d be helpful if Anton Harrison can cement himself as a back end R1 guy. Looks like he can move but maybe needs a little polish. Especially nice if they can keep Brown for him to develop behind.

Pulling something like Harrison/Tippmann/2024 first could help solidify the OL and leave them in position to go get a QB next draft class. That is probably one of the cleaner better scenarios, albeit likely a major stretch.

[Cosmo]

If Jets acquire Carr or Rodgers I see them drafting

1) OLT, 2) OLC, 3)LB, 4) Traded for D. Hopkins, 5) CB or S, 6) RB

If it's AR I can only see JD giving up a conditional 2024 pick.

If the QB's go very early, the Jets could trade back a few spots plus getting a 3rd or 4th round pick and still come away with a day 1 starter at OLT.

Also, if they get AR, I could see them go QB in Rd 3 if McKee is there.

[Chrebetfan80]

1 hour ago, #27TheDominator said:

I am not totally sure.  Initially, I had read that he was guaranteed for both years with void years added to spread the bonus hit.  Jason's site seems to say that cutting him saves about $5M, but they will have $6M+ in dead money.  Post June 1 it says they'd save $9M (his 2023 base), but I don't see how that works.  Isn't that just shuffling the money from year to year?

contract stuff goes over my head so im not sure. 

[Chrebetfan80]

3 hours ago, section314 said:

Cam Clarke having to retire was a big hit too. I think he would have been solidly entrenched at one of the two guard spots.

definitely a possibility, Any time you sign or draft guys and lose them to injury early on especially in the situation like his it hurts the long term plan.   

Hopefully pickups like herbig can thrive here or continue to progress and become players.  Either way they are at minimum good depth. 

[Chrebetfan80]

1 hour ago, win4ever said:

Yeah, just a pure talent wise, Hyatt is exactly what we need because he's an automatic cover 2 like Hill on deep routes.  Right now I have him as a possible Henry Ruggs type guy, that might just blow up at the combine.  Although the downside is some speedster like Anthony Schwartz, although Hyatt is far more refined than him.  Yeah, he doesn't have the stop/start movement like Hill, more of a straight line guy, but him on the outside means a safety is shading over more times than not.  

It's just a hard draft to predict, because the last few years, you knew who the clear cut top guys were, but this year the talent seems more spread out.  Even the QBs are not really cementing themselves, can make arguments in many legitimate ways.  

I've decided to just break down film after the draft this year, because it's too much work for someone we don't even pick.  Just watching some film for basic knowledge, but in-depth rewinding for 20 times type stuff is just not promising.  Last year, I was so high on Garret Wilson, that I think I watched a ton of film since we were likely going to draft a WR.  

I've very interested to see what the Saints are up to, if someone like Levis drops to 13.  They're very aggressive in moving up usually, and I think that's a bad team next year (especially if Kamara has any consequences from the fighting issue).  If the Jets sign Carr (and assuming Packers don't deal within the NFC), they are going to be desperate for a QB.  If they offer 2 firsts (Denver, and their own in '24), that would be interesting.  I'm not a fan of dropping that far down, but I think the jewel would be next year's pick.  

 

Yea I think the comparison will be there with Ruggs, But just going off the college guys ive talked to over the year the name that comes up the most is Hill.  I know their games arent a direct correlation but its like you say, the way he effects the defense and stresses coverages on a down to down basis fits Hills profile more than any other guy in this draft maybe.  Plus the deep cross ability which everyone forgets about is massive for teams like us and also a big part of what Hackett likes to do. 

I've broken down some film on guys im interested in but this year was just too crazy with my own football stuff that I had 0 time to prep anything for this draft.  Usually im more up on a lot of these prospects not just WR's but with a new title, new team, new system and a deep playoff run, i just had 0 time.  Alot of the WR film ive watched this year is guys I talk to regularly telling me about them and ill take some time at work to go through film on them to see if it matches up to what im hearing. 

The saints angle is verrrrry interesting.  I think if we end up signing Carr, and I do believe that is a possibility as i believe Douglas is weighing the situation as "Does the difference in price make sense for the difference in talent".  IF we get rodgers I believe the 13th pick will be in the deal but I also believe that Baktiari will be in the deal coming here as well.  I have heard that douglas is very intent on getting Baktiari which could dictate our plans in the draft even if we were to get Carr since there is a chance once rodgers is dealt that all of "his guys" will be released or traded along with him.  

If we were to sign Carr and add Baktiari that would negate the need to be aggressive for a tackle at 13 and open the door for that type of trade down which I think woudl be the best thing for the jets because they could add extra day 2 capital but also provide ammunition for next year to trade up for a QB if Zach shows he hasnt improved this year.  

[Lith]

 

[chirorob]

On 2/17/2023 at 4:14 PM, Beerfish said:

Here is a question, if you love a player do you take him even if you have no need in that position?   There have been a LOT of examples of teams getting blasted for taking a guy when they have a position covered and the guy they draft ends up being a big part of their team.

(I am saying this being totally enamored with Tyjae Spears) 

If you love a player, you take him.  Chances are, in 1 more season someone will leave at that position and the player you selected will slide in.

[win4ever]

7 hours ago, Chrebetfan80 said:

Yea I think the comparison will be there with Ruggs, But just going off the college guys ive talked to over the year the name that comes up the most is Hill.  I know their games arent a direct correlation but its like you say, the way he effects the defense and stresses coverages on a down to down basis fits Hills profile more than any other guy in this draft maybe.  Plus the deep cross ability which everyone forgets about is massive for teams like us and also a big part of what Hackett likes to do. 

I've broken down some film on guys im interested in but this year was just too crazy with my own football stuff that I had 0 time to prep anything for this draft.  Usually im more up on a lot of these prospects not just WR's but with a new title, new team, new system and a deep playoff run, i just had 0 time.  Alot of the WR film ive watched this year is guys I talk to regularly telling me about them and ill take some time at work to go through film on them to see if it matches up to what im hearing. 

The saints angle is verrrrry interesting.  I think if we end up signing Carr, and I do believe that is a possibility as i believe Douglas is weighing the situation as "Does the difference in price make sense for the difference in talent".  IF we get rodgers I believe the 13th pick will be in the deal but I also believe that Baktiari will be in the deal coming here as well.  I have heard that douglas is very intent on getting Baktiari which could dictate our plans in the draft even if we were to get Carr since there is a chance once rodgers is dealt that all of "his guys" will be released or traded along with him.  

If we were to sign Carr and add Baktiari that would negate the need to be aggressive for a tackle at 13 and open the door for that type of trade down which I think woudl be the best thing for the jets because they could add extra day 2 capital but also provide ammunition for next year to trade up for a QB if Zach shows he hasnt improved this year.  

I could see his speed being a game changer for an offense because he's so quick, and he tracks the ball well.  There was one throw, I forgot against who, where he actually slows down on film because the ball is underthrown, and still maintains the distance from the DB running at full throttle.  I legitimately expect him to challenge the combine record.  It also works with Carr since he had success with Ruggs, and the year before I think Tyrell Williams was the deep threat.  

It's hard to balance life with football now, I spend most of my free time with my kid now.  I used to be up until like 2 am watching game film for random prospects, but now it's just not possible.  Rather look after the draft so I know at least the Jets picked them.  I haven't gotten the All-22 yet, waiting a bit to see where guys slot in before doing the research.  There's pretty much no way the Jets use a first on a WR this year, so don't want to end up scouting guys that locked in the first after the combine.  

I think the Saints weirdly keep going for it, when it would be in their best interest to tank.  Last year was perfect for them to tank, coach left, no real QB threat, and instead they trade up for Olave.  I'm guessing Brady leaving means the division is wide open, so they might take that swing for a QB.  Kind of like how Pitt stayed in the teens and took a QB.  I just think they are a really bad team, if Kamara misses any time at all.  I would love to get Baktiari, and improve that line.  

Assuming they get a QB, I hope they trade down from 13 and get some picks next year because I love the QB draft class.  I'm a huge fan of Maye and Williams.  I'd like to see how Ewers does as well, but the Manning hype will be full blown to the point where he has to be perfect to keep his job.