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There HAS to be a way to take human element out of officiating in the NFL


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I don’t know how to post it but if you have instagram nflmemes just showed 3 holds by the chief’s on the Mahomes scramble, and a bengal getting hit clearly out of bounds. They also showed a late hit on burrow, it was a push in the chest , but it was definitely late. That one is 50/50 to me. 
 

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20 minutes ago, jgb said:

Ask @Jetsfan80 to use his AI bot to explain calls. Within 15 minutes fans will be begging for human refs again.

 

1. All players must wear proper equipment while on the field, including helmets, shoulder pads, jerseys, and cleats. 2. Players are not allowed to physically tackle or block the opposing teams players. 3. No player is allowed to intentionally hit, trip, or strike another player. 4. No player is allowed to hold or obstruct the progress of an opposing player. 5. All players must remain within the boundaries of the field of play. 6. No player is allowed to use any foreign object to gain an advantage over an opposing player. 7. No player is allowed to deliberately kick the ball or any other object. 8. No player is allowed to intentionally touch or catch a pass from a teammate. 9. No player is allowed to intentionally interfere with the ball while it is in play. 10. No player is allowed to intentionally push, trip, or strike an opposing player. 11. No player is allowed to intentionally throw the ball at another player. 12. No player is allowed to make contact with an opposing player while they are out of bounds. 13. No player is allowed to tackle an opposing player without the ball. 14. No player is allowed to cause a fumble intentionally. 15. No player is allowed to intentionally kick or punch another player. 16. No player is allowed to make contact with any part of the body other than the hands and feet. 17. No player is allowed to participate in a play after the whistle is blown. 18. No player is allowed to grab, twist, or pull the facemask of another player. 19. No player is allowed to use words or gestures that are considered to be obscene. 20. No player is allowed to wear unauthorized equipment. 21. No player is allowed to wear jewelry while on the field.

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4 hours ago, Greensleeves said:

The AFC Championship game last night has to be a breaking point. We need a way to take most of the human element out of officiating. We have so much tech - there HAS to be a way to quickly process each play and send a signal down to one official - like in soccer. Tennis has gotten rid of people calling lines in most of the big tournaments and there are zero disputes about calls, etc. You can just focus on the quality of the match and the better player that day wins. If there is a human element needed, let a main ref make a call. You know deep in your gut that the officials can change the course of a game or decide a game based on bad judgment. The roughing the passer call on Mac Jones I believe killed our season. We finally beat the Pats if that isn't called and probably beat them again since we were over the hump. You not only have to be good to win, you have to be fortunate enough not to have the game taken from you because they can basically call defensive holding on every play. The refs have proven over and over they aren't up to the task in big moments.

It would only help in one way, but I have always thought about putting a sensor system in the football.  This way you can tell where the ball was. Over the line to make or goal line.  That would just help with the spot and not the other stuff.  

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3 hours ago, SpankyJohnson said:

Mahomes barely gets a hand on his shoulder pad and then proceeds to flop like a soccer player on the ground. Multiple flags come flying in. 
 

Garrett Wilson catches a pass against Buffalo and goes out of bounds and a second later gets destroyed by a Buffalo defender.  Refs are like Carry On Nothing To See Here. 
 

Should not matter what team it is or who the player is or if it's the first play of the game or the last.  Call it evenly !

Both were penalties but only one was called which totally sucked.  However please don't act like that was not a penalty against Mahomes just because a penalty wasn't called against Wilson.   Even Stevie Wonder can see Ossai shoved him 2 or 3 feet out of bounds.  That is a penalty; PERIOD.  

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46 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

Both were penalties but only one was called which totally sucked.  However please don't act like that was not a penalty against Mahomes just because a penalty wasn't called against Wilson.   Even Stevie Wonder can see Ossai shoved him 2 or 3 feet out of bounds.  That is a penalty; PERIOD.  

Never said it wasn't a penalty !   
The hit on Garrett Wilson was violent and out of bounds that should've been called 100 times out of 100. 
Mahomes takes a little shove out of bounds ands flops around and every ref tossed their flag.  
Either both of these are fouls or neither of them are.  My point is there is absolutely zero consistency.  

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5 hours ago, Larz said:

The call last night I didn’t like was the grounding call. Perine was close enough. 
 

As a whole, it was a rough year for NFL refs. They are still part timers. Hiring them full time could possibly make it better but really only if there is a grading system to weed out the weaker ones. 
 

There is also a star system for QBs and coaches.  If you have a bigger star QB and coach compared to your opponent it seems like an advantage on 50/50 calls.
The thing that drives me crazy is Star QBs oline getting away with holding and getting the roughing call. Those are big swings, 10 and 15 yards. 

The Jets need a star QB and star HC. 
 

Rodgers coming here would help the Jets with calls, no doubt about it. 

I've long wondered why not just eliminate intentional grounding entirely.  Let the QB throw it away from anywhere on the field as long as it is a legit forward pass. Who cares if a receiver is "close." 

Maybe I'm missing a good reason why the NFL can't do that?

 

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For as imperfect as the officiating is, remember the games with the backup refs and how miserably bad they were and how miserable those games were to watch. (Although I enjoyed when the refs would throw the flags and hit the offender.) That shows just how difficult it is to have a handful of refs trying to watch twenty-two players at the same time over tens of yards of field. 

If you could use AI to catch every penalty, you'd pretty much have to call every single penalty even the ticky-tacky ones. Otherwise you're letting the NFL inject human decision-making on when a foul should be called and putting yourself back in the same boat. Is the game better letting the NFL openly admit it picks the fouls to call or have six penalties called on every play? IMO neither sounds like a better experience for the fans. 

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5 minutes ago, TheClashFan said:

I've long wondered why not just eliminate intentional grounding entirely.  Let the QB throw it away from anywhere on the field as long as it is a legit forward pass. Who cares if a receiver is "close." 

Maybe I'm missing a good reason why the NFL can't do that?

 

You would pretty much eliminate sacks and tilt the game more in favor of offense. If a QB can throw the ball at any time an inch in front of his foot and end the play without losing any yardage, why ever risk a sack or a pass running away from a defender? Might as well just stuff the line and send all the rushers into coverage. 

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6 hours ago, nycdan said:

If the Saints-Rams game from a few years ago didn't break the league, nothing will. 

No call I have ever seen or heard of before or since, was as awful as that one.  It's as if the ref simply said "anything short of murder with a machete is going to slide for the Rams on this drive".  The game was literally stolen from the Saints on that one non-call. 

So when I see any team other than the Jets (or Saints, or anyone playing the Patriots) whining about bad calls, I just can't get too worked up.  While there were a few that were debatable, I don't know that any of them were actually completely wrong like the one mentioned above was.

For those who don't like to watch video....THIS was a non-call:

image.png

Agree.

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8 minutes ago, rex-n-effect said:

You would pretty much eliminate sacks and tilt the game more in favor of offense. If a QB can throw the ball at any time an inch in front of his foot and end the play without losing any yardage, why ever risk a sack or a pass running away from a defender? Might as well just stuff the line and send all the rushers into coverage. 

Fair, but I don't agree that that would happen.  Teams still need to complete passes to move down the field and score.  Any QB who just spikes the ball at the first sign of trouble wouldn't last long in the league.

QBs already can throw the ball away on the vast majority of their drop backs, yet they rarely do, often taking heavy hits to throw passes downfield.  Ask Mike White about that!

:-)

 

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4 hours ago, SpankyJohnson said:

Never said it wasn't a penalty !   
The hit on Garrett Wilson was violent and out of bounds that should've been called 100 times out of 100. 
Mahomes takes a little shove out of bounds ands flops around and every ref tossed their flag.  
Either both of these are fouls or neither of them are.  My point is there is absolutely zero consistency.  

Sorry but you are just wrong.  The hit on Mahomes was a SHOVE 3 FEET out of BOUNDS.  That is a penalty 10 times out of 10....  especially if it happens to a QUARTERBACK.   Again, the hit on Wilson was definitely a penalty that should have been called.  There is no argument on that.  That was truly a BLOWN CALL no doubt about it, however, the hit on Mahomes was a obvious penalty and should have been called (and it was).   

Hit on Mahomes: 

 

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This has been going on for years, any time a team was about to come back and beat Landry’s Cowboys, the refs would calla  15 yard penalty on third down off a key  completion for holding by an opposing OL, if COWBOYS were behind, on third down, every incompletion was a penalty on the opposing teams DB’s .

now Mahomes and KC are the flavor of the month, America’s team.

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NFL has pussified and complicated the rules so much it is coming close to making the games unwatchable. Why is catching a pass in the end zone with clear possession having two feet in bounds then receiver hit ground ball moves the slightest bit then ruled incomplete but a ball carrier can put the ball over the goal line for a freaking nano second it’s a TD ? 

Simplify the rules like it was in the 80’s will be a much better game   

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20 hours ago, Warfish said:

Counter Argument: 

In every 3rd or 4th and very long, or any long pass play at any time, it would always be best to just tackle/interfere with the receiver and take the penalty if the receiver in any way has the advantage, rather than risk letting up a long first down.

The result would be more penalties committed more often, and with Refs as they are, the uneven way they call games would become even more uneven as the frequency of PI/Holding increases.

Road to hell is paved with good intentions, and I AGREE with your intention, but the cure is very likely be worse than the disease.

Kind of agree with both of you , couldn’t they rule it an intentional foul or unintentional and have the penalty be based on that in your example ? Kind of how the NBA does ? Yes we have reached the depths of poor officiating where I am looking at the NBA for answers..how sad is that ? 

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21 hours ago, Greensleeves said:

AI is a good start. At the very least the sidelines and goal lines should be set up so you can tell if someone's foot touches it or if you break the plane. Why go to a million different angles with a guy in NY that probably wears glasses? Have a chip in the ball so you can tell if the tip crosses the goal line or touches it. That's easy stuff.

The chip idea will not work. You would have to wire the entire ball and have a battery inside. The balls are abused during games and a malfunction  will happen. Having a system like cyclops that is used in tennis is possible but I would say validating TDs or players stepping out of bounds is not the issue. What is is the inconsistencies from crew to crew with how they call things. It is the same in baseball where batters and pitchers have to figure out for an inning or 2 what is a ball and what is a strike. 

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49 minutes ago, More Cowbell said:

The chip idea will not work. You would have to wire the entire ball and have a battery inside. The balls are abused during games and a malfunction  will happen. Having a system like cyclops that is used in tennis is possible but I would say validating TDs or players stepping out of bounds is not the issue. What is is the inconsistencies from crew to crew with how they call things. It is the same in baseball where batters and pitchers have to figure out for an inning or 2 what is a ball and what is a strike. 

I totally agree, but hate it.

Consistency.  Try to call the penalty as close to the definition as possible.  Of course, people will see it differently.  Last year Mac was hit a little harder than Mahomes was.  Not destroyed, but hit no call.  Josh Allen was touched or more directed out of bounds with the Patriots hand son him.  15 yard penalty.

  

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On 1/30/2023 at 9:57 AM, Trotter said:

The redo on 3rd down was a horrible optic and wish it could have been handled better.

when it was explained, it was the correct decision.

personal foul on mahommes out of bounds is no argument.

100% the right call. Sure unfortunate when it happened but it did and it was correct

The biggest call was the intentional grounding.  That's a Rodgers or Brady special.  Happens each week.

The RB was less than 5 yards away.

That call took any chance the Bengals had, at the very least an opportunity to kill more clock.

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1 hour ago, hawk said:

The biggest call was the intentional grounding.  That's a Rodgers or Brady special.  Happens each week.

The RB was less than 5 yards away.

That call took any chance the Bengals had, at the very least an opportunity to kill more clock.

True.

when they showed the replay from behind my first thought was the reviver is close by.

I figured there is some other obscure rule that I simply do not know that made it grounding.

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7 minutes ago, Trotter said:

True.

when they showed the replay from behind my first thought was the reviver is close by.

I figured there is some other obscure rule that I simply do not know that made it grounding.

Intent?  I heard that play on the radio and expected to disagree with it.   Watching it now I don't understand everyone's issue.  The back is 7 yards past the linemen.  Burrow gets nervous and drills the ball a yard before the linemen's feet.  

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On 1/31/2023 at 12:14 PM, #27TheDominator said:

Intent?  I heard that play on the radio and expected to disagree with it.   Watching it now I don't understand everyone's issue.  The back is 7 yards past the linemen.  Burrow gets nervous and drills the ball a yard before the linemen's feet.  

Happens every week, 7 yards is stretch but even if, still can't prove no intent.  

Every week this happens.

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