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Not as many teams in on Lamar as expected...many already bowing out


AFJF

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13 minutes ago, slimjasi said:

We’ll see

they are moving pretty slowly if they really want Lamar, IMO 

I don’t think they really really want him.  I think the ravens know he’s good enough to get them to the playoffs, but his playing style isn’t the type to get you to the super bowl and also his body can’t take the hits all season.  So I think they’re throwing bait into the ocean and seeing if they can get a team to overpay with draft picks.  

The giants are in that trap too, they had to pay jones a ton of money.  Guys like burrow and allen are elite.  But if you can’t get an elite qb, it’s not worth paying someone like carr that kind of money.  Such is the qb trap that the nfl has created by altering all the rules that favor qbs and offenses.  

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4 hours ago, slats said:

I wouldn’t even be in on the two first rounders and a conventional contract, let alone what he’s asking. Something’s gonna have to give and, if it’s not from his side, he could wind up pulling a Le’Veon; missing out on a large guaranteed sum just to sit the year and never make that money back. Dude needs an agent desperately. 

This is what I mean. The idea that you would give a flying **** about how much these owners pay out is silliness. And two 1sts plus an all (or even nearly all) guaranteed contract for an injury-prone QB is a non-starter for you as just a fan with zero economic ties to the team.

Imagine being a GM who’d otherwise enjoy a long career, except an injury to this one player sinks you. DeCosta isn’t getting fired without caving - and then having that come back to bite him - and he knows it.

Hey I’d love to have Jackson as the Jets’ QB. Reluctance to such costs and risks isn’t beyond comprehension, though.

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Maybe some teams don't want to bother making an offer since Baltimore can simply match it and the offering team wasted their time. I am of the opinion that he is not worth it because of his availability history, but then again I'm not an NFL GM. But either Baltimore, with several years history, doesn't think he is worth it, or they are simply going to match any offer. Either way, any team making an offer is either making a mistake, if Baltimore is right for not wanting him, or will lose him when Baltimore matches their offer.

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1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

It’d be such a bad look for the league if Burrow turns around and gets a guaranteed deal. He won’t, because the Bengals are poor, but my god the headlines

joe burrow playoff record last 2 years - 5-2

joe burrow games missed due to injury last 2 years - 0

 

lamar jackson career playoff record - 1-3

lamar jackson games missed due to injury last 2 years - 12 (including playoffs)

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20 minutes ago, slats said:

They’re currently ineligible to get in on it because they don’t have a first round pick this year. After the draft, they will have two first rounders coming up in the following two drafts, and can then submit an offer sheet (if they’re so inclined). 

True - we’ll see if they do. 
 

I’m skeptical. 
 

For one thing, teams want their QB situation figured out by then.

I’m sure Ross would love to land him, especially if the Jets do get Rodgers, but I’m not sure how realistic it is. 

I think I agree with Florio - Lamar should have had an agent like everyone else. 

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Just now, slimjasi said:

True - we’ll see if they do. 
 

I’m skeptical. 
 

For one thing, teams want their QB situation figured out by then.

I’m sure Ross would love to land him, especially if the Jets do get Rodgers, but I’m not sure how realistic it is. 

I think I agree with Florio - Lamar should have had an agent like everyone else. 

I think he was simply too greedy.  He should have realized that signing the contract he was offered was worth it, particularly given his style of play. 

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13 hours ago, TommyT said:

Ravens save 12-mil, smart organization.

I’m betting he doesn’t play for that and holds out. At very least he signs and comes in at last minute and refuses to play if any body part is remotely sore. Players can be disruptive enough within the rules to sabotage the team if they want to. Remember how TO ruined the Eagles trying to get paid. There were reports last year that Lamar was recovered from the knee injury and could have played but chose not to. He doesn’t seem like he’ll go the Cousins route and play hard for 2 years under the tag to finally get free.  He’ll more likely try to shoot his way out of town. 

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1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

Well, that’s the thing. We don’t know that Aaron Rodgers only has one suitor because Rodgers isn’t talking to the media. We’ll see in the coming days if anyone else comes for him. With Lamar, these league-wide pronouncements of “NOPE” came five minutes after he hit free agency. 

Fishy or not - good luck proving collusion. 

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1 minute ago, slimjasi said:

Fishy or not - good luck proving collusion. 

I don’t even see what’s fishy.  You have a qb whose production throwing is so so, gets injured too much and teams are balking giving up multiple first round picks for him and signing him to a tremendous contract?  

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1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

It’d be such a bad look for the league if Burrow turns around and gets a guaranteed deal. He won’t, because the Bengals are poor, but my god the headlines

Due to the style of play, who is more likely to get injured and destroy the best part of their career Joe Burrow or Lamar Jackson ? Some teams in the league just do not want that style of QB. Face it, without his legs Lamar is probably out of the league by now.  His passing numbers are well below average and his rushing numbers have declined every year. The 2019 season was a fantastic outlier  but in the playoffs that year (Tenn) 365 142 rushing 2 Ints 52% Lamar put up 12 points his TD pass came in the 4th Quarter down 28-6 in 2021 vs Buffalo  162 yards 34 rushing yards 3 Points.

2019 1 game 31 of 59 --52.9 completion -- 365 -- 1 TD 2 Ints. YPA 6.2 

2020 2 games 31 0f 48 -- 64.6 completion-- 341 -- 0 TD 2 Ints YPA 7.1 

I know Lamar can run but its obvious when he has to throw he can't get it done. He's a one dimensional  guy. I'm not sure what his overall numbers vs playoff caliber defenses is but in the playoffs themselves he was not good and never came close to his regular season numbers and he had a top tier defense behind him.

Any team giving Lamar and his 2400 yard per year average and declining stats a guaranteed contract are Idiots. If anyone thinks Lamar ever sniffs 2019 again especially moving forward and having leg problems they simply are infatuated with a season that will never happen again.

Lamar didn't play in this years Playoffs and some felt he could play .... I'm sure that works wonders for a guaranteed contract in bizarro world. Probably figured if he sh*t the bed yet again in the playoffs it would put that "cant get it done in the playoffs label" on him or would have made it much worse. He didn't play because he probably could not run but why not play QB ? You know throwing from the pocket ?

There is no argument at all in why Joe Burrow should get the more money guaranteed Contract then Lamar I mean Mike White was hurt 2 times in the last 2 years and is labeled fragile and Injury Prone so I guess we can label Lamar exactly the same way since Lamar Missed 8 games and Mike White missed 2 3/4 games.

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14 hours ago, AFJF said:

Let's see what happens when Burrow and Lawrence are up for new deals.  Either the league is going to have to make new rules for how QB's are paid or the top guys will keep getting enormous guarantees.

I would not at all suprised to see one player paid off the salary cap.

The other option is simple:  A cap on every position in the league.  Starting QB's make 'X'.  Backup's make 'Y.'  They could spread the wealth more evenly, and then have higher league-wide bonuses for all players for making the playoffs.  Obviously winning the SB would grant you the highest bonuses.

The idea that every starting QB will be making $40 million within the next few years can't be sitting well, given the fact that there are about 3 of them that might be actually worth that kind of money.

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12 minutes ago, docdhc said:

I’m betting he doesn’t play for that and holds out. At very least he signs and comes in at last minute and refuses to play if any body part is remotely sore. Players can be disruptive enough within the rules to sabotage the team if they want to. Remember how TO ruined the Eagles trying to get paid. There were reports last year that Lamar was recovered from the knee injury and could have played but chose not to. He doesn’t seem like he’ll go the Cousins route and play hard for 2 years under the tag to finally get free.  He’ll more likely try to shoot his way out of town. 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/34566275/sources-believe-lamar-jackson-turned-baltimore-ravens-contract-offer-worth-250-million

 

he was offered more guarantees than Josh Allen.  He didn't take the deal which I don't understand.  He had to know he was going to be tagged twice.  

if you add his 2022 number plus the 2 years of the tag (exclusive) you get 23mm + 45MM + 54MM which is 122mm total over those 3 years.

he should have taken the deal.

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1 hour ago, JiF4Lamar said:

Can you list the QB's in the history of the NFL that won an MVP at 23 years old? 

Thats all well and good, but that was 3 years ago and you have to base things off of right now.  He hasn't finished his last two seasons and may have "walked out on his team"...Burrow has lead his team to two straight title games and a super bowl birth. 

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3 minutes ago, CanadaSteve said:

I would not at all suprised to see one player paid off the salary cap.

The other option is simple:  A cap on every position in the league.  Starting QB's make 'X'.  Backup's make 'Y.'  They could spread the wealth more evenly, and then have higher league-wide bonuses for all players for making the playoffs.  Obviously winning the SB would grant you the highest bonuses.

The idea that every starting QB will be making $40 million within the next few years can't be sitting well, given the fact that there are about 3 of them that might be actually worth that kind of money.

Calling out owners claiming collusion because no one wants Lamar is Moronic and trust me I'm no fan of Billionaires . If Lamar had Aaron Rodgers type numbers at this stage of his career the entire league would be lining up including me and all of you as fans. Unfortunately Lamar is declining and does not in any way shape or form deserve a 40 mil contract or a large guaranteed sum. 

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47 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

2) The owners collectively don’t want to give out these massive fully guaranteed deals and rushing to the podium to announce their lack of interest is fishy.

That would be collusion, and I believe it would be illegal and a violation of the CBA, and a basis for a lawsuit from the players union.

Why does everyone always go with conspiracy theory as first-option-rationale on literally anything these days?

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55 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I’m of two minds on it.

I’m in favor of the NFL joining other major sports in guaranteeing player contracts (at least having them all guaranteed for injury anyway, as it’s the one with the most devastating long term effects and fast career ending injuries).

However there would need to be a safety net to get around it (e.g. a luxury tax that can be dipped into IF [read: WHEN] an all-guaranteed mega-money player now sucks horribly or is just too injured to play or be effective; in this rough sport it’d be too easy to sink multiple franchises not just for the year but for 4-5 years for injury reasons beyond anyone’s control, and that’s not good for the league).

An in-between is like Cousins territory, where it was all guaranteed but just for a few years, so the team doesn’t get any long term advantages (e.g. the Mahomes contract already is now below market, and it’ll seem like an outright bargain after another few more years of cap ceiling growth, plus very soon will be only at the team’s pleasure if he gets so badly injured).

Maybe there are other ways of being around that via having insurance policies pay up for players injured for the long term, and credit that against the caps for such affected teams so they can still spend to stay competitive. In that instance someone like Jackson, whose injury risk is undoubtedly higher, could get an all-guaranteed deal without the franchise tying the team’s fate for upwards of 5 years on this one player maintaining excellent health for 5 years (still more so if a pair of 1s is part of the price tag).

I don’t know how that’d work in terms of details, or if it’s at all even workable, but surely there has to be something beyond what they’re doing now. Maybe insurance becomes mandatory but where those premiums come off the salary cap (treat like a rookie pool amount they have to leave open, but for the whole season). Then a player can lock in for longer without the tail end having no guarantees. Problem is those policies are surely very customized for different players and risks, so it’d be impossible for gobs of deals to get done quickly like they do - and like they need to - when FA starts for everyone at the same time.

Agreed ...  and well thought .... I always thought if they were going to fully guarantee those contracts  ... there would absolutely NEED to be relief on the Cap if the player got injured. Especially if it was career ending.

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1 minute ago, Warfish said:

That would be collusion, and I believe it would be illegal and a violation of the CBA, and a basis for a lawsuit from the players union.

I mean all the owner have to do is then say .. ok ..you want fully guaranteed cash here is half ... or less. The market price is what the market bears.

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4 minutes ago, usanyj said:

Thats all well and good, but that was 3 years ago and you have to base things off of right now.  He hasn't finished his last two seasons and may have "walked out on his team"...Burrow has lead his team to two straight title games and a super bowl birth. 

Is Burrow available via the non-exclusive franchise tag? 

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2 hours ago, JiF4Lamar said:

Burrow is going to literally pull the pants down on the entire league when its his turn.  If they try and play this game with him, of all these dudes, he's the one dude w/ the voice, respect, command and well you know, that will expose this disgusting collusion nonsense.  If there is any sport that should be giving out guaranteed contracts as practice, it's the stupid ******* league who lets these players go brain dead after their career w/ no remorse.  

Him and Lamar should start taking w/ the Rock now and get a sexy contract w/ the XFL.  

whats "and well you know" 

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2 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

@JiF4Lamar I see what this has turned into ..... Class all the way.

 

2 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

Don't dance around it 

I'm sorry?  Referring to his man parts to show how big of balls he has while pulling down the NFL's pants was the reference.  If you think it's something else, dont dance around it.

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5 minutes ago, JiF4Lamar said:

They settled w/ Kaep.

Keap pissed a lot of people off with his choice of actions and because a lot of Owners did not want him on their team due to those actions it much be collusion . Keep in mind if he never did that bullsh*t during the national anthem and took a better road to get his message across we would not be having this conversation. 

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2 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

Keap pissed a lot of people off with his choice of actions and because a lot of Owners did not want him on their team due to those actions it much be collusion . Keep in mind if he never did that bullsh*t during the national anthem and took a better road to get his message across we would not be having this conversation. 

Taking knee was too rough on you? Too rough of a road? 

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The Pittsburgh Steelers should give Lamar the Deshaun Watson contract.

The Ravens would have no choice but to match it or have to play against him with their most hated rival twice a year for the next 7 years.

Either way, the Steelers win. 

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3 minutes ago, JiF4Lamar said:

 

I'm sorry?  Referring to his man parts to show how big of balls he has while pulling down the NFL's pants was the reference.  If you think it's something else, dont dance around it.

I'm not sure why he is pulling down the pants of the NFL :)

Oh wait !! It must be because the NFL now suddenly has a stance against crappy QB's 

Should have figured that out sooner 

 

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7 minutes ago, JiF4Lamar said:

Is Burrow available via the non-exclusive franchise tag? 

That's not the argument, people are comparing what lamar should be getting NOW (Not based off what he did 3 years ago) to what some players may get down the road if a president is set. If in a year or 2, burrow goes down the same path as lamar then my guess would be teams would be hesitant to give him a fully guaranteed contract.

You're trying to spin this into a racial issue, when the only other player to receive this fully guaranteed contract is a person of color.  Two things can be true at once, owners are not going to give him this deal because they don't want to give out deals like this, watson being the outlier deal.  And he just isn't worth that deal based off of years of recent history with games played/production.

 

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