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Jets need to develop their young QB


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15 hours ago, Yankeesrbest said:

I’m done with the Jets bringing in old QBs to try to win for a season or two see Favre and O’Donnell.  They need to develop Zach Wilson and should not have hired a rookie OC to develop a rookie QB.  They also should have had an experienced QB from the get go of the kids carrier.  This team was not good enough to get to the playoffs this year.  They got lucky a few times during the year when they played hurt teams or the Browns blundered otherwise they would have had a worse record.  Fix the OL through the draft preferably, add another running back and continue to add true talent to the roster to compete for several years to come not just 1 or 2.  

I understand your point.  Regardless of how we got here, Zach is not ready to start.  His footwork is lousy.  His reads are slow.  He has nervous feet.  These result in missed openings, passes off target and sacks because it takes too long to get through his progressions.  Are these correctable?  Maybe with a solid coach but not guaranteed.  The plan to take 2023 and sit Zach and work with him is not a bad one.  It will take months and months to get him right.  They tried 2-3 weeks.  He looks OK for 1 game and then he fell apart again.

This team has a defense that can take you places, especially the best pair of cornerbacks in the league.  The offense has most of the pieces.  The skill positions are there if you add one more solid receiver.  You need a QB who can make those offensive weapons better by throwing 65%+ completions and protect the ball with few mistakes.

It's time to become a playoff team.  They are close enough to get there.  In the interim, work with Zach.  Maybe grab a QB in the middle rounds once or twice.  There are a lot of QB's in the elite class who weren't drafted in the first round. There are some really good ones that went later.  

For 2023, the fans deserve better than Zach gave us.  Don't give up on him but don't rely on him getting better unless and until he shows you reason to.

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Garopolo, tannehill, minshew.  Those are the guys who can msn the qb position for a year or 2 while we either develop zach or draft a new, young qb.

Bring in Rodgers or Carr and everyone is getting canned.  Those 2 will fail miserably in NY.

Stay the course Joe!!  Keep building through the draft.  You will find the young qb soon enough.

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18 hours ago, y2k8 said:

 

If the New York Jets ever find their "Mahomes"- it will be when they draft a kid in the middle to late first round, when they are not counting on him to be the savior of the franchise.

TBF, anyone they spend a 1st on, even late in the round, will be expected to be the savior.  If we traded down to 31 this year and took Tanner McKee, you bet your ass the future would be banked on him.  

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3 hours ago, Joe W. Namath said:

Garopolo, tannehill, minshew.  Those are the guys who can msn the qb position for a year or 2 while we either develop zach or draft a new, young qb.

Bring in Rodgers or Carr and everyone is getting canned.  Those 2 will fail miserably in NY.

Stay the course Joe!!  Keep building through the draft.  You will find the young qb soon enough.

Coming in 4th place for another 2 years doesn't get you to the next QB.  

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Yall Zach truthers really just won't let it go will you....

Was Mike Lafleur terrible? Yes 

Has Zach shown enough to lead us to believe that he can be developed? NO! 

Is it Lafleur's fault that Zach wasn't capable of executing the basics of the QB position, that it was assumed he can do when drafted? NO! 

Is there any precedent for anyone to look as clueless as Zach looked at times to turn it around and be a capable QB? NO! 

 

Let it go. We missed at #2 overall. JD and Saleh will need to plug and play a vet to rectify the situation or we'll be starting over with a new regime in '24

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6 hours ago, Reasonable Jets Fan said:

He was a bust 5 years into the league... Whether you choose stats or not he was washed up... Zach had a terrible 2nd season... Ok... It's his ******* 2nd season... 

Yes he didn't grow from year 1 to year 2... Concerning.... Will he be good who knows but the guy has a cannon for an arm you don't give up just because he had a sh*t year... 

Year 3 and 4 are guaranteed anyway... So you let him cook behind a good qb and see what develops... All you doomers are freaking weird that want him off the team so bad... 

Worst case he is terrible after year 4 and you don't pick up his option for year 5... Best case he becomes Steve Young... Why would you not take that chance? It's not like his spot on the team is debilitating the team. 

Steve Young didn't become a seviceable NFL QB until year 7.   If he beocmes Steve Young he will probably be the Pats QB because we aren't picking up his 5th year option.

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6 hours ago, FactsOnly said:

My goodness another HORRIBLE take

Alex Smith had 1 TD and 11 picks his first year, followed by putting up the same numbers Zach did his first season 

WRONG

What did Alex Smith do from year 1 to year 2 that Zach Wilson didn't? He IMPROVED. 

Also,  Smith threw 16 tds in his 2nd year compared to Wilson throwing 9 his rookie year. How exactly is that the same?

Alex Smith threw more TDs in his 2nd year than Wilson has thrown in his career.

Dumbass

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5 hours ago, Joe W. Namath said:

Garopolo, tannehill, minshew.  Those are the guys who can msn the qb position for a year or 2 while we either develop zach or draft a new, young qb.

Bring in Rodgers or Carr and everyone is getting canned.  Those 2 will fail miserably in NY.

Stay the course Joe!!  Keep building through the draft.  You will find the young qb soon enough.

You realize he doesn't read this site right? Also any of those 3 you mentioned start at QB next year for the Jets and JD won't be the GM for very much longer. His leash is very short after missing on Wilson. 

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19 hours ago, Yankeesrbest said:

Yes, I do believe the kid can be developed but he needs a good O-line in front of him, and WRs who can actually catch a football.  I still wonder why the Jets signed drop specialist Corey Davis. The man drops more than he catches.  A few of the other receivers also had the drops.  Now, I’m not gonna say Zach doesn’t need to work on his precision cause he does.  He needs to do what Jalen Hurts did during last off season.  

lol yeah thats it. iut's wrs fault that zach wilson is woefully inaccurate, can't read a defense in real time and has the field vision of a horse with blinders and cataracts

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7 hours ago, Reasonable Jets Fan said:

They did have a plan... He got killed... They never replaced him... Turns out it was a huge mistake... Because of this he didn't develop from year 1 to year 2... But now all these doomers want to get rid of him... Instead of having him learn at no cost. 

There is no way to make that correlation.   It’s an assumption based on zero evidence.   Turns out there was so little tape on Zach against good competition that a lot of assumptions were made about him.   I bought into the hype.  Kid definitely needs to be developed but he’s a project and 2 years of development were wasted already.   

We don’t have Joe Montana in front of him and the great Bill Walsh to teach him for 4 years to see if he’s going to be the next Steve Young.   Bob Saleh and Joe Flacco are his mentors.   Kids dead here.  

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On 2/3/2023 at 4:19 PM, Yankeesrbest said:

I’m done with the Jets bringing in old QBs to try to win for a season or two see Favre and O’Donnell.  They need to develop Zach Wilson and should not have hired a rookie OC to develop a rookie QB.  They also should have had an experienced QB from the get go of the kids carrier.  This team was not good enough to get to the playoffs this year.  They got lucky a few times during the year when they played hurt teams or the Browns blundered otherwise they would have had a worse record.  Fix the OL through the draft preferably, add another running back and continue to add true talent to the roster to compete for several years to come not just 1 or 2.  

Britney Spears Cool Story Bro GIF

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On 2/3/2023 at 7:19 PM, Yankeesrbest said:

I’m done with the Jets bringing in old QBs to try to win for a season or two see Favre and O’Donnell.  They need to develop Zach Wilson and should not have hired a rookie OC to develop a rookie QB.  They also should have had an experienced QB from the get go of the kids carrier.  This team was not good enough to get to the playoffs this year.  They got lucky a few times during the year when they played hurt teams or the Browns blundered otherwise they would have had a worse record.  Fix the OL through the draft preferably, add another running back and continue to add true talent to the roster to compete for several years to come not just 1 or 2.  

Oh, this again? Let's fix Zach. I don't  know. We get stories about Zach being late to meetings and goofing around when he shouldn't  be and then another  story comes out he is a student of the game and really applies himself. Does anyone e else realize  neither  of these things is a good thing? I would feel better if he was late and being goofy because  that is easy to fix and if he does the right thing, he can improve but  if he is fully bought in and working hard and he still is the worst QB in the league, what does he do different this offseason to improve. 

I guess we find out how good Hackett is if we try to develop Zach at least. 

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4 hours ago, choon328 said:

You realize he doesn't read this site right? Also any of those 3 you mentioned start at QB next year for the Jets and JD won't be the GM for very much longer. His leash is very short after missing on Wilson. 

We won 7 games w/ literally 0 qb play.  Garropolo and Tannehill has both gotten to championship games recently.

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2 minutes ago, Joe W. Namath said:

We won 7 games w/ literally 0 qb play.  Garropolo and Tannehill has both gotten to championship games recently.

Tannehill is 35 and missed 5 games last year and it cost his team the playoffs. 

Jimmy G has missed 18 out of his last 50 possible games due to injury including 6 to finish the season. 

Both are pretty much guaranteed to miss time next year to injury. Can this team afford to play 4 or 5 games with Zach Wilson next year?

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31 minutes ago, choon328 said:

Tannehill is 35 and missed 5 games last year and it cost his team the playoffs. 

Jimmy G has missed 18 out of his last 50 possible games due to injury including 6 to finish the season. 

Both are pretty much guaranteed to miss time next year to injury. Can this team afford to play 4 or 5 games with Zach Wilson next year?

Id bring in tannehill/minshew or garopolo/minshew.  
 

QB 1- Tannehill/Garopollo

QB 2- Minshew

QB 3- Zach Wilson

This way we keep all of our draft picks and being that we are not spending huge on Rodgers or Carr, can improve even more via free agency.

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9 hours ago, Joe W. Namath said:

Id bring in tannehill/minshew or garopolo/minshew.  
 

QB 1- Tannehill/Garopollo

QB 2- Minshew

QB 3- Zach Wilson

This way we keep all of our draft picks and being that we are not spending huge on Rodgers or Carr, can improve even more via free agency.

Wilson will be the backup.  JD can not and will not bring himself up bury Zach. That's why I don't want a QB made of glass.

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20 hours ago, Biggs said:

The development ship sailed when they hired Saleh.

Saleh has allowed Zach to be undermined by the team publicly.   Its over for Zach in NY.   

I agree .. except i do not think its over ... he comes into work and clearly overtakes the starter ... trust me .. G Wilson et al  will be clamoring for him.

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On 2/4/2023 at 3:19 PM, carlito1171 said:

Yall Zach truthers really just won't let it go will you....

Was Mike Lafleur terrible? Yes 

Has Zach shown enough to lead us to believe that he can be developed? NO! 

Is it Lafleur's fault that Zach wasn't capable of executing the basics of the QB position, that it was assumed he can do when drafted? NO! 

Is there any precedent for anyone to look as clueless as Zach looked at times to turn it around and be a capable QB? NO! 

 

Let it go. We missed at #2 overall. JD and Saleh will need to plug and play a vet to rectify the situation or we'll be starting over with a new regime in '24

Is there any precedent of 2 years as a clueless Quarterback who turned it around?

Troy Aikman's 1st 2 years were worse.  How about 20 TD and 36 Interceptions.  Completion rate of 55%.  QBR of 60.  I believe he went to the NFC championship 4 times and won 3 Super Bowls.

Jim Plunkett had a 68.6 QB rating his first year.  In his second year, he had 8 TD's and 25 INt's with a QB rating of 45.7.  He went on to win 2 Super Bowls.

 

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1 hour ago, Flashlite80 said:

Is there any precedent of 2 years as a clueless Quarterback who turned it around?

Troy Aikman's 1st 2 years were worse.  How about 20 TD and 36 Interceptions.  Completion rate of 55%.  QBR of 60.  I believe he went to the NFC championship 4 times and won 3 Super Bowls.

Jim Plunkett had a 68.6 QB rating his first year.  In his second year, he had 8 TD's and 25 INt's with a QB rating of 45.7.  He went on to win 2 Super Bowls.

 

Granted, so that's two examples(in an era not geared towards QB play) amongst the many many QBs who've busted. 

Anything other then blind hope that Zach supporters hold onto? 

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Granted, so that's two examples(in an era not geared towards QB play) amongst the many many QBs who've busted. 
Anything other then blind hope that Zach supporters hold onto? 
Well you have to admit that the examples are compelling.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk

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On 2/4/2023 at 1:19 AM, Yankeesrbest said:

I’m done with the Jets bringing in old QBs to try to win for a season or two see Favre and O’Donnell.  

Our track record of developing young QBs is actually worse. But it’s moot as the current regime enters desperation hour to produce.

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3 hours ago, Dunnie said:

Well you have to admit that the examples are compelling.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
 

Not really….

Im a numbers guy. And the odds are heavily in favor of Zach Wilson joining a long line of busts more so than becoming the next Aikman, Plunkett, Gannon or even Geno….

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On 2/3/2023 at 9:18 PM, bla bla bla said:

Most likely, but you have to pay him anyway. As much as it sucks to lose the roster spot, it is worth it to just see what happens if plan A is win with Rodgers. Anything from Zach is bonus at this point.

 

• 2 years behind Rodgers

• Exercise 5th year option if you see improvement behind the scenes this year, it's only guaranteed for injury. Rodgers has started every game the last 5 years. I'd gamble on Zach not getting injured in practice and if you really don't like what you see then you deactivate him and cut him.

• 2025 - Rodgers retires, $60m dead cap hit and you tank that season. Or Zach showed enough to justify having Rodgers retire after June 1st. Keep Zach for his 5th year while splitting the dead cap of Rodgers over 2 years. If Zach bottoms out then the team implodes, Saleh may be gone, the Jets could have a high pick to take a QB coming out in 2026. Conveniently, that happens to be when Arch Manning should declare - along with others.

 

You likely sacrifice Becton and Moore in order to go this route but Wilson, Breece, Sauce, AVT, and JJ will all have their big money hit in 2026, after their rookie deals expire. (Contracts will be signed earlier). Unless someone offers us a pick for Zach, I think this is a good route.

I wonder if they do have to lose the roster spot all season long. Probably final cutdowns & week 1, otherwise he's technically released, but beyond that maybe they can demote him on the practice squad -- no roster spot (let alone active roster spot). 

It looks like the cutoff is for players with 2 years or less (that'd include Zach) who are eligible for practice squad with no limit on pay for 1 such player per team. Those with >2 years I think are limited to mandated minimums & maximums in the $20K/week range and there are no exceptions/loopholes.

What I'm not sure about is if a new PS contract is required (and therefore, the voiding of the existing one). In this case it might not matter cap-wise since it'd occur after July 1st and he only has two remaining seasons anyway (current year amortization stays the same and all the rest accelerates to the 2024 season; except the 2024 season alone is all the rest, so there'd be no change). His salaries are guaranteed either way, whether it's lump payouts upon redoing it or him agreeing to let the team out of it and then re-sign to a PS contract for the same amount per season. That'd make everything whole cap-wise, but I've doubts Wilson would agree to it. More likely he'd say hey just cut me and I'll sign elsewhere and double-dip since there are probably no offsets for a #2 pick, and Mom thinks this place is toxic to QBs.

What I'm not sure of is if they can have him on the active roster for week 1 and then simply demote him to the PS thereafter without tearing up his current contract and signing him to a new one. In that case they wouldn't need him to consent to anything; they just do it and tell him after it's done.

Anyway in that instance, at least in theory, he could be stashed without eating up a roster spot and there wouldn't be additional negative cap implications. Veterans being on the PS is pretty new, so I don't think there's a precedent for doing this. Could be an interesting loophole, though.

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20 hours ago, carlito1171 said:

Not really….

Im a numbers guy. And the odds are heavily in favor of Zach Wilson joining a long line of busts more so than becoming the next Aikman, Plunkett, Gannon or even Geno….

But what if those guys s we're sh*t canned early ?

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The team has to bring in someone capable of starting - the spectrum of candidates is vast. It ranges from Minshew, Dalton and Tannehill to Carr and Rogers. But, that said, I do think the Jets should not make a decision on Wilson's future until after training camp. I fully realize that no QB has ever succeeded after putting up the dismal numbers and on-field performances we've seen from Wilson. However, I don't think any of the young failed QBs possessed Wilson's combination of arm talent and work ethic (although that is what we've been told, I'm beginning to have my doubts about his work ethic). Anyway, it is a huge off-season for Wilson, If he puts in the work on his mechanics and sees a sport therapist to learn methods to help him remain calm and think while under pressure, who knows? It is certainly worth a wait and see at this point. I know I'm rooting for him, because him figuring it out is the best long term answer at QB for the Jets. Regardless, when we do see what his looks like at training camp, it will be a window into his soul and deepest desires. Only then will we know if he really wants to be a franchise QB or if he is more interested in being the next Milf Hunter.

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